Sarah Palin's Hubris: Thatcher Edition

Reg Stocking

A good friend once remarked that every form of craziness must be lived through. Current American politics is reminiscent of the 1850s, when the Whig Party flew apart and the Republican Party emerged. One faction of the former Whigs was called the Know-Nothings. The Tea Party is a descendant, and Mama Grizzly is a very suitable representative of the type.

PinkOne

A very happy Birthday to Baroness Thatcher from the US!

Sarah Palin is not fit for public service. Americans don't quit and do not vote for quitters!

I think she is far better suited as a political celebrity and wouldn't be surprised to see her appear on Dancing with the Stars!

Michael Kennedy

You obviously have no idea of the peculiarities of Alaska politics but that is to be expected. Many of us recognize what Sarah Palin was talking about and we hardly expected you to understand. Ronald Reagan was ridiculed as a has-been actor. American politics are very different from British and I suggest you study up.

willegge

Mr. Massie, the fact of the matter is Sarah Palin admires Mrs Thatcher, but also it has been reported that Mrs Thatcher wanted to meet her. I hope Mrs Palin will be the next leader of the free world. People like you will never concede that she has goodness, talent, or success, no matter what she does. You have your template set in stone, but I can only wish that you will be humiliated by her election , and I believe you will.

Ronnie

I have to say Alex, from the quotes supplied, I can't see where Ms Palin is comparing herself to Margaret Thatcher. She certainly praises her as many others do.

Can't we just agree that the ex-Governor of the great state of Alaska is an interesting candidate but unelectable, on a national scale, and leave it at that? I'd prefer you didn't give her any more publicity.

We know very well that you only posted this to annoy Cabbie.

normanc

I'd love to see Palin as President.

Not for any political reason, but to see leftists explode like the children in that 10:10 video such will be their righteous indignation and ire.

Beefeater

You are showing symptoms of Palin Derangement Syndrome.

The siren call of Mama Grizzly has sent you barking mad. Best we ignore your cries of anguish.

Pot Head

According to the recent excellent piece in VF :

"Early in the 2008 campaign, when John McCain's aides discovered that Alaska-size gaps existed in Palin's general knowledge (among those previously unreported: she had no idea who Margaret Thatcher was)"

Conservative Cabbie

I'm not biting.

Conservative Cabbie

...except to say:

Obama promised a summer of recovery, promised the people of Illinois he would not run for President during his first term as Senator, thinks America has 58 states,is leading his party to one of the biggest defeats in American political history and screwed up the stimulus. But hey, he's as smart as a button according to Alex.

Maybe, when someone thinks he's intelligent criticises someone else for not being intelligent whilst all the while stoutly defends another who has proven himself to be politically dumb, maybe we should not take his criticisms too seriously.

Bill Rees

Alex, you seem to have an unhealthy obsession with Sarah Palin.
She may or may not run for President, and, if she wins, she may or may not make a great President.
The fact is that it's often hard to predict who will do well, and who will crumble under the weight of the job.
I'm sure, 30 years ago, you would have been writing similar disparaging comments about Ronald Reagan.
I happen to believe that the current US President is clearly not up to the job, and I would vote for Palin over him on any day of the week. She showed some backbone in the way she dealt with the oil companies when she was the Governor of Alaska, and so far Mr Obama has shown no backbone when dealing with anyone.

ndm

To pick one of the Nutty Boys at random, Michael Kennedy writes:

-- You obviously have no idea of the peculiarities of Alaska politics but that is to be expected. Many of us recognize what Sarah Palin was talking about and we hardly expected you to understand. Ronald Reagan was ridiculed as a has-been actor. American politics are very different from British and I suggest you study up.

Frankly, who cares about the vagaries of Alaskan politics. Given the tiny population of Alaska - and its petrostate status - this is small town politics writ small. I'm sure there are some who recognize the insane ramblings of Sarah Palin. However, on the few occasions she has been pressed to explain her ramblings her pips have squeaked. Sarah Palin may be a smart celebrity but she is also a stupid and gutless coward when it comes to putting her ideas to the test. America would be no better served by her political prowess than it would be by that of Paris Hilton.

