Features

The EU is on a suicide mission. Do we want to be a part of it?

The borders were thrown open and now it’s too late for second thoughts

12 March 2016

9:00 AM

12 March 2016

9:00 AM

There are two great deportation games. One is the carousel which Rod Liddle describes — but even this, for all its madness, pales alongside the border-security catastrophe unfolding on the continent. Thanks to geography and a few sensible decisions by our government, Britain has so far been spared the worst of the migrant crisis. But we should pity most of the other European countries, because they are losing control not just of their borders but of their civilisation and culture — the whole caboodle.

Defenders of Europe’s disastrous recent border policies are keen to point out the technical differences between illegal immigration, economic migrants and asylum claimants. But the reluctance to create any serious programme of removal for the first two is not only sapping public sympathy for the third, it is part of the same failure that allowed millions of migrants into the continent in the first place, without checking where they were from or considering the consequences of them coming.

A tolerance for illegal as well as legal immigration has become a European principle in recent years. But over the last 12 months that attitude has been turbo-charged. European leaders have been searching for a rationale for their madness. Chancellor Angela Merkel’s first justification for opening the doors of Europe lay in the minority of arrivals fleeing Syria. But as a far larger number of economic migrants arrived from across Africa, the Middle East and Far East, the rationale changed. Instead it became a wonderful opportunity for an ‘ageing continent’ to acquire a new influx of workers; a new generation to keep us all in the style to which we have become accustomed.

Almost nobody asks why this position was adopted at a time when youth unemployment rates in much of Europe are hovering around 50 per cent. But today even the European Commission admits that most of the people who came to Europe last year should not be here. In January, the Commission’s vice-president Frans Timmermans admitted that at least 60 per cent of recent arrivals were economic migrants, not asylum seekers. Not Syrians fleeing a war prolonged by Turkey and all the other Muslim states of the Middle East, but people who, in Timmermans’s words, ‘have no reason to apply for refugee status’.

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Now futile second thoughts are everywhere. Even Sweden, the self-proclaimed ‘humanitarian superpower’, has been doing some thinking. The country’s own interior minister, Anders Ygeman, recently admitted that of the 163,000 people to whom the country opened its arms last year, at least 80,000 might be fake asylum seekers in need of deporting.

When, exactly, will Sweden deport those people — given that it managed to deport just 4,000 last year? Over many ensuing years, as Mr Ygeman pretends? Or never, as everybody else knows?

Even when Sweden does manage to arrange a deportation notice, three-quarters of the subjects immediately disappear. And since nobody bothered to check who was coming in from where, no one knows where to send most of the ones they do find.

It is the same story in Germany. How could it be otherwise in a country which brought in up to one and a half million people last year? Is Germany ever going to deport the more than three-quarters of a million people (according to the Timmermans estimate) who entered the country last year under false pretences? Of course not. They will slip into the black economy, a new generation of workers who will be on the run from the authorities and the law. In time, they will bring their families to join them.

Europe is expecting a similar number of migrants to arrive this year, and now the situation is so bad that last week Donald Tusk, the president of the European Council — appealed to the world: ‘Do not come to Europe.’ Too late. Last year, he and Angela invited them. And due to the incompetence, blindness or weakness of Europe’s leadership, everyone stayed. At last beginning to panic, those same leaders spent last week trying to slow the flow of migrants from Syria by doing a deal which flings the doors of Europe open to the citizens of Turkey.

Europe truly is on a suicide mission. All we have to decide is whether we want to be a part of it.

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Show comments
  • Jim Redo

    BREXIT. Only sane choice now.

  • Rik

    The clank and rumble you hear are the sounds of border gates slamming shut and armoured personnel carriers taking troops to guard the fences.Macedonia,Bulgaria Hungary etcetc have had enough of mad mutti Merkel,Schengen is dead,migrant relocation and/or deportation are fantasies from a parallel universe.Pity poor Greece bullied into being good Europeans they are now deserted to cope alone with this years flood alone.
    The only good news is that we can escape the stinking beached dead whale that is EU,BREXIT NOW!!

    • Mr B J Mann

      ” Is Germany ever going to deport the more than three-quarters of a
      million people (according to the Timmermans estimate) who entered
      the country last year under false pretences? Of course not”

      I seem to recall they had their own “Solution” the last time they had to deal with a problem like this?!

      • secretpeople

        Jews weren’t a problem. There go a people one can genuinely say ‘enriches’ a society. More than likely, the holocaust was borne of jealousy.

  • sebastian2

    Among all the multiple other things I find hard to grasp, top of the list must be the way in which Merkel and a handful of EU cronies have foisted an unwanted situation onto an entire continent of bewildered, resentful and unconsulted citizens who will have to tolerate or suffer the social dislocation, the petty crime (or worse) and the spiralling costs. Not just for now, but for decades. And they must do this uncomplainingly – or face censure and perhaps prosecution.

    We’ve heard before about a “democratic deficit” created by an arrogant EU elite contemptuous of peoples’ will. This has never been so stark. Merkels’ open door is the democratic deficit unchained.

    We have to Brexit this monstrous perversion of democracy. The EU is failing, and failing badly. We can save Britain; other countries may rescue their sovereignty and save themselves too, with rigour and determination. Even Europe may ultimately be saved. But none of this will happen with Brussels’ incompetent, dysfunctional and dangerous rule still over us.

    • stuckgear

      Indeed, Merkle’s pronouncements last year to an open door policy extended Germany hegemony to the EU. The German Chancellor calls the shots and decides for Europe; She then shut the door, having given out the invitation, leaving the European partners to solve the problem and of course, foot the bill.

      Now doing the same in reaching an agreement with Turkey, she is inflicting her will over all other member states.

      And we saw last week the head of a foreign state threaten the people of the UK, while our PM stood nodding, smiking and agreeing with the threat.

      Europe’s folly has made it a civilisation under siege.. Under siege from it’s elected leaders and so called elected representatives.

      Democracy EU style. You can keep it thanks.

      • Sarony

        Merkel can only inflict her will if other European leaders are complicit.

        • stuckgear

          Cameron certainly is

        • licjjs

          They are Germany’s lap dogs – and, of course, they reap massive benefits from the EU coffers.

      • FrancescaMacfarlane

        Is not extraordinary that Frau Merkel still has the support of 60% of the German population? – unless of course the percentage of illegal immigrants in Germany’s population has now reached 60%.

        • Hybird

          We’ll see how accurate that 60% claim is on Sunday when the regional elections take place in three German states. If , after all that has happened, AfD don’t get at least 20% of the vote then Germany truly is a lost cause.

        • Dukeofplazatoro

          Maybe they are following orders to agree?

          Some traditions are ingrained.

          • Mary Ann

            Or maybe they do agree.

          • Conway

            Befehl ist Befehl, nicht wahr?

        • WTF

          I heard that among indigenous Germans the support was down to 90% so it must be all those “Undocumented Merkel Supporters” who are making the difference !

          • The_Common_Potato

            Deutshe Post is probably extremely efficient.

      • sebastian2

        Merkel is lavishing EU countries’ money and social capital on a futile but fervent personal, obsessive delusion. These “guests” of the Chancellor now demand lebensraum; and if it isn’t offered, they will take it by German dominated EU edict.

        This is spooky. And we know why.

      • itsthepatriarchy

        my god! finally someone who gets it!

        https://itsthepatriarchy.wordpress.com

    • MrKaplan

      “or face censure and perhaps prosecution.”
      Bus driver in Sweden has been suspended pending investigation for sharing right leaning articles against immigration on facebook because his bosses are worried there “might” be a bad atmosphere on his bus “if” people found out his political position on immigration. No complaints have actually been made against him.

      • Frank

        Wonderful, this is a massive EU cluster-f*ck, but at least we can enjoy politically correct Sweden turning itself inside out as it tries to avoid dealing with reality – how many rapes will its female citizens have to endure before it grows up?

        • licjjs

          The women who have been assaulted and raped should start taking their governments to Court for not protecting them. We really need some fearless and committed lawyers to start fighting for the people of the EU.

          • Michael H Kenyon

            More likely the women who conceive after rape will eventually convert to Islam as they want the child to grow up with “their culture”. Sweden is surely more likely to be vulnerable to “Stockholm Syndrome”.

          • BritishPatriot

            I would think, it being Sweden, that a majority would opt to have abortions.

          • PaD

            That is an unecessary and despicable comment..if it was your daughter sister or neice you would not be saying it.

          • Lesmond-Nyjacks

            Are you a Rapefugee, or a vile Leftard apologist by any chance?

          • PaD

            im neither..Who TF are you a golly?

          • Lesmond-Nyjacks

            The “fearless and committed lawyers” are too busy protecting illegal Gimmiegrants and Rapefugees.

      • stuckgear

        The thought police in action. No thoughts allowed unless approved by the state.
        Where do we see thought control and persecution of those not subservient to the state ideology?
        Freedom of speech, freedom of thought ? Not allowed.

      • sebastian2

        No complaints are necessary. Mere suspicion or supposition suffices. This is sinister. Very sinister.

      • The Banana

        Surely a breach of human rights, in particular the right to self expression.

        • MrKaplan

          Most likely the bus driver will be allowed back to work but this is an excellent scare tactic to silence people. Who will dare speak up under threat of losing their job or at least being made a social pariah

          • The Banana

            Yup. Anonymity is the way to do it. Unfortunately it’s always been so, even if government’s don’t regulate societies ostracise.

          • MrKaplan

            The anonymity they want to get rid of…

      • Bill Kendall

        People who work in schools (and probably other public places) have been told not to discuss politics or religion on Facebook, and even to be careful what their friends say!

        • MrKaplan

          How can one be responsible for their friends thought crimes?!

          • Ed  

            Can’t be seen associating with the wrong people, you know.

      • Katabasis

        Reason is useless now. It’s all going to end in violence.

    • fordwych

      Merkel:No children=No grandchildren=No stake in the future.

      Her name will in time become a curse to native Europeans.

      • sebastian2

        I don’t think anyone in their right senses would marry someone who habitually opens the door to thieving and ill-mannered strangers.

      • Conway

        I don’t have any children (and therefore no grandchildren either), but I am very concerned about the future for other people’s.

        • itsthepatriarchy

          not to the same extent… no matter how strong your feelings are.

        • secretpeople

          I am worried for the future of my own offspring – but it isn’t only about others, it’s also about you, and what your ancestors would have wished for you.

      • NiceTry

        Many native Europeans have betrayed Europe by also ridiculously calling former Yugoslavians Macedonians. This is like bizarrely claiming western France the Republic of England.

        Many think this name issue is only Greece’s problem but much like migrants, much like debt, its Europe’s problems too. The very forces that are trying to narrate Greeks out of ethnic existence to ethnic engineer “Macedonians”… will not stop with Greece.

    • Norbert

      I could not agree more concerning Merkel & Company’s incomprehensible, unilateral decision to open German borders to an unlimited number of migrants, this without the slightest effort to verify their refugee status or control their identities. This was a monstrous error for reasons which we all know.

      However, as posted below, I don’t want the UK to exit. I want the UK to stand with Hungary, Norway, Austria, Poland, and other countries which are saying “No” to Merkel’s insanity.

      The EU is primarily a free trade zone. Free trade is a very good thing. The problem is that the EU has morphed into far more, including continuous efforts to redistribute wealth from one group to another. Furthermore, it expanded too fast, including countries like Rumania, offering them free movement throughout the Shengen zone.

      The UK should stand up for conservative principles and help re-focus on the EU’s original goals, not turn inwards. It won’t be easy, as Brussels is now a corrupted, bureaucratic nightmare. But that’s what I want to see changed, with the help of the UK.

      As for Syrian refugees, the plight of those from place like Aleppo is real. The best approach is to provide safe haven close to home, untll the war is ended. We should be generous with money and manpower, as the UK has done for some years. Admitting a few thousand families per the UK model is definitely an option for willing nations.

      • goodsoldier

        All the things you want will be voted down by all the poor countries of the EU because they want the redistribution of wealth and endless benefits. You cannot reform the EU from within. You can pretend to do it and then with unspeakable mendacity announce that you have reformed the EU. You are not being balanced, just naive or ill-intentioned.

      • LittleRedRidingHood

        The UK is not respected or has any sway in the EU project. We are better if our rather than being beaten up for our sweets every day by the EU bully. (france and germany)

      • PaD

        No this is a doomed project&governed by a malicious elite…remaining will mean present&future honest british meps having to escort the wreckers at gunpoint from the eu parliament…it is better to step back now.
        Trade will continue..it’s what it does.

    • itsthepatriarchy

      you said man. perfectly.

      https://itsthepatriarchy.wordpress.com

    • itsthepatriarchy

      you said man. perfectly.

      https://itsthepatriarchy.wordpress.com

    • PaD

      This is the most important and compelling comment I have read so far..thank you!

      • PaD

        But a ray of hope has emerged from AfDs recent election wins..the hope now that this will snowball throughout Europe..
        the situation that you tellingly describe has gone past dangerous and is now an actual crisis.

      • sebastian2

        :) Kind of you to say so.

  • misomiso

    +1

    Immigration is the ultimate triumph of the corporatist class over the the rest of us.

    • Randal

      The corporatists could never have done it alone. It’s the unholy alliance they have forged with the anti-nationalist, “anti-racist”, multiculturalist left that has made them unbeatable.

  • MrKaplan

    RE: the “new workforce for an ageing continent” argument. In Malmö 50% of asylum seekers taken in since 2009 are STILL unemployed. 40% for those that have been there longer. Of those that do find employment, they work as taxi drivers or find other such employment where they can avoid paying tax. Those that find legitimate employment tend to find it in low-paid, unskilled jobs where between them and their extensive families and the money that goes abroad etc. they are still taking far more from the system than they are paying in. Especially when you factor in costs such as schooling and health care, never mind the housing benefits etc. They’re not all doctors and engineers like the government likes to pretend. And the ones that are are not always up to scratch and end up not being able to find employment. Why are they here?
    Douglas asks “All we have to decide is whether we want to be a part of it”. What can we do when we decide we don’t want to be part of it? I think many of us have already decided we don’t want to be part of it but nobody is listening to us. There are things happening now across the continent that we all knew would happen back when they were calling us racists and xenophobes and the MSM is either ignoring it or looking around bewildered and asking “who knew?”. We all knew!

    • Hybird

      Your mention of migrants becoming taxi drivers reminded me of an accountant (who’d done some work for Pakistani taxi firms in the Leeds and Bradford area) telling me that it was an amazing fact that not one taxi driver ever earned quite enough to pay tax.

      • sebastian2

        I dare say many drivers were already receiving benefits. There are ways of concealing income so as to avoid both tax and benefits loss.

        • William Brown

          Then there are the other ‘benefits’ that they still enjoy whilst receiving ample protection from the police and social services…

    • WFC

      None of them are doctors or engineers. A doctor or engineer who wanted to come to Europe would fly here with a pre-arranged job and work visa.

      Nor are they students (another favourite of the media). They would be flying here with student visas.

      • sebastian2

        Also correct.

    • sebastian2

      Correct.

  • Bill Fitzgerald

    The quisling Cameron to issue more threats today. Siding with that toad Hollende to threaten the British people was the final straw for me. I will never vote for an establishment politician ever again. Everywhere you look in this country there are traitors occupying positions of influence and power. I think it will take more than a Brexit vote to leave the eu to remove the traitors. Perhaps a start but not the solution.

    • WFC

      It is a necessary start.

      The EU protects governments such as ours from their electorates.

    • Cyril Sneer

      “I will never vote for an establishment politician ever again.”

      This.

  • Patrick

    Merkel has put the final nail in the coffin of Europe as it has been for 1400 years, a continent in opposition to Islam. the other nails were hammered in by 40 odd years of governments of the left and right who wish for Europe to be ‘multicultural’. Nothing can be done to reverse the demographic change facing Europe and a new ‘European liberal Islam’ which many people belief will appear, will not happen. Islam is Islam and can never change, Turkey tried to de-Islamism itself and all that happened is religious Muslims have more babies and the liberal muslims have less. Go forward a hundred years and the religious families are now the majority.

  • Blindsideflanker

    The EU having seen what a brilliant society structure Bosnia had , have decided to replicate it across Europe.

    • Conway

      Perhaps they want Bosnia to feel at home when it joins – I believe it’s got its application in.

  • Randal

    Europe is only going slightly faster than we are, we are on the same track.

    How can there ever be any defences in the long run so long as anti-racist dogma pretends that the only legitimate criterion for nationality is place of birth?

    We are facing the triumph of an unholy alliance between leftist ideology and big business profiteering, that we simply cannot fight when our political and media elites are lockstep believers in anti-nationalist hippy internationalism, who actually believe that the manufactured anti-racist taboo reflects reality, when the opposite is the case.

    Until there is a backlash that recognises that moderate racism is natural, normal and beneficial, we have no effective long term defences. Japan, for instance, has not suffered from this anti-racist pathology, and as a result most likely has a far healthier future of cultural and racial unity, whereas our future will be one of cultural and racial division and strife, and political decisions made based upon loyalty to cultural and race-based parties.

    • Mr B J Mann

      “How can there ever be any defences in the long run so long as
      anti-racist dogma pretends that the only legitimate criterion for
      nationality is place of birth?”

      Unless you’re white and born (like your parents, grand-parents, great…….) in Africa, the Middle East, Asia……………

      • Randal

        Of course. These things only apply one way. We all know that.

  • Damaris Tighe

    As Douglas implies, this isn’t about filling job vacancies. This is about abolishing the concept of illegal immigration, abolishing borders, and allowing the world’s poor to share the European lifestyle.

    It’s about ‘equality’. The SJWs have won. They have moved from concern for the west’s poor, to concern for the world’s poor. The world’s poor made the west’s poor look like lotus eaters. So from redistribution of wealth on a national basis, we have now moved to redistribution of wealth on a global basis. This failed when the SJWs attempted to move capital from the west to the third world. The ultimate solution is to move the third world to the west.

    • FrankS2

      Yes, but… rather than “allowing the world’s poor to share the European lifestyle”, it will turn out to be forcing Europe’s poor to experience a third world lifestyle.

      • Damaris Tighe

        Indeed, but the idiots who rule Europe believe that migrants will undergo a magical cultural transformation the moment they step on European soil. Or at least, all they need is a few classes & informational leaflets to let go a lifetime’s
        saturation in misogyny, contempt for the kaffir, and male allergy to hard labour.

        • sebastian2

          You are correct. They are intoxicated by their own utter delusion. We, the ordinary citizens, get the hangover. And a very intense long lasting one it is.

          These mohammedans, rapidly establishing their own self-replicating colonies, will not change.

          • Damaris Tighe

            And the problem increases exponentially the greater the migration numbers. As they gravitate to existing communities, their culture is reinforced by its replication on European soil. The bigger the immigrant communities, the less likely it is that new migrants will assimilate because it isn’t necessary. Then we end up with parallel societies.

          • Mary Ann

            Bit like the English ghettos in France and Spain?

          • Damaris Tighe

            Indeed, but they are small in comparison & offer no more threat to France & Spain than a demand for full English breakfasts & baked beans.

          • WTF

            Nice one !

          • Conway

            You forgot malt vinegar – one of my French friends has me bring a gallon when I visit because it’s so hard to get and expensive!

          • Damaris Tighe

            Oh yes, the only vinegar that works with fish n chips!

          • Hybird

            And it has to be Ellsey’s from Wigan, of course. My mother once found some in a delicatessen in New York.

          • Damaris Tighe

            Sainsbury’s works for me.

          • Hybird

            That reminds me of an old joke.
            Old man from Wigan newly arrived in Spain looking for gravy browning knocks on neighbours door and says “Hast any Bisto?”
            Scouse neighbour replies “No comprende, mate, I don’t speak Spanish.”

          • Damaris Tighe

            LOL!

          • William Brown

            Yes indeed…all those middle aged, middle class beheaders do seem to be running wild in Bergerac and its surrounding communities.

          • logdon

            You missed the famed Watneys Red Barrel in Majorca.

          • WTF

            Luckily I could buy Ruddles County, Speckled Hen, Abbott and many other real ale imports from a UK run warehouse in Villajoysa and without UK duty/vat, the cost including transport was no different to Britain. Red Barrel, disgusting stuff !

          • logdon

            Ironically, I think it was Red Barrel which started the Real Ale movement.

          • WTF

            I’m sure you’d know all about that living in a pastoral setting of France rather than Calais, Marseille or many Paris arondissments but most retired OAP’s in Spain when I lived there even joined in with the local Pensionistas at the town hall. Funny that, despite the language problems for older people, they actually tried to integrate into Spanish culture unlike Merkels rapists, criminals and feral migrants !

          • sebastian2

            Not in the least.

          • Germainecousin

            Your comments are rapidly moving from stupid to outright disgusting Miriam. How ironic if they moved the ‘jungle from Calais to your doorstep. Would you still spout the same rubbish?

          • Mary Ann

            I feel sorry for the people of Calais, the British and French governments should do something about it, although it is difficult to know what, as they will not claim asylum in France because they want to come to Britain, despite the fact that the young men would all be better off in France. The only ones who would be better off in Britain are those with children. I think Britain is paying the price for having had an Empire. Or at least, the people of Calais are paying the price.

          • WTF

            Our empire never stretched to Europe other than a brief period during Tudor times I think when we ruled parts of North West France and certainly never included Syria or Turkey. Why should we pay the price for people we never colonized ?

            Under EU rules, Lisbon Treaty I believe, the ONLY thing the UK government should do is follow Australias lead and keep them out of the UK by any means possible. These migrants need to apply for asylum in the country they first entered in the EU and if France can’t deport them to Greece or where ever they first got into the EU, then bus them to Brussels. Hand the problem over to the eurorats to solve as it was they and Merkel who caused this mess not France or the UK.

          • LittleRedRidingHood

            Indeed. Gunships and warning shots. It’ll dry up to a trickle in no time

          • aguafiesta

            That Britain had an impire is of no importance to people of today. Likewise, ridiculous that Germans go on feeling guilt for what their ancestors did more than 70 years ago.

          • Penny

            The British empire was hardly the only one in the world, Mary Ann. What others do you think should continue to pay the price? And for how long?

          • WTF

            Mary Ann – The ULTIMATE NIMBY,

            You live in what is probably a nice safe part of France and the only thing a UK government could to for your moral high ground, would be to ship these feral animals into the UK from Calais. Didn’t the Nazis get rid of their ‘problem’ by shipping people to another country !

          • LittleRedRidingHood

            Utter tripe.which part of the empire would that be then.
            I agree that should do something, but that something should be a baton charge without prejudice followed by a forced reinsertion to their home countries.

          • mohdanga

            What, those pensioners that pump in billions to the local economies, aren’t looking to change the host culture, aren’t complaining about “Englishphobia”, aren’t hankering for Sharia law. Are the Spanish and French governments spending billions on these ‘ghettoes’, trying to get them to adopt Western mores and values? Please try and keep up with the adults.

          • WTF

            That’s exactly the point that even ex-pats who can’t or don’t learn the language in say Spain are still an asset to the country. I found that when trying to improve my Spanish in restaurants the young waitress’s or waiters there would speak English purely so they could improve their English for maybe getting a job in the UK.

            What this ‘cloth eared bint’ refuses to acknowledge is that OAP ex-pats in Spain bring 10 billion a year through pensions, goodness knows how much capital to buy a property and cause no more problems than Spanish OAP’s, essentially nothing of any consequence. If they were forced to leave (very unlikely) Spain would be the loser big time and I cant see that happening. Its a no brainer choosing whether to invite in a Brit OAP who pays for everything, claims no benefits and commits virtually zero crimes to a bunch of over sexed young men from an alien culture who will rape anything that moves.

          • Mary Ann

            British pensioners are in the state health systems, and they can claim benefits, I know a Briton who is claiming from the French government.

          • WTF

            A deliberately vague response, let me clarify this for you.

            1/ A British pensioner who is in receipt of a UK state pension is entitled to sign onto the state run health scheme of any EU country they are legally resident in without paying monthly contributions. To do this they need to present a form from the DWP along with their passport to the relevant state run health authority and they will receive the same health care rights as a citizen of that country who is entitled to state health care. Technically they will then be denied health care in the UK except for emergency treatment on a visit.

            2/ The costs of this health care for UK ex-pats is charged back to the UK authorities as a fixed annual charge which the UK government pays. The ex-pat does NOT receive any health care benefits from the country of residence in this situation. The UK government pays for this health care.

            3/ If an UK ex-pat has worked or is working in an EU country and assuming they were working there legally and paid contributions to their welfare system, they will be entitled to any benefit & health care under the same rules as a citizen of that country who has contributed.

            These are the rules over which you seem vague over but there will be some cases where Brits (like your Brit perhaps), who have worked, have contributed and have benefit rights in France separate from any UK consideration. Obviously it can become complicated where a Brit ex-pat has contributed to the UK & the French system for state pensions and will receive both proportionate to contributions & rules. As far as real unfunded benefits (not pensions) I suspect if any can be claimed such as disablement it would come from the system they last paid into or are still paying into, again subject to qualifying rules.

            The bottom line is, I know of no situation in the EU where you can can legally claim a benefit if you haven’t paid into the system. The only way you can fiddle the system is to claim a non contributory benefit like from the DWP and claim you’re living in the UK but actually you’re living in France , Spain or whatever.

          • Vinnie

            Why don’t you give up, Mary-Ann. You’re not intelligent enough to hang with the Speccie people. Niceties and virtue signalling won’t work around here, all you’re doing is dumbing down real debate with “oh but these poor people” – would you care to comment on the crime rate and rape epidemic that Europe now has? Go to the Graun or New Statesman where you can circle jerk with others about the glorious diversity. It won’t wash here. Sorry.

          • Damaris Tighe

            + 100 if I could.

          • mdj

            These ( and I don’t like them) are where people go to spend their life savings, rather than live off their new neighbours; the difference is huge.

          • LittleRedRidingHood

            People retiring there is slightly different, you should know.

          • Mr B J Mann

            The ones where they pay for their own homes, pay for their medical treatment, pay their taxes, pay their own way, you mean?!

          • sebastian2

            This is correct. They become established in almost every sense. There’s no incentive to assimilate for there are no jobs to go to and benefits will provide anyway. They can keep contact through social media and other means so little need to mix with kuffirs – who they have a doctrinal aversion to in any case. They may try to lure kuffir girls into their way of life but anyone with half a brain would shun them completely. They will discourage policing. They will establish their own mosques and madrassas where the usual narrative of grievance and eventual revenge and mohammedan domination will be delivered – incited actually. And all because of a hare-brained German Chancellor and a handful of dim-witted but sly EU flunkeys wielding power without true democratic authority and accountability.

        • MrKaplan

          Or if not right away a generation or two down the line and they’ll be just like us. Except they won’t. There are second and third generation immigrants rushing to join ISIS, becoming increasingly religious. Do our governments really believe that in a few generations time when they have out bred us and they outnumber us that it will be them who will become just like us? No, western culture and civilisation will fall. We will be forced to convert or be killed or made slaves… it will be us that have to change. Come to think of it, we are already changing. Removing statues, rewriting history, building mosques, serving only halal. The list goes on!

    • WTF

      Its the equivalent of what the progressives in America are trying but over here they call illegal immigrants “undocumented democrats” !

    • logdon

      Spot on!

    • woohoo002

      They call it ‘Cultural Marxism’……
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYu6qhd88_M

      • Lista

        Now it makes sense.

