Immigration: The BNP are Winning and Britain is Losing

Ken Simpson

"Personally I think it would be grand if more people wanted to move to Britain."

I'm sure but the majority do not agree with you. Are you going to force your views down the throats of the majority while celebrating the "boon for freedom" in eastern europe? Of course you are.

Sir Graphus

It’s a tricky issue, Alex, and I suspect you spent ages on the phrasing to ensure you said nothing that could be twisted into racism, just as I am.

If I may be so bold, Scots, even well travelled fellows such as yourself, are often a great deal more liberal on immigration than the English, because nearly all the immigration is to a small number of places in England, and Scotland is still characterised by some very wide open spaces. The South of England is not like this.

Your market forces theory works, but immigration will only stop when Britain is a worse dump than the place the immigrants wish to leave. So until Tooting is a less desirable place to live than downtown Karachi, or Somalia, the immigrants will still come. There are many non-racists who would like immigration to stop before this point.

You also seem to subscribe to the “no obvious upper limit” camp; this ignores the small matters of food security, & social cohesion. And I haven’t mentioned the T-word or the M-word.

Bunnykins

Alex, I can't decided whether "Personally I think it would be grand if more people wanted to move to Britain" is arrogance or ignorance. Too quiet for you up in the unspoiled Scottish Borders is it?

Grassmarket

I hate to keep bringing this up but your paeans of praise for multi-culti Europe would be so much more credible if they were coming from Handsworth, Rijswijk or Aubervilliers rather then rural Selkirkshire.

Theresa

Its got nothing to do with "winning" or losing" and its dishonest of you to use such emotive language to suggest that it is. Its more to do with whether our schools, universities, hospitals, social services, housing stock, sewage system, transport system, waste disposal and GPs can cope. Businesses want to import more customers and cheap labour and economic migrants arrive uninvited to "improve their lives" but that doesn't provide any benefit to the resident population who have to shift up to make more room for them in every sphere of their lives. And quite frankly, a lot of immigrants aren't very nice and they certainly don't thank us for our generosity or hospitality.

Magpie

Intra-EU migration is one thing as it goes both ways, what people object to is migration from the third world, and this gives us the worst of all worlds - they tend to be uneducated, live on benefits, bring in huge families, change the face of the area and tend not to return home. Yes to Eastern Europeans, no to Somalians and Pakistanis.

Desperate Dan

Grassmarket how right you are. The self-regarding Billy Bragg, from the comfort of his rural idyll in Dorset, is another one who like to exhort us urban peasants to embrace multi-culturalism.

MikeF

'Immigration' is not the issue. It is the denigration of established British identity in the name of 'diversity'. That is what makes people angry and why some people - not me - vent that anger by voting BNP.

terence patrick hewett

The whole point of the BNP is that the working classes have found something that scares the giblets out of the political classes and success breeds success, so expect more of the same. The BNP was turned from a party of no account to a party with significant local and European presence by the success of the Fabian model within the Labour party. And its prescription is the prescription we have today in government: top down, bureaucratic, managerial, pseudo-technocratic, elitist, middle class and authoritarian. They believe that the people should be treated kindly, but are fit only to be run by competent experts, i.e. themselves. The political classes are having great difficulty in realising that this model, with its attendant state control, suppression of individual rights and radical social engineering has failed through its own inefficiencies, lack of demographic representation and through technological advances in communication.

The BNP will not fail through internal flaws or through external attack but because the Labour Party itself is about to change: whimsically it is the revenge of William Morris. Bankrolled by the unions, Morris’s bottom up concept of socialism, with its concern for the family, mutuality, toleration and respect for creed and conscience, is likely to take control and the Fabians put to the sword. This is likely to become the over-riding ethos of future left wing politics and may prove to be surprisingly popular.

Victor Southern

Comments here are perfectly right - mass immigration will not stop because the country becomes poor and unpleasant to live in. You can see this very obviously in Africa where people abandon their freedom to starve in their bush villages and move in shanty towns near major cities, places where shacks are built of cardboard, plastic sheeting and third hand corrugated iron. Those townships have no sanitation, proper schools and the nearest hospitals are miles away by foot. To those people a London slum would class as Nirvana especially when they are given a free dwelling, free local medical care, schooling for their children and an income for life.

Rhoda Klapp

Can I come and live in your house? If I like it, can I bring the rest of the family? (If you don't find it convenient, well, I'll take that into consideration. You may be required to make a few changes to accommodate my needs, culturally.)