By the time he became President of the United States, Ronald Reagan had bee Governor of a huge state for eight years. By the time she became Prime Ministe, Margaret Thatcher had been an MP for 20 years. Sarah Palin's significant political achievement was quitting the Governorship of a barel-populated petrostate after two years. Sarah Palin is manifestly unqualified for the Presidency - and to compare her to Ronald Reagan or Margaret Thatcher is a grave insult to them.

Conservative Cabbie

ndm laughingly says:

"By the time he became President of the United States, Ronald Reagan had bee Governor of a huge state for eight years. By the time she became Prime Ministe, Margaret Thatcher had been an MP for 20 years. Sarah Palin's significant political achievement was quitting the Governorship of a barel-populated petrostate after two years. Sarah Palin is manifestly unqualified for the Presidency"

And Barack Obama had been a dial it in Senator for two years before he ran for President. I don't see the difference. Well, except one - Obama has manifestly proven that he is unqualified for the Presidency as the recent NYT magazine article proves. Quote

"He (Obama) realized too late that “there’s no such thing as shovel-ready projects” when it comes to public works."

It might have helped the state of Americas finances if he'd "realised" before he wasted billions of dollars on those projects. What does one expect from a politician who's political experience was either voting "present" in the Illinois assembly or turning up late for Senate committee hearings

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ah9W24oMIRc

ndm

Conservative Cabbie quotes:

-- He (Obama) realized too late that “there’s no such thing as shovel-ready projects” when it comes to public works."

Really? The country is flooded with overdue road reconstruction projects with signs declaring they were funded by ARRA money. They are even more uniquitous than the "EU Funded" signs that are ominpresent in rural Scotland.

ndm

Conservative Cabbie writes:

-- And Barack Obama had been a dial it in Senator for two years before he ran for President

By the time of his inauguration as President, Obama had been an Illinois State Senator for 6 years and a US Senator for 4 years - comprising 10 years of elective office. Conservative Cabbie is obviously not aware of the "rule" that you won't be elected President more than 14 years after first gaining elective office.

And Sarah Palin's major political experience? Quitting after 18 months - not even one term - as Governopr of Alaska. It beggars the imagination to think of the Wasilla Quitter facing up to someone like Khrushchev.

Christopher Chantrill

Now, now, how anti-woman can we get?

American women are deeply into celebrating each others' birthdays, and I am shocked, shocked that we are sneering at this authentic cultural observance.

Conservative Cabbie

ndm seems to be a little confused:

1.On the stimulus - I'm only quoting the NYT quoting Obama himself. Perhaps ndm should be telling Obama that all these shovel ready projects existed because he (now) doesn't think so.

2."comprimising 10 years of elective office". Hmmm. Not one of those years was spent running anything though. Unless you count his Senatorial office which I don't think counts as Presidential experience. And he was only Senator for two years before running for office - something he promised his voters he wouldn't do.

3.Obama didn't serve one term as Senator so I'm not sure of your point on Palin. Of course you conviniently allow Obama his time as state Senator but not Palin her time as mayor. Whilst Wasilla may not be as large as an Illinois district, being mayor does involve running things like budgets and not voting present consistently.

AGS

**Even Maggie's greatest or most misguided (the categories are distinct) enemies would not have considered her a shill for sweet-sounding but simplistic soundbites**

Do you not remember her sickening, unctuous allusions to St. Francis?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A23PQCndPYU

And why do you seem to construe quitting the Governor's position to become the currently MOST POWERFUL Republican a sign of weakness? Unlike Thatcher, Palin does not have to navel contemplate how people "at least" respect her, because she's got lots and lots of people who really like her.

KarenJ

"Of course you conviniently allow Obama his time as state Senator but not Palin her time as mayor. Whilst Wasilla may not be as large as an Illinois district, being mayor does involve running things like budgets and not voting present consistently."

