Features

Why Britain’s economy will overtake Germany’s

Our population’s growing – and we’re not in the eurozone

5 October 2013

9:00 AM

5 October 2013

9:00 AM

What’s the most surprising thing that could come out of the current economic upturn? A rapid revival in northern manufacturing? The City really getting behind small British businesses? Ed Balls admitting higher public spending wasn’t always the best way to promote growth? Any of these eventualities would be fairly amazing. But the biggest surprise would perhaps be this: a gradual realisation that the UK is on track to become the largest economy in Europe.

In the 19th century, at the height of the industrial revolution, the UK outproduced all of its European competitors. It steadily lost that position, however, ceding industrial leadership to the Germans and the French. In the next couple of decades that pattern will start to reverse. As the recovery gathers steam, we are likely to out-perform the rest of Europe. And that will change the way this country is perceived, both by global businesses and by investors.

The rankings of European economies are not set in stone. Right now, Germany is by far the biggest, with a GDP of $3.6 trillion. France stands at $2.7 trillion, the UK at $2.2 trillion, Italy at $2.1 trillion. If you count Russia as part of Europe, it slots into the table between us and the Italians. But over time, those positions have moved around. Back in 1987 the Italian economy overtook ours, a moment celebrated in that country as ‘Il Surpasso’, and indeed in the early 1990s Italy even overtook France. A couple of difficult decades later, Italy and Britain are tussling for fourth place.

The next decade will be a lot better for us, however. Our recovery may look tepid by historical standards; the mountain of debt, public and private, is too enormous for a rapid acceleration of growth, and there is little sign of a surge of productivity to kick-start a really strong upturn. But that’s not the point. As Alan Hansen likes to point out on Match of the Day, to move up a league table you don’t just need to pick up points yourself — you also need your competitors to drop a few. And that is what’s about to happen.

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If UK growth hits 1.5 per cent this year and 2 per cent next, that will be better than most people expect. But the eurozone has locked itself into what looks like a permanent recession, each minor burst of growth followed by a fresh downturn. And over time, that will change the rankings of the largest economies.

Italy, in its fifth recession since joining the euro, is not going to catch the UK up again. The Italian economy is no bigger now than when it joined the single currency in 1999. The OECD predicts it will shrink by 1.2 per cent this year, and only expand by 0.5 per cent next. France does not look likely to hold on to second place in Europe for much longer: it spent the first half of the year in recession, and has emerged from it only as far as an annual growth rate of 0.1 per cent — more of a rounding error than an expansion. Socialist President François Hollande seems to be doing everything he can think of to destroy wealth, from punitive income tax rates to lowering the retirement age to taxing smartphones. The Centre for Economics and Business Research has already predicted the British economy will be bigger than the French by next year.

But Germany? That really is a serious economy — Europe’s largest both before the first world war and since its recovery after the second, partly because Germans are very good at making stuff, but also because there are a lot of them — 82 million, compared with 62 million Britons. But even Germany is getting sucked into the eurozone’s depression. It was growing at just 0.1 per cent at the start of the year, and has recovered only slightly since then. Germany is the only eurozone economy still in respectable shape — but with even the Dutch next door in recession, that can’t last. The reality is that Germany is fated to a decade or more of faltering output just like its neighbours. If the UK starts to grow consistently faster than Germany, the gap will close.

There is another, more important factor. From 2015, Germany will have a sharply declining population. By 2020, it will have 80 million people, according to the Federal Statistical Office. By 2060, that will be down to 64 million. By contrast, the UK by 2050 will be home to 80 million, according to a report last year by the Population Reference Bureau. It would require miracles of productivity in terms of output per worker for Germany not to lose ground.

The French have already noticed. The state-sponsored French Economic Observatory recently published a paper on these changing demographics, forecasting that the French economy would overtake Germany by 2040. That’s very likely. But as you might expect, the French study left Britain out of the equation.

In fact, the UK and France are the only two European countries with healthy demographics, and the contest to be Europe’s largest economy will be between them. But with its state-heavy, over-regulated model, locked into a struggling single currency, heavily dependent on a shrinking German market for exports, it’s hard to believe France can outperform us. If the UK manages to combine faster growth with better demographics, we should overtake Germany somewhere between 2025 and 2030.

That will have big consequences. A region’s biggest economy attracts people and investment. Every multinational will want a stake in the British market. Migrants will flock here in even greater numbers. Global investors will be hungry to own British stocks. And it will make the UK a far more powerful voice in European politics — money talks. Our recovery so far may not feel very exciting, but if we do better than our neighbours, one day soon we’ll have something to celebrate.


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Show comments
  • Bonkim

    Population growth is bad for the earth – and resources are depleting fast and the economy based on growth in production and consumption will lead to the extinction of man.

    • Fergus Pickering

      God, how depressing. I’m surprised you can get out of bed in the morning. Malthus thought as you do. Dismal fellow. And wrong.

      • Bonkim

        Look at the real world and the root cause of the unsolvable conflicts increasing in intensity and widening in their extent – mind you those sitting in their ivory towers don’t think the storm will hit them.

        If you put a frog in a pot and gradually increase the temperature, it feels cosy and contented until boiled to death. I suppose there is something to be said about keeping people in the dark until the last day.

        On a personal note enlightenment is far from depressing – it is joyous release.

        • alabenn

          Population growth is bad for the earth

          If you take human nature into account, overpopulation will result in major wars and mass extinction of the weak, the ones remaining will be better equipped to deal with the situation, then the socialist will start their long journey of encouraging the protection of the weak back to where someone like you in the future will say.
          Population growth is bad for the earth.

          • Bonkim

            Resource limitation will arrest the cycle you refer to. Destruction of mankind is a one way street. Even small populations need resources.

          • alabenn

            It depends on who becomes the strongest, if it is people who have shown innovation they will survive, if those who have been content to grub in the dirt for thousands of years for an existence then who would care whether the human race dies out, you can bet that if the people who currently subscribe to that ideology called Islam gain the upper hand then bare existence is all women can look forward to.

          • Bonkim

            Agree somewhat – survival of the fittest – those already experienced in managing with less resources have an advantage but then it all depends on social organisation. Islamic people live in different types of societies – so not a monolith mindset, and those unable to adapt and change will perish as others.

  • Edward Harkins

    Beware you don’t get hit by those flying pigs there Matthew….

  • rtj1211

    ‘Our population is growing’ is not ‘our per capita GDP is growing’ The latter is the appropriate measure for prosperity, not GDP.

    • Smithersjones2013

      Indeed and its not our GDP per capita compared with our debt (public and private) per capita is growing either!

  • Adi von Dort

    I printed this story out and put it in one of my files to be opened again in 12 years (2025 being the earliest prediction for the ‘year of overtaking’). Let’s see how close the UK is to practically doubling the size of its economy in relation to Germany’s in that time-frame. Some hope. Nice fantasy.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Petra-Thompson/100000036809170 Petra Thompson

      In 12 years time, the muslim population of Britain will have doubled again (as it has on average every decade for 50 years). 60% of muslims are unemployed. The annual cost of policing muslim terrorism is £3.5bn, the cost of 7 police forces the size of GMP. That doesn’t take into account the cost of imprisoning the 330 muslims convicted of terrorism. Then there’s the cost of having 13% of prisoners being muslims, and 21% of young offenders.

      Muslims are 5% of the UK population. But only 0.4% of the armed forces.

      Muslims are a luxury good.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        Muslims are shotgun fodder.

  • edlancey

    Embarrassing drivel.

    • Fergus Pickering

      Not at all. Cheer up, for God’s sake. Moaning is the curse of the old and the curse of the British..

  • Peter Stroud

    About as useful a prediction as the IPCC’s prediction of catastrophic man made climate change. And about as unscientific.

  • Philip

    …but just what is our population growing with, exactly? productive, educated and motivated go-getters? Or benefit dependent/low-paid third-world immigrants – many of whom despise this country and the way it works? You’re way off the mark here.

    • Kewaza Kasooba

      I have seen more benefit dependent ‘whites’ ( who are beaten hands down in maths and computation by India and N.Korea), than ‘third world immigrants’. Without ‘third word immigrants UK would grind to a halt. Without the wealth of the ‘third world countries’, Britain would still be a jigsaw of islands filled with Neaderthals feasting on raw fish.

  • Terry101

    “Healthy demographics”? These people are so out of touch its painful. Take a train to Birmingham city centre & in a 3 minute walk count the Burkhas – last time I counted over 50 in 3 minutes. We call them the 3 B’s – Burkhas, Bags & Brats. (The bags of course contain the fruits of their never ending welfare-funded shopping spree). The only forlorn looking whites around are working on minimum wages slaving away to pay for it all.

    • Mox_Demon

      It’s just as bad in the states.

    • Fergus Pickering

      Oh come sir. How many people did you see in three minutes? A thousand. As for brats, that is no way to refer to children. What we have to try and do is to encourage these children to stop being Islamic savages. Their colour really doesn’t matter. Girls given a free choice will not wear the ridculous garb o a ridiculous religion. Why would they?

    • ud6

      Rubbish. English people are 3 times more likely to be unemployed than immigrants. It is the immigrants who are helping the UK to grow out of the economic problems, by working in low paid jobs and buying things.

      • Stephen Todd

        Statistics out not so long ago shows that migrants cost the economy approximately double what british people do. Although both over all do cost the economy. So it is not exactly rubbish

      • shikira

        In response to one comment: “many of the small shops and small businesses are run by these immigrants and not be the lazy ‘that job is too low for me’ English” – it must be made clear that, for the vast majority of migrants; they send their earnings to their families in their own native countries, and therefore can retire early – I have so far met over 60 individuals from the Ukraine and Lithuania who do this, and within my small local community. For a great many British poor, the same cannot be said, and so it is not about sheer ‘laziness’, yet more precisely to do with long-term cost of living in their own native country – It is the only one in the EU with the highest cost of living standards, and why many immigrants/migrants rarely stay here lifelong.

        • SonOfTheIsles

          Great answer.

          The British population has been bled dry.

          Land is scarce and unaffordable. The cost of living is enormous. British people have nothing to look forward to other than poverty in a council owned flat.

          Migrants can desert Britain to return from whence they came where they have salted away their earnings in cheap land in a country with a very low cost of living.

          Importing labour does nothing from the British people but everything for coporations and simple minded middle-class champagne socialists who suck up to these false facts.

      • Buddy Repperton

        I want to cream in your pu$$y.