TomTom

Scotland has lots of room for immigrants but noone wants to live there. It is a giant welfare zone akin to East Germany or the Mezzogiorno.

Augustus

According to the BNP, even taxi drivers are now accused of being racist when they display signs saying: 'English Speaking'.
And if, as they say, the Equalities Commission is out to destroy them 'by the back door' through protracted court cases, and when Harriet Harman shares a platform speaking on a 'progressive agenda to stop the Right in 2010' with an Islamic extremist, Azad Ali, who defended Islamic terrorist groups, one has to wonder who really is defending Britishness, and who really are the fanatics.

Paul

All the articles seem loaded against the
BNP ! People of all cultures are sick of
the Liblabcon arguments !
The BNP is saying what people are feeling,
Labour policy of SOCIAL ENGINEERING is
not what Britain wanted

Manxman

If you think mass immigration is so fantastic, why not move to somewhere like Peckham in South London. There are lots of huge grand old Victorian houses, a nice park and easy access to the city centre. Bring your kids with you and send them to the Academy At Peckham which has had £26 million invested in it and where your children will benefit from being schooled alongside the 92% or so of the pupils who are black and many of whom only speak English as a second language. They'll be so gratefull to you! Bring your parents and Grandparents. They'll really love the vibrancy and the excitement of day to day life in an area with some of the highest levels of street crime in Europe. You must be really suffering up there in mono cultural boring all white Scotland. Poor you!

Fergus Pickering

Alex, why do you suppose state schools in Britian have got so much worse in the last thirteen years? How do I know they have got worse? There are international comparisons and we gave gone down in all of them. Does it matter? I think it does? Why has it happened? It could be that children are getting stupider. It could be that teachers are getting worse. It could be - and this is the one I plump for - that the schools are full of children who cannot speak English and everything goes to buggery. What do you think, Alex? Do you care? I don't suppose Scotland suffers much because the immigrants who can't speak English don't get to Scotland, do they?

James D

This isn't helped by programmes that should know better (such as last night's Newsnight, where the only rational person on there was a rather pompous asparagus farmer, whom no doubt they deliberately selected so that he would come across a posh buffoon) broadcasting 45 minutes of Little Englander scaremongering, whilst they paid no attention the the whistleblower's allegations of racism and a systematic failure to grant valid applications in the UKBA's Cardiff office a few weeks ago. This is unashamed BNP/Labour-serving bias masquerading as news.

ndm

Another great post from Mr. Massie. It is sad, however, to see the commentariat at the Spectator so beholden to the bigtory masquerading as Nationalism that was such an unfortunate part of the early 20th Century history of the British right.

Boudicca

I want a Government which pledges to send back those people who shouldn't be here because they are failed asylum seekers, have entered illegally, overstayed their visas or have committed crimes and should be deported.

I don't think that's unreasonable. Those who have come here legally should of course stay.

I actually don't trust any of the main parties to carry out repatriation of people who have no right to be here. Whilst I don't intend voting BNP, if it came down to a choice of voting BNP to stand a chance of getting rid of a Labour MP in my constituency, that's exactly what I'd do. I will never forgive Labour for what it has done to the country of my birth.

Janice

I hope the BNP get more support in the coming years if only to knock some of the arrogance of the author and similar "journalists" who have destroyed the UK with their liberal agendas.
All the worse that this one doesn't even live in an "enriched area" in the UK but still seems to think he is qualified to comment.

C Wade

The BNP did not jump on the band wagon, they followed it for years your "GOON" mates are the ones who have jumped on the band wagon
the BNP have support becuase unlike you most of the country agree with them. That is the ones who have not been brainwashed liek yourself and the rest of the liberal left "GOONS" so stop crying and have a bet on how many BNP candidates will be in parliament this year.

Dave Thomas

You're looking at this from the wrong angle. I don't see Britain as my workplace which I can simply leave if I get fed up. It's my home, my family, my roots and my culture. How is my locality so greatly enriched by a mosque complete with no-go zones for local people?

ndm

A tip for those who support the goals of the BNP but don't want to be considered mouth-foaming racists. Don't write:

-- You must be really suffering up there in mono cultural boring all white Scotland.

Roger Clarke

"One of the odder aspects of contemporary politics is the amount of attention lavished upon the goons at the BNP"

Seriously can you please desist from this moronic, abusive mantra. It is so boring, and surely you can see that in purely tactical terms it is, from your POV, completely counter-productive?