----------------

Funny. That this thread has morphed, like so many others responded to by Palin apologists, into a faulty comparison between a failed VP candidate and a successful Pres. candidate.

Wasilla -- at the time Palin was its FIGUREHEAD mayor (6 months after she won the position, she was nearly recalled b/c she didn't know what she was doing; so she authorized hiring a city manager) -- had a population of between 5000 and 7500.

Barack Obama was State Senator for eight years. That means he represented a district in the State Senate of Illinois. That district, the 13th, is made up of people. How many people? That's hard to judge. But 45,486 people in that district voted for Obama in 1998.

Conservative Cabbie

Karenj

And now he's running a country of 300 million. He's about to lead his party to one of the biggest defeats in American political history, has created a stagnant economy, has mortgaged Americas future on a failed stimulus and is divisive as presidents can be. Maybe some experience of...you know...running things might have helped. Being responsible for a budget perhaps, having to work with a legislature.

I didn't realize that experience was quantified by how many people elected you. That's an interesting if bizarre concept. Personally, I prefer experience to be measured differently. Results for example. Obama achieved very little as state senator. Palin on the other hand grew Wasilla so that today, it is twice the size it was when she became mayor. How about principle? As governor, Palin reduced Alaska's sucking at the federal teat, she did away with the perks of the job, turned down pay rises and despite her social conservatism favoured constitutional governance when it clashed with her own religious values. Obama? He golfs and goes on holiday.

Ronnie

Khruschev!!!??? What's he got to do with the price of fish?

Baron

Conservative Cabbie @ 12.36 sums it up well, Palin does resonate with those people who made America great before community organisers popped up screwing things up. The only thing the Americans can hope for now is that they’ll still have some change left when the articulate but out-of-his-depth messiah departs.

like normanc @ 6.57 I, too, would vote for her, for the same reason, preferably without the instant explosion, witnessing the prolonged howling of the pseudo-liberal fruitcakes would be priceless.

Beefeater

What is so wrong with being a "quitter"? Palin had good reasons for resigning. Bill Clinton should have resigned after impeachment, but did not. The thought of being labeled a "quitter" was far worse than being labeled a "liar". And given the perks of presidency, one can see why. Presidential terms are limited anyway. Seeing the job through means coming downstairs into the Oval Office after breakfast for four years. Does it really weigh with voters whether or not a candidate will quit that? Even habitual quitters are very likely to stay the Presidential course. I would scratch "not a quitter" from my check list of desirable traits. Move onto "can quit addiction to taxing".

Viper1

I'm one of the "deluded" who managed to pull the wool over the eyes of a lot of morons who actually let me fly a $45,000,000 fighter for 10 years.

I managed to meet Governor Palin in 2009. Other than catching a few minutes of clips of her campaigning, I knew nothing about her and shamefully assumed she was the dunce people like you
and Claire Belinsky (whoever she is) portray her to be. I was somewhat surprised when I spent about 10 minutes with her while participating in exercises with the Alaskan ANG that she was articulate and not only more informed about national defense, foreign affairs, and the economy than you can believe, she was more informed about these matters than you could imagine.

I will let you contemplate a few line from "Henry V" . The young king had been presumed by the King of France to still be the feckless punk he was only a few years before assuming the crown--a pretentious dolt more suited to childish games than matters of state.

Like the Dauphine, you and your ilk see only what you wish to see about Palin--a snapshot that has not been altered by time. You are like the blind man who feeling the trunk of an elephant says,
"I see, an elephant is like a snake." You presume recklessly that Palin has learned nothing the past two years and so as Henry told the Dauphine's herald, one might say about your dismissal (with prejudice) of Palin,

"We understand him well, that he comes o'er her with her younger days, not measuring what use she made of them.

And to your ridicule of the woman this shoe seems a perfect fit:

"Your jest shall savor of shallow wit,
When thousands weep more than did laugh at it.:

Rhoda Klapp

Viper1, you are spoiling this debate with actual facts and personal knowledge. And you must know they won't work on sufferers from Palin Derangement Syndrome such as our host.