  • thomasaikenhead

    Easy to deal with illegal immigrants, simply shoot them at the border as a female German political recently suggested!

    • Mary Ann

      Shades of East Germany, only they were shooting them for leaving. Is that really the sort of world you want to live in.

      • WTF

        I’m sure you can put up a few families at your French Chateau !

        • Mary Ann

          I don’t have the English Channel between me and the migrants. Couldn’t afford to heat a chateau, that’s for the rich.

          • WTF

            Better get used to migrants appearing on your doorstep with far more serious intent than the simple burglaries we’ve seen from some eastern European migrants in Spain.

          • Mr B J Mann

            Pack enough in and you won’t need to, body heat will keep you warm, especially sharing your four poster!

      • logdon

        It already is. Have you heard of IS?

      • thomasaikenhead

        Clearly the fact that over a quarter of Germans showed that they agreed with her makes it clear that is exactly the world they ant to live in!

        What do you suggest, simply allow these illegal migrants to be allowed unrestrained access to Germany, the UK and Sweden were the bring crime disease and corruption?

        That they should be allowed to attack, rape and rob Western women at children at will cut their ‘cultural values’?

        Even the EU has stated that over 60% of them are not refugees at all, but simply taking advantage of the situation to gain access illegally to Europe.

        If these people wore Russian Army uniforms and were storming west from the Ukraine, everyone would expect NATO to confront them and kill them.

        Can you explain why Russian troops should be shot but not Third World invaders?

      • LittleRedRidingHood

        It would do for the next six months. Of there is a deterrent they won’t come.

      • Anna Bananahammok

        Oh yes please!

        I’d rather live in a world where my country shoots invaders, rather than inviting them in, giving them houses, and paying for their food and medical bills, while they plot how to blow us to pieces.

  • WFC

    At last beginning to panic, those same leaders spent last week trying to slow the flow of migrants from Syria by doing a deal which flings the doors of Europe open to the citizens of Turkey.

    It’s worse than that.

    The deal will see Turkey being paid €6bn to process the asylum claims for the whole of the EU. Turkey will decide, for and on behalf of the EU, who is a genuine asylum seeker, and ship them over on a one for one basis.

    Thus, the millions who may theoretically be subject to deportation will be replaced by millions who won’t.

    That, over and above Turkish citizens.

    • LittleRedRidingHood

      The new ottoman empire.

  • Simon

    I’m treated to an apocalyptic vision of a possible future for London and other British cities when I witness present-day Rome (I’m about to escape back to dear old England, thank God).

    Not the old Rome where the tourists go, I mean the residential areas and suburbs that Italians are fleeing in droves. No doubt someone will say, “but have you seen some British cities lately?”. I have, and some of them are bad I admit, but much of Rome is on a whole other level.

    It feels just Third World now. Dilapidated, graffiti-ridden buildings. Filthy dirty, potholed streets. Overrun by (apparently) homeless drunks, aggressive beggars and squeegee-merchants, all pestering you continually. Almost none of them Italian, of course – I can walk blocks without hearing an Italian voice. Beware especially the East European thugs lurking around public parking spaces, waiting to menacingly demand money to “look after” your car when you park in “their” space. Just drive away straightaway, or pay them, else you – or your car – will end up the worse for it.

    One of the greatest cities the world has ever known is now fast becoming a dirty and dangerous slum. The rule of law feels – and is – largely absent. The Italian police seem to have given up, while the judicial system is a joke. And for Rome, I’m reckoning you”ll soon be able to substitute a growing number of other European cities – as the migrant catastrophe and economic collapse leave no residual sense that you’ve even in a developed European country any more.

    Please don’t let the UK follow the Italians and EU into the Third World ruin I see Rome sinking into. Get our own country out of this waking nightmare, now.

    • sebastian2

      Sounds like excellent advice.

    • logdon

      I’ve read both of the late Oriana Fallaci’s Books, The Force of Reason and The Rage and the Pride which describe Italy’s descent into Islamic barbarism.

      She ‘faces the themes unchained by Islamic terrorism: the contrast and incompatibility between the Islamic world; the global reality of the Jihad and the lack of response, the leniency of the West.’

      ‘She defends our culture and blames what she calls our blindness, our deafness, our masochism, the conformism and the arrogance of the Politically Correct.’

      The Rage and the Pride was written, or rather forced out of her creative consciousness by the September 11 apocolypse near her Manhatten home where she’d relocated following censure and harrasment in her native Tuscany.

      That, since then it’s got immeasurably worse powered by our own suicidal tendencies and treasonous politicians who would sell their own souls for a handful of Muslim votes.

      I watched the Twin Towers fall in real time. For a week I was mesmerised but not utterly bewildered because this had been a long time coming and merely a matter of temporality.

      So what next was my initial thought? Is this war?

      Well, if you also read Raymond Ibrahim’s The al-Qaeda Reader, it was but only one side was playing. The other side intent on telling us that they weren’t. They were a perfect case of denial.

      Obama said that we would never be at war with Islam (to quote, he would, wouldn’t he?) but what he omitted was, is Islam at war with us?

      If Islam erected a poster a thousand feet high, ‘We’re coming to get you’, it would be no more informative than the actions of Muslims, whether Palestinian knife wielding savages or Malmo’s cultural rape enrichment.

      Each and every time we’re faced with this unambiguous threat, our leaders leap to Islam’s defence, ‘nothing to do with Islam’ being current favourite.

      This reached a new low in Rotherham where collusion of the dhimmi Police Service, Council and Social Services enabled the sexual disfigurement of 1400 teenage girls.

      The perps were Muslim

      In Sweden, Finland and Germany, they were Muslim.

      In the Middle Eastern fiefdoms of IS they’re all Muslim (or will be when they finish the job of wiping out the kuffar.)

      The London Bombers, Madrid Bombers, Hebdo assassins, Paris terrorists and about 85 % of global terror, all muslims.

      However, if some bright but doomed copper said ‘Sarge, the boys down the Staion think there’s a link here’ he’d be fired.

      That’s where we’re at.

      It won’t go away because Islamic thought dwells in decades and in about five, the way things are going, we’ll be gone too.

      • logdon

        PS:

        This just in, as they say…

        Donald Trump: ‘I Think Islam Hates Us’ – Is He Right?

        Donald Trump’s latest comment that ‘Islam hates us’ cannot
        be dismissed as mere bigotry, we have to tackle the root of the issue
        while opposing bigotry.

        http://www.clarionproject.org/analysis/donald-trump-i-think-islam-hates-us-he-right#

        • Damaris Tighe

          I read Fallaci many years ago & found her a bit purple. Perhaps I was still in the early days of waking up to the threat, & maybe her very non-pc prose put me off. I’ll give her another try.

          • logdon

            So did I. She was an enlightenment.

          • E.I.Cronin

            Hello Damaris! I know what you mean about Fallaci. She’s incoherent, histrionic and as you say purple prosed at times (what could be more Italianate? :) but there are passages where she just nails it. I found her rage, scorn and pride in European culture a sharp antidote to the pc self-loathing I was surrounded by at work.
            A few reviews from Muslim sources reckon she played hockey with the facts (especially with the quote from the Palestinian activist and the famous apocryphal comment by the Arab cleric at the UN). I read a few of her 70’s feminist work and that was good reading. And I found out about Paul Fregosi’s monumental ‘Jihad in the West’ through Oriana.
            But to me her best writing is her closing chapter in FOR where she talks about our civilisation as a river. It floods, it meanders, it’s uncontrollable but it has many tributaries and it bears life. She then says Islam is like a swamp. Water flows in, stops and dies. And she finishes on a note of hope by saying… well I shouldn’t do any more spoilers!
            Hope all’s well.

          • Damaris Tighe

            Yes, you’ve hit it one the head re Fallaci! She wasn’t my cup of tea.

            All’s well thanks. I only come here on the rare occasion nowadays that there’s something on my main concerns, & you know what they are. Also, it’s difficult to find something new to say. Don’t want to keep posting the same old, same old.

            Did you ever get TR’s book?

          • E.I.Cronin

            Funny you should ask re TR, my local bookshop won’t order him through Amazon and a credit card glitch means I can’t use Paypal. Books are very expensive out here and if our currency falls lower I’ll be paying in bananas. So have requested the library to purchase him, it can take a long time but they usually process requests.

            Know what you mean re same old, same old. Time for action. We’ve had some wins and a few defeats in local campaigns but things are moving quickly even out here.

            Good Luck in the Brexit campaign and will let you know when.Enemy if the State arrives.

          • UKSteve

            I thought I’d noticed you by your absence! A shame, as we’re fighting all kinds of evils here, and need as many troops as possible!

          • Damaris Tighe

            I’m banned from Coffee House and since last autumn (!) there has been a dearth of articles on the subjects that concern me most.

          • UKSteve

            Naughty Damaris! Were you going around spreading truths and informed insights again?

            Tut, tut! 😉

          • Damaris Tighe

            I made a comment about this illustrious organ that the editor took personally.

          • UKSteve

            Free speech, innit!?

          • Damaris Tighe

            Ha! Pooh!

          • Damaris Tighe

            When I see the crazies who freely post BTL on Coffee House (eg Freddy Gray’s latest on Trump) & it’s me who has been blocked, it makes me want to flounce off for ever. Someone needs to get their act together.

          • UKSteve

            I have to say, it’s even worse on the Teleg website – you should see the perfectly harmless posts I’ve had removed!

          • Germainecousin

            Reading your comments is like breathing in fresh beautiful air. You have a knack of putting into words what so many of us are thinking, and I genuinely think you should be writing a lead column in a very decent publication. Keep it up for all our sakes.

          • Damaris Tighe

            Thank you my friend.

          • Anna Bananahammok

            I thought her books were spot on.

        • Anna Bananahammok

          Islam hates us, Islam hates itself, and of course, everybody on the planet hates islam.

          Now, spot the lowest common denominator.

      • steddyneddy

        Just as you cultural Marxist Jews wanted all along.

        • logdon

          Can you read?

      • secretpeople

        Part of the problem is the insistence on infantilising Muslims/islamists, or indeed any ME or African, or even poor South European peoples. So, it is the arrogance of the left that – if not causes the problems you describe – certainly compounds the problems and renders us idiotically defenceless.

    • Damaris Tighe

      I saw the beginnings of this process in Lucerne Switzerland of all places. And that was over 20 years ago.

    • Jab

      I feel so sad about Italy.I spent 10 years in Sicily and returned last year to Palermo, Catania and Turin.These cities have changed so much, if you go off the main areas you see see migrants hanging around waste bins.The stations are frightening.
      The police see the illegal activities, like builders who are north african and certainly dont pay contibutions to the state, and do nothing.Thecountry seems in some kind of bad dream.
      Very worrying.

    • Anna Bananahammok

      Rome has today the largest mosque in Europe. It was just finished a few years ago.
      Why would Rome need a 12,000 people mosque, anybody?

      • Germainecousin

        Rome does not need it, but muslims need it to hammer home a point. They will take Rome and the Vatican and although it pains me greatly to say it, the present Pope is aiding and abetting them.

  • David Prentice

    Chaos and instability. Cameron, Merkel and European/US elites are deliberately sowing the wind. The question is, why.

    • Mary Ann

      Dreamer.

      • Tom Cullem

        You are in denial if you think Merkel does anything non-deliberately, or that she isn’t savvy enough to play a very long game. Google immigrant economy and see what you find.

        The EU could see from at least 2013 on that a migrant crisis was shaping up. It did absolutely nothing to secure its external borders. Do you think it was mere oversight?
        I think they thought they could “use” the crisis but miscalculated the numbers and the resistance from indigenous populations – they were unprepared for the refusal to “share” Muslim migrants by quota in perpetuity, unprepared for the defiance, unprepared for the turn to the right.

        The abominable “deal” with Turkey should tell you everything you need to know about the depth of these people’s cynicism. You should take off your rose coloured glasses.

        • E.I.Cronin

          Yes – up until recently I thought Merkel’s decision was based on stupidity and idealism – now I just see stupidity and a cynical audacity.

          She just gave a pre-election speech castigating resistance to the influx as a habit by people used to seeing ‘the crises and never the opportunities’. It’s a slight anecdote to go on but I thought the use of ‘opportunities’ was revealing. The interviews she’s given recently have been with vapid talk show hosts. I’d love to see her in the media ring with a really angry, seasoned interrogator who could rattle her until she let something genuine slip out.

    • William Matthews

      The neat is answer is Social Marxism. Mass migration provides cheap labour for the big evil capitalist corporations, under-pinned, supported and enforced by the useful Left-wing idiots, who bully the rest of us by suggesting anything less than 100% compliance with their ideologies is racist.

      Although I think they messed it up. The vast majority of these immigrants, as others have said, are useless.

    • Wee Mental Davie

      You are right … why ? I don’t believe any of these conspiracy NWO theories, capitalist corporate control, or any other nonsense like that. It has to be some reason though. Some reason so strong, that they are prepared to risk erasing our culture.

      Of course, it will take a couple of hundred years to do that, but it’s obvious by the numbers it will happen. Just like London being majority non indigenous white today, compared to 30 years ago. So the big question is why, alright.

      I doubt we will ever know but our government are so scared of Brexit, they have gone to ridiculous limits and spread all this propaganda and lies, to prevent us voting to leave. This vote, I suspect, will be fiddled somehow. A Brexit may expose the reasons. A connection somehow, to over population of the world is my guess.

      • Mary Ann

        With the birth rate falling in most countries, world population is expected to start falling from the end of this century, it is mainly in the poorest countries that people have more than two or three children
        .https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_fertility_rate

        • Wee Mental Davie

          The birthrate in Africa is about to explode. Muslims follow their agenda of world control via the womb. Wiki. I never believe all in Wiki.

          It’s got to be some reason Mary Ann. Beyond left or right politics.Lets face it, they know we are not comfortable with islam, so why force more of it upon us ? Everything is done for reasons and they’re not always aparent.

          This EU migrant thing has been nurtured. Our migration into UK deliberate. None of this just happened. It was allowed to happen. It’s no conspiracy though.

          I mean, why did all of a sudden, the Eurosceptics change their minds and back Cameron to reamain ? No way was it jobs. Something else, bad enough to split the Tories. I’m not smart enough to figure it out, that I do know.

          • Mary Ann

            It isn’t just Wiki, but if you think wiki is wrong why don’t you correct it, anyone can.

        • mdj

          Syria’s population is five times what it was in my childhood. Much the same is true for all the countries around it which, by strange coincidence, are basket cases too.
          We are bombarded with scare stories about how we desperately need more population, even though the years of recent mass migration have predictably coincided with a fall in GDP per head.. As far as I know, only Japan’s PM has had the level-headedness to say that a declining population can be managed as well as any other change.

        • WTF

          If we are too conserve natural resources its obviously a good thing that western birth rates are falling but it defeats that positive aspect in the west if we let in an alien culture that multiplies faster than locusts and strips the food & energy supply bare.

          I would argue that we can and are setting a good example here by having neutral or even negative birth rates, I had 2 children, my brother had 2, my son has one and my daughter none. We’re not using more than our ‘fair share’ of natural resources of food or energy. In third world nations, let the survival of the fittest make it just as in nature when resources are limited.

  • Cyril Sneer

    The EU must die.

  • Mary Ann

    “Allowed millions of migrants into the continent in the first place.” It’s easy to make a statement like that, but when you are standing on the beach and these small boats are coming in, what were the authorities supposed to do, shoot them. It would be nice to see the non-refugees returned to where they came from, I wonder how long the process will take to sort them out. Of course countries with very low birth rates such as Germany and Italy will be glad to keep some anyway.

    • Tom Cullem

      Put them on seaworthy naval vessels and take them back to the shore they set out from. Or set up humane, clean, safe camps outside Europe and tell them they can stay there till the war in Syria gets settled or go home. As for sending back the economic migrants: Germany has been trying and failing for years to get North Africans from Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria sent back – their home countries didn’t want them back and wouldn’t even return phone calls from German immigration officers. Those “migrants” rip up their passports and then it takes months to re-identify them, process new passports, and hunt them down and put them on planes back to those countries.

      The German government knows perfectly well these migrants, many of them criminal, live in the shadows and they call them “tolerated” people.

      There are more than one million illegal immigrants in the UK. Our Immigration Office has candidly admitted that it “costs too much” to track them down and deport them. Our borders are shambolic and once in, it’s nearly impossible to get people out.

      Any more good ideas?

      • logdon

        I think Mary Ann and good ideas is an oxymoron.

        • Tom Cullem

          Noticed some time ago. LOL

    • WTF

      You do what Australia did and then you don’t have a problem !

    • TheJustCity

      ‘Shoot them’. Using such perversities shows you have assimilated as factual truth the mischaracterisation by the lib-left elites and media of any who have grave misgivings or who reject wholly the notion that it is for them to provide for the vast populations of Islamic MENA who are descending on their european homeland.

      You can be against this migration and retain a sound moral conscience.

    • tracery

      Having read a number of your comments I have come to the conclusion that you are in need of psychiatric help.

      • Mary Ann

        You have the right to disagree with me but being rude is not an intelligent way of doing so.

        • tracery

          It’s the only response that your comments deserve. Just please go away and post elsewhere.

    • Penny

      Not every migrant has arrived via a small boat, Mary Ann. But I would suggest that, as the first duty of any government is to protect the people, those who can’t even stop small boats have no business running a country.

      I think you have also overlooked Angela Merkel’s reckless invitation and the role that has played in this crisis.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        So you think not being to control every single area of the shore at all times, which means massive spending…right. Not to mention pandering shamelessly to the far right, as who else is going to take money for there to be 24/7 watch on every part of the coast, backed with force at the drop of a hat.

        As you ignore the real crisis – the far right’s attack on democracy in Europe.

    • WTF

      Meanwhile you’re 1500 miles away in some French village oblivious to all the gang rapes, sexual attacks, crime and burglary. I don’t suppose you’ll be putting up any migrant ‘refugee’ !

  • William Brown

    last year, I envisioned widespread firearm usage, inflicted upon the UK public, by its own police force, within ten years. I’ve since revised that to five years.

    • Mary Ann

      Scaremongering?

      • William Brown

        Talk to me by end of play 2021.

        Better yet, let’s catch up a year after the remain/leave vote, (which looks like it will probably be ‘remain’), as I might have a further downward revision.

        After all, 12 months down the line from a position of supplicant submission, the grey men will be turning the thumb screws, without sanction.

        • D J

          Big changes can happen astonishingly quickly. The anger of a population kept in check by social mores and laws can be upset by a spark and then proceed uncontrollably.
          It happened in 1989 in central Europe where populations had been disenfranchised for decades.
          The anger and frustration was palpable and people put up with it, until all of a sudden they didn’t.

          • William Brown

            Quite. Even a cursory look at history, recent or ancient, bears this out repeatedly. I suspect that the prospect of May Ann’s Tassimo coffee maker being rendered unusable is just too much for her to consider.

      • Vinnie

        tell that to the people of Ukraine or better yet the people of Greece who have to wake up to house invasions by completely unknown invaders

  • D J

    It is a tragedy that out politicians have not listened to their people.
    Hundreds of ‘refugee’ centres have been burned down by arsonists in Germany and Sweden.
    By ignoring the people the result will be violence against both the guilty and the innocent.
    Unfortunately the leaders and the press will blame it on ‘far right’ elements who are trying to protect their homeland.

    • William Brown

      You are right, but politicians, generally, know little of reality and seem taken by surprise at any resultant backlash from the public – it was ever thus.

  • Norbert

    Posting from France, I profoundly understand the arguments in favor of BREXIT. François Hollande is an embarrassment, Angela Merkel appears to have lost touch with reality, Brussels has become both Bureaucracy Central and safe haven for ISIS terrorists, and the Euro is a trap for non-competitive countries like Greece. Yikes!

    However, there are many European countries and individuals who know all this stuff. For example, the EU’s Donald Tusk is a good man. Hungary’s Orban is being called nasty names, but he’s standing up for cultural integrity. That’s not “fascism”. Instead of bowing to Merkel’s swarmy arguments, he put up a fence. Others have followed.

    We don’t want things to get even worse, we want to fix it. If the UK exits the EU, the chances of that happening start to approach zero. We want to empower the Donald Tusks of Europe.

    When the London mayor suggested voting “Leave” and then giving serious negotiations a second chance, that resonated with me. I don’t want the EU to be left without the UK’s influence. OK, I’m begging you: please don’t turn away. Yes, vote “Leave”, but then get serious.

    —–

    Concerning the Merkel surprise engineered on the sly with Turkey, I will first point to the fact that the Balkan route is now closed. Second, it’s simply not clear what a deal would look like; i.e. how many true refugees (e.g. people from the city of Aleppo) might be hosted in Europe. Much needs to be clarified. I doubt that European leaders will accept a deal that involves millions more migrants turning up in Paris or Warsaw.

    There would be no open door for Turks to migrate to Europe. They would get visa-free travel to Europe, just like Germans now have visa-free travel to Turkey. They couldn’t settle there, seek employment or social benefits. Also, I’ve met many Turks in Berlin and know them to a different sort of crowd that the Arabs, if you’ll allow the generalization.

    N.

    • Mongo

      sorry, I’m voting leave. I suggest you demand your own government give you a referendum on EU membership – ‘Frexit’

      • Conway

        No point in that – they had a referendum and they were ignored. They’ll have to wait until we’ve left and get together with others like the Dutch, the Danes and the Irish, all of whom have voted NO and been ignored.

    • TheJustCity

      No, that generalization is not admissable. Once, it might have had currency, but a polity which has an Islamist as leader – undermining all of Ataturk’s work for an Islamic state based on a modern civilised model – is a dubious entity. As regard ‘getting serious’ – that’s the very reason brits are looking to Brexit. Tusk is a bough-and-paid-for-by-the-authoritarian-liberal-left eurobot.

    • sebastian2

      Sorry to disappoint, but it’s leave, leave, leave.

      • Disqus Bolloqus

        Please do

    • Mary Ann

      Voting leave in the hope of getting another referendum is a clever way to get people who want to stay to vote leave. Don’t be fooled.

      • Tom Cullem

        Voting to STAY will get people who want to STAY and then sold to Turkey for a very nice price. Not to mention thoroughly done in as soon as the ink is dry on the vote and the EU unrolls its next three pieces of legislation – all of which will render that silly hot air balloon Cameron brought back moot – if, indeed, it ever wasn’t moot.
        Listen, no one is forcing you to vote OUT. Cast your vote and luxuriate in your superior internationalist outlook. Another referendum is unlikely – but so is closure on this issue after this one.
        Especially when the EU rolls out the items it has “tabled” for AFTER the referendum: an expanded budget demanding more dues, expanded guidelines on the free movement of workers, and full accession to the ECHR which will render most national parliaments effectively neutered.
        Did I forget to mention Turkish workers flooding in so that our own working-class can be further undercut? Or the thousands of migrants in five years with EU visas who will have the right to walk in?
        Looks delightful from here.

      • Disqus Bolloqus

        It’s not particularly clever. Even the stupid would not fall for that, even those called Boris

    • Conway

      We don’t want things to get even worse, we want to fix it. If the UK exits the EU, the chances of that happening start to approach zero. We want to empower the Donald Tusks of Europe.” The EU can’t be fixed. Once the UK has left, other nations will start to wake up and question. Eventually, the EU will collapse (all empires do eventually) and it can be reinvented in a reasonable form – say a common market.

  • Espinaca

    1) The mass invasion
    was not a ‘spontaneous’ event………as Merkel will have us believe. It was
    planned, calculated, and orchestrated by ONU/UNHCR, US Neocons, as well as
    George Soros who OWNS the Clintons, as he owns Obama, and the US political
    establishment he has permeated, diseased and infested.

    2) Germans today are
    not in a hereditary trap. These are new persons.

    3) Do not forget that
    Germany since more than 100 years is in a trap: USA, Anglophones … what they
    fear most is a union between Germany/Europe and Russia, today Eurasia. We might
    have to overthink a lot of history… as they pushed Germany from on WK into
    another…

    4) Germany today is
    Europe´s Trojan Hourse: an occupied country without peace treaty. When the
    muslim invasion started, in September 2015 USA deposited lots of new atomic
    bombs in Ramstein. What for?

    5) USA is going down;
    it is called “debitism”. They occupy half of the world, but their
    economy is destroyed. This is why they start since 2008 – and Mister Soros is
    implied all the time…- one war after the other, look especially at the fire
    ring they created around Europe… Arab Springs, Ucrania… Moldavia… and
    Syria, too.

    6) “Lefties”
    have to be analysed in a much longer historical segment now, but also the lying
    face of ONU and UNHCR. This is what UNHCR promulgates for Germany, make your
    own idea:

    http://tracks.unhcr.org/…/the-germans-welcoming…/

    7) My thesis is that
    Europe is exposed to an invasion, to a fascist, racist race mixture.

    8) The real aim is a
    US aim: to lower IQ in Europe with these analphabets, to destroy Eurasia.
    Europe is just a side effect; their real aim is Russia and China.

    9) Turkey and
    Saudi-Arabia, too, are behind (Saudi-Arabia is buying lots of land in Bosnia,
    IS is training there), and NGOs financed by Soros: www2eu.info, http://live.w2eu.info/

    He is financing these calls also on Internet, Twitter, FB and
    a hugh network of NGOs.

    10) This invasion is
    not Syrian; more than 75 % come from more than 50 nations from Africa, Middle
    East and Asia. 90 % are young men.

    There has to be a high pressure or extortion on Germany/Europe
    to not start to defend themselves with arms. No normal nation would permit such
    a violent invasion without defense.

  • Ingmar Blessing

    Oh my god!

    “It is the same story in Germany.” I am German. Well, not for too long anymore, I guess.

    They really did it. Our precious – life-incompetent, management-skill-less, brain-free – lefties f*cked it up so much that there might be no way out anymore. The coming scenarios include:

    A) super police&surveillance state with video cameras everywhere including facial recognition to catch the illegals

    B) transforming the continent into a socialist zone (maybe the model EUSSR?) and pay-off the migrants to buy time (just imagine you stop paying them; they’d immediately start ganging up) and eventually scenario A

    C) locking up all cities and regions and allow some of them get turned into New Kabul, Mogadischu and Brazzaville, but also with (large) zones where the European culture can survive

    D) loss of control and turning the continent into something Syria/Afghanistan/Kongo in 5-20 years

    A few years ago I came the conclusion that somewhen in the 2050s there will be a reinforced fence in Europe again. Since France already was going through a dramatic change with the point of no return behind (just think of the ICM research result about ISIS sympathizers), I had hope that Germany had the chance to avoid the same fate. The fence would have been along the river Rhine. The other option was a fence along the river Oder between Germany and Poland. With Merkels extremely stupid and fatal decision of opening the borders last September she locked in the second option.

    I hope, at least Eastern Europe will survive…

    • Espinaca

      I agree, but you miss the point that – my thesis – Merkel is forced by a coalition of financial elite – Neocons – herself as a hegemon in Europe/a puppet as Germany has no peace treaty and still is occupied – Mister George Soros – ONU/UNHCR – Turkey – Saudi-Arabia and some other hidden forces. Your scenario might not even be achieved if now they manage to push the impotence and anger of normal people exposed to the violence of these invadors (here somebody is trying to gather the peaks of this ice-berg, as there is lots of repression and censorship, too: https://twitter.com/XYEinzelfall, and see all the cases of rape, assaults, robbing, beating, spitting, beating of women, children, even men: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=z12D0zt-V4iI.kXGfjpzjOS1Q) into the wrong corner, what MSM already try: to say that the guilty is Russia. This could end up in a real war even.