What would Orwell have said of this imbecilic parroting of received opinion?

Mass immigration has torn us apart socially - we never used to talk bollocks such as "community cohesion".

Economically it has proved a less than unalloyed blessing. The HOL Select Committee found no benefit. Neither did Bob Rowbotham, neither did Terry Coleman who pithily observed that the net "benefit" amounted to no more than 1 Mars bar/week each.

But now that the spiv, shareholder value, speculating obscenity has blown up what do we find.....why GDP/capita has decreased!

Well it will decrease a hell of a lot further the more we are "enriched".

But the charge I would lay at your door Massie is that you are boring.

Whatever you do, just don't bore me ok?

Avudale

"the expansion of the EU eastward has been a boon for freedom"

A boon for those newly enveloped by the former-communist East, but not for us in Britain.

"the more barren this country's economic prospects the less appealling the UK will be to workers from abroad"

That's a quite simplistic interpretation, if you don't mind me saying, of people's motivations and very basic economics. People don't stop coming because the economy is in a downturn.

Immigration under Labour was never based on need, but based on a forced desire to change the ethnic makeup of this country. A Marxist Nightmare, the Socialist Trick.

Someone living in dire poverty cares not for a British recession, they'll come regardless.

Britain loses its culture and its ability for its hospitals, schools, housing, climate change commitments, police, etc etc, to function properly under the weight of immigrants.

This country is being sunk faster every year.

slipx

The BNP is the only party that has consistently told the truth about immigration.

I would not vote for them but this is a fact.

Rhoda Klapp

Oh, another thing. If I'm supposed to have benefited from immigration by a Mars Bar a week, I wanna know what's happened to them all. Can I have them deep-fried?

Roger Clarke

Rhoda Klapp

Well I fear that your additional Mars Bar opportunity is no more as a result of the GDP/capita drop between 2005-10, enrichment notwithstanding.

"George Osborne says voters are £281- each worse off in 'broken economy'" Guardian

This being the case and assuming that a Mars bar cost 40p it would seem that our "Scotch feelosopher" Massie - as Cobbett would have put it - owes us all 700 Mars bars each.

We would have to undertake to supply our own pans and oil and batter for deep-frying purposes I suppose.

Beer Moth

"One of the odder aspects of contemporary politics is the amount of attention lavished upon the goons at the BNP."

Yeah Doc, absolutely swamped with BNP/immigration issues in the media. Ram it down our throats they do these hacks.

Please let's return to the really crucial stuff as seen from the multiculti hotchpotch which is the Scottish Border region.

Dame DeVille

I live and work in Croydon just about as rich a mixture of people from all over our planet as you will find anywhere.

The people I work with reflect that mix - i've even got muslim colleagues who are my friends (gasp of horror from the folks who comment on here).

I think it is fantastic, I love it. My colleagues are hard working, bright, interesting and fun. We had the best Christmas party this year I ever had.

It is when I go home on the tram that I get depressed; those idle, rude, aggressive white trash pushing their prams, track suited men leering in their baseball caps; hideous and scary.

For me mass immigration is the best thing that has happened to this country.

We work closely with a British Technology Company, great product, export earners, cutting edge. Danish Boss, Iranian, Indian, South African, Chinese - some are British now and proud of it others just like it here.

I dunno why so many commenters here are so angry about it - I remain happy and proud to be English, none of this makes me feel remotely threatened or cross.

Mono Culture, Mono Racial 1950s Croydon? No Thanks!

Noa Zrk

Nice to see that the long promised Neather debate has finally stormed into the epages of the Speccie.
I have to say I hadn't quite expected the spin you'd put on it though Alex. Obviously living in Selkirk adds a finely honed objective dispassion to your powers of analysis on this secondary matter.

Jonathan B

Coventry has refurbished hundreds of council houses, complete with furniture... even net curtains so no one can see in and guess what.. they have filled the whole lot with Somalian immigrants... none of them work.
They were brought here for a purpose... to vote Labour and keep them in power.
It is a rarity to see a white person in the centre of Coventry during the daytime.
No wonder our rates have doubled since Labour took office... we pay their rates.