        • William Alexander Plumbasket

          Why don’t you grow up Yankee boy, you are making yourself look like a typical dumb American. Mind you, is there any difference overall? :-) :-) :-)

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            And you look like a typical British pedophile, case closed. Hence, how was that trip in Thailand? Did you run into Gary Glitter? Anyhow, you’re the dumb one!! You foul mouthed Limey. That’s pure ignorance. Clean it up and use a bar on soap, and maybe people will take you more seriously.
            Good luck. Over and out, kiddo.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        You live in a dream world. Immigrants are dragging the UK down. If you feel that way about my great country then I will help you pack.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        Not all British people are lazy you moron. There are good and bad people from all countries. May I suggest that if you don’t like my country, then leave. As you have boasted, you are well travelled. Go live elsewhere, I am sure our economy will be just fine without you.
        I can understand people from other countries trying to belittle the United Kingdom, that will never change. What I cannot stand is when people from my own country have the nerve to disrespect my own fellow British men and women. You disgust me.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        Are you a terrorist by any chance? Immigrants are sucking my country dry. I live in a small town in England and can see what is going on wih my own eyes thank you very much, Why do you come on here and hate us British so much? There are many worse places on this planet.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        Easy to sum your comment up (wrong). Stop hating the British, you are are making yourself look like a immigrant yourself. :-)

    • GuybrushUlyssesThreepwood

      Bless

  • Kurt NY

    The question not being asked here is what the increased population will consist of. If the additional 20 million Britons or the additions to France’s population will consist mostly of unassimilated immigrants and their offspring, it seems far more likely that growth in both countries will be adversely impacted by increased societal discord. If instead the increases in population reflect genuine growth of reasonably assimilated and enculturated peoples, of whatever origin, it is likely that both will overtake Germany as the larger economy in Europe simply due to greater numbers – just to stay equal, the latter would need per capita GDP roughly 1/3 higher than its competitors.

    And, of course, being the largest economy in Europe might be good for bragging rights, but would not necessarily be indicative of competitiveness in the world or relative material well being of population.

    • Bonkim

      Well said Kurt.

    • Buddy Repperton

      Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor..

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        You Yanks are a bunch of big headed morons, you will fall one day. Always thinking that you are better than everyone else, you are just making yourself look like a c**t. As for Califonia and Texas. The only thing I would store there is nuclear waste. So keep your comments to yourself you daft pr*ck.

        • SonOfTheIsles

          Thankfully, you are old and not long for this world.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            He is old lol. So is the American dream, a pile of shite if you ask me :-)

          • TH

            William, I am British, living in America, and I am fully behind you. While I have met many intelligent Americans, and there are great things about the US, there can be a distinct inability to realise their own shortcomings. No one can shoot me down for this observation, as I have lived here for over two years now, and I have experienced it first hand. They think they are untouchable. There are a lot of people who are like ‘it’s our way or the highway.’ They need to do themselves a favour, and stop shooting themselves in the foot. It is a symptom of complete brainwashing and never having travelled beyond their own borders. The article about the UK being one of the poorest states if it were admitted to the union is laughable. It would add around 15% to US GDP. But I would not want our NHS ruined by some profiteering, greedy businessman who has the morals to charge $100, 000 + for cancer treatment of a dying patient, leaving the family bankrupt and homeless. God bless the USA huh?

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Thank you for your kind words (TH).
            I apologise that it has taken me a while to get back to you.
            I have no problem with the USA, it is just that they have this silly ‘we are the best at everything attitude’. All countries have good and bad points, it is the same for the UK.
            I travelled to the USA many years ago, I loved the (travelling) aspect and some of the people were fine. It was just a feeling I got with certain folks there that the rest of the world did not matter, now that did bemuse me slightly.
            How is it for you over there at present? I must admit the climate is slightly more palatable, but I will just have to endure the rain lol.
            I hope that you are having a good life over there and once again, thank you for the comment :-)

          • TH

            I love it over here. Don’t worry about the late reply. You are right, every country has its good points and bad points. There are things about America that are better than the UK, and vice versa. I like how here people havd such an excellent work ethic. We have lost that in the UK. But as we discussed in this thread, there are certain shortcomings! There are lots of things I enjoy. The summers here are stunning, however the winters are punishing. I love my career, and very thankful to be working here. So many opportunities. Where in the states did you travel to? Hope the crazy ex is not stalking you too much lol.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Wyoming, Califonia, Chicago. The country itself is stunning.
            Some people are decent enough in the states, it is just the odd one that tends to get a little too much at times.
            As for the crazy (ex) well, still no sign, thank my lucky stars lol. I hope that you have a good 25 December and holidays (TH). All the best, from Alex :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            What is wrong with that (guest) talking rubbish?

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            That guest is (smackmacdougal) the troll. They obviously do not have much of a social life. 😉

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Not at the moment lol. I think that is a luck thing though. According to (PutinsCoward), I am a paedophile, you see what I mean? They cannot help themselves, but make vile comments. So in order to communicate with the primate, I have stooped to his/her level and replied. I know it is not the correct way to go about things, but I will defend myself. Thank you for taking the time out to reply to me TH. :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            I almost forgot, I apologise about my crazy FBook name, it is to stop the EX from finding me, long story lol.
            Take care 😉

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            On a per cap basis, using prevailing cash exchange rates and after removing the effects of inflation, Americans are 1.16 times richer.

            Americans have the best survival rates on earth upon diagnosis for cancer. By comparison, Brits medicine is almost third world.

            There isn’t anything laughable about that.

            Good luck!

          • TH

            Cancer survival rates have nothing to do with whether it is NHS or private. There are many other factors. You may want to visit the UK. You only need to compare the taste of food between the two countries to see that the food in the US is far more “plastic” than anywhere else. The lax regulations of the U.S. that allow corporations to use cheap, toxic ingredients in their food for the sake of profit, means there is all kinds of rubbish in the food that leads to illness. Just look at WHO life expectancy figures, and you may be sadly disappointed to find that the United States has the worst life expectancy of the developed world.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            You have committed the fallacy of red herring when deflecting with the irrelevancy of food.

            It’s clear that you didn’t click on the link. What a shame that is.

            Removing death by injury and Americans have the highest life expectancy on earth.

            Americans have the highest cancer survival rates on earth from the point of intervention precisely because Americans have the best medicine available produced by the best medical practitioners trained in the best medical schools.

            Good luck!

          • TH

            I read the link. To be honest with you, it is utter crap. You could spend the high cost of good health care publically, or privately, it doesn’t matter. To be honest, I would rather think about the bigger picture, and have the attitude of looking after my fellow country folk, and educating people on prevention of illnesses, than having a greedy, profiteering system where you have to pay even to get a doctor to invite you in the room. I would rather spend $100, 000 on enjoying my life, than squeezing an extra year on my life. Maybe you should check those life expectancy figures, and look at the bigger picture. It’s not just about private vs public, it’s about trying to encourage a healthy society and do good for people. I would come down like a tonne of bricks on greedy corporations, and shift the focus to serving society, and not capitalizing on people’s misery. If that makes you sleep at night, good luck to you.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Whatever your hang ups are dude, you’ll need to work through those yourself over your lifetime.

            Good luck!

          • TH

            Hang ups? Haha. I have a good moral compass. I believe Obamacare, in its intent, is a good thing for the American health care system. It helps people who are not as well off get access to affordable health care, rather than leaving them for dead should something happen to them, where only the stinking rich could afford it. Kapish?

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            What you have are beliefs. And that you desire others to live by your beliefs, and that you might want to do something about it (e.g., agitate in public, vote, etc.) calls into question your claim of having a “good moral compass”.

            Nothing that is involuntary has its basis in goodness or morality.

            In so far as your beliefs that medical doctors are somehow “greedy” because someone must pay for a consultation, so the car mechanic is greedy selling his skill in purchase and sale of an honest trade in diagnostics to suss the problem with your broken car? So the attorney is greedy is greedy selling his skill in purchase and sale of an honest trade in diagnostics to suss your legal woes? So the athletic trainer is greedy selling his skill in purchase and sale of an honest trade in diagnostics of your lame exercise mechanics leading to weak results?

          • TH

            Your point is perfectly valid, but the power of your punch is self nullified. The NHS does not magically pay for itself. We pay for it through our taxes. So we are engaging in your enderingly termed “honest trade.” Doctors get paid very well in the UK. It is not the doctors I am referring to as greedy, it’s the system. I believe when it comes to health care, a socialist attitude is right. I believe you are a right winger republican, so my efforts here are probably futile, but I will at least try my best to highlight why I think this way.

            If you noticed someone dying of some vile illness, living in the wilderness (when we roamed the planes of Africa thousands of years ago), wouldn’t you feel that compassion to help that person? You helped nurse them back to health, then you said afterward “right, I want something in return.” Like seriously? If you knew before hand they had an inability to trade, you would have left them for dead. Is that right? You wouldn’t give them your everything, but you would at least take care of them to ensure they were ok. That is the good thing about the NHS. We have private health care in the UK, and if you have the money for that, good for you. But I think I would rather pay a little extra tax, knowing I am helping my fellow country men, than flittering away hundreds of billions on illegal wars for over exaggurted terrorist threats.

            I believe I do have a good moral compass, and I have convictions in my beliefs. This is what I feel is right, and I will never be swayed. I am proud of the NHS. I would hope that if you ever went to the UK, you would be delighted to take care of our free health care. If you break your leg on vacation there, we will not charge you. There you go. Aren’t we nice!

          • TH

            Or feel free to donate!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Nice comment (TH) I feel you are the one with the brains right now. He/ She is talking utter nonsense. Please tell me that not all American people are like this toad, thank you.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            We were ruling a large proportion of the globe whilst you noobs were still unsure of what you were pmsl. So try and compose your own messages for this page, rather than use the (copy & paste) function all the time.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Do you think America will go on forever?

            Do you think that America will be the last superpower?

            Do you think American human beings are superior to all other beings on the globe?

            If so, every word that you have (composed/copied/pasted) is totally worthless. Get the picture?

            I have seen far worse Americans than yourself spewing pro America fictional dross.

            If I want art, I will visit Italy or the far east.

            If I want engineering, I will buy German or Swiss.

            If I want a developing country, I will visit Brazil.

            If I want a breath taking holiday, I will visit Canada or New Zealand, Japan, Australia, Africa, quite a few more lol.

            If I want love, I will visit France.

            If I want culture then I will visit London, yes London.