    • Tom M

      You have my sympathies Ingmar. As you are German a question springs to mind slightly off-piste.
      After the events in Cologne and elsewhere were covered up enmass by the German Government and finally became public it was the immigrant issue that dominated the scene.
      What interests me is what are you lot saying and doing about a Government who has the nerve, in a democratic country, to close down all the newspapers, radio, television stations in the country from reporting upon a story they didn’t like.
      This from one of the more apparently stalwart members of our democratic EU. If this is seen as an uncontested example imagine what those countries of a recent totalitarian or Communist persuation will think or do.

      • Espinaca

        I respond as an Austrian: You no longer can read these facts as a democracy. There are mighty powers behind this very well prepared influx. In my opinion, there is hardly any chance to change anything with democratic means. There has been already a try to show the violation of Germany´s “constitution” – its basic law – and it was just refused. What is still not clear is if the aim is just to destroy Germany/German speaking countries or really all Europe, as they are so much insisting in spreading these invadors of more then 50 nations, packed up in the Syrian fairy tale. The main aims seems to be a unipolar world with just one hegemony, race mixture and some other nasty things, and Europe is just the entrance hall, what really is the goal is Russia, and then China.

        • CRSM

          I think you stretch your net too widely. The goal is the destruction of Christendom, and it has been going on since the middle of the 19th century. It’s just that those of us who point this out get called a well-known name.

        • PaD

          Coudenhove Kalergi?

          • Espinaca

            Could be… there are many “plans”, Hooton, Kaufman, the one you mention… and there is this Pentagon guy Thomas Barnett with his 4 flows, one of them global migration. In his 2 books he seemingly speaks of 1,5 mio migrants each year for Europe and reducing IQ to 90. I have no idea which of these perverse plans we are dealing with, only that they are perserve in my opinion.

            I hope we can stop this.

          • PaD

            Im praying that AfD get into power. And soon.

          • Espinaca

            Well, I am praying that Europe get´s into its senses (if this is good English..). We need a wall like Israel, and we need that somebody is able to stop this bordermonitoring.eu, Soros behind. We need to stop Green and lefties (I voted them until one year ago.. no longer): https://twitter.com/Muschelschloss/status/709764558781603841?lang=de

            We cannot wait until AfD get´s into power. We need to stop this for whole Europe and Germany this spring !!!

          • PaD

            Your English is fine.
            Like you one year ago I was voting the same..but slowly,then quickly I awoke as if from a sleep..to find that there was a nightmare happening…and the kind of people who I thought were ‘good’ were in reality bad..bad thinking bad acting bad everything..when ‘less intelligent’people complained they were described as ‘racist’ islamaphobic'(a word they invented) ‘rightwing’ when they werent ANY wing just concerned for their childrens future..
            the pokitical elites across europe have so much to answer fir.
            Here in Uk . A town called Rotherham..that was what woke me up..and the party in power for the 15years of terrible crimes against young girls KNEW and IGNORED this..locally and nationally this was happening..people who raised the alarm were castigated and sent on a DIVERSITY course. .my anger is deep and bitter.
            Cologne Malmo where when will it end?
            It HAS to end soon because our cultures face extinction ..brought on by people who share that culture but have nothing but sntagonism towards it..mostly whitecmiddkeckass professionals

          • PaD

            Sorry some typing errors..

          • Espinaca

            Yes… what we in Central Europe perhaps do not understand, that is if this is just against us… a revenge 70 years later with innocent people. But the more I read, I think it deals with Europe in general. The plan is to weaken whole Europe as an economic power. USA financial elites want unipolar hegemony and this means Europe has to go down. It make absoluty no sense to resettle these muslims in Europe !!! No sense at all ! Why should we or why do we have to accept this? Lefites sell us brainwashed humanity? Why do they not go to Saudi-Arabia? Why do we Europeans have to subsain the destruction US-army did to Syria? And why UNO is insisting to resettle millions in Europe?
            Guys, we need to stop this, in any way. This is no longer a good plan.

    • Dominic Stockford

      It is sadly ironic that Eastern Europe may be assisted in surviving by Russia!

    • Damaris Tighe

      Ingmar, I’d be interested to read your take on Merkel. What possessed her do you think?

      • Ingmar Blessing

        Well, Merkel seems to be a (smart and power aware) risk-minimizer. That means, her aim is not to win, but not to lose at any cost. That can be a very powerful strategy, but eventually ends up in a catastrophe because it is not a dominant strategy. At one point you have to start winning, otherwise you lose it all.

        It’s like when you play Roulette. You always put the same chips on one color and if you lose you double up. This way you – theoretically – cannot lose. In reality, at one point you run out of chips, or you bust the bank.

        She seems to have done that her entire life. All her “success” in politics was not based on her doing/deciding something, but others trying and failing. She only stepped in after it happened. I’m not sure if that is her Eastern-German socialization or just a pattern that had suited her well. But it does have something of a collectivized Sowjet citizen.

        – This pattern must have gotten her into university including privileges although her father was a reverent with distance to the regime.
        – The same got her in politics although she had no role in the revolt (she spend the decisive evening in the sauna; kind of symptomatic: At first it was cosy warm and right after, it got very cold..)
        – Her political career took off not because she was charismatic or anything, but a young Eastern German women with an academic degree in nuclear physics (lot’s of quota). It was pure coincidence that she ended up in the (formerly) conservative party. Others with comparable spacetime ended up in the Green party.
        – When she became head of the party, it didn’t happen because she was smart and rallying the masses, but because almost all other leading members were involved in corruption scandals (including Schäuble, who would have been the “natural” head), she simply stepped in without much noise
        – as head of the party she didn’t become candidate for the big office at first – reason: lack of charisma and leadership skills
        – Before the election where she finally became chancellor, the social democrat government pushed through extreme labor reforms that split the party in two. Even tough, she almost lost against (the charismatic) chancellor Schröder.

        … and then in office…

        – she never fixed the currency crisis, all she did was post-boning the unavoidable again and again and again. The other players on the table realized that (Greece..) and spiced up the price (e.g. an Italian in charge of our French currency – 20 years ago the nightmare #1 for every German in peace times and beyond personal news)
        – she didn’t do anything to get the EU on track, all she did was post-boning and at the end getting overrun by the new facts and giving in. That cost us so far alone for the currency >400bn Euros in securities, another 1-2tn in dead paper values, a permanently broken currency, fading savings and a monstrosity of a lemon market.
        – on international level they praised her, but all she did there too was to avoid, post-bone, pay off and at the end taking the loss (=doubling up) but pretending it was a success or circumstantial (our media helped here a lot on that)
        – domestically her biggest screw up was the reopening and then after Fukushima the shutting down again of the nuclear plants (=the pattern). All that during the transition of the energy supply to renewables, something which alone costs 20bn a year till 2050. Until recently energy was considered her biggest screw up in her legacy.

        … then a lot happened in just 6 months…

        – and now we have a crazy stupid deal with Turkey where Turkey is 100% in charge of sending us as many illegal migrants as they want, which we then whitewash into legal refugees by sending them back to Turkey, so that Turkey can send us new ones instead. Here too: Avoiding, post-boning, paying-off and then getting run over and doubling up. (I can’t wait to see Britain replaced by Turkey in the EU!)

        Since she is running Germany and not something Latin America the bankroll is quite deep. That is why she could afford to double up so often in office.

        When they passed the ESEF/ESM mechanism for the standard bail-outs two(?) years ago, I already had a feeling that she would double up another time, because there is always an other crisis coming and then she would be going epically bankrupt with the entire continent.

        But that it would be this issue and in that way – WOW, I had no clue!

        Overall the whole migrant crisis looks to me like a game that you play with someone who seemingly is successfully running his business on that loser strategy. I don’t know who started the mass migration – apparently someone did (Soros, Turkey,..) – or if they anticipated Merkels behavior in that way.

        What I can definitively say: With her reaction pattern she was basically doomed to take those decisions. They always suited her and they brought her success. That she actually lost every time has been over-compensated by doubling up and (self-)pretending, that there is much more to gain – well, so far.

        • Damaris Tighe

          But opening the borders & ‘refugees welcome’ seems proactive not reactive.

          • Ingmar Blessing

            It was more of a non closure of the borders and the refugee welcome campaign was not her idea. I have already seen the posters with “refugees welcome” in summer near a punk bar. The mainstream (+politics) only adapted it.

            She reacted on both by first ignoring and then allowing it to happen. The situation in Hungary on Sep 4/5 was a classic zugzwang for her since the alternative would have been to be hard and decisive. Allowing the migrants to move on was the less tough decision which would have had happened anyway.

            But of course I just tried to outline her general pattern. That does not exclude the occasional active decision (usually connected with a lot of costs).

          • Damaris Tighe

            Ah, I see. That’s very helpful Ingmar. Merkel has been a complete puzzle to all of us on the Anglo right. I’ve seen page upon page of dissection including psychoanalysis & conspiracy theory. Personally I subscribe to the c*ck-up theory of history. But psychology is always important. Perhaps you’ve described someone who has been promoted above her capability so is always on the defensive. And she really hates all manifestations of patriotism & nationalism with a passion – I’m thinking of her removal of the German flag from a photo op. The look of disgust on her face was unforgettable

          • Ingmar Blessing

            Yes, she is clearly above her level of competence. Maybe not intellectually, but when it comes to leadership she is reliably picking the wrong option (e.g. she burned through several presidents).

            Not sure if that makes you more comfortable, but most non-left people here didn’t understand her too.

          • Espinaca

            I made an analysis of outside Germany and I am Austrian, but right now living in Spain. Seemingly, the money giver of nearly everything is Soros: his money is in the EU, the European parliament, especially green-left-socialists, in Swiss Migro, in the left-wing Podemos of Community of Madrid… so he is everywhere and this is a corrupt netwerk behind the curtains.

          • Penny

            Ingmar will correct me if I’m wrong, Damaris, but although I wouldn’t go so far as to suggest “disgust” is the general public response to the German flag, I don’t think the flying of it hither and thither is seen as “appropriate”

            I lived in Germany for a few years and, outside of football matches or other sports events where flags are the usual indicator of nationality, I don’t think I saw a German flag flying. I remember a German friend saying that it didn’t feel “comfortable” to display patriotism because of past history.

            At the time I thought this discomfort arising from an historical cause was troubling. We’ve had it here in the UK over the British Empire and then the NF adopting the English flag. But I think that the guilt factor can only be pushed so far before resentment or indifference sets in. How that resentment is handled can either restore equilibrium or perhaps give rise to a more troubling scenario.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “can either restore equilibrium”

            Appeasement? Never works.

          • Espinaca

            The logo of “Welcome” is a copy of signs at the Mexican border = American. I have seen this sign in October all over Madrid, too…., in November it nearly disappeared… so I think the campaign was designed for ALL Europe.

        • Espinaca

          As an Austrian, I would say you focus too much on Merkel – she is a puppet !
          In my opinion, instead of Merkel it could be Ferkel, Serkel, Rerkel, Terkel, Kerkel… does not matter. The network behind is much more powerful. Germany unfortunatly – and it is injustice done in 1989/90 – is still not free, USA has its fingers on the whole country – see all the military basis. The network behind is financial elites (debitism is very important…) – NeoCons – UNO/UNHCR- Soros – Turkey – Saudi-Arabia. Merkel is just doing what all these Thinks Tanks and hidden forces put on her.

    • PaD

      A bleak and depressing prospect.
      But decent and intelligent German people are now resisting with AfD recent success..we hope!
      We are with you in spirit !

    • PaD

      You have our sympathy and support Ingmar..if this is all some kind of plot by EUSSR then the people throughout europe must rise up and cast these plotters into permanent exile..or better,on a 1way flight to Syria.
      If it has NOT been plotted then the people should still rise up and banish thrm permanently from Europe.
      They are dangerous to all the nationalities within Europe..and a serious threat to life of Europes indigenous people.
      No1 deportee Merkel
      No2 Peter Sutherland UNglobal migration cheif.
      He is on record recommending nationalities should be suppressed.
      We wish you all a better life than these ‘leaders’ are making you suffer.
      AfD I hope sweep to power. And begin the task.

  • Tickertapeguy

    Of all the reasons why the EU will collapse (including collapsing economies, 1 trillion dollars of bad loans held by European banks) none come close to the issue of a nation’s sovereignty. That has been sacrificed by millions of asylum seekers flooding Europe
    and
    the laws of the EU that demand her members meet a quota of this invasion.

  • jeffersonian

    I recall how, only a few years ago, people would sneer at and call ‘alrmist’ those who warned that European civilisation was under threat, and that the gruesome end-product would be something called Eurabia: a place without the values which created the greatest civilisation Mankind had ever seen.

    And it’s coming to pass before our eyes, with the traitors enabling this horror (read: mad Mutti Merkel and the rest of the Euro establishment) touted for the Nobel peace prize.

    Orwell couldn’t have done it better.

    • grimm

      The hordes of people coming from the third world to enjoy what the West has created seem unable to understand that our values and our intellectual freedom have been crucial to creating the modern world they so envy. Do they imagine that if Western societies become dominated by the third world’s intellectually stunted religions and social structures this progress will be sustained?

    • PaD

      Indeed eurabia. The EU already has secret project to include much of MEast and North Africa in its masterplan

  • James Chilton

    The cultural suicide pact, which has been agreed in continental Europe, need not include us if we assert our sovereignty before it’s too late.

  • Disqus Bolloqus

    Project fear, Brexit style

    • licjjs

      This is actually Project Survival, Project Last Chance Saloon. If these millions keep coming from islamic countries it is the end of us, That’s it. It is not an irrational fear like the ‘Remains’ try to spread daily: “O what will happen to us? How can little Britain survive?” complete panic and pessimism, as if we have all lost the capacity to manage our own affairs in the past forty or fifty years and see staying in the monstrous muddle called the EU as being preferable.

      • Disqus Bolloqus

        Why do you think leaving the EU will mean they won’t come?

        • licjjs

          They can’t come unless we have allowed them in, in which case, we’ll know EXACTLY who to blame – and there will be no EU apron to hide behind.

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            We have control of our borders now to non EU immigration. Leaving will not change that. It could make a difference to EU immigration, however the point raised above was. About Muslim immigration.

          • Mongo

            we have our own spineless govt to blame for that – unfortunately that won’t change after Brexit

          • licjjs

            I am talking about the millions of muslims now flooding the EU: eventually they will be given passports and come here if they want – many of the Somalis and others in the UK have come here via European passports from Holland, Ireland etc. Now the whole population of Turkey is to be given a free gift of 90 days freedom of Europe as an introductory offer. Once it is a member of the EU that is 70 million muslims at one fell swoop.

          • Mary Ann

            Well if Britain stays in Cameron can always veto it.

          • WTF

            Read and digest !

            David Cameron’s package of EU reforms cannot be made legally binding the president of the European Parliament has said.

            Martin Schulz said the European Parliament could amend any deal done and would not necessarily even rubber-stamp it at all.

          • The_Common_Potato

            Mary Ann,

            I don’t know how you feel about Christoper Booker, I don’t much care. May I suggest you read his The Great Deception: Can the European Union Survive?? It’s essentially an history of what is now the EU, from a British perspective.

            If anyone person is reonsible for the European project it’s Jean Monnet. His dream was for a federation of European states, run in a top down manner. However, he and his supporters were unable to achieve their aim in one fell swoop so decided to progress in stages. This stealthy approach explains why the EU loves a ‘beneficial crisis’ such as BSE. The current refugee also falls into this category. During such crises the EU takes action and once the EU gains ‘competence’ in a particular area it will have control over that particular subject for ever more.

            It is simplistic to say that we don’t know how Brexit will pan out, but equally, we have no idea how the EU itself will evolve. At least, post Brexit, we – and any other country that goes down the leave route – will be able to decide for itself how it acts.

            It’s probably important to mention that the EU came about soon after the end of World War 11 during which central planning was essential. It’s my opinion that the very same people thought that the same ‘the man from the ministry knows best’ top down working model was the way to go. Decades later, a bottom up works better (susidiarity).

            Anyway, go ahead and read Booker’s book.

          • WTF

            I wish you the best but I’m afraid that people like this woman don’t want to face the facts, the truth and the lessons of history. They have their own fantasy world that they want the rest of us to fall in line to and then they can’t understand when it all turns to s*** !

          • The_Common_Potato

            Apparently someone paid for and sent copies of Booker’s book to all (then) serving MPs and all (then) serving British MEPs. I doubt many of our representatives actually read the book.

          • WTF

            I had come across the name Jean Monnet briefly but I had another look at his background just now and its seems another case of history repeating itself or at least at the beginning. Part of the reasons for WWII were the reparations demanded of Germany for WWI (rightly or wrongly) and it seems that Monnet was trying a repeat exercise by grabbing part of Germany’s coal / steel production after WWII in what looks like an attempt to enfeeble them and make France the leading power of Europe. Maybe its in the French psyche and they never got over Napoleon getting his rear kicked by Britain and Germany (Prussia).

            Perhaps that was Monnet’s core plan to do the usual French trick of getting their own back (and some) and maybe it explains why the French didn’t want the UK to get involved in a common market as they would play second fiddle once more. In any respect, it probably set the scene for later EU federalists who don’t believe in real democracy but want control at all costs from the top. Naturally they justify these mechanisms by repeating its for the good of all rather than looking at the methods used thaat we’ve seen of late.

            Just reading Monnets bio worries me but it does explain why we are where we are right now and it serves as a useful easy read to try and draw sense fromthe EU today. As you say, it doesn’t look as though many in politics and certainly the remainiacs here have ever bothered to understand Monnet & others real agenda.

          • The_Common_Potato

            I also think that the French don’t get enough of the blame for WW11 with their excessive demands for reparations. Also, I don’t really understand why they have a permanent seat on the UN Security Council. They held out for – what? – six weeks?

            One recurring theme in Booker’s book is when a piece of EU legislation is about to be signed, the French demand and get beneficial terms in a totally separate and unrelated area. (It’s usually something CAP.) But of course they are the ‘good Europeans.

            The other recurring theme is how bad our civil servants are at negotiating terms that are beneficial to us. Related to this is the way we ‘gold plate’ many EU-related laws.

            I know it doesn’t sound like it but I love France. Their politicians: less so.

          • UKSteve

            She won’t – as others have concluded here, “she” is basically a tr0ll.

            But North / Booker’s book you cite is one of the most important I’ve ever read.

          • The_Common_Potato

            I don’t think she’s a troll. Rather, I think she’s fantasist fool.

            Re Booker’s and North’s (oops, I forgot about him) book: as far as I recall, Peter Hitchens recommended the book in either his column of blog several years ago – so I bought it.

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            What evidence do you have that the ‘millions flooding Europe’ will be given passports?

            If you’re serious about immigration you should be concentrating on the push factors

            – War
            – Huge wealth disparities between rich and poor countries.

            Without action to address those issues, anything else is fiddling whilst Rome burns. Remember humans have since time immemorial moved around the globe in search for better lives, from Out of Africa to the European expansion to today’s crisis. You’re not going to change human behaviour by sounding tough on border control, you’ll just create more conflict which will create more immigration. That is nothing more than trying to apply a plaster over a gaping wound. Deal with causes had you have a chance of limiting and reducing the numbers arriving at our gates.

          • mohdanga

            How does Japan manage to control immigration? By not letting anyone in! Not rocket science.

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            Probably by being a continent removed from the war zones of the Midle East and Africa. Having a language no one else understands.

          • Anna Bananahammok

            what absolute rubbish

            Muslim nations don’t even let in their own neighbours and brothers and sisters who speak the same language!
            It has nothing to do with geography or language, but with some countries being strong and wishing to protect their people from outsiders who can’t even live in peace with their own, and other countries being weak, who sell out their people, so they can benefit from the political status quo.

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            So you’re saying jumping on a boat across the Aegean is the equivalent of trekking across the Asian continent. Do you have any understanding of geography?

          • Anna Bananahammok

            why don’t they just cross a small half hour strip of desert then, you idiot?

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            Thanks for calling me an idiot Anna, I can see you’re a charming individual.

          • Mary Ann

            The vast majority of our Muslims come from the Middle East and Pakistan and India, the EU is predominately white Christian. Farage wants to stop immigration from the EU and instead take it from the commonwealth. Mind you, he is never going to have to put his money where his mouth is.

          • WTF

            The demographics of Europe are rapidly changing after the Madness of Merkel and unfortunately there’s little we can do about deporting UK citizens who break the law. However, we can introduce an Australian points system which will ensure only those who have a clean record and are needed will be allowed in.

            I find it striking that both you and I live outside of the UK and yet you wish to sell it down the river and let in all manner of low lifes in whereas I am still concerned for the country of my birth and especially my family members still living there. A classic case of NIMBYISM by you if ever I saw one and I’m all right jack, **** the rest of you. You really are a nasty piece of work !

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            Commonwealth countries like Pakistan, no Muslims there presumably!

          • The_Common_Potato

            I’m pretty certain the Farage wishes to stop automatic immigration from the EU, not all immigration. That word “automatic” is quite important.

        • Espinaca

          There is a very brilliant article, but only in German, that make it clear that Tony Blair already did this to you in Britain some 15 years ago !

          It could happen that the poor Germans will be so much invaded that they will be used as the ones that beat back first, then they will be declared nazis again, but all others, French, British, Dutch… will use the shadow to clean the house…

          I feel injustice for Germans. They do not deserve to be used again.

          • Tancred

            But the Germans have been brainwashed to be guilty since 1945. The minority who have a high enough IQ to see through this nonsense risk getting arrested for challenging the ‘established truth’. Germany is not really a country anyway, it’s a commercial company set up by the four occupying allied powers. Merkel is probably a CIA stooge. I reckon that sooner or later the Germans will explode in anger again and a third ‘Punic’ war will be fought by the Anglo-Saxon Roman Empire against the German Carthage. The result of this war will be the complete abolition of the German state forever – those Germans who survive the war will be deported to Australia, USA or Canada and German lands divided between France, Poland and the Netherlands.

          • Espinaca

            This is what I fear… and it is injustice… because provocation again… Germans are killed since more than 100 years…

          • vieuxceps2

            Mat we have a link to the article? (I read German)

          • Augustus
          • Espinaca

            See here (be aware that this is alternative media, this editorial is already declared “antisemitic”… just in case: I am not :-)…):
            http://info.kopp-verlag.de/hintergruende/deutschland/gerhard-wisnewski/medien-schweigen-briten-skandal-tot-premier-blair-plante-schon-vor-15-jahren-migrantenwelle-fuer-gr.html
            It is a critical editorial, was the first one to really analyise the Soros-network behind the invasion. There are some 3-4 excellent articles done by Friederike Beck – you can find them at the same site !

          • vieuxceps2

            Many thanks! Will read Bower’s book now.

          • Espinaca

            I fear that now I am “under observation” here as one posting, completely neutral in my opinion, did not appear. I just want to make clear now – because I wonder about the reason and the only thing I can think of is mentioning this one word “antis…” – that probably you in the UK are not aware that any critical view or research or publishing facts which in MSM are silenced, simply is pushed into this corner. The same happens with “right wing”. This is all I wanted to say. It is just an alternative media.

          • vieuxceps2

            Thanks! Anyway, Bower’s book is freely available here so we can all learn from it.

          • WTF

            Unfortunately they need to ditch Mad Merkel fast and start kicking out unwanted migrants before it turns really nasty. Unlike WWII where most of Europe & the UK were against Germany’s policies at that time for obvious reasons, I suspect that if it kicks off again over there the peoples of Europe will look the other way when deportation starts in earnest as they all have similar problems ourselves.

  • Conway

    I decided long ago. I want OUT!

  • Polly Radical

    People were arraigned at Nuremberg for this type of thing.

    • grimm

      For what type of thing?

      • red2black

        Surrendering.

  • Vinnie

    We need to seriously have a discussion about self determination – we want our own country. We’ll take Cornwall even. But we want it for the indigenous British. And full control of borders.

  • Chris Hobson

    The EU is a bureaucracy built on a Platonic Republic, we should revert to Periclean Democracy.

    • Morris Jasper

      & even the Republic was very clear about both, quantity & quality.

    • Tancred

      Gobbledygook. In modern times we need a firm hand, that’s what we need.

  • John Andrews

    No. I do not want to part of it. I would like the UK to be moved to the mid-Atlantic to avoid it. I want what’s left of our armed forces to be deployed on coastal and airport defence. I favour a national competition to find which part of the UK is best suited to the setting up of camp for illegal immigrants. The Isle of Wight is a possibility but it seems a little hard on its residents. Ditto Essex, but would Canvey Island be suitable?

    • tracery

      One of the SNP’s strongholds in Scotland would seem to be the most appropriate place. Sturgeon says that Scotland wants more migrants.

      • abystander

        The whole of Scotland is an SNP stronghold.

    • nutsingha

      A cold rock in the North sea somewhere?

    • CRSM

      The use of the Isle of Man is traditional.

      • John Andrews

        Good idea. But it is not in the EU or the UK. What about using the Isle of Sheppey?

  • justejudexultionis

    European culture is collapsing, along with its self-respect, due to the abandonment of Christianity which has been the bedrock of our civilisation since at least the time of the Emperor Constantine. We must reconstruct the antemurale christianitatis in the Balkans and across southern Europe in order to keep the Islamic hordes out. Islam, even its so-called ‘moderate’ strains is a profoundly bigoted, irrational and violent cult that is entirely antithetical to democracy and respect for human life. Merkel will go down in history as a traitor, a fool and the Jezebel who threw threw a great continent to the dogs.

    • rtj1211

      European Culture was about one bunch of savages fighting another lot of savages to rule over a bit of the continent. Kings, Dukes, Generals, you name it, they all wanted conquest, loot and pillage.

      The Renaissance and the Industrial Revolution had rather more to do with technical innovation, science and trade than anything to do with Christian values. Making money, rather than deifying God.

      European Culture before the Renaissance was described by the term ‘The Dark Ages’, which suggests it wasn’t much of a culture at all, more a very authoritarian, very nasty place to live.

      Christianity was a brainwashing tool for the Establishment which was rejected by the submissives around 1920. It was a tool of subjugating women which they rejected at the end of WW II.

      Christianity as was was merely one tool of the rich and powerful to control the masses.

      It was used as a subjugation tool in the colonies too. Very successfully.

      It is a tool of blackmail and bribery: you pay me 10% tithes for me to keep your dirty secrets, which I have induced you to confess by promising forgiveness.

      Just look at the grandiosity of all the Christian churches, cathedrals etc. Unbelievable wealth put into buildings. Paid for by 10% tithes of the poor.

      Just imagine what you haters of taxation would say about coughing up 10% of your income to the church, like it or lump it, eh?

      Makes £160 odd for a BBC license seem like a pittance, doesn’t it??

      Well????

      • Anna Bananahammok

        I think you might be more mentally off than I had previously realised.

  • Murti Bing

    We already have sharia patrols keeping the streets of east London safe from corrupting western influence. Soon our museums will be trashed as temples of idolatry and the rest of our cultural and political institutions will be torn down one by one as the new fascism takes hold. Hold on to your hats – it’s going to be a bumpy ride.

  • TrippingDwarves

    To paraphrase a line in Civilisation by Kenneth Clark – A civilisation collapses when it loses confidence in itself.