Conservative Cabbie

viper1

Very nicely said.

ndm

viper1 writes:

-- she was articulate and not only more informed about national defense, foreign affairs, and the economy than you can believe, she was more informed about these matters than you could imagine.

viper1 can speak to his own imagination but everything I've seen about Sarah Palin has shown that I lack the imagination to understand who little she knows. The reality is that if she were such a deep thinker she would be able to spend more than a sentence talking about something without going into an insane ramble. But then she reads all the newspapers, likes all the Supreme Court Justices - she just knows everything.

Ronnie

Viper1.

Please give us example of what she actually said to you. Evidence please.

Viper1

Re:NDM. Noted. With respect to your second-observations I would suggest you are experiencing "inattentive blindness"; that is, you are so "channelized" on certain aspects of your perceptions of Palin, you are literally blind to others. Second, you are mistaking being very knowledgeable about something with profundity. The former suggests the possession of fact; the latter deep insight. An autistic person can possess encyclopedic knowledge about something and yet not be at all capable of insite.

If you find Palin completely incomprehensible, perhaps the fault lies with you, just as the fault probably lies with me that I found your response garbled and momentarily confuisng.

Re: Ronnie: I believe you're asking for an example. Evidence is a legal term.

As I said, we (myself, crew chief, and two other team members) spoke for about 10 minutes. I expressed some envy for the F22 pilots and asked her what she thought about the Senate killing the Raptor program. She said one of the biggest problems was that it would put about 100,000 people out of work and some in just about every state where components were designed. On the other hand she felt the F35 would compensate and with the F22's now in service still allow America to keep its air Superiority.

She made some small talk with another one of our pilots who had served in South Korea at Kunsan. He believed Korea would be the next "hot spot" America would have to deal with. She said something like "You're not alone with that. China has a thousand or so missiles aimed at Taiwan and that's making a lot of folks antsy. She said there were three of our allies who were really nervous about China's military buildup--Australia, Japan, and India. One of the guys spoke of concerns about the chill between China and Japan and thought that was a potentially bigger problem for the U.S. and she said something along the lines of, "I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for China to give up its claims to some islands that both nations claimed as their own and that would inevitably lead to maritime disputes that could flare up."

I had to leave. A few other people approached her, shook hands, and I have no idea what they talked about.

It is astonishing to me that any reasonable individual could actually believe that any woman could rise to the position she has by being a zero.

Then again, there are countless uninformed people who will go to their graves thinking Bush was an idiot although he qualified to fly "Daggers" for the ANG--a "widow-maker" only the best pilots strapped on because it was so quirky. People think he qualified to fly for the Guard only because of his father's clout. Now THAT's a
really ignorant idea. I knew a three-star general's kid who washed out because he couldn't cut it and his father couldn't do anything about it.

I wonder how many people on this thread knew about the
territorial disputes between China and Japan. I didn't--or that there were Chines 1,000 missiles aimed at Taiwan.

Maybe she reads more than Katie Couric would have you think.

David Lindsay

Will Thatcher explain to Palin her lifelong support for abortion up to birth, which she ensured became the law of this land while she was Prime Minister, with her proxies specifically and repeatedly citing the existence of Down's Syndrome as the reason why it was necessary, as they still do?

And will Palin explain to Thatcher her admirable history as a Buchananite battler for job protection, for war aversion, for immigration control and for family values against the archenemy of all of them, the global "free" market, together with her record as Governor of Alaska on the basis of publicly administered natural resources held in common ownership?

They are both overrated. But Palin is the better of the two.

ndm

David Lindsay writes:

-- They are both overrated. But Palin is the better of the two.

I am not a particularly big fan of Margaret Thatcher but to describe her as overrated and to describe Sarah Palin as being better than her is utterly insane. Sarah Palin is nuts but she is a genius in comparison to those of her raving supporters who think she is better than Margaret Thatcher.