            If I want to be sad and get shot and left for dead, then I will visit north America and run into you, you wouldn’t think twice, as life is so cheap.

            In the UK when WWI or WWII is mentioned. We like to think of it as an allied victory. Now you and I both know that there are some American folk that think that America won the war (Hollywood) style singlhandedly. When the truth is that Russia sacrificed the most in blood and graft. You try getting that through to a large proportion of American people, it is like wading through treacle.

            In one sense your appauling comments about the UK shows your insecurity and actually in a strange way people like you are useful. If there were no (troll) like people bashing the UK or America for instance, then both countries would be in serious decline. I have witnessed it for 11 years of being on the Internet. There will always be nasty comments about the UK and America, the likes of you and I will be long gone and the war of words will still flourish.

            I am not going to budge and nor will you. I suspect with you arrogance and fancy words that you think that you are the smartest person in the world, that doesn’t necessarily make it so. There are people on basic sites such as (youtube) (pro British/American) that make you and I like like Amateurs.

            As stated, America is 53 times bigger than the UK, it is pretty obvious that you have more resources, that doesn’t make you better people. Alas, that is the part that you cannot grasp, nor most likely never will. So the argument continues.
            Do you by any chance trawl the Internet and look for anything British? So that you can (be-little) if you like the UK?
            I am not really (Anti-American).
            The reasons are as follows.
            I respect native Americans, or (Indians) to you lol.
            I love black American soul music, do you?
            I accept my countries responsibilty for making America what it is today. Now I am not sure whether to boast or complain about that.
            Now after you have had another rant. You can have a glass of milk and calm down.
            Have a nice day :-)

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            The UK is nothing more that a Welfare State. The US State of California produces more than your puny country of 60 million people. Yet, California only has a population of 30 million, lol. Those are true facts, and you can’t work around facts. Hence, California has a higher GDP nominal than the UK and a higher GDP per capital ppp and nominal. California GDP nominal: 2.5 trillion. UK GDP nominal 2.4 trillion. Yet the uK is growing at -.9% whereas California is growing at 2.5% in GDP yearly. Also, Texas is on its way too. And Texas will surpass the UK in 2019. Like I said, this can’t happen in a Unitary state, only a bona fide Federal Republic like the USA with 50 states.
            I’m now over and out, kiddo. By the way, enjoy your Muslim invasion. And please send me a postcard when Allah finally takes the throne.

          • TH

            Of course I will! And you can send me post cards of charming Chinese buildings when you become China’s bitch in 20-30 years. You probably don’t realise it, but China is like a parasite that has a hold of your treasuries, and has a lot of control now. If they recalled their treasuries, the dollar would be in serious hot water my friend!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You still talking crap I see. You lot cannot even claim the moon landings as a (American/solo). Without rocket engineer ( Wernher Von Braun) you would not of even got off the launch pad. Largest empire in history, second behind you lot in the nobel prize list (we are 53 times smaller than the US). Show some respect, instead of ranting factless dross. Cheers.

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            WHO life expectancy figures? Why WHO? Why not UN? According to the UN, the US has one of the highest.

            Also, the USA is a Federal Republic with 50 states. And you can’t compare a puny British population to a population that’s 5x bigger, lol. Ignorant limeys like yourself, can’t accept the fact: The USA is a Federal Republic. Get it. The USA isn’t Unitary state
            , like the UK you uneducated buffon. And you’re living in the USA? I highly doubt that. You’re proof, that all Brits are filthly liars.

          • TH

            Who said I never accepted the USA is a federal republic? Haha. You are hilarious. And for your information, I am very well educated, and well travelled. You are probably like the typical American, who is untravelled, ignorant, and never stepped outside of your home state. Don’t blow smoke up my ass saying I don’t live here, because I do, and have seen the nature of your culture first hand. You are just too big headed and arrogant to accept it, which is another trait of your beloved Homeland. For your information, if a war were to break out between the US and the UK, we would bury each other alone. Stop thinking you are god’s gift to the world and invincible, and realise there are other ways of doing things. Haha, you can’t even stop Iran sending their war ships near the U.S. to provoke you anymore. Come down off your pedestal you moron.

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            Enjoy your Unitary state with your Muslim Guests, hahahaha.

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            You don’t live in America, you ignorant liar!!
            I just looked at your ISP Protocol and it shows you located in Manchester.
            Good one, though.

          • TH

            I do live here you fucking prick! My home town is near Manchester. Who are you to say I dont? I can show you plenty of proof I do. Hope I never meet you, or I will snap your neck. Asshole.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Are you old? What a shame.

        • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

          You ought to consider that calling others names makes you every bit of guilty of fitting those names.

          Now, if you’d like a dose of reality, check out this:

          If Britain were a U.S. state, it would be the second-poorest, behind Alabama and before Mississippi.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            That is if we became part of America, we ae much better than you think. As for the prat who started this petty argument, why don’t you scurry off and lecture him. Oh I forgot, you are an (American) and would never criticise one of your own. I shouldnt pay too much attention to the media if I were you, you could end up with egg on your face.
            So your post is most definitely irrelevant, as we will not be a part of America now or any time in the future.
            As for a ‘reality check’ as you stated in your above comment, you need to look closer to home.
            If you check the guy that had a pathetic dig at my country in the first place (Buddy Repperton) then you will see that he has been making sexual and lewd comments, hardly intelligent, is it? Get back to me on that one. If a large percentage of you American folk think like that guy, then your future generations are in big trouble.
            You are making yourself look foolish by defending a guy that talks about sex on a sensible page.
            You are just another embittered American trying to belittle my country, there are many more (troll) like people as yourself out there, unfortunately. Now we are done here, I am sorry that you got taken in by the media so easily.
            If you feel the need to discuss anything else, then I will reply, if am not busy. Have a nice day :-)

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            You don’t know what I think. What you have is a fantasy movie running through your head and it is from this fantasy that you felt compelled to act.

            Your reading comprehension fails you. No right-minded one would claim I have defended anyone from the foregoing comments.

            You wrote, “You Yanks are a bunch of big headed morons…” Likely, it is not the case that everyone in America fits your inapt description.

            In a comparison with Americans, Brits can’t be all that bright as they would be among the poorest Americans.

            Reality. Taste it and swallow it.

            Good luck!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You’re an idiot. Hiding behind the internet.
            Try and engage in a conversation using more than a few sentences.
            We wouldn’t be aong the poorest Americans, You just believe some over-hyped American media trash. Now how bright does that make you? Now go and fight an illegal war somewhere dunderhead.
            You still haven’t commented on Your Yank friend making sexual comments. You must really feel intimidated by my small island lol.
            We had the largest empire known to mankind, now you think about that.
            You pay me a visit to my smal town in England and spout your anti British shit to my face, see how big and clever you are then.
            Let your American friend defend himself, maybe he can get through a sentence without mentioning sex, I doubt it though.
            Pound or pound, great Britain is just as good as America, you simply cannot accept that fact lol. Surely that makes you deluded.
            BTW: I love arguing with dickheads like yourself.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Mere words have triggered you into rage. Look at you go!

            My words control your strings, and you, William Alexander Plumbasket, are my petite marionette. My words pull your strings and you dance for us, entertaining us.

            On an aside, you write, “Hiding behind the internet.” Hiding behind the Internet is a phrase. It is not a sentence and should not have a period. It belongs with a clause containing a subject and verb to constitute a sentence.

            And yet, here you are trying to call someone else an idiot.

            So what is your street address? The next time I visit England, I’ll come over. Do you have your NHS paper work in order?

            For a guy who likes to talk tough accusing others of hiding behind the Internet, you haven’t made it easy to find you.

            Good luck, um, genius!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Referring to punctuation now?

            Obviously you have lost this argument. As for my NHS paper work, you will need more than that.

            It is you that are far too stupid to acknowledge (for the third time) about the guy is using lewd sexual comments, now why is that?

            Hiding behind the internet is not a phrase in the UK, it is just that you retarded Yanks never did get the proper British accent or language. My spelling and punctuation are correct, so yes you are an idiot. Pay a visit to my little market town of (Bromyard), Google it. Say this to my face, see what happens.

            Funny how you do not concede where you live? Why is that?

            You Yanks have to pay for your medical attention, how pathetic is that.

            Google, Bromyard, Herefordshire, England. I don’t hide from dunderheads like you.

            We were talking about why you think America is so much better than the United Kingdom, so stick to the argument shithead. I will be here every day, so I expect you to be courteous too.
            I don’t lose arguments to ‘disgruntled’ Yank folk. I have seen a thousand like you just out to jest about the British way of living, fair enough. There is no need to pretend that you are better, as that stinks of ignorance on your part as well. I await your insulting message tonight. Maybe you should visit me and disrespect my family, I presume that you have insurance?
            At this present moment in time, I am proverbially wiping the floor with you. my punctuation is correct, unless you want me to ignore this American made automatic spell checker that appears on this particular page. As you already will know.
            When you come over, I will expect you to pay for my cups of tea, I might buy you one if you are not greedy.
            We cannot make this a date, as I am not that way inclined, please do not feel sad about this.
            I understand that you probably only have so much time on the (WEB) before you have to go to bed :-)
            I must be honest, I am actually starting to enjoy this, now you know that you have to reply, it is an American thing, as you started this little fight lol. failure to reply mean the loss of this argument. You do understand the rules now, don’t you?
            Sorry I haven’t had much time to compile a large message tonight, but I have to go to (work). Do you work/ Or are you on, now let me think a moment (welfare), that I what they call it where you live? Or are you going to boast and say that you are a millionaire blah blah blah lol. I work with my stepfather, cabinet maker, you will probably belittle me by saying ‘low life employment’. At least I make an effort and the money is pretty useful. Must go now, as it is getting light. Kiss kiss.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Your ignorance lost you the argument long ago.

            Say, mate, likely there is a mental health hotline you can call in the UK. Likely the call is free, but you must pick up your phone, if you have one.

            Your family will thank you. If you have any, your friends shall thank you as well.