JohnBUK

Perhaps the problem for us "goons" is that we have never had a say on immigration nor on the "European Law" that says we should abide by all this. Talk is cheap and we've had plenty of that from everyone bar those who have been personally affected by massive unmanaged immigration. The time has come to stick two fingers up to the Islington elite and suggest if they want more immigrants they should open their spare bedroom and take a dozen each. No doubt they'll shut up then.
There seems little difference between any of the three main parties and as such a large number of voters have been disenfranchised for the past 13 years - and it's not going to change anytime soon.
Lastly, the country is up shit creek without a paddle by any measure and the BNP didn't cause any of it.

Dirty Euro

If the English do not want to so many people moving to England they should not have gone around conquering poor people and then getting angry, when they move here.

Horry

Don't you believe it! Firstly, the BNP party is not made up of goons,
there are plenty of them in every party, plenty in the general
public. If more good people had the guts to vote BNP they
could start to improve/correct those attitudes they feel are wrong.
You don't have to suddenly become a dastardly racist just because
you vote BNP.

Richard Greene

Dame Deville, an 'inverted racist' is still a racist. You'll find that the 'white trash' exist so people like you, can work in offices like you, making money out of their social control. Its these people, social workers, solicitors, probation officers, teachers, that scare me more! A 'balance' of people is a good thing like the old coke advert, unfortunately this equilibrium rarely lasts and that's when the interesting time's start.

Dan``

i hope the BNP win lots of elections... and i wish people would write reports whixch have less bias.

Noa Zrk

"If the English do not want to so many people moving to England they should not have gone around conquering poor people and then getting angry, when they move here".

Complete rubbish as I'm sure you know, Dirty Euro. I really can't remember when I last invaded anyone, or having invaded them, left the place peacefully,oh yes and richer and better governed than when I went to it.
Which is more than can be said of the many people who have come to live here uninvited and at my and your expense.

Amanda

Well how wrong you are, times have changed and yes we WILL be voting BNP, enough is enough, and they have won me over. I'm sick and tired of Labour/Conservative crap while they sit in their ivory towers and have no idea what it's like living on the ground seeing your country being destroyed.

Allan Sharp

I shall be voting for the BNP because I'm seeing this 'enrichment' right before my eyes and I don't want it, wasn't consulted and I'm not sure that there could ever be a sustainable argument for allowing an advanced nation to be invaded by the people who make the 3rd-world the vibrant place that it is and has always been. I joined the BNP and, guess what: no nazis, no skinheads, no oiks - just people who are frightened by what the Establishment's parties are doing to their homeland.

Emma Royds

You're wrong there, Alex. BNP didn't hijack the debate on immigration. They started it only nobody would listen. Instead we got the warcry of racist/islamophobe/goons in the hopes that it would frighten people from voicing their views on unfettered immigration and damaging multiculturalism. I hope there is a big swing to BNP and UKIP because if we don't, we will never get the chance to undo the damage done to Britain and especially England which hosts most of the unwanted immigrants.

davidke

Why don't more Brits go and work in Romania, and take all their jobs ? That'll show em. And they'll be entitled to Romanian child benefit and everything.

Roger Clarke

For me mass immigration is the best thing that has happened to this country.

That's nice Dame DeVille

It would have also been nice if we'd been asked.

How come we have never been so "enriched" and yet we have never been so bankrupt?

I wonder who is committing all these rapes. Perhaps the regime would like to supply a breakdown of ethnicity - or perhaps they wouldn't, likely not.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/rape-reports-surge-a-picture-of-horror-1910936.html

When that serial rapist of old ladies in London was nicked the Daily Stasi aka Mirror was pleased to put a "Terror Identikit" on its front page. It had long been known that the offender was from the West Indies but the Stasi's "identikit" looked like it had been lifted straight from the seventies "Black Panther" case.

The regime puts out a miasma of propaganda, spin and misinformation - they are in complete denial.

It will be like South Africa the way things are going.

Leeds Ian

This country needs a complete change of government style and direction.
We've become a nation of flabby-welfare funded non-workers who are bleeding dry the rest of us taxpayers.
It's a white underclass topped up with millions of illegal migrants and bogus asylum seekers.
We're full up to breaking point, and no-one seems to notice, no one seems to care.
The BNP is not he problem, but it might just be part of the answer.

michael

Integrated multiculturalism... if only.
The only people who continue to pedal this rubbish are like most pseudo-idealistic do-gooders (politicians), nimbys with a career to coddle.
Perhaps as part of the governments cultural training program, all immigrants should have to give a bullet point talk for delivery of a zoned focus creativity engaging an enlightened engenderment and an intensive empowerment agenda.
The very best of bullet point Britain...
or the point of a bullet?
It's a no-brainer.

ndm

Allen Sharp writes:

-- I joined the BNP and, guess what: no nazis, no skinheads, no oiks - just people who are frightened by what the Establishment's parties are doing to their homeland.