    Ask yourself who is the more confident these days? And why?

    Europe, either as a whole or as a loose amalgamation of its constituent parts, needs, DESPERATELY, to recover its confidence. Are our values worth defending or not? And if they are, then we need to start fighting. Tolerance is the luxury of the man who cares for nothing.

    • vieuxceps2

      Tolerance is what Lefties have demanded from us in the face of invasion and takeover. Doesn’t work the other way of course. I fear that we now have not tolerance but immeasurable apathy. Those few who have spoken out have been swiftly cut down by laws passed expressly for that purpose.

      • rtj1211

        What did your kind demand of Africans during the conquests of the British Empire?? Or does that not matter, as they were blacks best suited to being servile to the superior white man??

        If you are going to trash ‘lefties’ about us being ‘invaded’, you’d better say what you expect of others when you do the invading……

        So far as history records it, you expected immeasurable apathy and applied the death penalty to those like Kenyan Mau-Mau fighters who refused to lie down and submit……

        • vieuxceps2

          I don’t think what “my kind” did in Africa has any relevance to the settlement of millions of incomers into my homeland.
          You excel yourself by combining Whataboutery and You-too-ery in one comment.Neither is relevant.
          You are one of the lefties who “rubbed our noses ” in diversity, are you?
          .You should all be ashamed of the harm and insult you have poured upon your working class supporters.
          Do you expect us to be grateful? Watch the next elections and find out.

        • mohdanga

          And does Britain still control African colonies? Most of the inhabitants of those countries can’t wait to swan up on the shores of Blighty.
          I thought taking over other countries was wrong…except, of course, when it’s done to white countries, then it’s “diversity”. And the British never replaced the African population with whites, they were always a very small minority, unlike the tsunami of Muslims entering the EU and UK.

        • Anna Bananahammok

          Isn’t Africa just the perfect example of how not all civilisations are the same.
          Such a large continent, so many many many countries, most of which absolutely failures and hellholes.
          Without a single white man around.
          Go figure.

        • CRSM

          I think that you’ll find that given what the Mau-Mau did, the death penalty was too good for them.

    • rtj1211

      Tolerance is the daily bread of those sufficiently enlightened to know that no set of ‘values’ works for all humanity so tolerating parallel sets of values is a reasonable course of action.

      Tolerating values of those who seek to destroy you is not included in that. However, it’s not a mark of ‘confidence’ that you feel able to beat bloodthirsty savages in war. It’s a mark of the retention of sufficient animalistic barbarity not to become mentally deranged by taking that course of action……

  • Nick

    Civil war is coming to Europe.

    • Mary Ann

      It’s the outers who are meant to be using project fear, still imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

      • WTF

        You’ve got that wrong as all the fear mongering to date has primarily come from Cameron, his oiks and the EU as in “If we leave, we will lose this, it will cost that etc, etc ad nauseum”. None of it was substantiated and it was the ONLY way they had of countering true facts over the costs of being in the EU and where Cameron failed in his negotiations. That said, the possibility of WWIII or a Civil war was raised by your old friend Jean Claude Kluncker and NOT Brexit. No surprise there considering his heritage !

        Do you ever bother to research what you post ?

        https://www.britainfirst.org/eu-nonsense-if-britain-leaves-eu-it-could-spark-world-war-iii/

        • Mary Ann

          Frequently, and I frequently give links as well, I shan’t bother to check you link, I wouldn’t trust it anyway, but I have looked at the link to the Indy. about Europeans applying for British nationality, amusing, when they get old they won’t be able to go back to their home countries to retire, and Britain will have to look after them until death, and all because of the outers. Pity the Brexit lot don’t think things through. My Mother-in-law went back to Scotland to die.

          • WTF

            You’re talking rubbish again as dual nationality is allowed for some EU countries and perhaps the EU will get around to helping its citizens for once instead of migrant free loaders by making dual nationality a right.

        • Mary Ann

          I would expect a site like Britainfirst to skew the facts to suit its own agenda, but I did look at the Indy reference because I expect the truth from them.

      • WTF

        It appears that lots of Europeans want to become UK citizens, any chance you’ll become a French citizen with all the benefits the EU brings you ?

        http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/eu-referendum-worried-eu-nationals-dash-for-uk-citizenship-amid-brexit-fears-a6923836.html

        • Mary Ann

          That was an interesting read, there is a feeling of complacency over here, very few Brits. actually believe that Britain will vote out, they certainly don’t believe they will be thrown out of the health care system, and have their state pensions frozen, a lot won’t of course qualify, they haven’t bothered to learn the language, we don’t qualify because we haven’t lived here for long enough, so if we loose our state health care, we will have to come back. Most of our friends are saying the same thing, loose the health care and it’s back to Blighty. Keep the health care and we stay, if we are allowed to, unless of course Le Pen gets power.

        • Mary Ann

          I responded to this but it seems to have vanished, I am not eligible to become a French citizen I haven’t been here long enough and I intend to go back to Britain to die like a lot of other migrants do, my children live in England. My husband is unlikely to pass the language test anyway unless they make allowances, he is severely dyslexic. If we loose our state care we will have to come back anyway, we can’t afford private health insurance and most of our friends are saying the same thing.

          • WTF

            And the EU allows discrimination against handicapped Brits who want to become citizens, who would have thought it as that doesn’t happen in the UK to other nationalities. There again, we still have some semblance of democracy unlike mainland Europe. Sounds like you’re one of those ex-pat Brit families who sponge off the UK tax payer for benefits whilst living abroad, that explains a lot of your hypocrisy ! I understand the DWP is always on the look out for benefit fraud as there was a little of that going on in Spain with ex-pat scroungers as well.

          • CRSM

            So, in essence you’re a parasite?

      • WTF

        Did you really mean to say that ? Implying that we apparently imitated the ‘remainiacs’ confirms that it was your side that started project fear !

    • Tancred

      Erm….WW1 and WW2 could fit that description. A new European civil war would mean WW3 – not a happy thought….

      • rtj1211

        Why? Which European power has the military might to expand it beyond the european mainland??

        There isn’t one. No EU army will fight the Russians in the East. And the Americans won’t stand for NATO members initiating war in the Middle East.

        It might be a terrible civil war in Europe, but it won’t spread beyond. There simply isn’t the military might to enable it to happen……nor the megalomaniac necessary to justify it.

      • mohdanga

        Really? In WWI were Germans fighting Germans?

    • vieuxceps2

      The term “civil war”? Alas, race-war is more descriptive. Horresco referens.

    • jeffersonian

      Some would say that the opening shots have already been fired. In Cologne.

    • rtj1211

      No doubt Langley, MI6 and the Saudis had it all planned long ago??

      • CRSM

        You missed out the key player.

  • grimm

    I think a majority will vote Remain because they really do not grasp the full nature and extent of this suicide mission. Our ever reliable broadcast media (always keen to promote those lazy virtues of tolerance and diversity) will do nothing to raise the public’s awareness of the destructive effects of the muslim invasion.

    • Richard

      Whatever wins the day as the “cool” option will win. British people are far to stupid to make any sort of rational decision, they only operate on trendiness and coolness and what will bring them “street-cred”.

      • greencoat

        Yes, too polite to fight.

    • rtj1211

      Really, you should set up your Christian equivalent of ‘Jihad’ and create cells equivalent to those run by the Provisional IRA back in the 1970s. If it’s all as terrible as you say.

      Who are you going to bomb first? Tony Blair’s Belgravia address? Guy Verhofstadt’s family pile? Martin Schulz’ farmstead back in Deutschland??

      If this really is a war of civilisations, you’d better start creating yourself a military resistance to do something about it…….

      • CRSM

        Hmm… I don’t think you’ll find that those who might well be doing this would openly discuss it here though.

  • Tancred

    This can all be stopped, and leaving the EU will not solve anything. We need to be in and fight hard against the liberal elites in France, Germany, Italy, etc that want to cosmopolitanise the continent. We should be forging alliances with right wing forces in Hungary, Poland and Slovakia, where the right still holds sway, and push these liberals into the dustbin of history where they belong. Leaving the EU will ensure the victory of the liberal-libertarian lunatics and ensure that we have enemies at the door in the future. Madness.

    • Wildflowers

      That’s really worked well so far hasn’t it. Look at the figures.

      http://ukandeu.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Figures-3-and-4.png

    • vieuxceps2

      “Cosmopolitanise” is too optimistic. Do you suppose that Islam will leave pockets of kuffars among them? They will know that that was the mistake which we made and carefully ensure our “integration”.

    • rtj1211

      Count the votes. People have been counting them for decades and it hasn’t stacked up. You want to stay in, you need pretty strong evidence that the tide has turned decisively in your favour.

      You can argue as long as you like, your arguments can be as good as can be, but if the votes are stacked against you, you can achieve nothing.

      • UKSteve

        “It’s not the votes that count, it’s who counts the votes!”

    • rhys

      Leaving the EU would be an important first step along the road………But my, what a long, long, uphill road it is going to be.

    • UKSteve

      Written by someone completely ignorant of the “right-wing” parties of Europe,

      Some of them want to re-ignite the Final Solution.

      Anders Brevik?

      http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/news/right-wing-extremism/ ?

  • right1_left1

    It seems to me that due to the emotional blackmail that can be generated by weak kneed apologists for utopian idealism coupled with political indifference to populist opinion there will be no peaceful solution to the problems that will follow the massive inflow of population into europe.

    My limited understanding of history over the last few thousand years tells me that whereas in the past succesive civilisations were ultimately conquered by force european idealists have encouraged decadence and then become intent on surrendering what has taken say 500 years or so to build.
    There can only be one explanation for this.
    They know less history than I do !

    • Richard

      Or they think their policies will bring them more power. Think of the UK: for years, Tony Blair’s government brought in millions of non-EU citizens against all public opinion because he thought it would bring power to the Labour Party. As we have seen in by-elections in areas where those migrants have congregated, he was entirely correct: Labour has won handsomely as a result of that strategy. No doubt other Leftist EU parties and governments feel precisely the same way. Their own electorate are not to be trusted to vote them in.

      • rtj1211

        Amazing you haven’t gone and kidnapped his son Euan if you feel that strongly about it……

    • vieuxceps2

      The “weak-kneed apologists ” know all too much history. Their actions against our civilisation were carried out with much malice aforethought. They have, in their terms, done a magnificent job. They needed only the apathy of the average person to help them and have won a notable victory.The European people of the world, wherever they live will be absorbed or marginalised.

  • Richard

    What Merkel is doing to Germany, Tony Blair did to the UK between 1997 and 2010. And, he managed to get elected three times whilst doing it! Britain is already dead, its civilisation and culture gone the way of the dodo, all at its own hand!

    • voidist

      it was not only blair….remember it was Thatcher that turned london into londonistan….

      giving refuge to every muslim phsycopath because we wanted to fight the soviets in afghanistan….?

      at one point it was almost customary for every muslim terrorist organisation to have i ts HQ in london ,,,almost like multinationals…

      I ts only after they repeatedly bit us in our well deserving posterier that we came to our senses..

      by then we had already cultivated a hoplessly radiscalised mass of islamiists

    • rhys

      Yes Blair et al did do it : but don’t ever forget they were aided and abetted by the Tories : the minute Hague got a bit of flack for using the phrase ‘bogus asylum seekers’ he ran a mile – no intellectual self confidence at all : he and his successors as leaders of the Cons just adopted pro immigration and all the rest of it policies ‘heir to Blair’ indeed. Of course, if you are mega rich with a place in town and a great pile in the countryside you have insulated yourself from the consequences of the open door to the whole world…… At least temporarily………….. But now even MPs and journalists who managed to get a flat with a mortgage ten or twenty years ago will be finding that their children cannot do so – do you think the Blair brood would have a roof over their heads if it had not been for all the Blair millions garnered from overseas dictators wasting their countries’ resources on his ridiculous ‘advice’ ??

    • Larry Bond

      There is definitely much in that. I recently asked a young lad, he’s 16, what the British flag is — “The Union something?” was his reply, after many hints. He knows absolutely nothing of British history or Christianity. Nothing. Yet he is still definitely British, his behaviour etc. Perhaps you’re being a bit over-pessimistic?

  • WTF

    Ironic that in Europe there seems to be a panic on for Europeans applying to become UK citizens but no Brits wishing to become European citizens, I wonder why that is ?

    Now come on ‘Mary Ann’ you’re a blinkered Europhile who keeps posting here and trying to convince us of all the benefits of the EU, prove us all wrong and tell us you’ve applied to become a French citizen after living there a long time.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/eu-referendum-worried-eu-nationals-dash-for-uk-citizenship-amid-brexit-fears-a6923836.html

    • Mongo

      no point feeding the ‘Mary Ann’ troll – it’s not even genuine. I don’t buy the ‘loony lefty living in a chateau in France’ persona for a minute!

      • Mary Ann

        Lots of us lefties living in France, never mind if we leave the EU we can always come back and vote in a Labour government.

        • Mongo

          that’s why France has gone to the dogs I guess…

        • WTF

          Better start brushing up your Urdu and take up Islam as unless Brexit happens it will be a Sharia state by the time you get back.

        • Anna Bananahammok

          Is that why France has become such a sh!!hole?

      • UKSteve

        Could be Beatrice Campbell? 😉

      • andylowings

        I would agree there

      • UKSteve

        Definitely tr0ll-like – I’ve thought that for a while.

    • Mary Ann

      We haven’t lived in France for long enough, but we can always come back to Britain and claim social security.

      • WTF

        According to all your lies and rhetoric, I thought the EU brought common benefits to its citizens all across Europe, what a crock of s***. Not so it appears as 5 years seems to be the minimum for France citizenship according to what I’ve researched and even then there are other conditions attached. However, my American born wife became a UK citizen after 2 years of legal permanent residence without any EU involvement !

        Good luck on coming back and claiming social security as ex-pats are at the end of a very long queue way behind all the male rapists migrants you want to let into the UK.

        • rtj1211

          Either your wife was very rich, very well connected or she gets citizenship quicker because she is married to you, a UK citizen.

          If you go as a single person to the USA, it takes you about 3 years to apply for a Green Card, then another few years before you can apply for citizenship. I’m sure $2m would buy it a bit quicker, but if you are traditional middle class, it takes as long as in France in the USA…..

          • WTF

            It took 4 months for her to get right of UK residence but ONLY after I supplied chapter and verse as to means, bank statements, mortgage docs etc, etc and believe it or not, a letter from my Mother guaranteeing that she would fund my wife rather than the state should there be a problem. I don’t recall other migrants to the UK being forced to supply all this cr** but there again, we’re both white.

            It was 2 years if I recall correctly when she applied for UK citizenship and got it but why not, she had a job, she like me have NEVER claimed a penny off the DWP in benefits. I guess being married to a Brit was the means after being a legal resident for 2 years.

            It was a lot harder for me to get a green card in so much as how long it took and the extra documentation needed. For example, I had to get a police certificate from the UK & Spain proving I wasn’t a criminal or terrorist and take a medical plus all the usual and similar stuff as my wife needed for the UK. As I understand it, I can apply for US citizenship after 3 years residence. Again, just like the UK, if you’re white you have to jump through hoops on the I-120 spouse visa but if your a female terrorist like the one in California, you can apparently just walk in and commit mayhem killing people.

            Personally, I’m all for police certificates & medicals and in these days with ISIS, I think EVERYONE wanting to visit or settle in another western country should be pre-vetted. More than anything else, the side effects will be to secure national borders and keep out virtually all undesirables that cant or wont contribute to a country.

            My real point being to ‘remainers’ here, all of this was achieved without any union with the USA and there’s little that I can see where the EU actually helps EU citizens other than booze cruises !

    • Sandra Barwick

      It’s reasonable for M A to vote to remain, it is France’s interest for Britain to stay, and she has chosen France as her residence, and that’s where her loyalties and self interest lie.
      If you were all nicer to her she might invite you over. The Dordogne, is it?

      • WTF

        The whole point about making making comments here is to debate facts, so far she hasn’t given any factual reason why she wants the UK to remain in the EU. She constantly posts how its so much better in the EU but never says why. Perhaps if she were to debate rather than vacuously opine, we could all have a good debate.

        • Sandra Barwick

          I’ve been thinking about your very accurate points.
          Let’s think about MA as a fictional character, she isn’t brave enough to use her name, so that’s essentially what she is, it’s not possible to verify anything she claims. I think all MAs, comfotable retirees in Europe, will vote to remain. Many will be on public sector pensions, which are a tax on the working class and the lower middle class by the comfortable Guardian reading middle class, but soft socialists do not confront this fact.
          She has a fuzzy feeling that it is a “modern thing to do”, dating back to her youth, when ec membership was equated with enjoying foreign travel. She feels very strongly that she is morally superior in preferring the USE, and that is why she posts on the Spectator site, because she feels that she is rightly tormenting Fascist leaning privileged people. The fact that the EU is protectionist, and disciminates deliberately in favour of white European producers, like the French fArmers she loves … “the markets in the Dordogne are wonderful!” …. and is institutionally racist, not only in its import tariff policies, but also in its immigration policies, is something she has never considered, or could ever believe.
          Her delightful, period property is not in the outskirts of Paris or in Marseille, but in the charming, French dominated countryside, where the reality of the immense strains caused by the immigration of those whose loyalties are not to France, and who have been raised in women-despising, corruptly run countries, where a contempt for the rule of law is universal because of the deficiencies of the elite, have yet to become clear. I am not saying, by the way, that all immigrants are like this, not at all, but some are. She will learn, but when she does, she will blame the right, not her own blinkered viewpoint. There is no point in arguing with her, but there is some point in understanding her.

          • WTF

            A good assessment and I would add that I lived in Spain for 11 years as a retired computer engineer but didn’t have the luxury of a generous public sector pension from age 60. My wife and I lived off our savings for 7 tears before my drawing a state pension at 65 and a meager private sector company pension of 210 GBP a month. I’m not complaining as we are more than happy with our modest income and since moving to America we now have my wifes US state pension as well which helps pay for medical costs.

            The reason I’m very vocal about whats happening in the UK & Europe is watching the destruction of a centuries old culture that I want my son and his family to enjoy in the UK and not be over-run by the NIMBY low lifes that MA and some others want to let in. These progressives use other peoples taxes, well being and safety to pay for their moral high ground and are never affected by the results of their actions. Perhaps if they had a loved one raped, murdered or assaulted they might change their tune.

          • Sandra Barwick

            The big question is whether the NHS can remain as it is with such a large and rapid expansion of the population. And the benefit system cannot continue under it, I think, that’s already clear. These are reasonable questions to ask. Not ones that affects the absent Mary Annes though.
            We have a massive job ahead in integrating much of our immigrant population, (not all, obviously, some are brilliantly educated already) and it is urgent, not least in getting the standard of written and spoken English up as high as possible amongst women and children. If we don’t achieve that there will be growing alienation and anger as the next generation feel second class in the hunt for good jobs. We haven’t managed to do that for the UKs white benefit class boys, so there’s a huge job ahead.
            And an education in the reason for the rule of law, the separation of powers, etc … for all children.
            Giving out pamphlets explaining to male Muslims migrants from countries where women are despised that they must not assault women wearing skimpy clothes, as some European countries are now doing, is really not enough in the way of educational provision.

  • voidist

    well what did you expect from the europeans..? 2 ww in last 100 years….rampant anti-semitism, which means coddling up to islamists in germany and sweden…..what did you expect from this club of tired old men called EU who are asking an islamist like erdogan to defend thier borders,, just because they dont want to……a people who cant or wont defend thier borders have no right to exist as countries….has there ever been such a supine , pathetic reckless mass of bipedals that is such a miserable eptaph to humanity in general.?….may the europeans achieve thier century old dream to self-destruct forever

  • Maureen Fisher

    The argument that young workers from elsewhere are needed to replenish the workforce when there is such massive youth unemployment in countries like Spain, Italy and even France is an absolute nonsense, as Douglas points out.

    • red2black

      Countries like Spain, Italy and France have Social Welfare, so the need to find work elsewhere isn’t immediate.

      • aguafiesta

        Have you ever wondered what (or who) is funding their Social Welfare?

        • red2black

          Working people who are part of the same political, religious, social and economic system as the recipients of Social Welfare. Some of those working people will have been unemployed at some point and will have received ‘benefits’ themselves. Marinaleda in Spain is an example of what can be done locally to bring unemployment way down, but it’s considered to be politically incorrect by the Right.

      • Jab

        No social welfare in Italy , casintegrazione for 1 year after you lose your job or fake invalid pension are the only welfare there.

        • red2black

          I’m surprised at that, considering they’re in the EU.

        • rtj1211

          There is drug dealing for the mafia…….rather a one-way ticket though….

        • Anna Bananahammok

          All Italians who have something to contribute, are leaving Italy or have left already.
          Italy is full of pensioners today. The same will happen to the rest of European countries: countries that reward hard work and/or talent and education, such as China, US, etc will get European talent. What will remain are the elderly, the underachievers and the millions upon millions of useless parasitic ‘migrants’.
          Happy days.

      • Maureen Fisher

        Social welfare in Spain and Italy is very limited or non existent. Certainly nothing like our generous benefits.

        • red2black

          You’re right, and I’m very surprised, as they are EU countries.

  • putin

    Thanks to Merkel’s activities, Brexit is unfortunately going to be fought on a single issue. I believe that we should vote out. It’s possible that our leaving may quicken the inevitable collapse of the EU house of cards. We will be blamed and resented for it (so what’s new) but we may also inadvertently have saved Europe from its self destruction, again. Once out of the EU, sovereign countries will once more be able to control their own borders and this madness stopped. Unfortunately however, the left have squandered our future and set us on a path towards eventual Islamification.

    • rtj1211

      Well, perhaps you should emulate the proddys and catholics in Northern Ireland who decided that now they weren’t going to fight each other, they would both fight against the bloddy Muslims……..well, against them building Mosques anyway?!

  • Yorkman99

    I used to think the Crusades campaigns belonged to the middle ages but now I see it happening again in Europe.

    • Mary Ann

      And you call the inners scaremongers.

      • Gareth

        A Syrian policeman was among the migrants; he estimated that 10% of the people he travelled with were islamists. Police chiefs and intelligence officers have offered estimates of 5,000-10,000 jihadists in Germany – and it only took 8 to kill 130 people in Paris. If they get their hands on sufficient guns and ammunition, we could see 1000 repetitions of the Paris attacks. Meanwhile, the internet is awash with reports of rape, arson,murder and vandalism perpetrated by the migrants.

      • dogwonder

        Why don’t you take up knitting that way your ilk can repair the fabric of society when the EU becomes Eurabia.

      • rhys

        There are approximately a billion people in Africa.
        At least half of them would improve their lives if they could reach any part of the EU, but especially the UK ‘ the land of free money’ as it is known. Most of the half billion are just too poor to even make it to Turkey or Greece or the Italian islands close to Libya. So should they all have their entry to EU / UK facilitated ? If not why not ? Could it be that somewhere in the recesses of what you might call your ‘mind’ there is a tiny bit of logic which accepts that there have to be limits to the numbers allowed to enter the EU / UK ? If so – then just what numbers do you think the limit should be set at ?

    • rtj1211

      Well, perhaps that will cause a revision of how the historical accounts of the Crusades are viewed, since you and your kind may now be experiencing on the receiving end that which we were dishing out a thousand odd years ago……??

      History is written, after all, by the Conquistadors. So if the Jihadis win this time, the conquest of Europe will be written up with all the moral accolades granted by Western Historians to the Crusades.

      Won’t it??

      • Anna Bananahammok

        ‘dishing out’?

        The crusades were a RESPONSE to the warring and violent expansion of Islam.
        Go read a history book ffs.

  • Mary Ann

    When it comes to scaremongering the outers are outdoing the inners.

    • Freddythreepwood

      Is he right? Or is he wrong?

      • abystander

        He’s wrong.

        No one threw open any borders. People reacted to a humanitarian crisis. The whole thing is a perfect illustration of the inability of individual countries acting on their own to deal with an event like this.

        • Mike Sinkovich

          Except that it’s only the countries who acted individually to control their borders (against the wishes of the EU) who have managed to get some kind of control on the situation.

          • abystander

            Like Turkey.

            and Greece.

            and Italy.

          • Mike Sinkovich

            Turkey isn’t in the EU (yet). And Italy and Greece toed the EU line and kept their borders open. So, thanks for proving my point.

          • WTF

            Like Hungary perhaps !

        • WFB56

          Obviously you don’t get out much. I regularly cross the border from Austria to Germany and I see busloads of “immigrants” freely driving past as I wait for the Germans to ask me for my “papers, please”.

          • abystander

            I live in Germany and get out quit a lot.

            Typical UKIP lounge bar know-all.

          • WFB56

            Good news, you are welcome to stay there! Presumably you will also do the right thing and not vote in the UK referendum.

          • UKSteve

            Su-u-u-u-ure you do.

        • WTF

          BS – Mad Merkel invited them in but knew logistically they couldn’t fly into Germany but had to come through the periphery of the EU so it wouldn’t be her immediate problem. According to the Lisbon treaty they were supposed to apply from asylum there but again, she didn’t think it through as they didn’t want to live in Greece, they wanted Germany and Sweden where their alien culture is already quite well established and the streets are paved with benefits.

          Anyone with half a brain (excluding you) could predict that a mass influx of free loaders would overwhelm the capabilities of Greece or Italy to cope with this, he**, even France can’t even manage a couple of thousand migrants at Calais.

          As you said “The whole thing is a perfect illustration of the inability of individual
          countries acting on their own to deal with an event like this.”

          Only Merkel & Juncker didn’t see this as a problem or that’s what they are trying to spin !

        • UKSteve

          What amazing bilge.

          The EU and its predecessors have been in existence since the 1960s – exactly how has it shown any ability “to deal with an event like this”?

        • Old men plant trees

          I agree that no borders were thrown open, there are no internal borders under Schengen. I struggle with the point that countries cannot control a border without an institution like the EU to help. A fast response will be of great assistance as I have misread 1000 years of European history. Thanks in advance.

    • Vinnie

      any opinion on the deliberate rape epidemic in Europe right now? Is that scare mongering?

      • WTF

        It’s called embracing multiculturalism & diversity don’t you know, we must be indoctrinated into an alien culture for our own good no matter that our daughters are sacrificed on the altar of political correctness

    • rhys

      Use of the word ‘scaremongering’ implies that the fear of the consequences of mass uncontrolled immigration is irrational.
      But it is not : the consequences of such are already visible to anyone willing to open her eyes ( or ears : how often do you hear English being spoken on a London bus ? ). Voting for more of the same by voting to remain : now that would be irrational.

  • A real liberal

    We are bequeathing the most terrible war to our children.

    • Oracle9

      The only possible outcome. Very few can foresee it.

      And the deciding factor is the active collusion of the so-called left, the self-hatred of which has infected half the population and manifested in the policies of the elites – the four “p”s – politicians, press, police, and professors.

      • tracery

        I agree, and particular emphasis should be put on the professors. Academia has been largely responsible for the inculcation of self hatred, undermining our culture and history as it has been doing for several decades. In today’s “Daily Telegraph” the Archbishop of Canterbury has pointed out that there is nothing racist about fearing the impact of mass immigration and that Britain needs to be confident about its Judeo-Christian heritage. “We need to be confident about our own heritage, our Judeo-Christian heritage, whether we’re believers or not. That is what has shaped our own values, and we need to be confident in that”. Why, it needs to be asked, has he and others like him not been saying this years ago, rather than remaining silent as multiculturalism and political correctness have been imposed on the population at large.