            Good luck!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Look, calm down. You know that you want me.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            I am attracted to your arrogance :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You love the thought of my presence up your windsock :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Phone lol? Oh yes.
            There was no argument to lose, you never put forward a strong enough case. Now keep up.
            Remember, it was you that got sucked in by the media, not me. Do you believe all the television commercials as well? I bet you must be real fun when you go out for drinks with your mates lol.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            As for ignorance (SmackMacDougal), it is you that picked up the first bullshit article online and gave me the link.
            Having serious doubts to you being ‘American’. I suspect that you are a little closer to home than that. This is the reason that you will not provide me with a rough idea as to where you reside.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Friends? Easy one this, more than you.
            Do you have a girlfriend by any chance, or are you a singlehanded type of guy? :-) :-) :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Still waiting for your details Dougal. Where is your proper avatar picture? What have you got to be ashamed of then? Hurry up and get back to me.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Have you ever been bitten when you have had intercourse with the life form on your avatar picture Dougal? If you have, make sure that you get that animal checked out by your local veterinary surgeon.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Great Britain forever, now Scotland wimped out of the (yes) vote lol.
            Now you jog off and live in your favourite country, maybe you will find someone desperate enough to tie the knot with you.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Why you gone quiet for?
            I will be back tonight to keep you company and help you through your time of need, you will never leave England :-) :-) :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Are you watching the television adverts and seeing what bargains you can find in your local supermarket?
            90% of what you read online is total baloney, I thought that a (so called) intelligent person like yourself would have noticed this little fact.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Don’t forget to thank me for replying, you know that you like me and would be devastated if I didn’t get back to you, I will always be here for you. I cannot let you in my back gate though, people would talk. 😉

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Why don’t you use a picture of yourself on your avatar, instead of your wife, I have noticed that you are hiding your identity. I will not take offence if you prefer miffins bridge, that is your preference when all things are considered.

          • ian steven

            smackmacdougal left something out in his calculations w.a.p..china and japan own a hell of a lot of his country.the financial genius forgot about the size of his countrys debt.here is my mail to him.

            you are not taking into account the respective debt levels of the uk and
            the usa when comparing the levels of wealth of each country.
            i
            believe the national debt of the usa just now is almost $17.6 trillion
            the uk debt level is $2.2 trillion.the total additional debt burden of
            the usa over that of the uk is approx $6 trilliion which equates to
            $20000 of debt for every citizen of the usa.

          • TH

            Agreed! Not to mention, by the rules of US government, the UK would have around a 20% representation in Washington! I’m inclined to say, the influence would be crippling!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Nice one mate. I agree.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Trust me, I am not angry my dear, I just hope that you show me the attention that I deserve, so you best get back to me or I will cry and it will be your fault lol.

          • ian steven

            you are not taking into account the respective debt levels of the uk and the usa when comparing the levels of wealth of each country.
            i believe the national debt of the usa just now is almost $17.6 trillion.the uk debt level is $2.2 trillion.
            the total additional debt burden of the usa over that of the uk taking into account the population difference of the two countries is approx $6 trilliion.this equates to every citizen of the usa owing $20000 more in debt than every citizen of the uk

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            First, by your words above, you don’t seem to understand what wealth is.

            The name for property put to purchase and sale for cash and credit is wealth.

            A new bicycle traded in a purchase and sale from a retailer to a cyclist is wealth, but only in that moment of trade. Once trade ceases, so to does wealth cease.

            If the cyclist puts that bicycle on offer at a rummage sale and no one buys the bicycle, clearly, the bicycle isn’t wealth. It’s mere possession. The cyclist retains property in the bicycle, but the bicycle isn’t wealth as it does not trade for trade quantities of purchasing.

            Second, you don’t seem to understand public finance, especially with respect to the United States.

            The U.S. Congress has a debt. Any adult might or might not have a personal debt irrespective to what the members of past and present Congresses have done by imposing duty upon themselves and giving rights of action by holders of bonds.

            The U.S. Congress would like to impose taxation law upon enough adult individuals getting them to pay for their debt.

            However, it’s mere mythology and parroted by the unthinking of the citizens owing a debt incurred by Congress merely by taking the sum of the congressional debt and dividing that by the total population.

          • ian steven

            you would not know what wealth is if it smacked you in the face.
            you do not seem to understand that debt has to be paid back in interest and capital and this greatly reduces the money/wealth available to spend.
            i repeat every citizen in the usa owes $20000 more in debt than citizens in the uk.to put it simply the usa is living way above its means and china japan and various other countries are financing you’re countries spending spree.
            sorry to break this news to you,must come as a great shock and all that.
            all the goverment debt figures for the usa and uk are readily available to view online and i understand them very well.
            you will note no anti usa rants etc. i love you’re country.all the best to you

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Debt doesn’t get paid back with capital.

            You don’t understand commerce nor public finance.

            Good luck!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Are you Scottish by any chance? That vote must of really hurt you a few moths back lol. If you had of left us, you were finished pmsl. You know it as well.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            smackmacdougal. How many more names are you hiding behind?

            Are you ugly?
            Do you have bad breath?
            Do you find it difficult to communicate with members of the opposite sex?
            Do you ever leave your parents bedroom?
            You see where this is going, don’t you? :-)

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            Go back to moms basement and look at your child porn.
            Your avatar seems to fit the picture. Get the needed help that you deserve, kiddo.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Yes, let me at your siblings you cunt, I will turn them into adults, yum yum. At least I have the guts to use an avatar. Now where is yours you pathetic Yank coward pmsl?

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            By the way, you talk like a (typical Yank). I wouldn’t expect any better. You rants on my great country make you look like a terrorist. By the way, you gutless lot couldn’t & wouldn’t even join the war efforts WWI & WW2 till you lot knew you could help win, what does that say about you. It has took you over six months to think up these tame insults. Easy for you to insult me, why don’t you pop over to my (puny) island as you stated and say it to my face. Gutless Yank, no go start a war on a country that cannot defend itself. Why don’t you lot pick on Russia, they would erase you from history completely. I could live happily ever after then. Now let’s see you picture. Are you overweight and have hygiene issues? 6 moths to reply to me using another profile, sums you dumb Yanks up in one lol.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Puny island? My ancestors have done more for the modern world than you Yanks could ever hope to achieve in a thousand years. Jealousy is so abhorrent.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You lose.
            I have a postcard with a picture of the twin towers on it. Is it worth more money now? Do you want to buy it for ten pound £££ pmsl :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            I do not want you taking six months again to insult me, it is funny lol. So get back to me and consume my fudge :-)

          • TH

            Exactly! They do not understand how integrated the Chinese are into the U.S. economy. If it’s an investor, most of the time, you hear they are Chinese. They are putting the money in to grow the U.S. economy, because, wait for it, their national debt is twice their GDP. Last time I took a wealth 101 class, isn’t your wealth/net worth your = assets – liabilities? I would love someone to argue that precarious reality.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Thank you. There is a guy that keeps changing his profile without an (avatar) talking shite and calling me a “paedophile”. See what I mean? So I have stooped to this guys level for a couple of messages, just so he can understand. Your words are correct.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            We owe you Yanks nothing. You live in a dream world.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            I blew you out of the water before and I will do it all over again.
            Please tell your parents that you love them very much. Then commit suicide in the most horrible fashion you can divise. You will not be missed. Go spread your (anti British) crud elsewhere.
            As for you being ‘clever’ as you put it. Wouldn’t a person with a decent background show a little more respect to a country that pressed forward with the (industrial revolution)? I don’t know what your beef is with the UK, but it seems to me like you have go it on you, not just with me, judging by some of your dizzy comments. That is the problem with the Americans, never could accept defeat.

          • TH

            Well said William! America will be remembered, when it becomes China’s bitch in 20 years, as the country that waged illegal wars, and gave quality like Miley Cyrus….Britain started the world as we know it. Something to shout about!

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Nicely said TH. Just some of the American folks comments are unbelievable at times.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Love it, nicely said mate :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            So the moral of the story is. No reality check, just more anti British propaganda that some idiot (mentioning no names) stumbled into online. Here is another one for you.
            China will most likely be the dominant force in under 50 years time, it will not matter to you and I, but that is the likely scenario. All great empires come to an end. Roman Empire, Ottoman Empire, Mongol Empire, British Empire, Spanish Empire. the list goes on, or do the Yanks think that they will go on forever? I suppose all the leaders thought that at one time or another. Now wouldn’t you agree Dougal, surely to believe that your country is better than the rest of the worlds countries, is absolute ‘ignorance’ of the highest calibre? Yet you defend the Yanks and get ankle deep up their sphincter with just your soles of your feet showing. We both have an opinion, I won’t back down and neither will you, simple as that.

          • gamble mandem

            The figures in that article are adjusted for Purchasing Power Parity, which isn’t a suitable indicator for measuring economic strength at all.

            Here’s a dose of reality for yourself:

            Britains per capita GDP is larger than any individual south Eastern US state. London’s GDP Per Capita is higher than the vast majority of US states.
            Lastly, the entire UK economy would make it the richest US state by a few hundred Billion dollars. You wouldn’t want a colossal economic power like the UK as a 51st state … we’d make you our bitch.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Meanwhile, Brits are the bitches of Americans already.

            But that aside, you don’t seem to understand the concept of purchasing power parity (PPP). PPP equalizes cash of various banking systems, leveling such to par so as to make comparisons accurate.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Do you need me to give you a contact number so that you can get the medical help you so need? I am so sorry that you have not managed to balance your medication :-)

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You are saying ‘people don’t understand’ on here. Maybe it is you that has become so deluded with that (shithouse) you love so much. Maybe they should have you in power so that innocent marines can go and fight another (pointless) bloody war. I bet that would make you really happy, now that would be a profit for the US. I grant you that the only time America as a whole sticks it’s head above the parapet, is when there is a chance of testing it’s weapons lol. More innocent people dead, well done. Pat yourself on the back.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You have taken a serious beating in this room, it is just you that cannot see it pmsl :-) :-):-)

          • gamble mandem

            You dont know what you’re talking about. I haven’t said anything that can be regarded as an explanation as to how PPP is calculated, or what it means. So how you think you can have any idea of my understanding of it as at a concept is simply bizarre.

            I simply pointed out that it is not a suitable indicator for measuring overall economic strength. It certainly is not a measurement that can be justifiably used to make the claim that Britain is “poorer than any US state, other than Mississippi”.

            Britain has a 3 trillion dollar economy.

          • PUTINISCOWARD
          • PUTINISCOWARD

            Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor..