I strongly suspect that the vast majority of the people who joined the National Socialists in 1930s Germany had pretty much the same doe-eyed view.

Emma Royds

ndm, could it be that instead of being 'doe eyed' Allen Sharp is simply telling the truth and has met decent people like yourself who have had enough of Labour policies and the damage they have done? Look at the Labour's disgraceful record of socially engineering Britain to keep themselves in power? Would you vote for them now or would you vote for a party who is unafraid to speak out on the issues that concern so many?

Roger Clarke

Auschwitz survivor says new hate comes from????

"Judith's story reminds us of how important the fight against Nazism is today. Since 1980, over 20 people have been murdered by the Nazis in Sweden and we must never turn our back on them", said Mattias, who as well as Joel, will donate the money he received to Rättvisepartiet Socialisterna and its campaigns against Nazism and racism."

http://www.socialistworld.net/eng/2009/12/0701.html

And yet a few weeks after she is quoted as saying this.....

"This new hatred from a group 40,000-strong is focused on a small group of Jews," Mrs Popinski said, speaking in a sitting room filled with paintings and Persian carpets."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/sweden/7278532/Jews-leave-Swedish-city-after-sharp-rise-in-anti-Semitic-hate-crimes.html

steve

Cut the immigrants some slack! It's nice to see they have their own tv programme. I enjoy Crimewatch every week.

The Old Man

Alex Massie should be grateful the BNP do not have a better quality of leadership and a richer type of supporter. A well-funded, media-savvy party putting forward the BNP's views would, I am sure, tap into solid mass support.

angie cook

Does anybody recall? the titanic taking on more passengers as they were sinking? no.
Britain is now the Titanic, and its sinking fast, due to an overload of unwanted people and their baggage!

Lynda Davies

I live in the highlands of Scotland and, as of yet, the immigration deluge is not "in my face" as it is further south. However, it's in all our faces in regard to the pressure it's putting on our country's resources regardless of which part of our nation you live in. Personally, I'm sick of it and I want OUR country and OUR values back. Lab/Con have systematicalliy brought this country to it's knees. My Grandparents suffered due to their policies, I don't want anyones children to continue to suffer due to their policies. That's why I'm supporting and voting for the BNP. When I look at the BNP website it's like I've just woken up and smelt the coffee. I urge more people to do the same. I love the UK.

David Rowlands

The faltering economy in the last 2 years seems to have done little to deter immigration,if the most recent immigration figures are anything to go by. Proof that immigrants still find this country to their personal advantage - they are here to benefit themselves, not for the benefit of the indigenous Brits ( modern Tories will of course scoff at the very notion of native Britishness, so far have they travelled down the road of national treachery))You 'modern' Tories quantify everything in material and economic terms, therefore national ancestry, kinship and heritage, sovereignty are 'worthless in your materialist eyes - you are at one with the marxists in this, your difference being only to do with the means of ownership and distribution of wealth. Truth is, there's nothing British about the Conservative Party!

Roger Clarke

David Rowlands

"The faltering economy in the last 2 years seems to have done little to deter immigration,if the most recent immigration figures are anything to go by"

Sir Graphus dealt with this:

"Your market forces theory works, but immigration will only stop when Britain is a worse dump than the place the immigrants wish to leave. So until Tooting is a less desirable place to live than downtown Karachi, or Somalia, the immigrants will still come...."

Never-ending enrichment

"Taliban terror supporter sets up home in Birmingham"

"The Home Office said the men were in Britain legally and would be prosecuted if they committed any crimes."

http://www.sundaymercury.net/news/midlands-news/2010/02/28/taliban-terror-supporter-sets-up-home-in-birmingham-66331-25928424/

Perhaps Massie would welcome them as neighbours

Alan Walker

Alex Massie has got it wrong - immigration is NOT falling. More immigrants are coming into the country every day and we are told they benefit the country - rubbish. I have seen immigrants sitting begging in several cities - is that helping the country? Are people like Alphonse Semo and the Zwimbabwean who killed his children helping the country - they are costing the taxpayer hugely.
By the way, the BNP has a right to exist. They are an elected party and their views should be heard. They are NOT racist as the media brands them. Racism is a label pinned on anyone who dares mentions immigration.