        • rtj1211

          Who are these ‘professors’ who have ‘undermined our culture’? I worked and studied in 6 UK Establishments and carried out projects with over a dozen more. I never in all that time came across a single Professor trying to indoctrinate people.

          Maybe the sociologists and the anthropologists do, but how many students do they actually teach? None of the medics do it, none of the scientists do it, none of the engineers do it and I quite frankly doubt that any of the linguists do either.

          I simply do not believe that a small cabal of loony profs can change a whole culture of 60 million people.

          You are assuming that everyone in the country believes what some Professor says on TV, radio or in the print media. You are also assuming that the whole of the teaching profession bows down before these weirdos and has agreed to indoctrinate a whole generation of children. Sorry, but that will come from the Secretary of State for Education, not some nutcase in academia……..

          I can assure you that the badge ‘Professor’ may get you on a show with an editor/producer/anchor, but it doesn’t buy you guru status with the general population of the UK……..

          • Kasperlos

            The indoctrination process commences with grade school through the high school. By then, thanks to the Marxist Frankfurt School virus that is throughout the West, it is too late. The damage to the mind has been done. From then on university is but a refresher course. Do look at the loony behaviour at UK universities demanding PC actions on this and that. These ‘students’ are viral forms of Mao’s Red Guards – also cloned indoctrinated fanatics. The West is in deep trouble from all of this lunacy.

          • Ozzy Guy

            You can start with the PPE – Philosophy, Politics and Economics, University of Oxford. These ‘professors’ who have ‘undermined our culture’ do so by their influence on future “leaders”.

            It’s sad that most politicians are graduates of the bullshit disciplines…bogus theories and untestable dogma. Sadly, not many graduates who have been taught to use their brains (science) would go anywhere near the intellectual cesspool of politics…

          • PaD

            Critical Theory ..the trojan horse.
            Medics scientists maths graduates wont have been exposed..
            Social Science Humanities etc most definitely have.

        • rhys

          I think you will find that the Archbish is NOT calling for a halt to more immigration – just that people’s fears about it should be understood ( like you might comfort a child who wakes up with a nightmare ) .

          • Ozzy Guy

            …and Europe is having a nightmare it can’t wake up from.

      • Ozzy Guy

        Hopefully the m…military…will step in. Their only purpose is to protect their nation. Sadly, looks like the generals are as pathetic as the sheeples…

    • Ozzy Guy

      Merkel has no children…

    • secretpeople

      Only not upvoting you because i don’t want to believe it.

  • WFB56

    “And due to the incompetence, blindness or weakness of Europe’s leadership….Europe truly is on a suicide mission. All we have to decide is whether we want to be a part of it.”

    Dave and George do but those of us who want out are, in their views, “loony” and xenonophobic. History will prove who’s right but by then the damage will be irreversible.

  • dogwonder

    Perhaps the liberal elites’ planned the invasion all along, they can’t force the unwashed masses to vote them into office so they replace the voting citizens with seventh century Islamists who’ll keep the liberal elites in office for another couple decades. That plan worked for the Labor Party in England.

    • greencoat

      The simple truth of your comment pierces like a sword.

    • Henry

      The simple truth is that UK and other European governments are sacrificing their country and citizens’ well being to satisfy their immediate selfish interests. On the other hand, the Central Europe sets an example…

    • UKSteve
    • Ozzy Guy

      Then…when the time is right and the muslim invaders have reached critical mass, the “useful idiots” will be the first to be eliminated. Those who would betray their own people are never to be trusted.

  • WTF

    The current rush for EU citizens to obtain UK passports highlights the present fear & uncertainty playing on EU & UK citizens in the UK & EU and can be laid at the door of Cameron and the control freaks in the EU like Juncker or Shulz. Between them, they have stoked the fears of what may happen in their politicized attempts to sway the vote to remain rather than lay out the truth and let it speak for itself.

    If we go back to before the EU or even when countries like Spain joined, people from there came to the UK to work and live without fear of being kicked out and Brits bought villas in Spain without any fears or uncertainty. Right now however there is massive uncertainty due to the fear mongering spats that have taken over with the remainers being the main culprits.

    In contrast, my American wife came to the UK some 17 years ago with the expected certainty of residence & rights as well as a path to citizenship giving her dual nationality which she obtained. She obtained dual nationality not because of fear like now but for purely bureaucratic expediency in another EU state. We moved to Spain 11 years ago to live in the villa I had bought years before with a lot of certainty for the future but two years ago the writing was on the wall in the EU and for that and other reasons we decided to move to the USA. Once more, despite the tortuous immigration procedure I obtained US residency and have certainty for my future in the USA and will apply for US citizenship when I can. The point being that the EU was supposed to harmonize procedures & bureaucracy between member states to make things transparent & certain but right now, several million people across the EU & UK are scared, worried and unsure which way to jump. In contrast, between the UK & USA there is certainty.

    Personally I believe all the scare mongering from the ‘remainers’ is unfounded but having seen how the EU has behaved over transgressors like Italy or Greece, can we be certain. The EU is behaving like a classroom bully and threatening all manner of sanctions or penalties if we leave and in response, its natural for the leavers to highlight what they will do in return. A trade tariff on one side will result in a trade tariff on the other, restricted movement of people by one side will have an equal and opposite reaction from the other side. Nobody wins of course as it just ends up as a p****** contest on who can pee the furthest.

    If the EU and Cameron would just spell out the unvarnished truth of the facts and let the people of the UK decide for themselves with no threats or vindictive reactions, this uncertainty of residency rights wouldn’t have happened and there would be no rush to get UK passports. This debate was always a political morass of self interests and still is and I doubt we’ll get to the real truths to make a well judged decision in June.

    On this passport issue, I would point out that it seems to be a one way street as I’ve not seen any panic from British ex-pats to obtain French, Spanish or any other EU passport as these applicants would appear to value the democratic worth of a UK passport very high indeed, I wonder why.

    Will that send a message to the EU ? I doubt it !

    • rabid_skunk

      You have made an extensive post. Very briefly I am also British but now reside in the USA. However, I see growing problems here too and that’s why I will move to the tropical island paradise where I have land and have already got food production and pure spring water available. In a way, I’m a “prepper.”

      • WTF

        At my age, I’ll stick it out as I believe America will come back from the brink and settle down again once the progressives get removed from positions of authority.

  • outlawState

    Sweden and Germany are currently the most authoritarian, repressive and irresponsible countries in Europe. The media in these countries is not free. Merkel now wants to jump into bed with with another authoritarian and repressive country, Turkey, Germany’s historical WW1 ally.

    It’s time we abandoned the EU, as should all other nations who value their sovereignty, before the great dictatorship takes away all our freedoms.

    • rtj1211

      The media in this country is so lacking in freedom as to be laughable. I’m not quite sure what we need the media FOR any more. They don’t do anything but plug proprietors’ interests, which are never the same as the interests of the majority of the people. NEVER.

      Not reading newspapers, not watching news programmes, not joining any political parties seems to me to be the first requirement for long-term mental and spiritual health.

      Or if you do read and watch, not believing a word you read or hear until you have personally checked it out.

      If you have to do the checking anyway, what’s the value of the media outlet anyway??

      • Germainecousin

        Yes, Cologne proved you point. I will never, ever buy a newspaper again. They colluded with each other and but for social media, we could have been back in the medieval ages where things happened and were learnt about years after the event.

  • Mike E

    I fully agree with the conclusion that Europe is committing a demographic and cultural suicide. All civilizations and cultures come and go. They have a peak and then they degenerate. The new ruling postmodern, post-socialist, red-green class in Europe has nothing in common with what made Europe the freest, wealthiest and most scientifically advanced place in history.

    Britain is, unfortunately, more than part of it, it is the worst affected country in Europe. It is already the most Islamized country in Europe so what good did the geography do? I mean, Britain even accepts sharia courts! In Britain!

    • Henry

      British are silent and accepting…even their own demise. The same goes to Swedes, Germans, Belgians, etc. It is not socialist governments but a population who is not able to resist their cultural suicide and kick off the destructive governments. The plague is now affecting Canada. The good thing US will not allow that despite Hussein Obama.

      • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

        Britain gave up its Christian faith a long time ago. Therein are the seeds of all we are today.

        • Cobbett

          Oh yeah? Christianity is about peace and love, acceptance of the ‘other’….a loser’s religion.

          • CRSM

            An arguable view certainly. “The meek shall inherit the earth”?

          • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

            No, it’s not at all about some kind of hippy “peace and love”. It’s about repentance for sin and penance for it.

          • Cobbett

            I don’t believe int he concept of ‘sin’…so no penance for me.

      • Cobbett

        The US is well on the way….Obama or not.

  • Business Cat

    So Europe will become more islmised (if that’s a word) at the behest of Frau Merkel.

    ….. after a few decades it might become as islamic as the UK then!

  • Ed

    The entire planet can see western leaders are the biggest dickheads on the planet.

    BBC, CH4, SKY, ITV stopping us seeing what fools we have as leaders.

  • Discuscutter

    Another 12 months of this and Europe may be politically unrecognizable. If, when, there is a major Islamic attack it may be even more so.

    Le Pen leader of France, Wilders in The Netherlands.

    Think it can’t happen, what if tomorrow a stadium with 70k in it came under a mortar barrage, what if a water supply in Paris was poisoned.

    Merkel has ensured mayhem in Europe.

    • Espinaca

      As I already had written below; it is not only Merkel ! There is a network behind which promoted and promotes this invasion, look her: http://www.w2eu.info. This network has a lot of money, finances lots of NGOs and the money comes from George Soros. It is also financial elites, Neocons, UNO/UNCHR (look up the people in leading positions…), Turkey and Saudi-Arabia.

    • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

      Not just Merkel.

      These liberal-progressives have sought our destruction for many decades.

      • CRSM

        They have, but it’s part of a much older agenda, with the destruction of Christianity as its objective.

        • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

          Agree 100%.

  • Kasperlos

    The failed ‘leaders’ at Brussels EU headquarters and most of the member states have allowed the singular greatest threat to emerge upon Europe since the end of the Second World War. They have aided and abetted in the final steps to once and for all dismantle any final remnants of a Europe that existed prior to the Great War. That essentially means the dissolution of cultural, sociological identities into a generic cauldron. The elites’ final aim for this brave new world animal farm is for a one size fits all political system. Generally better known as a dictatorship. For Europe the crossing of Cassandra is done and the only thing left is for people to survive the bumpy ride down. And all this taking place in the centenary of the Great War. And all this taking place from a crisis of non-EU peoples flooding into Europe. What a piece of work this will be for historians: The fall of the EU empire due to third world migrants previously living in hovels and who prayed to Mecca. It is very distressing to see what is happening and to think of the past generations who have been so horrendously betrayed.

    • Espinaca

      I completely agree with you, Kasperlos. But still, hopefully it is not too late. Spain e.g. is not willing to accept this Turkey deal… and so far has managed to stay free of this invasion, although seemingly it was also planned for her. What we need is to get rid off the lefties now, so sorry… They are bought and corrupt and part of the game. But perhaps we will manage to stop this crazy dystopian influx now together with the efforts from Austria and Visegrad countries. We need to make pressure on our govs now!

      • rabid_skunk

        Of course, Spain has historically been engulfed by the vermin and knows full well the consequences of muslims in their country.

      • Sue Smith

        The invasion of the Visigoths!! They don’t want Spain – for now – because it’s an economic basket case and isn’t offering to completely pay their way. But ultimately they will want to reclaim Spain!!

    • rhys

      But not only EU leaders – UK ‘leaders’ – overgrown PPE grads who have never worked in a real job – started the madness many years ago. And are still determined to continue with it.

      • Ozzy Guy

        Maybe these useless turd- polishers should have studied some history…about how many Brits and us Colonials died last century protecting the U.K. from foreign invasion and control from the Continent.

        Some study of social Darwinism and demography would also help the buffoons understand the long term consequences of mass muslim invasion.

        It’s sad that most politicians are graduates of the bullshit disciplines…bogus theories and untestable dogma. Sadly, not many graduates who have been taught to use their brains (science) would go anywhere near the intellectual cesspool of politics…

    • Ozzy Guy

      Merkel and other E.U. lunatics are following the Kalergi Plan…using mass muslim migration to destabilize individual nations…and eliminate “whiteness”. Their goal is the creation of a single United States of Europe.

      The muslims have other plans…

      • Leon Wolfeson

        No, see, your “Kalergi” plan in your head, Muslim…

      • Sue Smith

        Have you seen the film “Ten Things I Hate About You”?

        “Now that you’ve seen..the plan……”!!

  • stephen powell

    The solution to human overpopulation in the Islamic and Developing World is not mass migration into the welfare systems of Western democracies. Yes, Human Overpopulation is one of those Orwellian forbidden terms that is prohibited. That is the problem in a nutshell, politicians telling people the great lie that more people, from anywhere, is the answer to their problems.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      So, who dies first?

      • CRSM

        Don’t be silly. No-one needs to be killed off. A policy of restricting fertility for three generations will be adequate to bring the English population down to a sensible level. The scare stories that this would result in a “demographic time bomb” are foolish. The temporary hump in the population of the elderly can be coped with. We would have plenty of money to pay for our care if it wasn’t being poured into the pockets of various undesirable agencies.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          No, no-one needs to, but it always happens in highly totalitarian states. So, who in your world gets to breed? What are the qualifications? You’ll “cope” by what, forcing people into camps when they retire?

          As you blame “undesireables” like what, the courts? NHS? education?

          And of course you’d need a massive army to keep the borders shut and stop people from fleeeing your HyperChina…

  • trobrianders

    The Left will not rest until it has driven every last centrist to the hard right. To avoid this we have to destroy the Left.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      No, your idea of eliminating leftist views, from your far right, is nothing new as you try and claim your extremist views are magically centralist.

      • trobrianders

        Leftist views on the EU are totally extremist. That we should throw out rule of law and accept people who have no qualms about breaking our laws of entry is an extremist position. That we should accept leftist social policies from the EU when the British would never vote for them is an extremist position.

  • John Andrews

    Let us pray for the soul of the Archbishop of Canterbury. It is a long time since any worthwhile moral leadership has come from the primate. He has made a bold and overdue comment on the wicked misuse of the term ‘racism’ – but he still wants more immigration, Salvation of his soul and his church could follow upon a clutch of sermons about on the morality of standing up for Christian values and their tolerant, humanitarian values – compared to those of their ancient foes. I’d like to see the our Primate and our Monarch campaigning together – for Brexit.

    • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

      His predecessor is for euthanasia.

      These protestant sects gave up any semblance of Christianity long ago.

      • Malcolm Stevas

        I shudder to think what form of “Christianity” you would wish upon us, and the consequences.

        • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

          If you hadn’t yet noticed, there is a great sorting out going on at the moment. Call it sheep and goats if you like, or cast it in primary philosophical or political terms.

          But it is going to end in whole seas of blood. Well, we will see what happens.

          • Malcolm Stevas

            Sounds apocalyptic. Most probably brought on by political incompetence, of which we have more than our share. I doubt its genesis is at all divine…

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, the far right is trying for blood once more.

        • Rædwald

          I think it’s fair enough to say that a religious organisation like the CoE, which seems filled to the brim with people who are more focussed on creating populations that lack Christians in favour of those of another religion, is questionable as “Christian” at this point.

          • Malcolm Stevas

            You might well be right Raedwald (nice to see you here) but it seems to me quite a few million people have questioned other sects’ claims to be “Christian” during the past two millennia! The CofE is certainly an absurd body, though – indeed I thought that way in the 1960s, especially when I was compulsorily confirmed by the Bishop of Chester. To be a teenager then was somewhat like being in prison, at least when one was still at boarding school…

    • rabid_skunk

      I wonder what his fate will be when the UK becomes another caliphate.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        You won’t win, Islamist.

    • Sue Smith

      Well, your definition of a primate and mine are obviously different!!

      • CRSM

        Yes, he appears to be a primate with a tail.

        • Sue Smith

          Tall tales and true, no doubt.

          Important in this world of imploding political correctness to maintain a sense of humour. The ultra self-actualizing and self-righteous pc brigade will melt, like Superman to kryptonite, if you laugh at them.

          Keep doing it!! This robs them of their ‘special’ power and effectiveness. The great writers of the past, like Pope, knew all about it!!

          “What mighty conquests rise from trivial things!!” (Alexander Pope, ‘The Rape of the Lock’).

  • Tommy Wimpin

    muslim immigrants are merkel’s wunderwaffen. she’s waging war on europe and our leaders can’t even see it; weaponized migrants. jews are fleeing to israel for their lives in record numbers as hordes of invaders rampage through europe screaming for their beheading and the european people with nowhere to flee to are being raped to death and pillaged into submission. a familiar story. and is our leader protecting our jewish and indigenous communities or judeo-christian way of life? no, he’s aiding in its genocide. history will remember mad merkel and cameron in a much worse light than the certain german leader before them who had this same plan for europe.

    • Anna Bananahammok

      We need a functioning Stauffenberg moment in the EU headquarters in Brussels asap.

      • logdon

        They’d be hanging Farage on piano wire.

        A General Patton moment would be better.

    • Rædwald

      “judeo-christian way of life?”

      “Judeo-Christian”? I must have missed the definition for this new terminology being applied to our way of life, although I’m not sure what way of life that even is at this point.

      • Anna Bananahammok

        you must be returded, poor thing

      • CRSM

        There’s no such thing as “Judeo-Christian”. As anyone who has read the Pentateuch and the Koran can immediately ascertain, there’s little more than a cigarette paper between the two groups in their basic beliefs. It would be more appropriate to talk of the Judeo-Islamic culture of large parts of the near and middle east.

      • Tommy Wimpin

        then you need an education, visit a library or something.

    • Wessex Man

      We all know who you mean and if you seriously believe that you are a fool.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Your far right are driving Jews out, yes. As you blame the Other, including Jews.

      Your past hero failed, and your historical revisionism…

      • Tommy Wimpin

        far right? i’m left winged mucker, i abhor uncontrolled capitalism and the corrupt economics of privatization where lives are cheap. i think you need to look up what left/right actually means my old son.

        also i’m jewish myself, just to clarify how much of a dumbarse you really are. most jewish communities here have fled – due to islamic aggression. been here for 600 years and now we’re under a new genocide in europe by merkel’s wunderwaffen – demon worshiping muslims!

        • Leon Wolfeson

          So now claim an opposite position… as you apologise for the far right, as you spew the very sort of thing Jews had to flee from before… oh and as you show you have no understanding of how Judaism views Islam.

          • Tommy Wimpin

            lol what? the far right are a disgusting position. I oppose nazism for the very same reasons I oppose political islamism. both totalitarian, both anti-semitic, both evil.

  • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

    ABORTION – the great elephant in the room.

    None of this immigration would be needed or could be justified if you hadn’t killed your unborn little ones by the million.

    You have swallowed the liberal-progressive line Comrades (one it took from Bolshevism) – and now you are reaping the whirlwind.

    Does the West deserve to survive?

    • Malcolm Stevas

      Attempting to link the migrant problem to abortion is certainly creative, in a battily obsessive sort of way. The quickest and most satisfactory way to solve the present impasse over a migrant invasion would be retrospective abortion of much of our political class.

      • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

        Sorry Malcolm, if you refuse to see the obvious and clear link, not just at the statistical level but at the philosophical level, you are just part of the uncomprehending problem.

        The liberalism of the post-War and subsequent generations has destroyed us.

        • Malcolm Stevas

          Are you American? You appear to employ “liberalism” in the American sense. To be liberal, properly speaking, is to be free thinking, open minded and tolerant – sounds ok to me. It’s remarkably arrogant to attempt to claim that those who disagree with you are merely “uncomprehending”, and I dare say you would have to lump an awful lot of us into that category if you insist on any sort of causal link between abortion and extra-European mass migration – either statistically, or philosophically.

          • http://www.GULAG.ru The Great Stalin

            From Norfolk … and not the one in Virginia.

      • Cobbett

        5 million plus abortion since 1967….not much excuse for mass immigration if they weren’t slaughtered.

        • Malcolm Stevas

          I’m sure you don’t mean to join the other bloke in a tenuous, oddball attempt to link abortion and mass migration. “Slaughtered” is tendentious.

          • Cobbett

            Well, there wouldn’t be the ‘demographic decline’ argument..and ”we need more immigrants to pay our (p*ss poor) pensions”,that’s all.

          • Malcolm Stevas

            True, though it comes down to balancing the wrongs done to us by mass immigration (= a gross infringement of political liberty and an assault on our culture), with the assault on individual freedom posed by the sort of anti-abortion atmosphere encountered in Ireland or much of the USA.

          • Cobbett

            I’m not religious although I find abortion on demand somewhat distasteful…flushing your foetus down the toilet because it’s not convenient to have a baby. how about not getting pregnant in the first place?

          • Malcolm Stevas

            Certainly preferable, and yes it’s distasteful, but then so are the venomously nasty anti-abortion extremists in the US who attack people and set fire to abortion clinics. For me, it’s about individual freedom.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Really, more poor kids meaning more demand on services, not less…

      • global city

        But, the EU is attempting to follow Sweden’s lead and be known as a humanitarian superpower… that is until the migrants reach a majority and put a stop to that sort of nonsense

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Yes, I’m sure you think murdering elected politicians… all so you can take power and blame minorities.

    • Ozzy Guy

      The buffoons no longer have a choice. Our former Prime Minister tried to warn Europe to get tough with the economic parasites and prevent them from entering. Australia solved a similar migrant flood by using the military. Don’t European countries have an army?…either to stop the illegals…or to depose the incompetent socialist criminals who welcomed the invades in.

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Ah yes, gotta purge those poor and disabled inside the country, etc.

        As you call for coupd against non-far right governments.

      • Sue Smith

        Ozzy Guy, couldn’t agree more. The bible says, “the meek (read ‘weak’) shall inherit the earth”. Can you think of anything more egregious?

        Doubtless they have their own versions of Sarah Hanson-Young – profoundly unintelligent but bunyip-seeking activists who are VERY prepared to overturn the democratic wishes of the majority. It’s frightening that these fundamentalists haven’t been called out more often.

    • vieuxceps2

      Well I think I do.
      Not sure about you…….

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Ah yes, how dare women not end up getting backstreet abortions, etc.

    • CRSM

      No, though abortion is the wrong way to go about it, if it hadn’t happened then the overpopulation of England would be far worse.
      I think we need to give Eugenics a reappraisal.

    • UKSteve

      It sounds as though you’ve swallowed your bong water.

      Now, back to licking windows for you, my man!

  • Maureen Fisher

    Osborne is cutting the benefits of the disabled while letting in freeloaders from everywhere.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      He’s doing what you wanted to the disabled. You want more, and harder, right, gotta block that trade and keep the freeloading rich pouring in.

  • Cobbett

    “We will breed children with them, because we shall conquer their countries. We will trample them underfoot, God willing.” — Sheikh Muhammad Ayed, speaking at the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem

    I’ll tell you one thing: black and Asian people should come here
    in the hundreds of millions. It’s not right that for 500 years,
    imperialism has looted our countries of all our wealth, has destroyed
    our countries. We will come here, we have been coming here, and WE WILL
    CONTINUE TO COME HERE IN THE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS until, indeed, as
    Gaddafi said, EUROPE WILL TURN BLACK!”

    Sukant Chandan

    Welcome to your future.

    • rabid_skunk

      Europe won’t turn black. We don’t get the sunshine. If hundreds of millions come here then Europe will end up like the place you left. Now where do you go? USA? You’ll do the same thing there, turn their country into a craphole like the one you left.

      You need to change your beliefs, customs and lazy ways if you want to be rich like the Europeans and North Americans. Islam is a cancer of humanity. Your doctrines impose poverty wherever you abide.

      • GnosticBrian

        The Alhambra was created by poverty stricken, work shy backwards folk?

        • Cobbett

          Is that the best you can come up with? and it wasn’t like the moors were invited into Spain was it? 750 years of conflict.

          • GnosticBrian

            Is that the best you can come up with?

            Britain became an island about 350,000 years ago. Have there been NO population movements (immigration / emmigration) in that pedriod? Were your direct ancestors here 350,000 years ago – your actual basic Neanderthals?

          • vieuxceps2

            What have your silly prehistoric questions to do with today’s immigration? What if every word of yours is correct, how will that help anyone?

          • GnosticBrian

            Go play with Cobbett, his vitreolic racism will chime with you.

          • vieuxceps2

            Answer the question. And it’s vitriolic.Silly Bri.

          • GnosticBrian

            There were two questions, to which do you demand an answer?

            And you need to use the space bar after a full stop, silly viux.

          • vieuxceps2

            Both please. Viux? Vieu maybe.

          • GnosticBrian

            I thought “viux” appropriate because it hosts twits.

            Immigration (direct or by descent from) is the source of every single person in this country – unless you are one of those Yorkshire folks that believe the Garden of Eden was near Heckmondwike.

            It helps those with functioning brain cells gain a sense of perspective.

            I should make clear that I insist that immigrants peacefully assimilate and don’t attempt a Norman Conquest. Those unwilling can sod off.

          • vieuxceps2

            What a fart you are. “Viux” was a mistake. Why not admit it?
            Every single person in the world no doubt had forebears from elsewhere,including Syrians and Sioux and Sudanese. I repeat (wearily),how does thart help with today’s problems?
            How good of you to insist that immigrants assimilate.No doubt they will take due heed of you. But what if not, O Sapient Bri? What then?

          • GnosticBrian

            Why don’t you use a space bar?

            I thought “Viux” most apposite, that is why I used it. And I’m glad that it seems to have hit home.

            Contemplate the actions of King Canute and the old Saxon proverb “He who pi$$eth against the wind, wetteth his shirt” and the implications for going against the tide of history.

          • vieuxceps2

            Space bar? Wassat?
            Why did you not simply look up “vieux” not “viux”after your error?
            I am pleased to see you try to leaven your lumpy prose with humour, but witty is not the word I’d use for it. Cumbersome? Elephantine maybe? Still, you tried.

          • GnosticBrian

            You shouldn’t judge others by your own low standards.

            The persistent use of ad hominem attacks betrays your lack of intellect.

          • vieuxceps2

            Let us hope you have now had the last word for I am a-weary of you.

          • GnosticBrian

            If true, why did you respond?

          • Cobbett

            Let’s just stick to the last 50 years eh?

          • GnosticBrian

            No, I don’t agree to drawing up the bridge at some arbitrary date – which happens to be when you or or forebears arrived?

        • Hybird

          Built by slaves.

          • GnosticBrian

            So it was like the much more modern American and German slave-based economies.

          • Stonefreetorant PatrickStrei

            Drop this fool in Raqqa.

          • GnosticBrian

            The ad hominem attack, clearest indication that the poster is bereft of cogent argument.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            And yet, you…

        • vieuxceps2

          How the Pharoahs toiled as they built their pyramids,eh?

          • GnosticBrian

            Yes, they devoted a great deal of time to building their pyramid.

            I do hope that you are not one of those stupid lefties who only recognise manual labour as “work”.

          • vieuxceps2

            “one of those stupid lefties”- Are there other sorts?

          • GnosticBrian

            Yes, there are some delusional souls who actually believe that the left offers a bright future for the UK – typically about one in three votors; it would be a sad indictment of the national gene pool if they were all stupid. Perhaps a good dose of bright immigrants could restore IQs to an acceptable level?