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            Britains per capita GDP is larger than any individual south??
            Where did you learn math?
            Florida, Georgia, Virginia, and NC have larger GDP per capitals than the UK. I know what your problem is, you’re uneducated and you don’t know the difference between GDP ppp and GDP nominal. Sure your GDP ppp is going to be higher in the UK because you use the Pound. GDP nominal is a figure used on the World Stage. Hence, the US Dollar is the Worlds currency/reserve. Whereas, the Pound is nothing more than Monopoly Money on the International World Stage, lol.
            My God, are Limeys this ignorant?
            Wither way, the UK will fall in the gutter when the Muslim Conquest has ended and you have a Muslim King or Queen, lol.
            Enjoy your Muslim Invasion and Holy war, kiddo. Like bad weather, a puny island, fat women, and terrible food wasn’t enough. hahahahaha

          • gamble mandem

            Wow, you’ve got to be the thickest yank I’ve ever seen with an internet connection. None of those states have a larger GDP per capita than the UK. This isn’t even up for discussion, it’s a fact.

            “Sure your GDP ppp is going to be higher in the UK because you use the Pound.”

            Eh? Hahaha, you’re so stupid. The UK GDP ppp is lower than the US, not higher. It’s lower because things here are more expensive to purchase. That’s what your ridiculously flawed article is basing it’s wild claim that the UK would be the poorest state on. In reality the UK would have one of the higher end GDP per capita (nominal) of the US states ($46,243.589 as of 2015), and it would have by far the largest economy of any state (over 3 trillion as of 2015).

            Read the stats you dozy yank

            http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2014/02/weodata/weorept.aspx?pr.x=13&pr.y=3&sy=2014&ey=2015&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&c=112&s=NGDPD%2CNGDPDPC%2CPPPGDP%2CPPPPC&grp=0&a=

          • Jordan Keogh

            think this must be bullshit pal, as america has gross domestic product of 16.8 trillion dollars and the uk 2.5 trillion dollars. If your saying that 50 of americas states are richer than the uk then (50*2.6 trillion dollars)=130 trillion dollars. The maths doesn’t even nearly add up

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            First, you are off by almost THREE-FOURTHS OF ONE TRILLION ($17,555 billion vs $16,800 billion).

            Second, I made no claims. The writer of the article, which I provided the link made claims.

            There is the article again. It’s not mine.

            If Britain were a U.S. state, it would be the second-poorest, behind Alabama and before Mississippi.

            Third, by your math, you reveal that you don’t understand the concept.

            On a per capita basis, Americans are 1.29 times richer than Brits based on prevailing cash exchange rates ($55,553.80 vs $45,859.13).

            The economy of the United States of America is the equivalent of almost six United Kingdoms, 5.8 times bigger to be precise.

            If you can, imagine another five United Kingdoms suddenly existing on the earth. If all six were ruled by the same MPs in Westminster, you would have one USA.

            On a per cap basis, using prevailing cash exchange rates and after removing the effects of inflation, Americans are 1.16 times richer.

            That’s reality.

          • Jordan Keogh

            nice copy and pasting work there 😉 even with your increased value of GDP for the US my point still stands. The debt levels of the US are astronomical, each US citizen has to bear the brunt of that. Debt per citizen in the US is 56000$, in the UK it is 26000$. There is some disparity in the figures as you can imagine, now you said that on a per capita basis a US citizen generates 55500 $ and a UK citizen 45800$. If debt was factored into the equation you can see that a citizen of the UK would be vastly ahead of a US citizen. The debt is real my friend it has to be payed back and it cannot be ignored. I don’t even want to start talking about the interest being payed on that debt, especially considering americas credit rating downgrade. Also just looking at the money sides of things is rather one dimensional seeing as we have free healthcare and education. Americans have to pay for expensive health insurance which again decreases the real amount of money each citizen has. The rampant income inequality of america is also worrying, although the UK suffers the same problem it is less prominent as the US due to the free healthcare/education and the large welfare state.

          • http://bizarrotheater.blogspot.com/ SmackMacDougal

            Not so nice lame ad homimem there, Justin.

            I’ll write it one more time for those slow. This is someone else’s work:

            If Britain were a U.S. state, it would be the second-poorest, behind Alabama and before Mississippi.

            THIS IS MY WORK:

            1) On a per capita basis, Americans are 1.21 times richer than Brits based on prevailing cash exchange rates (US$55,553.80 vs US$45,859.13). In short, the random picked American will have 21% more income than than the random picked Brit.

            The economy of the United States of America is the equivalent of almost six United Kingdoms, 5.8 times bigger to be precise.

            2) On a per cap basis, using prevailing cash exchange rates and after removing the effects of inflation, Americans are 1.16 times richer. So, in truth, the random picked American will have 16% more income than than the random picked Brit.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You are getting anally fucked by a few people on here pmsl. Is your bumhole gaping from the British meat that is fucking you left right and centre. You are giving me a good laugh running up to Christmas. Now you will be my (bitch) and reply to me so that you can give me a good laugh. Do not let me down.

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            You look like a X Rated version of Benny Hill. Go clean up your act, you filthy Limey.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            After I turn you into a corpse, you overrated Yank cancerous tumour.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Take no notice of him mate, you cannot reason with (him/it). It is obviously an American fanboy brown ankle lol.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            America is at least 53 times bigger than the UK and you are trying to show off like a little school boy. If the majority of the people in America are like you, then the time for America as a (super-power) will be greatly limited lol :-)
            Suck it up conveyor belt tongue :-)

          • PUTINISCOWARD

            America is a Federal Republic with 50 states/countries. Hence, each US State has its own flag, economy, food, culture, military, leaders, consituation, and ect. I said California had a bigger economy than the UK which is true. Even GDP per capital is bigger in California than the UK. Hell, even the BBC will agree with me:

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            I am not the one that has used sexual comments am I now?
            Read his comments before you start throwing stones :-)
            Or should I call you ‘smackmacdougal’?
            How sad :-)

        • PUTINISCOWARD

          My God, you’re nothing but a typical Autistic Brit. You offered no rebuttal for him, only insults. Which tells me: You’re the uneducated moron. And by looking at your picture, I’m not that way off, either. Enjoy your Muslim population, your puny island, and poor weather mate 😉

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Obviously you have no (avatar), so what does that say about you?

        • PUTINISCOWARD

          It’s obvious you’ve never been to the USA and never will.
          I’ve visited the UK 3 times, and It’s nothing but a puny crowded island full of Muslim who hate the UK. I would rather live in wide open space, than live on an island with whiny women who’re some the ugliest women in the World.
          And you’re proof of that when two ugly retarded people conceive. Good luck with life, kiddo. Oh, and I’ll speak my comments wherever I like. And guess what, there’s nothing you can say or do about it. You’re worthless, and I own you.

      • gamble mandem

        You might wanna check those numbers again buddy. The UK economy eclipses California’s.

        • PUTINISCOWARD

          I checked them Buddy. Anybody with a 4th grade education can see that I’m showing facts.
          Hence, The UK is nothing more that a Welfare State. The US State of California produces more than your puny country of 60 million people. Yet, California only has a population of 30 million, lol. Those are true facts, and you can’t work around facts. Hence, California has a higher GDP nominal than the UK and a higher GDP per capital ppp and nominal. California GDP nominal: 2.5 trillion. UK GDP nominal 2.4 trillion. Yet the UK is growing at -.9% whereas California is growing at 2.5% in GDP yearly. Also, Texas is on its way too. And Texas will surpass the UK in 2019. Like I said, this can’t happen in a Unitary state, only a bona fide Federal Republic like the USA with 50 states.
          I’m now over and out, kiddo. By the way, enjoy your Muslim invasion. And please send me a postcard when Allah finally takes the throne.

        • PUTINISCOWARD

          GDP: All goods and services. And GDP nominal is a tool used on the World stage because the US Dollar is the Worlds currency/reserve, not the British pound, lol.
          Good luck living in moms basement. Maybe you can find a hood rat to make love too. If you’re lucky. However, don’t expect teeth and a charming personality. Also, keep your belongings safe because It’s likely she’ll have a major drug habit.

      • https://www.joshuaissac.com/ Joshua Issac

        “California has a bigger and better economy than the UK”

        You are funny man, Buddy. England alone has a larger economy than California. But just “keep drinking the Kool-Aid”, as you Americans say.

      • http://www.facebook.com/deian.mountbatten Deian Mountbatten

        Most people who are intelligent enough to understand our British humour don’t live in Britain, and mostly aren’t even British.

    • Vera Morgan

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  • Smithersjones2013

    Why Britain’s economy will overtake Germany’s

    Priceless. We should all cheer because we are going to become the top country in what is clearly the economic zombie continent. Whoopsie Do. Who cares. Its the rest of the world we need to be comparing ourselves with not the EU crippled nations of Europe.

    • Fergus Pickering

      America looks pretty prosperous to me. And being English is such a blessing we should try to spread it everywhere. We could ditch all the foreign influenced Marxists – -bloody French AS WELL AS bloody Germans.

    • ud6

      I agree, but there is no strong link between prosperity and population size. Ireland (4.6m), Greece (11.3m) and Portugal (10m) all have small populations.

      • bramhall

        So do Norway and Switzerland; but their average income per capita is two and a half times and twice that of the UK respectively

    • William Alexander Plumbasket

      Oh yea. As Wiki is known for being accurate, I think not. Now isn’t Wiki based in America? Say no more. If you don’t like great Britian then tough. Largest empire known to mankind, so you keep sucking up to America lol.

  • Clive Mather

    Hmm. It would not need ‘miracles’ of German productivity for their economy to outperform ours in 40-50 years. If the German population was about 64 million versus 80 million in the UK, they would just have to have 125% of our productivity per head of population at the end of this period for the German economy to match ours. It is also worth reflecting on how the statistics for ‘size’ of an economy are built up. Germany has very stable property prices – the price of housing hasn’t changed much in 30 years – whereas in the UK, housing continues to inflate even though wages stagnate. If property prices are used to measure the size of an economy, the UK will indeed appear to be an economic superstate; it might be more sensible to regard ever-increasing house prices as a form of inflation (if you can ‘earn’ a small fortune by just occupying your dreary noddy-box or London cubby-hole, you are being rewarded for doing nothing). Exports in Germany account for 40%+ of their GDP; for the UK, the figure is around 20%. Their youth unemployment rate is about a third of ours; their education system, and not just for a gilded elite, is far superior. Now that Adolf’s regime is long gone and the nasty GDR has been consigned to history, Germany is an increasingly pleasant country in which to live (I intend to move there). The UK, in contrast, gets nastier year by year.

    • Fergus Pickering

      The UK suits me. The trouble with Germany is that it is full of Germans. And you know what it is with them. Self-satisfaction and dreams of world domination. I hope you will be happy there. And close the door as you go out.

      • Clive Mather

        Dear Fergus, Thanks for your informed and bias-free response. Germans are of course obsessed with dreams of world domination, and they all eat sausages and sauerkraut and wear dirndls or lederhosen. We of course are different. Our ‘special relationship’ with the world’s mightiest superpower has allowed a succession of neo-imperialist clowns to fantasise that Britain is a world power, and send our troops to fight pointless wars. It really is getting a bit embarrassing – Uncle Sam’s government nowadays can’t even be bothered to disguise the fact that the UK is there to do US bidding.
        We really ought to take stock, aim for a normal (but friendly) relationship with the US, and concentrate on genuine defence of these islands. We also should stop pretending we do things differently because we’re cleverer than everybody else (e.g. the Germans!) – by and large we do things differently because we’re too stupid or arrogant to acknowledge that others may do things better. This is particularly noticeable in education. Most countries don’t attempt to teach kids to read until 6 or 7. These countries (especially Finland) have far more effective primary education than us. This fact has been known for years, but of course our system of forcing babes in nappies to read and write is ‘obviously’ better. Stands to reason dunnit.
        I see no change in direction on the horizon. We will carry on getting the products of the Oxford madrassa in 10 Downing Street, to inflate the housing market, encourage employers to offer unskilled jobs at low pay to a teeming population, to send troops to do Uncle Sam’s work and to offer punitive education.On present form the UK in the future will be a free, prosperous and beautiful country – just like Poland under communism.

        • Buddy Repperton

          Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor.

          Let’s also not forget: Scotland is leaving the UK, lol. Will a UK even exist after that transition, lol..

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            You live in a dream world.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        Well said Fergus. He will not be missed.

    • Buddy Repperton

      Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor.

      Let’s also not forget: Scotland is leaving the UK, lol. Will a UK even exist after that transition, lol.

      • William Alexander Plumbasket

        The United Kingdom was dominating over most of the planet whilst you dumb Yanks were still wiping your asses with dock leaves. We will be here long after you Yanks have wiped yourselves out, the sooner the better hopefully. So stop talking anti British shite and do one, as no one really gives a shit about your sad sexual comments.

  • celtthedog

    Well, we can always dream can’t we?
    If British demographic growth is dependent upon mass migration of semi-skilled and unskilled Muslims and North Africans (as it is at present) — bet on the Krauts.
    I also wouldn’t put it past the Krauts to engineer a baby boom — as you noted, they are very good at making things. As a people, they do tend to get the job done once they get their marching orders.
    Finally, if the Eurozone does condemn nations to permanent economic decline (and Eurosceptic that I am, I believe the jury is still out on that one), this will be recognized and countries will start to leave. In fact, I could see Germany leading the charge out if they believe their economic interests are being harmed.
    Britain overtaking France I can see — but I’ll need more evidence than what is presented in here to believe that we’ll be seeing the Krauts in the rearview mirror anytime soon.
    My BMW says you’re wrong.

    • PaderB

      And your BMW says that seceding from the EU by the UK is also right. Lord Digby Jones, the Business Minister at the last Labour Government (and the only Minister not to have ANY party affiliation) whilst speaking at the UKIP Conference was negative about the UK leaving the EU from a personal perspective. However, his closing remark upon finishing his speech was: “I will tell you one thing though; If the UK does leave, we will have a Trade Agreement with the EU within 24 hours”.

      The CEOs of BMW, Mercedes, VW and all of the other European car manufacturers, not to mention all of the ‘white goods’ manufacturers who export to the UK will NOT allow any other course of action.

  • Dave Hogarth

    Are you joking! A country which favors financial expansion over sustainable industry. A government which is loading up a generation on debt. You think we are even close the Germans? Do you understand the technical advantage and head start they have?

  • NotYouNotSure

    Having a quick look at the nations with the fastest growing populations (on CIA and Wikipedia), I see nations like Niger, Afghanistan and Liberia at the top, so according to this authors logic these places will also have the fastest growing economies then.

    • PaderB

      You cannot compare Niger, Afghanistan and Liberia with a European economy. It is entirely a matter of scale. 1% of 1 Trillion is 10 Billion; 1% of 10 Million is 100,000. I know that these are just figures taken from out of the air, but they illustrate what I mean.

    • Bonkim

      you have to look at rate of increase and the base where the increase starts. Furthermore social organisation, and available skills/technology and ability to innovate/improvise are major factors in economic growth – some of the countries you refer to are still in the dark ages in regard to these factors.

  • Ben Kelly

    You need a stable society for this to happen, on our current course we will have a balkanised society of people divided by racial and cultural differences, an unskilled and ill educated workforce, a loss of cultural identity, an out of touch and incompetent elite ruling the nation alongside an intelligentsia of ideologues turning the thinking population into conformist sheep. I am far more pessimistic, i’d rather take a temporary hit to GDP and have a stable society than have a fragmented massive population.

  • volker_lives

    This is priceless, an illustration of the absurdities of simple extrapolation over long time horizons (and yes, climatology comes to mind). However there is one serious point to make concerning the need to adjust GDP for exchange rate effects. The Russian rouble is seriously undervalued, probably because investors doubt an economy based just on extracting oil and gas as fast as possible (and Putin). World Bank PPP GDP puts Russia just above Germany, once output is adjusted for actual purchasing power.

  • tolpuddle1

    We’re all going to get sucked into the Eurozone depression. As for “fastest-growing economy”, we’ve also got the most overcrowded and the fastest-growing population.

    So our population will soon overtake Germany (you quote us at 62 million; 70 million is the real figure). Declare a day of national celebration, immediately! But Germany has rather more room, doesn’t it ?

    And Germany has a cohesive society and a future; we don’t.

    The article is, to put it coarsely, nothing more than a willy-measuring competition; charmingly boyish, but of no relevance to the world of grown ups.

    But cheer up Matt; I hear Britain is “on track” to be the first nation on Pluto AND the first to reach complete social and political catastrophe.

  • Ronnie

    Absolute hogwash coming from Spectator. Toppling Germany is a dream which will be missed by miles.

    • Fergus Pickering

      We toppled the buggers twice before.

      • Ben Kelly

        Ha ha, we did did we? Well, the first time we just about got there in the end thanks to mobilisation of the empire. The second time we were ritually humiliated for three years, then we’re occupied by our American friends who thankfully allied with us, but on the condition that we became financially dependant and dismantled our global power status, oh, and of course there was the dignified alliance with the vicious, murderous Stalin and his Communist empire which ended up ruling Poland, the nation we signed up to defend but never did, which was what dragged us into the war at time we declared it- leading to our humiliation by Germany and Japan. Then after our great victory came our great toppling. Marvellous victory indeed. We stopped ourselves capitulating and being occupied and servile, thank heavens for that, but let’s not indulge in this world war victory mythology too much eh. Two world wars. Now Germany is the power of continental Europe, Europe has no borders, Belgium is not a proper nation, Britain has no empire, anti-semitism is alive and well in Europe and Britain, socialist and communist ideology lives on in various forms too and Britain is not an independent country but is increasingly ruled by a parliament and courts not on these shores.VICTORY!

        Sorry… meant to say, TWO WORLD WARS AND A WORLD CUP! ! ! YEAH!

        • William Alexander Plumbasket

          I lost two relatives in WWII you moron. The battle of Britain was a turning point in WWII, you obviously know nothing about history Ben. If you have no faith in my great country then I will help you pack, go live in America.
          America did not save the day as you put it. I think you have been drinking far too much cheap lager and watching too many Hollwood movies for your own good. It was an allied victory by many brave sides to defeat the axis of evil. No one side would of toppled Germany as they organised over 20 years under a dictator, which does not make them superior human beings to the rest of the world population. We may not have an empire any more, but look at it this way Ben “better to have been a has been than a never been”, now there are plenty of countries to fit that list aptly. I would rather belong to Britain than Japan or Germany, that is for sure, maybe you should go and live there Ben, they would really like you. We were not Humiliated by Japan and Germany, that was a lot of propaganda. Someone should of told the America public that WW I started in 1914 and WW II started in 1939. I have relatives who (brown nose) America just like you, so I know what you lot are like. Personally you can have them. I have said my part now Ben, if you don’t like the UK, then just leave, simple as that.

          • Ben Kelly

            You are clearly too simple to properly understand what I was saying. I did not “brown nose” America, I called them ‘our American friends’ with more than a hint of sarcasm. They entered WWII entirely out of self interest, not to “save the day” or to help Britain. IN 1939 Britain “Stood alone” but was practically bankrupt and did not have the resources to wage war on Germany. The United States used the opportunity to strip the assets of the UK, this is a matter of FACT.

            Having already defaulted on our debts to the US from WWI (after which we had already lost much of our interests in South America to the US) the US was embittered and determined to neutralise Britain as a rival, once and for all. “Lend lease” saw the US provide us with the means of waging war, but in return we were forced to transfer the entirety of the Empires life savings, the majority of our gold reserves, across the Atlantic in convoys.

            Semi-secret records, uncovered in the 1970’s by the journalist Alfred Draper, recorded the rapidly increasing tonnage of gold being hurried to the USA via Canada. We may never know how much of this gold was sent to the USA – at least £500,000,000 at 1940 prices, an immense sum. By handing it to the USA we completely altered the balance of wealth between the Europe and America, forever. It is why we had to retreat from Empire so hastily post-WWII, we were bankrupted. How on Earth I am brown nosing America, I do not know.

            It is you that does not know your history, you think being patriotic is believing in myth instead of seeking the truth. We were not humiliated by Japan? The surrender of Singapore (one of the clearest signals to our colonies that we could not protect them, a catalyst for independence movements everywhere) was a humiliation, it was lost easily and many of our men were taken as POWs and severely mistreated. We also retreated and surrendered Burma and feared Japan might march into India. The Japanese offensive cut through us like a knife through butter, these retreats were a death knell for the British Empire.

            And, i’m sorry, as romantic and heroic as the Dunkirk escape was, it was not a victory of any kind. It was a severe defeat, a retreat, a surrender. It was Germany making Britain look foolish. We dived head first into the war without a strategic thought in our heads, sent a tiny expeditionary force to the continent, which was then easily pushed back into one of the worst defeats the British army has ever suffered (along with Singapore). This doesn’t diminish the braver of any of our soldiers of the brave people who helped them escape. It is just an undeniable fact.

            Now, Admitting FACTS is not un-patriotic or self loathing or being anti-British. I’m sorry to cut through much cherished myths but replying by saying “why don’t you go live in Japan then” makes you sound immature and moronic. Picking apart the mistakes made by our government and the mistakes made in the past, is the duty of the patriot. Believing in myth, and blindly supporting everything the rulers of your country ever does is the behaviour of a conformist sheep.