        • Stonefreetorant PatrickStrei

          It was created by native craftsmen, a good deal of it from repurposed Roman materials. Anyway, what have the Mohammadans done lately, that is to say in the last 500 years, at best?

          • GnosticBrian

            I don’t want to get into a “what have the Romans done for us” debate so I will restrict myself to two disparate examples;

            One of the most beautiful buildings on the planet, the Taj Mahal, was constructed by Muslims.

            Mohammad Abdus Salam’s work in theoretical physics gave us electroweak theory, for which he was awarded the Nobel Prize.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            And yet you hate and decry them. So…

      • Cobbett

        What the f*ck are you on about? They’re quotes you cretin…and obviously not mine.

      • Sue Smith

        Sadly, I have to agree with much of this. As Shakespeare said, “the canker galls”.

  • Rupert

    If we leave the EU then the EU will just send all the refugees directly to us. Being in the EU means we can bribe some other country to take these rapists.

    • Ridcully

      How will they do that exactly? Catapult them over the Channel?

      • Rupert

        eurostar tickets, let them on the ferries etc and don’t let us have any border patrol police on their side of the channel. Its pretty easy really.

        • Penny

          I very much doubt that the French could refuse us border controls. Immigration aside, one country can’t abstain from its security obligations out of pique.

          But even if they did, there are border controls in Dover so they can just be sent back.

          • Rupert

            Of course they can. They only have to accept our border agents due to an EU agreement. Otherwise they would send all the refugees over the chanel and we’d have to process them all in the UK (as they would be claiming asylum on british soil). Currently as we have agents and police actually in France we can stop these guys from arriving on british soil.

          • Penny

            I don’t think it’s an EU agreement, Rupert – it’s between the French and the British. Bilateral agreements tend to benefit both sides – in this case there is funding from the UK, and the French can have border controls at Dover, allowing them control over who enters France.

            But if France were to rip up the agreement tomorrow, the message it would send out would attract more migrants into Calais. This was clearly stated by France’s interior minister, Bernard Cazeneuve who said ” ‘Calling for
            the border with the English to be opened is not a responsible solution.
            It would send a signal to people smugglers and would lead migrants to
            flow to Calais in far greater numbers. A humanitarian disaster would
            ensue. It is a foolhardy path, and one the government will not pursue'”

            Apart from this, agreements tend to have fixed terms. If the French were to simply rip up an agreement before its term had ended, it would diminish France – it doesn’t benefit a country’s reputation to simply tear up an agreement out of pique.

          • Rupert

            Cazeneuve is a liberal and doesnt represent the real france which is moving more to the NF everyday. The reality is that while the UK taxpayer might be paying to house and feed these refugees in the calais camp its French citizens who are getting robbed and raped by these refugees. As such they want them out. If we left the EU the French gov would be put under huge pressure to get rid of the agreement and just buy refugees eurostar tickets like they used to do.

          • Penny

            It doesn’t matter from whose lips these words fell, Rupert – Hollande, Marine Le Pen, Cazeneuve – it is the substantive that is important: tearing up this agreement will bring even bigger problems to France.

            In denying UK border controls, France wil be announcing “Calais is an easy touch” That announcement will be heard. More illegals will head for the French borders and onwards to Calais. If Calais is under pressure now, it will become intolerable as more people arrive.

            People trafficking will continue – and probably increase – and France will have extra work to do in preventing it. Think of the problems being experienced by Greece. No country wants to bring that on themselves. Not least if the UK then turns back illegals. Besides which, France would not have the option to place their own people in Dover and control those travelling from there to Calais. Even if we exclude immigration, global terrorism is still a factor in controlling borders.

            Currently, bringing an illegal immigrant into the country is a carrier’s problem, too. This is why lorry drivers – who may not even know an illegal immigrant has accessed his vehicle – are fined should one be found. There are French and other European lorries that travel via Calais. There are French ferries, and the Eurostar is a joint enterprise between France, Belgium and British railways. Creating problems for European commerce and companies is not in France’s interests.

            As mentioned: countries don’t just rip up agreements before their end of term out of pique – there would be no value in having any agreement if that were the case. This is also the message France would send out “Enter into an agreement with us – but we might just tear it up if we wish to” This wouldn’t be the best signal to send out in a competitive world.

          • Rupert

            I’m guessing you don’t remember your history. The whole reason why a camp exists in Calais is to hold the “refugees” on their way to the UK. This caused so much trouble previously that Blair did a deal with the French (through the EU) where we could have border patrol officers in France to stop the refugees coming in and in return we’d take the whole population of the calais camps and the french would ban the construction of a new camp. At the time it was seen as a great deal for france and a bad deal for us (as we had to take all the refugees) and obviously france wouldnt stop any camps. In reality it was a great deal for us as we stopped a flood of refugees into a trickle. Do you really want to risk having that flood again if we leave the EU?

          • Penny

            The reason why the camps existed in the first place is the Schengen agreement, of which we are not a part. This has enabled non-EU citizens to cross several borders in order to get to Calais.

            There are two agreements: the Sangatte and Le Torquet protocols. The former is linked to the channel tunnel and has no provision for termination by France. This might not extend to border controls, but the burden placed on Eurostar – 55% of which is owned by French railways – would be huge, as I will explain later in my comment.

            The latter is the one that can be terminated, but would take 2yrs to come into effect.

            With respect, you keep making the same point but you are not responding to the points I’ve made about the impact termination would have on France, Rupert. Creating long-term chaos at a very, very busy ferry port and its surrounding areas would have consequences. As mentioned, bear in mind that the trade passing through Calais en route to the UK – and vice-versa – is not limited to French commerce. Other countries in the EU have an interest in how this port is managed. Furthermore, France would have no control over who – or what – enters their territory from the UK. Think of the message being sent out to criminals and/or terrorists.

            Even if France terminates the Le Tourquet agreement and disallows UK border checks, it cannot terminate carriers liability because this is linked to British Acts.

            In addition to the Act which places a £2,000 fine on carriers for transporting an illegal passenger, the UK can implement part 4 of the Counter-Terorism Act which requires ferry and train operators to submit information about passengers prior to departure. The fine for failing to prevent an illegal passenger from travelling is £50,000.

            The hassles and delays caused by carriers undertaking searches and/or gathering and submitting information about passengers would be not inconsiderable and impact on all who use (and live) in Calais. Profit would also be affected. Given that the trade passing through Calais en route to the UK is not limited to French companies but those from wider Europe, I can’t imagine pressure would not be brought to bear on France to maintain the agreement. Business is not insignificant to the EU. It has a voice.

            France has as much to lose as the UK. Throwing a hissy fit would not be in its interests.

          • Rupert

            Do you think the UK gov would do any of this? As you said Eurostar has joint ownership so the French would veto any responsibility in taking refugees back. And as you know there has already been some refugees who got in through Eurostar and they were not sent back.
            Also in regards to trade if we were no longer in the EU we wouldn’t have guaranteed free trade so there would be less trade through the French ports.

          • Penny

            Yes – I think the UK government would impose their own Acts. They already do by imposing fines on lorry drivers who are found to have illegal immigrants stowed away – whether knowingly or otherwise.

            I don’t think you quite understood the point about Eurostar. Like airlines, any transport that moves from one country to another is a “carrier” and has responsibility should it bring someone into the country illegally. France doesn’t have a veto on that. The points I made above have nothing to do with sending people back per se – although the UK can certainly do that – but of preventing them from getting onto the Eurostar in the first place. This would be done by implementing section 4 and requesting the appropriate paperwork and checks be done by the carrier – not by French officials. It has nothing to do with the government.This would cause extra time and work. If anyone does get through because of negligence, the UK can impose a fine on the carrier.

            We have a trade deficit with the EU, Rupert. This means they sell more to us than we sell to them. The chances of, say, a European country turning down business with the UK just because it’s not in the EU are very slim. Because if they turn down contracts, they lose money. If they lose money, workers go. The EU does business with countries outside of the EU – it’s not that insular. We’d just be another one of them.

          • ButcombeMan

            You are a fool.
            Eurostar would not let them board.

          • Rupert

            How could they stop people without tickets?

          • Sue Smith

            Do you ever get the impression, as I do, that so many of these people flooding into Europe are ‘surplus to requirement’? I mean, they’re on the human scrap-heap. There’s just nothing for them!!

          • Rupert

            I don’t think so. They have just paid $5000 to be trafficked to the UK and so want to go to the UK. As they get food and shelter (plus wifi) at the calais camp they don’t mind waiting. Australia for example runs ad campaigns in Indonesia saying that no refugee will ever set foot in Australia. They will end up in camps and get sent home. We should do the same.

          • 9sqn

            It is nothing to do with the EU. The agreement is between Britain and France.

          • Rupert

            Its through the EU. France would cancel that agreement the day we left the EU as they are fed up of refugees raping their children.

          • ButcombeMan

            No.you are wrong. Read the carriers liability act

          • Rupert

            thats for planes.

          • ButcombeMan

            You seem to have some claim to second sight, maybe you could explain why the law could not similarly be applied to trains and boats?
            Of course it would put up costs but cheap air fares seem to survive it.

            You are just wrong.

          • Rupert

            Because once they are here they can claim asylum. In an airport you have a secure zone. I guess you could put one in around the stations and the port. Maybe fence in the whole area.

          • ButcombeMan

            You are missing the point, the carrier exercises the control it does at the airport of departure, so would it be with trains and boats.

          • Rupert

            Its not that easy sadly. Even at heathrow you get refugees throwing their passports down the plane toilets so on some routes the police now meet the flights and check all the passports. So you’d need A LOT of manpower, only have 1 stop in the UK and you’d have to convince the French to take back the refugees.

          • ButcombeMan

            I do not quite see the point you are struggling to make. In the event of Brexit and the agreement with the French breaking down (I think it unlikely because it would cause them even more problems), the carriers will be forced to exercise more control and be held responsible. Yes some will get past those controls but in relatively tiny numbers. You started off saying the Anglo French agreement was an EU agreement, totally wrong but you said it.

            Now you are trying to be smart and not being.

            You are desperately trying to save face now. Give up. you were wrong several remarks ago. There is no recovery from getting things THAT wrong.
            Whatever happens at Channel Ports is of little consequence in the big scheme of things, regaining sovereignty, limiting our population growth to less than the 90 million forecast etc.

            Europe is going down the pan.

            We will be better off out. Yes there will be some pain but the end is worth it. There is a lot of pain to come from staying in such a dysfunctional mess.

          • ButcombeMan

            No. The carriers will not allow them to board, the carrier will bear responsibility.
            The French will not facilitate an open door policy to the UK as it is against their interests. Calais would become uninhabitable except by migrants. A few thousand will become 100,000.

          • Rupert

            Actually the number would go down as the french would help them cross. Like the european countries are helping the migrants get to germany as they want them out as quickly as possible.

        • Ridcully

          In which case it will be the responsibility of our border police to send them straight back; a lot easier when you have control of your own borders.

          • Rupert

            Back to where? The french wont take them and when they claim asylum in the UK they are given due process. Ie a piece of paper saying when the court case is. A majority don’t even bother going to court they just disappear.

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Really, so which country is taking British rapists?

      • Rupert

        ?? In Britain we’re taught that rape is bad. In other countries they are taught its a great way to submit the native populations.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Funny, you seem to think it’s fine outside a few groups, as you make up conspiracy theories…

          • Rupert

            Read a few crime stories about South Africa. Some how every time someone is robbed or killed rape is involved… Doesn’t happen in the UK.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you deny crime here, k.

          • Rupert

            Currently we don’t have a rape culture. But its coming.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            And I oppose people like you who are trying to create it, right.

          • Rupert

            Too late. The rape culture is here and a lot on the left are encouraging it.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            No, you’re the one here advocating for it and claiming you’re already doing it.

        • Sanctimony

          Did you mean ‘subdue’ ?

          • Rupert

            nope. Submit to islam

  • Espinaca

    For those of you reading German: 80 % of Austrians have enough and want this invasion to be stopped: http://diepresse.com/home/politik/innenpolitik/4944600/Umfrage_Knapp-80-Prozent-fur-Aufnahmestopp-von-Fluchtlingen?from=gl.home_politik

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Really, 80% expressed unconditional hate of the Other and agreement with far right parties?

      Nope.

      • Penny

        Do you speak German, Leon?

        • Leon Wolfeson

          Do you speak American, Penny?

          See, I too can make random remarks.

          Fact; The far right do not have 80% support. Not even 8% in Britain.

          • Penny

            Indeed! Now – do you speak German?

          • UKSteve

            He speaks 3 languages – English, gibberish and rubbish.

          • Penny

            Leon – when you edit comments you should inform readers of the fact.

            As I’m sure you know, my reason for asking if you spoke German was to ascertain whether or not you could understand the linked-to article. Clearly, you don’t.

        • UKSteve

          Ignore Wolfeson – he’s a well-known tr0ll.

          • Penny

            You’re right – generally I ignore his one-line, hit-and-run stuff. I should have known better this time!

          • Sue Smith

            A serial troll – and not in the least intelligent. A deadly cocktail, to be sure.

      • Stonefreetorant PatrickStrei

        Ah, “the Other.” Edward Said is dead, and so is your intellect.

        • Leon Wolfeson

          So you think you can murder my mind with your magic POWAZ

          As you defend hate,

    • ButcombeMan

      85 percent of Austrians are, according to an IMAS survey for the continuation of border controls.

      03/11/2016 | 21:01 | (DiePresse.com)

      Nearly 80 percent of Austrians speak aloud a IMAS survey for the “Kronen Zeitung” for a “hiring freeze” of refugees from. Only 15 percent of respondents were accordingly for “all refugees who
      want to come to open the door,” as the “Kronen Zeitung” writes.
      More on the subject:

      Refugees: Interior Ministry ordered an additional 750 containers
      Cardinal Schönborn: “Can we not be walled on time”
      Budapest-Vienna: Refugees avail train barely

      For
      the continuation of border controls, including limiting barriers
      advocated according to the report, 85 percent of respondents. Great
      concern to the Austrians, therefore the integration of refugees: 72
      percent believe according to IMAS, it will be hard to be that “settle”
      the persons concerned in Austria. And more than 80 percent believe that the refugees search specifically
      those States as a destination, in which the benefits are best.

  • Adrian Werner

    Donald Tusk never invited them. From the start he was stressing EU needs to take control over it’s external borders before any other decisions can be made. For that he was bashed by german EU bureaucrats.

    • PaD

      Donald tusk is a semi-literate pole who cant believe his luck jumping from 30000 to300,000 euros a year with his ‘important’ job of masterminding europes complete f..k up.

  • Watt

    “Europe truly is on a suicide mission. All we have to decide is whether we want to be a part of it.”

    Two points :

    1. It is not suicide, it is the pandemic of cultural marxism whose target is the West and its values
    2. UK is already infected by this virus and will go the same way as Europe whether we are part of the EU or not

    • Leon Wolfeson

      Ah yes, the existence of any kind of leftist view, blah blah.

      Your Reich lost, get over it!

      • vieuxceps2

        Soviet Union? Still going is it?

        • Leon Wolfeson

          I’m not a communist. Or socialist.

          Oh dear, there goes your rebuttal.

          • ButcombeMan

            But you are one of the most absurd & provocative trolls on UK sites.

            It is quite plain that you get a buzz out of your silly behaviour.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you make wild claims, and claim with your magic POWAZ to make me silly and control what I feel.

            All because I pointed out a few facts which meant your rebuttal was wrong.

          • PaD

            Neither are you sentient..

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “U NO SENTIENT”

            Ahh, denying those with other views are like other people. Good hard right dehumanisation….

    • Sue Smith

      Your point 1 and ‘cultural suicide’ are both one and the same.

      Thank God I live in Australia! I was never so glad to be here!!! We will not tolerate that happening here; governments will be comprehensively thrown out at the merest hint.

  • Roger Hudson

    I read in the Express that the flood may try to divert to the Dalmatian islands, don’t worry as we are ready to repel them ,” Za Dom ,Spremni!”.

  • John Raynham

    TO LUFTHANSA AIRLINE. CHIEF EXEC Yes its full speed ahead but not in the direction you anticipate.The evidence about the crash cover up by the WHO in conjunction with others incll five MEPs in UK is now being translated into Spanish. German. French and other languages.We also this week have found around 50 more people in uk doing cover ups re Mental Health. One of them is a prominent Judge based in Manchester UK which is riddled with Health. Court. Coroner. Press and Other Corruption. The greater area Lancs was found to be doing same as is the county Cheshire where cover ups are going on re suicide of Airbus Engineer and a Lawyer and 1000s others who have died in that area. Other counties are Lincs. Bucks. Hants. Yorks. Essex. East Anglia. Berks. Oxon (30 Councillors). Herts. Somerset (Bristol uni)..Staffs. Scotland..We now want Lufthansa aircraft seized where ever they touch down. This is also addressed to South Hants Historical Aviation Society who may relect on the manslaughter we are aware of which the County Council are responsible for. One email removed the Chief Exec at the time of the election.(Mr Smiith) Violent police attacks on us failed to stop that and wont stop next phase. The Council is protected by local press corrupter which incl those owned by Johnston Press of Edinburgh who have also been doing cover ups all over UK. Latest news past few days is scams going on at the so called fitness to practice Tribunal Manchester. This is the place set up by the wholly corrupt GMC council. We just found around 30 of their members engaging in deception of the public. The man in charge of the tribunal is a Judge DAVID PEARL..He is in deep trouble as is GMC fo doing Mental Health cover ups..We discovered latest evidence by accident when we noticed all the fuss about Doc Solomonides of Chingford in the press for supposedly using ‘expletives’. He was called to the Tribunal for that reason. He did not know about cover ups re avoidable deaths going on for 30 yrs but he soon will cos we are drowning the Hosp where he worked and the area. Also by chance we now found similar things going on Manchester Uni. They like the rest never answered queries. We now find that the mal funding of affinity groups in order to get votes is/was organized by a character at that UNi who control the local press Manchester Even news part of Trinity Mirror.We now reckon Manchester is a main area for Establishment money making at the expense of the clueless meek public. THIS HAS NOT BEEN PROOF READ. IT HAS NOT BEEN PROOF READ.

    • UKSteve

      “Nurse, the screens!”

      • Sue Smith

        He’s out of bed again!!

  • Leon Wolfeson

    No, you’re on a mission to crush the EU. Including Britain. Difference!

    The far right are trying to rest control away from the moderates…

    • dogwonder

      Load of horse manure, there is nothing moderate via allowing a male invasion of Europe via anti-semitic Muslims breast fed on women and Jew hatred.

      • UKSteve

        Ignore Wolfeson – he’s a widely-known tr0ll

        • Wessex Man

          As are you.

          • UKSteve

            Ah, my stalker-tr0ll returns! Why don’t you give us another of your absolutely hilarious imbecilities, such as “There’d be no referendum without UKIP”, or “If Nigel was Prime Minister, we’d leave the EU and stop immigration.”

          • 9sqn

            There would be no referendum were it not for UKIP.

          • UKSteve

            Oh not another one!? Is there something in the water?

            As I said, “….absolutely hilarious imbecilities…”

            There is a referendum despite UKIP, not because of it. If you knew anything, it would be a miracle.

          • 9sqn

            UKIP brought leaving the EU to the public agenda which forced Cameron to promise a referendum. Whether a referendum would have been called had it not been for this fact is a matter for conjecture. My opinion, and that of many far more literate and intelligent than you or I, especially you, concurs with the belief that it would not have. Your cheap insults are a pretty sure sign of your lack of any substance and reasoning. Aka a troll. Goodbye.

          • UKSteve

            “UKIP brought leaving the EU to the public agenda which forced Cameron to promise a referendum.”

            Illogical, insupportable, fallaciously inducted, and plain-as-doughnuts wrong.

            Nikki Sinclair’s petition – which Farage told ‘Kippers to try and block – triggering a referendum debate in the Commons with the help of several MPs, forced Cameron’s hand. Like I said, “if you knew anything”, but then I’ve told you this before, and not long ago. Typical ‘Kipper – nothing goes in and nothing comes out.

            Nobody, only ignorant and dim fools, and lazy, clueless liars “concur[ ] with the belief that it would not have”.

            I know a great deal more than you could possible understand, as evidence by this exchange. Final proof you’re a know-nothing Faragista? You accuse others of a shortfall in intelligence etc, while being a dumb as a cheap pork pie.

            Making my ‘failed parachute’ theory look increasingly valid. Now, back to your Lego.

          • PaD

            You are nikki st clair ..and i claim my 5pounds.
            .meetu in the gents..err the ladies?

          • UKSteve

            Damn, you’ve got me.

            Now, how do I break this to my wife and teenage daughters?

          • PaD

            Haha ..got to give it to yout..that WAS funny!

          • UKSteve

            Gawd blessya, guv! 😉

          • PaD

            Youre welcome me ol china.
            Now if youll just have a google(with an open mind which i know you possess).
            Nigel Farage at the eu parliament.. has been in the lions den for a long time sticking it to them(inc blair)and the rest of the nobodies over there
            Youll also hear Nigel making the clearest factual and no punches pulled arguments for brexit..go on you wont regret it…i was a wooly nobrain lefty until I heard him on these clips..completely changed my way of thinking..almost overnight. ..oh well its up the apples and pears for me. Oh wait im in a ground floor flat. ! Wotcha..

          • PaD

            Plenty on youtube..

          • UKSteve

            Yes, seen a good few of them.

            A lot of style, not much substance. I wish UKIP were stronger – it’s held back by Farago.

            Anyway, got to my mickey, found me way up the apples, put on me whistle and the bloody dog went. It was me trouble telling me to fetch the teapots.

            Lawd luv a duck! ‘Appy days, mush!

          • vieuxceps2

            “something in the water”-? In your water perhaps. Where do you make it?

          • UKSteve

            Very childish.

            1/10… Must try harder.

          • vieuxceps2

            UK Steve- The lonely one.

          • UKSteve

            vieuxceps2 – the clueless one.

            All those books, all that internet, and you’re mind is completely unsullied by both.

          • vieuxceps2

            “you’re ” mind? Better learn English. Try books.

          • UKSteve

            You can use that one when you’ve read 2 or 3 books a week for nearly 3 years. From your posts, your reading list seems to consist of the Dandy and the Beano. Period.

          • vieuxceps2

            “2 or 3 books for nearly 3 years” Ah, a stooodent then? BUT- Dandy and Beano? Must be mature stooodent ? No grammar

          • ButcombeMan

            The referendum is obviously because UKIP won the EU elections and substantial numbers, probably the majority, of conservative supporters in the country, want one.

            The role of UKIP has been essential.

            If the UK votes to stay in, it will be because of Labour sheep.

          • UKSteve

            B0llux is it I’m not going around again with you, ‘Kipperidiot.

          • ButcombeMan

            Good. A win on points then.

          • UKSteve

            I always win on points….and style, content, reasoning, education, panache…I could go on :-)

          • UKSteve

            Only if you’re on immense quantities of illegal substances.

            Try and do something with your life than have the same arguments (which you’ve lost each time) again and again?

            I’ve told you before, you must be a special kind of thick. We only have this EU referendum because of Nikki Sinclair’s petition – which Farage tried to disrupt. – triggering a Commons debate. UKIP contributed 2nd place in 3 parliamentary by-elections. They are an utter irrelevance and a dustbin for protest votes – and I have seen e-mails from within of how he tried to destroy Vote Leave, and and has now gone to be completely useless to GO.

            UKIP should be spearheading everything to do with the Leavers on this referendum, it’s doing nothing. If we lose it, and I fear we will, it will be because UKIP is a bunch of idle, bigoted, political illiterates.

          • ButcombeMan

            You really make me laugh.
            Only political and EU anoraks have heard of Nikki Sinclair.
            The average voter, indeed all voters, /have/ heard of UKIP and of Farage.
            I am not a Farage defender, he is in many ways his own and the Brexiters, worst enemy, but his achievements in keeping the EU ball in the air are obvious.
            It is UKIP that has taken so many votes, it is UKIP that is rising in Wales. It does that DESPITE Farage’s mismanagement.

          • UKSteve

            You’ve defended Farage no end of times!

            There is truth in what you say, UKIP has 22 MEPs who with the rest of the MEPs, cost us £1 million each and I, and it seems many, haven’t a clue what any of them have got up to. Thy may as well be invisible.

            But taking credit for something that UKIP tried to block – well, it speaks volumes.

          • PaD

            If you had a brain youd be dangerous

          • PaD

            But as it is youre just an idiot

          • UKSteve

            That’s “you’d”. And a full stop after ‘dangerous’.

            Quite rich, coming from a UKIP window-licker that can’t punctuate.

          • PaD

            If Nigel was PM we’d leave the EU and stop immigration..

          • UKSteve

            LMAO.

      • rhys

        paid for by Saudi Arabians sucked up to by our very own Heir to the Throne thingy.

    • Sanctimony

      Or even wrest it…

      • Leon Wolfeson

        Yea, my bad, voicetype error.

        • PaD

          Voice or type..you talk boll…ks

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Attempted censorship, right.

  • Joe Long

    “For those living in the town surrounded by mountains, 350 miles north-west of Stockholm, there is no doubt where to find these criminals: among the migrant men who have arrived in droves in recent months, forcing them off the streets of the town they call home.

    An asylum centre has opened 10km outside the town holding 900 refugees, mostly from Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq.

    Many within the community have blamed the migrants for the attacks. Police have not released any nationalities of suspects but have admitted victims described their attackers as men of ‘foreign origin’.

    Commissioner Jerand added: ‘We have had a lot of problems with immigration. It strikes our resources really hard. We are often called out to asylum centres.

    ‘We see increasing violence towards women and children at the centres and do not really have the resources to cope with everything.’

    The string of assaults began on February 20, when the two young schoolgirls were groped”

    .https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2016/03/12/the-tiny-swedish-town-rocked-by-eight-muslim-sex-attacks-in-three-weeks/

    Very enriching

    • Sue Smith

      Yes, with ‘enrichment’ like this we could all use a few months vacation in GitMo.

  • Pretty_Polly

    Hello,

    My name is David Cameron and my aim is to destroy Britain as you know and love it.

    That is why I have admitted over 1,000,000 migrants in the last 12 months alone, why I support Turkey’s EU membership and why I have done virtually nothing to stop illegals entering the country and remaining forever. I will of course repeat these policies this year and every year during my premiership. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHqRtLeI_pE

    Up and down the country, I am told that my plans are working perfectly as people find they are becoming ‘Strangers Where They Live’ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9831912/I-feel-like-a-stranger-where-I-live.html and I am delighted my Defence Minister, Michael Fallon, has told me that our towns and cities are being enrichingly ‘swamped with immigrants’ http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/26/british-towns-swamped-immigrants-michael-fallon-eu

    As the ‘Heir to Blair’, I am proud to be continuing the pro immigration policies adopted by my close friends in the Labour Party and to be able to develop such ideas to extinguish ‘Britishness’ wherever it may be found. That is why I have abolished many of the planning rules in order to build huge anonymous new towns and cities in what was the unnecessary and socially divisive English countryside http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3463832/Couple-discovered-300-000-dream-cottage-soon-surrounded-700-home-estate-hearing-neighbour-walked-dogs.html

    I will soon be holding the long awaited confirmation of my views and opinions that Britain should remain an EU member forever and I will personally ensure that the Remain campaign is full of lies and propaganda to obtain the highly desirable Remain outcome, thereby wiping the floor with a blonde haired mop. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Johnson

    As you will understand from the foregoing, I am extremely excited about the forthcoming abolition of Britain and ‘Britishness’ by the enrichers and by my friends in the European Union who have assured me that a new name has already been decided for these very small inconsequential islands..