            We “won” WWII by allying ourselves with Stalin’s evil empire and with the United States doing much of the heavy lifting on the western front. This is the truth of the matter. It doesn’t insult your relatives or mine, or diminish the courage and spirit of those that fought. The sad fact is we leapt into the war too early and without any kind of strategy. We declared war without the armed forces or the finances to fight, allowing the US to act as a bailiff to a desperate bankrupt. By the time Churchill became PM we were already at war and he did the right thing by refusing to deal with Nazi Germany, because the terms of peace would have been crippling.

            If, however, we had bided our time, Germany would have turned east and weakened themselves as their war against Russia was the the real objective of their war. They had no intention of invading and occupying Britain. Much like WWI they sought to neutralise France so they could turn east and attack Russia without worrying about their western flank. Just like WWI the British ruling class decided to leap into the war unprepared which cost us dearly.

            We were on the winning side of WWII, but after the war we were bankrupt, no longer able to sustain our empire, no longer a great power, and completely and utterly within the USA’s sphere of influence. This is a strange kind of victory, it is a victory, and we can be thankful we were never occupied by an enemy, but it is not one we should be bombastically boasting about all the time as if we were the winners of a football match.

            Both great wars saw the ruling class horrible fumble foreign policy decisions and make huge mistakes that diminished us forever. Pointing this out does not make me anti-British or un-patriotic you simple minded ignoramus. If you don’t like it, fuck off you unlearned slob.

          • William Alexander Plumbasket

            Bring it on you sad fuck, pay me a visit to my local town (details provided) and say this to my face. Me in prison and you eternal darkness. All your above ranting is factless shit, now go and bad mouth someone who gives a fuck.

        • William Alexander Plumbasket

          Nevermind Ben. Easy to call me a ‘moron’ and tell me to ‘fuck off’. I see that you have used the (copy&paste) function to make yourself look more intelligent than you actually are. I absolutely hate liars. So I am inviting you to my local town (Bromyard) to be disrespectful to my friends and families faces. I do not expect you to be on your feet for many seconds, I really do mean that Ben. Being disrespectful towards brave British servicemen and women will not win you any friends. I will try once more to get this through your thick skull Mr Dunderhead. It was a brave allied effort that defeated Nazi Germany, no one country could of done so. Russia gave the greatest sacrifice in lives, as the saying goes they ‘bled Germany white’. I do realise that you can play your mouth and act like the big man trying to impress people with your bad attitude and factless dross that you have been churning out on this page, but if you haven’t got anything positive to say about the country that you live in and sleep safely in your bed in, then the most precious thing you can bring to this discussion is ‘silence’. This country has changed the world more than any other counry, now that is not me being over patriotic, that is just a fact. You can read it in most good books, but I should make them introductory in your case 😉 We could leave Europe and become independent, or haven’t you got any faith in the Unitied Kingdom whatsoever? Just because Germany are better than us at football, doesn’t make them better than us at everything Ben. Your comments disgust me, as you probably are unemployed and think that this country owes you a living. Now you know that you will not have too many friends that will agree with your made up bullshit comments. Just tell me the truth Ben. You are some disgruntled (Anti British) do-gooder with far too much time on your hands. Stop being a coward and come down and visit me to discuss your bad feelings towards my country. I don’t even know you, but I suspect you are one of these Pro Europe idiots that think we need to be in the EU, well we managed just fine before we joined the EU and I am sure that we can manage just fine out of the EU, that is if our gutless government can grow a pair of balls and do the right thing, I won’t hold my breath on that though. There will be no further comments now Ben as I am disgusted that you feel the need to copy and paste other people’s work to make yourself look big, I am disappointed with you. As for Germany and Japan humiliating British soldiers, well we did the same to them. Two nice nuclear warheads sorted Japan, and Russia made an example of Germany in 1945, what goes around comes around. Wouldn’t you agree? At least I am proud of my country and would serve for my Queen, I admit that I would be terrified and not much good, but at least I would have the guts, would you Ben? So man up and pay me a visit, I am sure we can clear this problem up rather swiftly don’t be an anonymous electonic (troll). We are done here.

          • Ben Kelly

            You are challenging me to a fight now? Seriously? Why don’t you grow up? How old you? About 10-20 years my senior, what, in your forties? Late thirties? Honestly, you still have the mentality of the play ground. I responded to you in the same uncivilised, belligerent tone in which you addressed me. Those who want respect, give respect.

            Why on Earth do you make so many presumptions? It’s easy to dismiss what I said as “factless dross”, rather more difficult than taking the time to actually read and research as I have. Again, no idea how telling the truth over myth is disrespectful to anyone. I’m perfectly aware that it was an allied effort to defeat Germany, this I haven’t denied. All I said was that the heavy lifting was done by Russia and the US, that doesn’t discredit any brave soldier from any other country, its just the truth. It it also true to say the war exhausted Britain and left us poorer and less powerful, how does this disrespect anyone? Is it a simply fact, everything I sad was true, and it doesn’t make me unpatriotic.

            How we got onto the EU I don’t know, but you’re so way off on that, really don’t know why you keep making such leaps. I’m a secessionist and don’t believe Britain should remain within the union, simple.

            No, i’m not unemployed, neither am I “anti-British” by any stretch of the imagination. Yes, warheads sorted Japan… who launched them? Not us. Japan drove us out of our colonies which created more support for independence, its true, accept it. It wasn’t due to the troops defending the territory, it was due to complacency on behalf of the government and lack of funds for the armed forces. This is, again, not disrespectful to anyone.

            It’s MY country too, and you have no more claim to it than me, so stop acting like you do just because you refuse to hear anything negative said or anything that challenges myth and distorted history. I criticise because I wish we had acted differently at some points in our history because it would mean we would be a stronger country NOW, duh, this is why it is important to criticise, a real patriot understands this, a football terrace flag waving blubber ball of hostility doesn’t.

            You could fight me and beat me and you still wouldn’t win the argument as it would be an irrelevance. I’m sure you’d feel like a big man though, well done you. End of conversation, tedious yob.

        • William Alexander Plumbasket

          If you have no fear of me then come visit for an adult discussion. I might even pay your fare. Do not call me ignorant or racist, just because I love my country. I work hard for my salary, ok, probably not as much as you get, but I make my contribution, which is more than I can say for a lot of people in this country.

          It is also easy for you to refer to me as a ‘blubber ball’ over the internet, you too will not beat me in an argument. I have to compose all my messages, better that than use the (copy&paste) function to (as I stated before) make yourself look more intelligent than you actually are.

          The United states and Russia had the man power to sacrifice (fact), we didn’t. We held our own as good as any other country involved in WWII.

          We have some of the best television and culture on this planet, or are you going call me a (liar) about that as well ben? Just because I want us to be the best at certain things, all of a sudden this makes me a (racist) lol.

          Just out of curiosity. What are your views on immigration? This should be good for a laugh. I make a prediction that you favour opening the gates and letting them all flood in from all Europe, prove me wrong Ben.

          I respect the Roman Empire, they educated us when we were almost still primitive (fact). It may be that we are (has-beens) as far as the scheme of things go. I would rather my country (at present) be a (has-been) than a (never-been), there are plenty of countries for candidates in that particular group.

          Now I suggest that you read all the comments on this page and observe some of the crud that a couple of other people have left about the UK (American posters), I have checked that fact. It is strange how you do not say anything to them about the vile comments made towards the UK. Now why is that Ben? You go check on that and get back to me. Or I suppose you do not factor that detail in.

          As I stated ‘easy to call me nasty names over the Internet’ You call me ‘childish’ yet use vile names lol.

          As for beating me in an argument, maybe there is something that you want to get off your chest Ben, or should I call you ‘Bernadette’?

          I do my research Ben (when I get the chance).

          Who is second in the list of Nobel prizes. I know America are way ahead of us, but they are 53 times bigger than the United Kingdom, so as in WWII, they have the resources. Crush them down to our size, then we will see if they are close to us for every aspect of what makes a country great. You cannot deny those facts, simple as that.

          I lost two relatives who were brave enough to fight for our freedom, just like so many men and women from all the allied countries. So what if I am proud of the UK?

          I am sure that you will come back and spew out more vile comments about my family and myself. Easy to do over the Internet, isn’t it?

          As for my age, grow a spine and pay me a visit. If you cannot afford it then I will pay you a percentage of the petrol, or any other form of transport you care to use (excluding a private jet). Enjoy. See you soon for a cup of tea and currant bun.

          I cannot date you though as I am not that way inclined, but ‘live and let live’. I am not a (homophobic). good day to you Ben.

  • kingkevin3

    i think this article is very much based on Wunschdenken, aka not in a million years

  • Darcy

    Yes, the UK population is growing — it is growing a dependent underclass. This is not at all the recipe to a stronger economy. Quite the opposite. It hardly needs to be pointed out that larger population does not translate into better economy. Plenty of third-world nations have big populations comprising a dependent underclass, and their economies are rubbish.

    • ud6

      3rd world countries don’t have a dependent underclass, they have an upper-class that survives through selling all the countries natural resources and taking (corruptly) a slice. It is rare for the poor to have any relationship with the government at all, and certainly not social support.

  • disqus_KdiRmsUO4U

    To suggest that the UK will overtake Germany in anything that may be called value added activity is absurd and flies in the face of economic history since 1870.

    GDP is a meaningless indicator.
    I recall Italy’s GDP over took the UK some time on a Thurs evening about 5 years ago. Quite preposterous.

    Germany beats us at football too .
    Our Jamaican/African athletes do quite well !

    • Fergus Pickering

      Who cares about football. It’s a silly game.Now cricket – we are pretty good at that.

      • disqus_KdiRmsUO4U

        You do know that Afghanistan has just qualified for a major cricket tournament.Not sure where it will be held.

        If they arrive at Lords expect a Taliban googly or two or their bats to be IED’s

        re your comment that colour doesn’t matter I think that can only be said by someone who is being totally dishonest with themselves and parroting the current fashion.

        Tribal identity has been universal throughout history.
        Stable racially diverse societies have never existed except when under totalitarian control.

        I have a nice property available. for you in any of Tower Hamlets, Brent of Southall..
        White flight does not describe the courtship behaviour of swans

  • Teacher

    I don’t see 80 million people as anything to celebrate.

  • bencorde

    I wonder how many people we can cram into the UK. given it’s size of 93K sq mls. After all farmland and national parks have been built up have we enough beach space above the high water mark or will offshore housing estates become a reality. At least there will be easy access to windmills for power

  • Harvey

    Wish everything was true. But then the journalist expressed his enthusiasm over “migrants will flock here in ever greater numbers” Why can’t we be enthusiastic about the British people being more productive in their own country’s economy, rather than giving the jobs away. Article hard to believe at the moment.

  • Christian A. Wittke

    I believe your conclusion is wrong… not because I am German,
    but because I am a German living in Scotland; a growing population and having the
    Pound does not make an income! What is worse, all the cuts in education, training,
    know-how and production accelerate UKs speed on the spiral into depression.

  • McQueue

    That we will grow assumes that when you transplant people from low GDP, low productivity, poorly educated countries that these poverty-ridden characteristics were not determined by the character or culture of the people but rather the geographic location they were in versus the one they occupy now – seems rather spurious to make such assumptions, particularly given the multicultural fracturing of society, with the loss of integration and concomitant balkanisation of our society.

    • Anthony

      It’s worked for America for over a hundred years.

      • McQueue

        Exploiting new assets the size of North America with no population density issues really isn’t the situation we are in, is it now.
        —– Reply message —–

  • Birdielein

    And just what is the British population growing with? People who actually work? Or people who want to live on the dole? Or people who live in Britain but who have no respect for British laws and the British way of life?

    • William Alexander Plumbasket

      We wouldn’t have many unemployed British people if our weak government would stop the constant drip of immigrant sewage we get engulfed with every year. Simple as that. I live in a small town and lucky enough to be self employed, but we are now being overrun by Polish and Bulgarian numbskulls. I for one am not happy about this rising threat.

  • ud6

    Behind these figures are real processes. In Portugal the established older generation, whilst in secure jobs, are having to have their pensions cut because the wages of the young were so low as to not be able to live (200-300 euros a month). They have a huge demographic problem upon them, with skilled and educated young people leaving (many going to the UK or Germany, others to Angola and Brazil). Portugal will never recover, because fundamentally nothing has changed.. the bureaucracy is the same, if not worse, and the judges are preventing the government reducing the generous rights of state workers (14 months pay a year, able to leave for 2 years and their job is kept on hold, good holidays and pensions). The state system in these countries is still crippling them and they are unable to enter into the modern ultra-competitive work market.

  • Drwho

    Actually, I think this article is completely right: by 2040-’50 UK and France may likely overtake Germany in terms of GDP. Unfortunately, this is bad new for both UK and France, if you think about how it will be achieved. The increase will be achieved by massive increase in population, comparative to DE, not increase in productivity. So Germany’s wealth per capita may still grow faster than ours, they may still have a faster increase in GDP per capita. And is that no what matters for the common man? (for sure, politicians in London will feel and maybe be slightly more powerful internationally, that is true, OK). But Switzerland, Denmark or Norway are midgets in terms of absolute GDP/military power and influence, but their citizens are not so unhappy…

    • GuybrushUlyssesThreepwood

      Unless Germany can get its retired population being more productive then you’re completely wrong.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1051139103 Richard Gambler

    How does the UK economy of 2.2trln overtake France at 2.7 next year? “The Centre for Economics and Business Research has already predicted the
    British economy will be bigger than the French by next year.” 2% plus or minus won’t change the standings at all. And size of the economy is much less important than things like debt levels and unemployment. Stupid article.

    • GuybrushUlyssesThreepwood

      Currency fluctuation. If sterling goes up and against the euro … You get the picture. The UK economy was probably never smaller than that of France if the truth be told. GDP statistics in these times of QE are probably misleading somewhat.

      • siad

        My friend the French economy is already lot bigger than Britain’s so is it’s population!

  • GuybrushUlyssesThreepwood

    You have to laugh at those that think immigration is bad for Britain, hilarious stuff. It’s a crazy myth that all immigrants are moving to Britain for £50 a week and a Glasgow council flat. Believe that if you wish but it’s total utter nonsense.

    Immigration has never hurt any country, none, only benefited them on so many levels. I know you won’t read that in the Daily Mail or the Daily Telegraph etc,. but it just happens to be true. Immigrants are far more likely to send their children to university for proper degrees, start a business, better themselves on so many levels.

    Demographics is fairly basic economics, if your population gets older then your workforce gets smaller. More upkeep and less income. It’s very basic and easy to understand.

    Germany, Japan, Italy, Korea, China, to name but a few, are going to have huge problems going forward. Japan is predicted to have a population of 40 to 60 million come 2100. Today it has a population of 127 million. It’s going to be a very traumatic decline these next 100 years for Japan.

    It’s not only a possibility that Britain will overtake Germany, it’s an absolute certainty.

    • Thruth

      Are all projections future truths? To the ignorant maybe. You realise of course that European countries with demographic problems do have plans to handle them? Germany has politics to help skilled immigration and tax breaks for people starting families. Odd that people on here think that any country will just stand by and look as its population shrinks. Russias population is shrinking quite fast and they too are planning how to counter the development.

  • kaiser

    Germany the true masters of europe. No matter how many times we fall we get up again stronger then before.

    if it wasnt for the USA all of you would be speaking german

  • Tom

    Your country is full of unemployed people led by a culture of milking benefits for decades. Even if your country grow to 100 million you wont get advantage over Germans or French as they culture differs in many aspects. Those nations are led by the benefits for the whole society in center of their way of thinking while in your country all people care is to survive to the next pay day and spend it all in a pub straight away anyway. The benefits systems in Germany or Austria is far better than here, yet only a fraction of society is using it. I see your country fuc… so much that nothing will help it. And ive been here for a while… God or Allah wont save your country either;-)

  • Andreas Walter

    The author is assuming that the trends are certainly permanent. Well, there are contrary trends the article neglects in it’s rosy picture for the UK: One, the UK may not exist by 2030 if Scotland’s succession movement, already underway, succeeds; Two, 20 percent of the world population will not reside in the nation of their birth, and Germany is the 3rd highest immigration destination on Earth over the UK’s 5th; Three, 20 percent of Germany’s people are now of foreign extract, making Germany perhaps the most heterogeneous mix in all the Eurozone, and finally, it is naive to believe a country with only a 5 percent unemployment rate and with a skilled labor shortage shall simply implode when so many immigrants choose a German opportunity over those found elsewhere. Besides, if 80 percent of Germans speak English; 20 percent speak French; and 10 percent speak Russian, immigrants shall not peep over the virtually English only working environments they’re now finding in Germany.

  • Thruth

    Projections are exactly what they are… Projections. What happens when Scotland votes for indepence? When Northern Ireland and Wales thereafter demand similar referendums? When Germany allows more immigration to compensate for low fertility and hords of Ukranians and Russians seek work in Germanys production industry? When sea levels rise and shrinks Englands already tiny size starting with London and areas around it? When Turkey joins the EU and a few million Turks decide life in Germany is better than in Turkey and they decide to join the other 5 million Turks already living there? Oh yes, Englands little man complex is alive and thriving. Youll always be second to Germany and probably France too. Odd how Britain always sees itself as Germanys equal and in constant competition with Germans. Take a trip to Germany and Youll soon find out they actually dont care about Britain or Britons. Germany has been successful in keeping millions of good production jobs in the country despite the competition from Eastern Europe and China. No projections can change that. As long as they have plenty of jobs, there will be plenty of people and plenty of GDP!

  • Matt

    I think this article is some what correct UK will probably have 150,000,000 people with the third world immigration it gets from India and Africa its per capita GDP will probably be lower then Portugal or Russia but with such an awesome productive multicultural population it probably be slightly higher then 60,000,000 population of Germany

  • wadewade

    It’s great to see Muslims being talked about in the ‘debate’ – whether positive or negative. No such thing as bad publicity hey! Then again, as Brits, we always have someone else to blame our faults on and be bitter towards others for no apparent reason. I’m just wondering – after Muslim and immigrants being blamed, who’s next? The Greys from interstellar-space? If so, then I too would like to have a darn good go at them and I’ll start by counting them on my street – starting from 50 of course! Bloody uneducated and unskilled saucer skimmers!

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  • Guest

    Wir sind gut vorbereitet. Ich glaube nicht, dass die deutsche economoy kleiner als die britische Wirtschaft.

  • Guest

    Wir sind gut vorbereitet. Ich glaube nicht, dass die deutsche Wirtschaft wird kleiner als die britische Wirtschaft zu werden.

  • Rafiq de Rafew

    Wir sind gut vorbereitet. Ich glaube nicht, dass die deutsche Wirtschaft wird kleiner als die britische Wirtschaft zu werden…

  • barrydavies

    In a word No.

  • Buddy Repperton

    Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor.

  • Buddy Repperton

    Yet, California has a bigger and better economy than the UK, lol. And Texas will surpass the British economy by 2019. If the UK is getting that much bigger, it only means that the USA is going to get astronomically bigger. Got to love British humor.
    Let’s also not forget: Scotland is leaving the UK, lol. Will a UK even exist after that transition, lol.

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  • Firefighter21

    Great point Kurt!

  • Firefighter21

    Plumbasket? Are you any relation to Mrs. Doubtfire?

  • peter feltham

    Always remember,’ IF ‘ is the biggest word in the english language.

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  • Rafasa Arandas

    Germany is way cooler than boring Britain

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  • stephen

    I really doubt the UK will overtake Germany economy and certainly not in this century and even factoring in the demographics.
    Germany has always protected and invested in its strong and world class manufacturing/ engineering industries. Since the end the Second world War the UK has done the complete reverse and under-invested it’s manufacturing and allowing great British companies to be overtaken be by foreign competitors’ in the name of short term greed. Can you ever imagine BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Siemens being owned and operated by foreign companies, its an unthinkable concept and this is exactlywhy Germany have the largest strongest Economy in Europe. This is a country that out exported the USA and was second only to China.
    As the population of the world becomes more affluent they will need quality
    cars, electronic and mechanical products, all of which Germany
    produce. The strongest, most resiliant ecomonies have manufacturing as the backbone of their ecomonies. The UK has swung to a Service sector, particular the financial sector and governments have thought that making money from money is going to grow the economy. How dearly that ideology has cost the UK with greed, corrupted bankers costing the country billions. It needs to be more balanced with a far stronger manufacturing sector to ever compete with Germany. As an Engineer I have admiration and respect for the superb quality products Germany produce.
    Not until we recognise this will the UK every overtake Germany.

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