    Consequently, to further the re-writing of British history and the destruction of British traditions, they have chosen ‘EU Sector North West’ which must now be written below your postcode or your mail will no longer be delivered.

    God Save The President of the EU Commission. Rule Jean Claude Juncker.

    Yours sincerely

    David Cameron

    Governor General EU NW – Designate.

    • Callan

      With every day that passes the views of Enoch Powell on Europe and immigration come back to haunt us. He was a patriot, a towering intellect and an honest man. We now have Cameron. Weep for your grandchildren.

      • Sue Smith

        Sadly, I have to agree with this. What it does demonstrate is the stupidity of the political class, particularly the bien pensant.

        • rhys

          well that’s all of them that are in parliament, given our grotesquely undemocratic electoral system……………
          SNP gets half the Scottish vote and all but two of its MPs
          UKIP gets twice the SNP vote and one MP.

    • NiceTry

      David Cameron et al shows the same respect for British identity that he shows for Greek identity by claiming former Yugoslavians are “ethnic” Macedonians.

  • Cobbett

    Merkel: ‘I have no plan B’ on migrant crisis strategy

    In an interview, Chancellor Angela Merkel called for patience with
    efforts to accommodate refugees. Merkel said she was not weighing an
    alternative to her approach toward reducing the number of asylum
    applicants.

    Speaking on public television on Sunday, Chancellor Angela Merkel said
    Germany’s borders would remain open to refugees. Merkel dismissed a
    “rigid limit,” saying that “there is no point in believing that I can
    solve the problem through the unilateral closure of borders.”

    “I have no plan B,” Merkel said, adding that she is convinced she is on
    the right track with efforts to redistribute refugees within Europe and
    addressing the problems causing mass displacement: “I am fighting for
    this approach.”

    Merkel sought to reassure viewers by insisting that her government’s
    strategy is the only “logical” one – and came about after much thought.

    http://www.dw.com/en/merkel-i-have-no-plan-b-on-migrant-crisis-strategy/a-19081119

    • Norbert

      Chancellor Merkel is playing politics. Happily, France announced today that a “no visa” rule for Turkey is off the table, effectively killing Merkel Turkey proposal.

      Austria confirms its zero tolerance for illegal migrants crossing its border.

      Merkel has isolated herself internationally, though she continues to be popular with the German Left: SPD, Die Linke, and Greens.

      Let’s be clear. True refugees from Syrian war zones need safe refuge. No question. But, throwing open European borders to everyone … to say there are “no limits” … and to pose for selfies with young Arab men … has sent a different message. This message has resonated from the slums of Casablanca to nice neighborhoods in Kabul: Germany is the land of milk and honey.

      The intended or unintended consequences of Merkel’s policy are becoming an unprecedented disaster.

      • Cobbett

        For a start…most Syrian refugees have a safe haven..whether that is Lebanon or Turkey. No need to let them into Europe.

        As for ‘playing politics’ she seems to be determined that Germany, and the EU have an open door migration policy…she seems clearly ‘unhinged’ to me and the sooner she goes the better…although on a brighter note populist/nationalist(AfD & NPD) parties have shot up in popularity.

        • Norbert

          Hi Corbett,

          I’d have no problem allowing a few thousand Syrian families into France, Germany, or other European countries on temporary visas. There are Syrian professionals who could likely contribute to our national economies. This would keep them active and employed; and when the war ends, they return home.

          Merkel allowed 1,000,000+ Muslim migrants from many countries to move to Germany last year. That’s insanity. The impact on German society and on our security has been damning.

          Germany is a big attraction for migrants because of the very generous social benefits, including an apartment. Syrian refugees may apply for refuge in, say, Greece or Macedonia, but few do. That tells me that migrants coming to Germany are economic opportunists. Safe haven is available elsewhere.

          As for Merkel, yes, she’s clearly gone off the deep end. I’ve studied her over the years and don’t know how to explain this. She did a similar thing by shutting eight German nuclear power plants after the Fukushima disaster. This was an entirely political move to counter the sudden popularity of the Green Party. My conclusion is that she made a political calculation with the migrants … and it backfired.

          • Sue Smith

            I note on the news this morning (AEDT) that Merkel’s party has taken a hammering in some of the state elections in Germany!! The far right is gaining a foothold. All well and good – but it comes way too late.

            If I was a European citizen I’d be looking for the person who started the stampede!!

          • Fraser Bailey

            Yes, the moment she announced the end of nuclear energy in Germany was the moment I saw through Merkel.

  • Espinaca

    I wonder what other readers think about this here, the “Tet, Take Two: Islam’s 2016 European Offensive”:
    http://gatesofvienna.net/2015/11/tet-take-two-islams-2016-european-offensive/

    • UKSteve

      Not a lot:

      “Which brings me to the main thrust of this essay. I believe that Europe is being prepared for a Muslim-jihad version of the 1968 Tet Offensive in Vietnam.”

      …and a visit to his website will cement any notion you may have had about him, based on that line.

      • Bertie

        Disagree. it’s an invasion by an alien culture taking advantage of our politically correct inspired cowardice and unwillingness to stand up for our own culture which has brought sio much advancement to the world.

        What has Islam brought in the last 1000 odd years – sweet FA aside from war,hardship, rape, slavery,and despotism.

        No thanks.

        Just look to Turkey and its assistance of ISIS and other hard line extremist groups, its willingness to use maximum force against the Kurds, but not lift a finger against ISIS.

        • Gweedo

          Paranoia aside, a more likely explanation is that we in the West are just bewildered bystanders, watching Islamic civilisation collapsing around us.

          • Core Macro

            Their towering minarets are collapsing into Europe. Brushing off a comment with ‘Paranoia aside’ shows you are just scared to face up to what is happening.
            Here’s a bucket of sand for you to enjoy. But I do understand your fear.
            Islamic civilisation it not collapsing, it is just relocating, funded by oil money.

          • Bertie

            Erm, how is Islamic civilisation collapsing.Looks to be spreading further to me

      • Paul Robson

        Way OTT maybe, but there is a degree of truth, unfortunately in the Islamic takeover stuff.

  • trobrianders

    Douglas Murray’s arguments don’t reach doubters. He needs to embrace a more visceral style in these troubled times. Reasoned arguments only work on reasoned minds.

  • Ivan Ewan

    It’s worth repeating that in a few years time, if we’re still in the European Union, they’ll be nothing stopping the flood of illegal immigrants from the Middle East and Africa from getting their passports and coming over to be showered in government hand-outs by our nefarious do-gooders in Parliament.

    Join Grassroots Out, Leave.EU or Vote Leave – doesn’t matter who – just get out there and campaign for us to Leave.

    • Sue Smith

      Excellent comments. Unfortunately, though, the horse has already bolted. I predict the wholesale evacuation of the third world into Europe. Fortunately I’ll be dead before it is fully realized – hopefully!! My generation (Boomers) have lived through the best times. It’s over now.

      • Pioneer

        How long will it take to fully realise?

        • Sue Smith

          Twenty years, tops. If I was a European younger person (or from UK or Scandinavia) I’d be making plans to get out now; Australia or NZ. We just won’t tolerate over here what you’re getting!!

          • cremaster

            The same globalist scum are in charge in Australia, US and NZ. There is nowhere to run. That is how they devised it.

          • Core Macro

            I would have laughed at such comments but as ‘things’ progressively hit the proverbial fan, it really seems to be the case.

      • Ivan Ewan

        Europe might, or might not crash and burn under the weight of its own folly. We can be brought down with it, or we can get out while the going’s good, and help pick up the pieces later.

        • Sue Smith

          I’d certainly advocate the latter action, which will send a real message about centralized, authoritarian, non-representative ‘government’.

      • Sanchez

        I think it is partly your generation (boomers) that sold us out. Your generation’s lack of action means my generation (millennials) have to deal with the mess you have left us.

        • Sue Smith

          You hear that complaint often about the “boomers”. I’m unsure what “action” you think we need to take. If it’s about climate change I think you’ll find that a great many of the scientists are “boomer” generation or those very close to it who are doing all the work. That is, unless you think people like David Suzuki is your age.

          • Germainecousin

            Excellent reply Sue and you have hit the nail on the head by stating that you have five children. That is the difference. You were prepared to make sacrifices and consequently you have the right to speak from a moral highground. When you have a large family, you have an investment in the future. Merkel unfortunately for Europe has no such investment.

          • Sue Smith

            When I said younger generations today wouldn’t tolerate what we did to get ahead I would add that a very small number would make those sacrifices in the interests of getting ahead, and my eldest son is one of these. But when we moved onto the farm in 1979 with 2 very small kids and lived in that horse stable (yes!) our Sydney friends looked down their noses at us as well. That’s all so long ago now and we’ve been financially successful and live comfortably. But only because we took HUGE risks, lived in a dwelling we called a “hovel” (people would laugh!) and my husband worked exhausting hours for 23 years. Now our government (actually the Labor opposition) thinks we need to shell out our cash and have organized a raft of new taxes to support welfare, disability, education, bigger and bigger government. We have been rebadged the new “wealthy” (ha!) for the purpose of raising taxes!!

            It doesn’t end!!

          • Johnnydub

            “And are you planning to have 5 children? The muslims certainly will.”

            Well we’re stupid enough to pay for them.

          • Core Macro

            Only 5, or did you mean per wife?

      • Jackthesmilingblack

        Patting myself on the back for relocating to Japan in 1973.
        Jack, the partly banned Black

  • NiceTry

    Indeed Europe is on a suicide mission. Participating in it would include the mountains of ethnic engineering idiots that ridiculously claim ancient Paeonia is “Macedonia”.and its Slavic inhabitants “Macedonians”! Shall we claim that Poland is actually Republic of England and its Slavic language is actually English?

  • Mike E

    Sweden expects to get another 140 000 muslims in 2016 so this little ideologically insane country will soon go from being feminist to being Islamist.

    • cremaster

      Same difference.

      • Sanchez

        I’d rather neither.

        • Core Macro

          Feminists are unlikely to behead you.

    • trobrianders

      And not a single drink to drown their sorrows in.

  • Mike E

    Britain is actually spearheading the suicide by totally bowing down to Islam. No other non-Muslim European country has to my knowledge given the Muslims Sharia courts as Britain has.

  • Jacobi

    As you say we now have a border disaster in Europe. Merkel has now ensured that.

    You mention three categories of migrants, but omit the fourth, the largest and the most threatening and that is religious migrants, whether also economic or otherwise.

    These constitute the bulk of the 60% of the total that Timmermans admits to.

    As for this year, this coming summer, you suggest the same number. Come one? A least double or more.

    Turkey alone will see to that!

    There has been comment below about getting out while we can. In my family we have a habit of staying put and fighting things out. Now I am an oldie and a bit past that. But there are others and it makes me angry that the stupidity of what is just being allowed to happen will mean they will have to deal with the disaster.

  • booradley

    It’s difficult for ‘Old Europe’ to swallow its pride and take a lesson from younger upstart nations like Australia, but the obvious illegal immigration problems you have ought to justify a moment of reflection.
    Australia solved its problem, and cleverly worked a way around the Leftist activists who ‘game’ the legal system at the taxpayer’s expense:

    We found cooperative neighbours to accept illegals and provide them with a new start under their flag. No, they didn’t like that because there wasn’t a truckload of handouts to dive into, but we said “tough – you wanted a new place to live in, and you got it. Like it, or lump it”

    We said if you arrive illegally, you are forever excluded from having a visa to enter Australia. Forever. And you’re deported to Manus Island or Nauru, with the option of returning home, wherever that is.
    We shut-off taxpayer funded legal aid to foreigners, to avoid decades-long court cases that create de-facto residency.
    We presumed criminal intent for anyone who destroys their passport or fakes an identity.
    We intercepted them on the seas, and turned them back to where they came from.
    We completely neutralised the people-smugglers’ businesses.
    It worked. Nobody comes illegally.

    Hundreds of thousands of migrants are welcomed, legally, having been processed and filtered so their intentions are known. The money saved on illegals, makes the legal arrivals experience better. It has the strong support of over 95% of the Australian population. Problem solved.

    We are proud of this success, and the consequences of ignoring it are before the eyes now, of all Europeans.
    Techniques for the taking. Good luck.

    • trobrianders

      Your policy is almost beautiful but you misunderstand the purpose of the new leftist-controlled institutions of Old Europe. In New Old Europe we want to do away with old-fashioned things like Europeans.

      • Core Macro

        Australia isn’t spacious, most of it is outback and difficult to live, people live all around the thin green edge.

        • trobrianders

          Just as long as you’re not trying to put us off. We’ll be coming regardless. Where else are we going to go.

          • Core Macro

            I live in Putney London, I’ll be on the boat with you :-) I’ll buy the drinks!

          • trobrianders

            I read an alarming post from a New Zealander saying the islands had basically been sold to Chinese interest resulting in unwelcome change.

          • Core Macro

            If you are referring to this, it was halted, maybe it was something else entirely though.
            http://www.reuters.com/article/newzealand-china-farming-sale-idUSL4N11N06N20150917

          • trobrianders

            Thanks for that. He told me Auckland is unrecognisable now.

    • Paul Robson

      God no, I’d copy this tomorrow, or the attitude anyway. I particularly liked (well all of it) but

      “We said if you arrive illegally, you are forever excluded from having a visa to enter Australia. Forever. ”

      My understanding is, or was, that if you migrate to Oz you either have to provide for yourself, or you have to have someone else who will (not public sector, a person), for four years.

      Otherwise you starve.

    • johnb1945

      Europe is connected by land and about 6 miles of sea to Asia, we’re dealing with millions, not thousands, of migrants, there are no friendly Islands to put them on and the only country you could tow them back to is Turkey, because everywhere else, specifically Libya, is a war zone.

      Sure, we can be uncompromising on the one hand, but on the other we need more regional processing and a reformed refugee policy.

      Realistically, we also need a unified European asylum policy to go along with freedom of movement.

      Just shipping them back would cost a bomb, probably break international conventions, and when distances are so short they’ll just keep trying until they find a weak spot and get in.

      • mohdanga

        Shipping them back is a lot cheaper than paying them for life ie. on social assistance for the rest of their existence in the UK. The “international conventions” that would need to be disregarded are from a different time and place and have been used by do-gooders to enable the overrunning of the West. Time to think about the sovereignty of Western countries rather than enabling a Muslim invasion.

        • secretpeople

          Australia did the right thing by nipping it in the bud and thus setting an example for those who otherwise may have followed. The scale of our problem now may be difficult to undo, but do it we must – we have to.

        • johnb1945

          I doubt.

          To intercept then ship the millions who are attempting the crossing and who will continue to attempt the crossing would cost billions and billions of Euros and pounds every year that we and our European partners have to do it.

          You’d need a vast flotilla of ships, all with paid crews, maintenance and fuel bills and then admin costs of processing claims + whatever Turkey would sting you for taking them.

          Australia’s annual bill for deterring a flow of about 20,000 migrants over a much larger body of water with far fewer entry routes is estimated to be around 7b AUD.

          This is not a cheap solution, and potentially inhumane. The priority has to making it more attractive to stay put, rather than deploying hugely expensive defence measures.

          • mohdanga

            Putting up a fence seems to have solved the problem in Hungary, Czech Republic, Bulgaria, etc. You don’t allow them into European/English waters, simple as that. That doesn’t cost billions and billions. The West is tired of being humane, let their Muslim brethren in the filthy rich, Middle Eastern oil sheikdoms take care of them.

          • johnb1945

            Sorry to ask the obvious, but how has putting up a fence in Hungary stopped people crossing the Med?…. It hasn’t?

            Many of their “Muslim brethren” (human brethren?) are showing extraordinary generosity.

            Majority Muslim Lebanon and Jordan have accepted millions of refugees. These are tiny, tiny countries with middle/ low incomes.

            Sending a flotilla of ships big enough to intercept and deport every boat to the Med would be so costly I suspect that if you did the sums you may as well invite them in to live on benefits forever, and we’d have no boats left to do anything else.

            There are no Islands we can ship them to either, they’d have to go back to Turkey.

            The best thing to do is to make staying put more viable and comfortable while cracking down on people trafficking. There are many improvements which can be made here.

          • mohdanga

            Hmmm. Naval boats off of Turkey prevent boats crossing from Turkey to Greece. Problem #1 solved.
            Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Oman, Bahrain, UAE have done ZIPPO for their Muslim brethren. They can take them.

          • johnb1945

            How any boats have got as far as the English Channel BTW?You said English Waters?

          • mohdanga

            Once the Jungle in Calais is big enough they will try to get to England in boats. They’re already walking through the Chunnel, and sneaking over in lorries.

          • johnb1945

            the jungle is already big enough and its occupants motivated enough – several thousand people desperate to escape squalor. They don’t come because they don’t have boats to make the journey – where are they going to get them from?

            The people with connections and money to organise boats in Libya or Turkey are people traffickers, and there is simply no way that this kind of overt organised crime would be possible or tolerated in a well organised, well policed country like France.

          • Angkor

            That is the first time I have seen anyone claim that the cost to Australia for border control policies is A$7 billion per year. The figure touted by the opponents of the policy in Australia is A$1 billion and they have no reason to understate the cost..
            I believe that you have made the $7 billion figure up and that it is pure fabrication.

          • johnb1945

            It’s scale and geography which make it impossible to lift the Australian approach.

            They were dealing with a drip of migrants crossing hundreds of miles from Indonesia. Europe is dealing with a million crossing 5 or 10.

            And we don’t have islands to put them on.

            Supposedly a deal to send them to turkey has been finalised but this will come at a cost.

            The terms being discussed were lots of aid to Turkey and visa free access to schengen for Turks. So you swap a million Syrians and afghans for 75 mill Turks.

          • Angkor

            I only commented to question your claim that Australia’s border control policies cost it A$7 billion a year, which is a complete untruth that you have made up. However the untruths you peddle continue.
            For migrants out of Libya the distance to the nearest European island, Lampedusa, is the same as the distance from Indonesia to Australia’s nearest territory, Christmas Island.
            Australia is dealing with a drip of migrants because it cut off the flow. If it did not then it would have grown to the hundreds of thousands.
            Europe is dealing with a million crossing from Turkey to Greece because it has been too incompetent to stop it and in fact under Angela Merkel it encouraged it.
            You have a perfectly good island in Ascension Island to put your unwanted migrants on. It is every bit as attractive as a destination for them as Nauru.
            If you weren’t tied into the rule of the German government under the incompetent and reckless Merkel you would not be paying the Danegeld that the Turks are extracting from you.

    • Disqus Bolloqus

      Can’t see France or any other of Britain’s neighbours be willing to accept money in return for housing migrants

      • secretpeople

        Nor even, still less in fact, the poorer countries of the bloc.

    • secretpeople

      But do you have nutty chancellors intent upon changing asylum laws such that economic migrants are equally entitled and can choose where they are sent to? An ECJ who promotes their ‘right to family life’ and their rights over the lucky intended host population’s rights?

      • booradley

        No, but we do have our share of nutters in the Labor and Greens parties who would advocate that approach, and ultimately bankrupt Australia. Fortunately they are in the minority, and completely dependent upon the unions for their marching-orders and income – and the unions don’t like migrants from a competition perspective.

  • trobrianders

    Douglas Murray is far too straight to address this mad subject.

    • Sanchez

      lol the irony in saying he’s straight.

      • Johnnydub

        Whats the correct allegory? He is a friend of Dorothy?

        • PaD

          What has that silly remark got to do with what his article is about? He’s open about his sexuality..and also has discretion.

  • Kalyan Deb

    No need of lecturing mainland Europe, your Great Britain has already metamorphosed into a mini-Pakistan, ha ha ha!

  • Paul Robson

    Does anyone know (seriously) if Merkel were to give her refugees German nationality, is there anything we can do to stop them moving here ? Some sort of statute of limitations ?

    It just struck me as one way out of her problem ; yes you can become European, now go be European elsewhere.

    • Disqus Bolloqus

      Is the German Government planning on handing out mass German citizenship to the migrants? I know this is a fear but I have yet to see any evidence that this will happen.

      • WTF

        Its not a case of if, its a case of she could and there’s nothing we could do about stopping them coming to the UK except by leaving the EU.

        • Disqus Bolloqus

          There’s al sorts of things that could happen, Russia could launch a nuke in central London tomorrow. Corbyn could win the next election. The Calais camp could move to Dover. What’s important is not what could happen, but what is likely to happen. That’s why I asked my question. What evidence is there that Germany is planning on giving the immigrants citizenship?

          • frank davidson

            Best bet is that citizenship will be given. Painless for Germany. Other possibility is to deport them. Limbo seems unlikely.

          • WTF

            Did I say she would ? No — Did I say she could ? Yes

            I never claimed there was evidence that Germany was going to do this, you do understand the difference between ‘would’ and ‘could’ I assume !

            Its like that famous line by Farage who correctly said said that several million EU citizens ‘COULD’ come to Britain not that they would and also with Trump who proposed halting Muslim immigration until the the vetting was sorted but was twisted by the progressives by air brushing out the part about ‘until the the vetting was sorted’.

            What is it with progressive liberals, are they dyslexic, hard of hearing or just plain liars intent on race baiting. My money is on the latter !

            As for those other lame points, the odds of any of those events happening are far less likely than the UK leaving the EU.

          • Disqus Bolloqus

            So it was scaremongering aka the Brexit campaign saying 3 million could lose their jobs and the Calais camp could move to Dover. What we need is evidenced based debate not speculative coulds

          • WTF

            It wasn’t Brexit making those claims it was the remainiacs.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Ah yes, anyone who is not a country-hopping leech like you and does not want to be sealed behind the borders you’ll keep crossing…

          • WTF

            Anyone in the world is allowed to travel to most countries without let or hindrance assuming they have a passport and are not a security problem. Perhaps you’re on the no fly list and you’re all bent out of shape over it or maybe they wont let you in for other criminal record reasons, is that your problem or is it just plain envy and jealousy ?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you don’t have the faintest idea about visa issues.

            No, I don’t have your issues with your past actions, thanks, or your envy and jealousy. You’re simply a hypocrite who does not practice what he preaches for the masses, simple as that.

          • WTF

            I have personal experience with immigration visas for both the UK as well as the USA, have you ? Is that your issue !

            Other than the usual bureaucracy one experiences with any government department or country, if you’re a law abiding citizen without a criminal record, like me you won’t have any issues. From your dis-jointed diatribe it sounds like you’ve had problems in this area !

          • Leon Wolfeson

            So you claim experience, but deny the knowledge you’d have gained there.
            As you deny i.e. the H1-B visa lottery, right.

            And from your poor English skills you accuse me of having your issues, right. No doubt you bribed you way in, via the investment path as otherwise…

          • WTF

            You really are a sad individual with a massive chip on your shoulder !

            What do you want to know about the immigration process, I’ll willing share my experience with anyone whose interested if it can help them. I didn’t need to enter the Visa lottery nor did I need or have the money to bribe anyone. Being married to an American citizen, with no criminal record, no diseases and a means of self support tends to help in these areas just as it helped my American wife to live in the UK and the EU.

            As I have said previously, I’ve walked the walk and can talk the talk with first hand knowledge over immigration matters as they affected my wife and I but I doubt you have the same knowledge or have even looked at emigrating to the EU let alone further afield.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “UR SAD”

            As you talk about your desire to slam an axe into my shoulder and take a chip out of it.

            And right, you’re willing to share how millions makes it easy to bribe your way in, magical work visa’s!

            You’re a really rich hypocrite, right, you repeat over and over how you’ve used what you’d deny others…and I’m not afraid of the British and feel the need to escape, no. Although your far right may well drive me out, by force, if you get your way.

          • WTF

            So what skills have you got other than rambling on and on about your low self esteem !

            What magical work visa’s, I’m retired and haven’t worked for 11 years but I’ve lived off my meager state pension and prudent savings since then as I’ve never taken a penny in benefits from any country I’ve lived in, how about you ?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            I don’t have your esteem issues, but thanks for projecting.

            And yes, I hear you, you don’t work as you never have. Those “prudent” funds you inherited, as you claim never to have used any state services…no NHS, no consular services, never got a VISA….

          • WTF

            You don’t know my background or work record so you’re talking absolute bollux !

            Neither have I taken any benefit from the state such as job seekers, disabled benefit, workshy benefits, free-loader benefits or any other benefit many have availed themselves of. I have of course had occasion to claim off my state insurance cover that I pay into to receive medical treatment just as I claimed my pension that I paid into for over 40 years.

            As for consular services, you’re pig ignorant how they work as unless you’re some free-loading migrant claiming refugee status, just as everyone else, I had to pay for consular services and visas. Sixteen years ago it cost $420 for my wife to apply for UK residency and for me four times that amount for US residency, plus medical costs plus police certificates.

            You really are in a different world, where do you find all this sh** you post or shouldn’t I ask ?

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes yes, be very specific, ignore the other benefits…deny your claims as a rich man and spew hate at the 99%. You then admit you have participated, and hence should pay tax like anyone else.

            As you hate on the consular services you’ve used, oh dear, as you claim because I am not your sort of rich hypocrite I’m in a “different world”, and you’re afraid of people commenting on the sh** which you post, from your mind…

            Workers like myself rightly have issues with leeches off our backs like you. You’re a hypocrite, who has crossed borders, lived elsewhere even and would deny the same to the 99%.

          • WTF

            A close friend of mine had a retarded son but he had a rationale explanation for his condition, he was born very prematurely. He’s now 25 years of age but despite some disabilities, he makes far more sense than you despite needing secure assisted living. Even autistic children have saving graces by excelling in some area or other to make up for deficiencies in other facets of their personality but you have none. Forget it, I can’t debate with the absolute rubbish you post as it makes no sense and I’m not wasting my time anymore.

            As I and others have said before, you seriously need to seek psychiatric help. Based on your posts here, you have zero self esteem, you have a serious persecution complex and your rambling diatribes are akin to ADD with senseless drivel. Additionally you appear to hate the world and everyone in it.

          • Leon Wolfeson

            “rationale explanation”

            Ah, the excuse for a friend, check, when you’d condemn “retarded” people generally. Check. Screaming hate at me based on your bigotry and poor English skills, check. More anti-disabled hate check, as you spew hate at me for discussing your hypocrisy.

            As you and your alts whine your anti-discussion mantra, the same far right, social darwinist, toalitarian mantra that not being just like you is madness…your proposed abuse of mental health services against political opponents…

            As you blame me for your issues, as you note you’re trying to persecute me and whine onwards, as you demand I share your hates. Nope, I’m not your sort of collectivist – it’s just you who under your own ideology should stop crossing borders, hypocrite!

            Run away now, got more food to steal eh?

          • WTF

            mixed delusion – one in which no central theme predominates. – Check +

            delusion of reference – a delusional conviction that ordinary events, objects, or behaviors of others have particular and unusual meanings specifically for oneself. Check +

            bizarre delusion – one that is patently absurd, with no possible basis in fact. Check +

            Yep, sadly you have all these symptoms, go seek some help !

          • Leon Wolfeson

            Yes, you think you have all sorts of issues.
            In fact, the central theme seems to be hypochondria on your part, but hey!

            Blaming me for your problems…is just sad. But part and parcel of your intolerant hate preaching against those not just like you.

            As you try and excuse a friend the general bigotry of yours, showing your hypocrisy.

      • Paul Robson

        Not that I’m aware of. I suppose there are four options ; deport them, spread them around the EU, give them German citizenship or lose them in the morass of illegality.

        Whilst the first and last will happen to some extent, obviously, I’m unconvinced it’s a solution with those sort of numbers. I can’t see them being spread around the EU ; other countries may well (not unreasonably) take an “it was your idea, you live with it ” approach. If it had been universally agreed beforehand but Germany for some bizarre reason decided it was going to adopt an allincomefree policy. That leaves the latter, which is political poison in Germany. Could be offset by “tough rules” being introduced against new migrants, but that in *itself* could be against EU rules if they are officially “German”.

        It also depends on the rationale of the migrants. Would Germany be their country of choice, or did they go to Germany simply because Germany adopted an open door migration policy when many other countries were making it clear they wouldn’t have them. If they did decide they prefer the UK, could we do anything about it ? There is clearly a preference for the UK over France.

        It is all very hypothetical I agree. But it is also an unsolved problem. I’m not trying for “Project Fear” – we will all die in agony if we do/don’t leave the EU stuff.

        The reason I asked was because in other cases – Poles for example, there was an *option* of having a temporary block on free movement for new EU countries – this was to stop mass economic migration. We did not take advantage of this (there is an amusing piece where the Polish Government Rep. basically refused to believe our government wasn’t putting some limits on Polish migration) but it does show that people are actually thinking about this.

        Reminds me a bit of the old joke where someone stops someone and asks for directions and the response is, well I wouldn’t start from here.

        • Disqus Bolloqus

          Thanks for reasoned reply. A refreshing change in the hysterical debate that is the referendum campaignS

      • Sandra Barwick

        Germany gives citizenship after eight years, though that can be reduced to six with language courses. They don’t allow dual citizenship of countries outside the USE.
        Any who wished could then come to the UK or whichever country was most prosperous in the USE at that time, presumably most likely if Germany’s economy faltered, or if there was massive resentment and attacks on Muslims in Germany, or they had strong family ties in another European country. They would have surrendered their citizenship of birth, so they would not be returning.

        • Sandra Barwick

          I don’t know whether committing crime in the eight year waiting period would be a bar to citizenship. Anyone know?

  • https://sites.google.com/site/deanjackson60/home Dean Jackson

    The so-called ‘War on Terror’ is an operation being carried out by the Marxist co-opted governments of the West in alliance with the USSR and other Communist nations, the purpose being to (1) destroy the prominence of the West in the eyes of the world, where the West is seen (i) invading nations without cause; (ii) causing chaos around the globe; and (iii) killing over one-million civilians and boasting of torture; (2) close off non-Russian supplies of oil for export, thereby increasing the price of oil, the higher price allowing oil exporting Russia to maintain economic stability while she modernizes and increases her military forces; (3) destroy the United States Armed Forces via the never-ending ‘War on Terror’; the ultimate purpose of the aforementioned to (4) bring about the demise of the United States in the world, opening up a political void to be filled by a new pan-national entity composed of Europe and Russia (replacing the European Union), a union ‘From the Atlantic to Vladivostok’;* which will (5) see the end of NATO.

    The following are two discoveries I made in April 2015 regarding the Yugoslav ‘civil wars’ and ‘collapse’ of the USSR, and what they prove about the institutions of the West…

    (I) Communist control of Yugoslavia ‘civil wars’ gone unnoticed for quarter century.

    Secessionist Yugoslav Orthodox, Catholic and Muslim factions waged dirty wars against each other, neglecting to first wipe out the 9% of the population that attempted to do away with religion in Yugoslavia, proving the wars were orchestrated and controlled by the communist faction.

    Murder, torture and legal discrimination of those professing religious sentiment was so intense under the Marxist regime in Belgrade, that those who professed no religious affiliation increased from less than 10% pre-1945 to a bewildering 32% by 1987…

    ‘Like in most former Communist countries in Central, Eastern and South­‑Eastern Europe, the means and actions applied by the Yugoslav Government between 1945 and 1990 to reduce the influence of religions and religious organisations were quite effective: While there was just a tiny group of people who regarded themselves to be without a religion before the Second World War (less than 0.1% of the population), this number grew to 13% in 1953 and to 32% in 1987.’

    https://web.natur.cuni.cz/ksgrrsek/acta/2009/2009_henkel.pdf

    That 9% constitutes members of the League of Communists of Yugoslavia, the Marxist party that subjugated Yugoslavia from 1945 until the party’s dissolution in January 1990. Before any religious sectarian strife, first there would have been massive reprisals against the reviled Communists who implemented policies to wipe out religion in Yugoslavia. The fact that no such reprisals took place proves that the breakup of Yugoslavia, during the Yugoslav Wars (1991-2001), was manufactured and controlled by the Communists; and

    (II) When Soviet citizens were liberated from up to 74 years of horrific Marxist-atheist oppression on December 26, 1991, the day the USSR officially ended, there were ZERO celebrations throughout the USSR, proving (1) the ‘collapse’ of the USSR is a strategic ruse; and (2) the political parties of the West were already co-opted by Marxists,** otherwise the USSR (and East Bloc nations) couldn’t have gotten away with the ruse.

    ZERO celebrations, as the The Atlantic article inadvertently informs us…

    http://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2011/12/20-years-since-the-fall-of-the-soviet-union/100214/

    Notice, however, the Kremlin staged anti-government demonstrations that took place in Russia (and other Soviet republics) in the years immediately preceding the ‘collapse’, yet ZERO celebrations after the ‘collapse’!

    The fraudulent ‘collapse’ of the USSR (and East Bloc) couldn’t have been pulled off until both political parties in the United States (and political parties elsewhere in the West) were co-opted by Marxists, which explains why verification of the ‘collapse’ was never undertaken by the West, such verification being (1) a natural administrative procedure (since the USSR wasn’t occupied by Western military forces); and (2) necessary for the survival of the West. Recall President Reagan’s favorite phrase, “Trust, but verify”.

    It gets worse–the ‘freed’ Soviets and West also never (1) de-Communized the Soviet Armed Forces of its Communist Party officer corps, which was 90% officered by Communist Party members; and (2) arrested/de-mobilized the five million vigilantes that assisted the Soviet Union’s Ministry of the Interior and police control the populations of the cities during the period of ‘Perestroika’ (1986-1991)!

    There can be no collapse of the USSR (or East Bloc nations) without…

    Verification, De-Communization and De-mobilization.

    The West never verified the collapse of the USSR because no collapse occurred, since if a real collapse had occurred the West would have verified it, since the survival of the West depends on verification. Conversely, this proves that the political parties of the West were co-opted by Marxists long before the fraudulent collapse of the USSR, since the survival of the West depends on verification.

    For more on this topic (and related subjects), see my blog…

    https://sites.google.com/site/deanjackson60/

    Conclusion:

    The West will form new political parties where candidates are vetted for Marxist ideology, the use of the polygraph to be an important tool for such vetting. Then the West can finally liberate the globe of vanguard Communism.

    ————————-
    * ‘Russia is an inalienable and organic part of Greater Europe and European civilization. Our citizens think of themselves as Europeans. We are by no means indifferent to developments in united Europe.

    That is why Russia proposes moving toward the creation of a common economic and human space from the Atlantic to the Pacific Ocean – a community referred by Russian experts to as “the Union of Europe,” which will strengthen Russia’s potential and position in its economic pivot toward the “new Asia.”’ – Vladimir Putin (2012).

    https://www.rt.com/politics/official-word/putin-russia-changing-world-263/

    ** The failed socialist inspired and controlled pan-European revolutions that swept the continent in 1848(1) taught Marxists and socialists a powerful lesson, that lesson being they couldn’t win overtly,(2) so they adopted the tactic of infiltration of the West’s political parties/institutions. In the case of the United States…(continue reading at DNotice)…

    https://sites.google.com/site/deanjackson60/now-you-see-me-now-you-don-t

    • UKSteve

      Missed you meds?

      The EU not even mentioned once.

  • Jackthesmilingblack

    Mass Muslim immigration into Western Europe, the blunder of the century.

    • Johnnydub

      The second self inflicted catastrophe of the EU after the Euro.

      Wooh. Lets stay with that bunch of fools…

  • Christian Stanicki

    Why does nobody believe, that there might be a happy ending in the end? The fugitives in Germany are grateful, they will be integrated. This article is made of fear! that´s poor as a point of view.
    I think people are blind who don´t see, that in times of globalisation migration is a undeniable fact. And don´t forget, the whole thing started in unprecedented dimension after Lybia became instable after airstrikes of France, Britain and the USA, not to mention the Bush/Blair Iraq-war. A typicall behavior for human beeings is to start all kind of big actions but never finish them, and then let somebody else clean up after them. Solutions have to be found now. And don´t mix up process with panic.

    • Jacobi

      You have answered your own question.

    • Cyril Sneer

      I think you need to listen to the German people. You won’t. Then you’ll be all surprised when Germany fully swings to the right. Then you’ll be calling all Germans racist like the wilful ignoramus you are.

      Thanks for letting us know you’re a globalist and that western culture no longer matters.

    • mohdanga

      These ‘migrants’ are so grateful that they are raping and mugging to show their appreciation. Please read the facts.

      • Bonkim

        That is special benefits they deserve it after the long march. Rest and recuperation for you.

    • Bonkim

      Integrated? You must be joking!

  • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

    Disreputable and offensive article. A humanitarian crisis has been under way and only one thing matters. How can we all help these people? They are not “migrants”. A migrant is someone who voluntarily chooses, for whatever reason, to move to live and work in another country with the intention that this should be a permanent. Those fleeing Syria had no choice but to leave. Their towns, their homes and the basis of their lives had been utterly destroyed. But they are not “migrants” in the conventional sense at all. Just people and families who want to live. To survive. Syria can and will be rebuilt. We need to help this process – a modern day “Marshall Plan” if you like. Those Syrians who have fled their country will mostly return. In the meantime the rich West has a moral obligation to help. That’s what the Germans and the EU as a whole is doing. This issue is not about “immigration” – it is about helping refugees. How grotesque that Mr Murray doesn’t want to do this.

    • itsthepatriarchy

      ummm, ‘cept for the little problem that they aren’t from Syria…. 80% are from north africa, 10% from a variety of Albania, Yemen, Sudan Eritrea… not even 10% are Syrian

      • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

        You make an unsubstantiated allegation without any references. Perhaps you could let
        me know the source?

        • itsthepatriarchy

          on the conservative side (i.e.-the ones with an interest in admitting the f-ed up…
          ” Even Frans Timmermans, Vice President of the European Commission, made this point this week. In his accounting, at least 60pc of the people who are here are economic migrants who should not be here – are from North African states such as Morocco and Tunisia.”

          from the FT:

          “Angela Merkel’s government has backed plans to curb the number of asylum seekers coming to Germany from Tunisia, Morocco and Algeria in response to public fears over mass migration and the suspected role of men from these countries in the New Year’s Eve assaults in Cologne.

          In a surprising move, Berlin plans to add the three north African states to a growing list of so-called safe countries whose citizens do not normally qualify for asylum”

          i.e. – close door after barn

          ps-don’t believe what governments and mainstream tells you…

          • Bonkim

            No need to explain if you feel like doing something – just go ahead and do it.

    • Cyril Sneer

      35% of those are from Syria. And the vast majority are young men.

      65% are not. And the vast majority are young men.

      Most of these young men are not refugees but economic leeches looking to cherry pick the most lucrative country to move to because people like you have ripped up the refugee rule book They will pass through numerous safe countries before they arrive at their destination of choice. They are not refugees.

      What you support will line the pockets of people smugglers and provide further incentive for many many more to attempt to come here and thus the policy that you support will result in the deaths of a great many of these opportunists, most of which are not actual refugees.

      In addition, as you’re unwilling to follow the rules on what defines a refugee, the people who genuinely need our help will not get it and most likely be lost in the sea of economic migrants that you have chosen to define as a refugee.

      Next you’ll be moaning about the rise of the ‘far right’.

      • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

        What is the source of this contention?

        • FallingDown

          And what are your sources to the contrary? You don’t have any do you?

          I cannot believe there are people naive enough to believe that the Syrian conflict isn’t being used as a gateway for hundreads of thousands (possibly more?) of economic migrants to enter Europe for a better life. Of course it is! And with people with attitudes such as Mr Briggs long will it be allowed to continue. This mass migration of people is not a solution to anything and is the beginning of the end for Europe as we know it. I am glad that the UK is doing the correct thing and taking people directly from the Syrian camps, that is the right thing to do and the numbers are fair too as Britain does not have the space that Germany and others have.

          Shame Mr Briggs doesn’t believe our own countries have a moral duty to protect our citizens, cultures and communities like he does for these migrants. Because the changes that are happening and will happen all over Europe due to this crisis have a potential to be disastrous and already are in many places. Not that that matters to people like him of course.

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            Shame that you didn’t actually read what I said and just resorted to “people like you” abuse.

          • Cyril Sneer

            Twice you have been asked for a source and twice you have ignored the request.

            Our debated already and we have only just got going.

          • Cyril Sneer

            Twice you have been asked for a source and twice you have ignored the request.

            Our debated already and we have only just got going.

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            Shame that you didn’t actually read what I said and just resorted to “people like you” abuse.

        • Johnnydub

          Try the EU Commissions own figures.

          Oh wait you won’t because you’re a self loathing demagogue.

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            Amazes me that people like you still think that they enhance their arguments by descending to abuse.

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            Amazes me that people like you still think that they enhance their arguments by descending to abuse.

          • Cyril Sneer

            You can’t even defend your argument or provide any sources.

            Standard behaviour for your kind.

          • Cyril Sneer

            You can’t even defend your argument or provide any sources.

            Standard behaviour for your kind.

          • Bonkim

            Beggars cannot be choosers and should be prepared to abuse and worse.

        • Cyril Sneer

          Try the UNHCR for starters.

          What’s your source? The MSM?

        • Cyril Sneer

          Try the UNHCR for starters.

          What’s your source? The MSM?

    • itsthepatriarchy

      the ‘rich’ west. Is that the same west so indebted up to its eyeballs that its entire social and welfare system is being curtailed, on the road to being outright scrapped? (I trust you don’t call that an ‘unsubstantiated allegation.’)

    • itsthepatriarchy

      the ‘rich’ west. Is that the same west so indebted up to its eyeballs that its entire social and welfare system is being curtailed, on the road to being outright scrapped? (I trust you don’t call that an ‘unsubstantiated allegation.’)

    • SimonNorwich

      You’re ignoring the point that these people are not satisfied with being in Turkey or Greece, or Macedonia or Serbia or Hungary. They don’t just want to get to a safe country, they are demanding to get to the very richest countries. They are migrants.

      • Bonkim

        Don’t blame them – that is free enterprise.

    • SimonNorwich

      You’re ignoring the point that these people are not satisfied with being in Turkey or Greece, or Macedonia or Serbia or Hungary. They don’t just want to get to a safe country, they are demanding to get to the very richest countries. They are migrants.

    • mohdanga

      Please direct your concerns to the following;
      Saudi Arabia
      Kuwait
      UAE
      Oman
      Qatar
      Iran
      Bahrain
      China
      Russia
      India
      Indonesia
      Malaysia
      Singapore
      Thailand
      ….all safe countries, many of them next door, Muslim neighbours to the Syrians. But the MSM is stumm on this, somehow it is the West, always accused of “sticking our noses where they don’t belong”, responsible for saving these non-refugees.

      • Bonkim

        You have to learn Arabic and other languages for that. You get translators and lunch stations, even maternity hospitals en-route to Germany. Only desert sands and no water on the way to Jiddah.

    • mohdanga

      “In the meantime the rich West has a moral obligation to help. That’s what the Germans and the EU as a whole is doing. This issue is not about “immigration” – it is about helping refugees.” How about the rich Muslim oil sheikdoms right next door to Syria?? F**k me!

      • Bonkim

        They know Muslims are trouble more so where there are other Muslims.

    • SunnyD

      I was going to write you a rebuttal but can see that everyone’s already done a far better job than I would and you have yet to answer any salient points made against you.
      Your pic made me smile though :)

      • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

        There has been no rebuttal. Just uncaring, ignorant prejudice.

        My pic? What’s funny about it. Do tell.

        • SunnyD

          you ignored Cyril Sneer’s requests for citations and your pic just looks, I don’t know, amusing.

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            In what way amusing?

          • SunnyD

            goodness paddy, you’re more hung up on what I think of your inane smile than what might happen to your fellow countrymen if we’re left to contend with millions of economic chancers from backwardistan. You should get your priorities in order, but do keep smiling :)

          • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

            Your abuse certainly fits. Your opinions are offensive. You lack understanding or emotional intelligence. You resort to insults rather than reasoned argument. Yep, that’s the sort of chap who’d think it smart to comment negatively on how (in your eyes) I look. In short you are the archetypical social media troll.

        • Cyril Sneer

          “There has been no rebuttal. Just uncaring, ignorant prejudice.”

          What tosh. The ignorance Paddy is coming from you.

          We can see that you’re blissfully unaware of the demographics of this invasion or where most of them are coming from. You blindly moralise without the facts at hand.

        • Bonkim

          Carefully thought out cause and effect analysis is not prejudice.

    • PaD

      Have you heard of Cologne? How about the Bataclan..Malmo?
      Syrian people could gave veen helped in their own country.. after all it was easy for nutjob Blair andthe yanks to invade a whole f..cking country..there could have been a military action to establish a safe zone in syria..but there wasnt was there? Address that instead of guilt tripping everyone who YOU think is wrong

    • Patricia

      Only a small percentage are Syrian – most are from Libya, Morocco, Somalia and even Pakistan and other countries who are not “war-torn”. They have passed through safe countries en route where they would be been grateful to stay had they been genuinely running away from horror. The 6,000 or more strong, fit young men at Calais are not fighting for survival – just take a trip to Calais. Paddy, and see for yourself.

      • Bonkim

        Why should they miss out on a good thing? No discrimination.

    • Bonkim

      Syrians in danger could have walked the shorter desert route to Saudi Arabia and the Gulf States where they would be with their compatriots and not risk drowning and the long march through the swamps of Europe. Also no problem with language and religious/legal practices.

    • andersm0

      You are ill-informed, whether through slack disregard for obtaining facts or deliberate obfuscation of truth, I don’t know. Go to the UN’s website and follow the links until you get to the hard factual data on the demographics of Europe’s so-called refugees. These numbers jump out at you. First, 75% are males. 18% are children and 6% are women. Second, fewer than 50% are Syrians. Throughout history refugees have been desperate families fleeing for their lives. You know, mom, dad and the kids. And throughout history there’s another truism – the march of young single men into foreign lands is coincident with invasion and conquest.

      • http://www.brandaware.co.uk/ Paddy Briggs

        You just don’t get it do you? My post was about Syrians. The fact that there are refugees from other countries is true. But I wasn’t writing about them specifically. You use grossly offensive language, cheap jibes and selective simplistic statistics and rhetoric to try and justify your lack of compassion. And your final grotesque “truism” sentence is scraping the barrel of prejudice and bias with its faux historical justification – which is nothing of the sort. Just awful

        • andersm0

          I’m calling out hard facts and feel nothing but irritation for your whimpering over wounded feelings. How about compassion for the beleaguered citizens of Europe being trampled in the onrush of economic migrants living off welfare benefits while they colonize in the name of Islam? What’s your level of compassion for non-Muslim women and young girls terrorized by Islamic hatred of female infidels? How about our kids? Any compassion for the young girls being passed around like a box of crackers to be raped and prostituted by Islamic gangs? Or, does your heart only beat for the invaders who’re the forerunners of the third wave of Islamic conquest over Europe?

    • WTF

      Now here’s the thing, when two parties are in a discussion and one asserts a claim that the other disputes, the one who asserts has a burden of proof to justify or substantiate that claim. The burden of proof here is clearly yours as you made the assertion but you have provided no proof. Your assertion is from blatant ignorance and cannot be assumed to be valid for that very reason.

  • SimonNorwich

    The German argument that we need more workers to support an aging European population not only makes no sense in view of the high youth unemployment rates in Southern Europe; it doesn’t make any sense with regard to either our long-term future or the immediate future of the countries from which the immigrants are pouring. For who is going to support a newly increased current workforce when THEY get older? Do we keep increasing the population indefinitely? And who is going to look after the older generation in the countries from which they have emigrated? The whole scheme is madness and highly irresponsible.

  • SimonNorwich

    The German argument that we need more workers to support an aging European population not only makes no sense in view of the high youth unemployment rates in Southern Europe; it doesn’t make any sense with regard to either our long-term future or the immediate future of the countries from which the immigrants are pouring. For who is going to support a newly increased current workforce when THEY get older? Do we keep increasing the population indefinitely? And who is going to look after the older generation in the countries from which they have emigrated? The whole scheme is madness and highly irresponsible.

    • Core Macro

      These migrants will get jobs in Europe eventually and send money back to their families, at some point they will will return home like the Polish are doing in the UK, possibly just move back and forward as necessary.
      LOL!

      • Mr B J Mann

        Yeah!

        There’s loadsa third gen Muslims going “back” to Syria, Libya………

        Not so many first and second gen ones though, except to bring back wives for their kids!

    • Mike

      Also, if more bodies are needed, why not operate with a selection scheme like in Canada or Australia?

      Lots of Philippinos, Indians and Vietnamese would be happy to join: they don’t all have to come from the same place.

  • Bernard101

    What’s happened is similar to science fiction plots. Last year radical Islam kidnapped Frau Merkel and replaced her with a lookalkike in the German parliment. Since then the lookalike has set about the task of destroying Europe. She’s making a good fist of it, aided and abbetted by Europeans.

    Saladin must be rolling in his grave. He tried to take Christendom by the sword, but all he really needed to do was create a “refugee” crisis. This is not immigration, it’s an invasion.

    Meantime, the real Frau Merkel is being held in a cave in the Tora Bora, with a shower of Guardian readers. G-d help the woman.

    • PaD

      This is truly like Invasion of the BodySnatchers..the left elites have had something rewired in their brain..and to me they have become malevolent and scary..unless they are stopped its lights out over europe..and uk

    • Mike

      That explains everything. I had previously thought that it was a brain transplant, but this makes more sense. Thanks!

  • itsthepatriarchy

    The EU is actually the subject of a ‘takeover mission’ … by Berlin. But… we must stay in, so our (meaningless) voice is heard… heard by Berlin, who has no intention of listening to anything.

    https://itsthepatriarchy.wordpress.com

    • WarriorPrincess111111

      I was reading about the Suez Canal crisis in Wikopedia – where the intervention of both Russia and the US prevented what could have been WWIII, In 1952, France and Germany were engaged in talks, both France and Germany are reported as stating that they would each obtain their own Nuclear Weapons, and Germany stressed how they wanted to be the Third Power! Just after those talks, the talks for the EEC began – the precursor to the EU??
      Makes you think!

  • Yorkman99

    The EU is all about sharing. They want to share our wealth and share with us their immigrants.

    • Bonkim

      Regardless of the EU and sharing hungry locusts will march in and destroy everything in sight.

  • Mike

    The only way that they could reverse it at this point would be by doing things that violate “human rights”, though they would make “common sense”. Examples:

    1) Determining country of origin by accent and looks. It should usually be possible to get it down to a small number of possibilities.

    2) Bribing said countries to not interfere with the deportations of their putative citizens. If they end up in the wrong country, they can sort it out later.

    3) If impossible to bribe them and they refuse landing to DeportAir planes, send them back by the boatload.

    4) Run DeportAir pretty much on a regular schedule: flights leaving Tuesday and Thursday to Algeria, Monday, Wednesday and Friday to Somalia, etc. All planes leave full.

    5) You’re entitled to a hearing prior to deportation, to avoid things like mistaken identities. It happens within the month, which you spend in detention. Then it’s straight from detention to DeportAir.

    6) Really can’t figure it out? You go to detention for up to 5 years. If you’re willing to put up with that, you’re probably for real, or at least tenacious enough to let you stay. If more than 5% tough it out, increase it to 10 years.

    I’m not even saying that these methods are desirable.

    What I’m saying is that absent this style, they’ll never deport more than a token number/year.

    • Bonkim

      human rights was an invention of the post WW2 affluent nations – means nothing where you have difficulty feeding yourself.

      • Mike

        Pretty much what Lee Kwan Yew said, and frankly, he looks more intelligent by the minute.

        • Bonkim

          Mr Yew got results. Wait until the population bulge hits Britain soon – mainly from minorities that think God asked them to multiply and take over the earth.

  • Bonkim

    Do Lemmings have ears?

  • Pretty_Polly

    Hello,

    My name is David Cameron and my aim is to destroy Britain as you know and love it.

    That is why I have admitted over 1 million migrants and asylum seekers in the last 12 months alone, why I support Turkey’s EU membership and why I have done virtually nothing to stop illegals entering the country and remaining forever. I will of course repeat these policies this year and every year during my premiership. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHqRtLeI_pE

    Up and down the country, I am told that my plans are working perfectly as people find they are becoming ‘Strangers Where They Live’ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/9831912/I-feel-like-a-stranger-where-I-live.html and I am delighted my Defence Minister, Michael Fallon, has told me that our towns and cities are being enrichingly ‘swamped with immigrants’ http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/26/british-towns-swamped-immigrants-michael-fallon-eu

    As the ‘Heir to Blair’, I am proud to be continuing the pro immigration policies adopted by my close friends in the Labour Party and to be able to develop such ideas to extinguish ‘Britishness’ wherever it may be found. That is why I have abolished many of the planning rules in order to build huge anonymous new towns and cities in what was the unnecessary and socially divisive English countryside http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3463832/Couple-discovered-300-000-dream-cottage-soon-surrounded-700-home-estate-hearing-neighbour-walked-dogs.html

    I will soon be holding the long awaited confirmation of my views and opinions that Britain should remain an EU member forever and I will personally ensure that the Remain campaign is full of lies, threats and propaganda to obtain the highly desirable Remain outcome, thereby wiping the floor with a blonde haired mop. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Johnson

    As you will understand from the foregoing, I am extremely excited about the forthcoming abolition of Britain and ‘Britishness’ by the enrichers and by my friends in the European Union who have assured me that a new name has already been decided for these very small inconsequential islands…

    Consequently, to further the re-writing of British history and the destruction of British traditions, they have chosen ‘EU Sector North West’ which must now be written below your postcode or your mail will no longer be delivered.

    God Save The President of the EU Commission. Rule Jean Claude Juncker.

    Yours sincerely

    David Cameron

    Governor General EU NW – Designate.

  • pooh

    We are all pawns in a very dangerous plan. Google redgreenalliance.com

  • Bodkinn

    If you inform someone living freely in your country that they are on a list to be deported without first taking them into confinement you must expect them to do a vanishing act. I would in their shoes.

  • WTF

    Stay or remain,
    the future is uncertain BUT there is one certainty, if we stay, being
    part of the EU we cannot rule ourselves, make our own trade agreements
    or control our borders.

    We cannot affect our prosperity, we
    cannot control our benefit costs, we cannot proactively react to export
    opportunities, in effect, our lives & future are controlled by an
    un-elected Council of Ministers who use 28 member state MEP’s to act as
    clerks to rubber stamp their directives.

  • avi15

    We are witnessing the end of European civilisation – not with a bang but a whimper.

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