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Tuesday, 23rd September 2008

Brown's speech: live blog

Peter Hoskin 1:58pm

1400: Welcome to our live blog of Gordon Brown's conference speech.  No sign of the man yet - he's expected to take to the stage in around ten minutes time.  Early word is that his speech is going to be of the "personal vision" rather than the "specific policy annoucement" variety.  We can, though, expect some more details on that internet announcement.

Stay tuned, then, for my thoughts, as well as analysis from James and Fraser in the conference hall.  Just keep refreshing the page to get the latest.

1410: This just in from Jon Cruddas:

"We await the speech. Meanwhile rumours abound. My favourite- the existence of a Caroline Flint martyrdom video filmed by Hazel on a hand held in a Salford cave. In the hothouse of a conference this is being taken seriously.

Rumour number two: that David M only gave 60% yesterday for fear ‘of doing a Hestletine’- why the PM’s press guy was pushing this one around to the hacks last night is beyond me. Impressive calm response from David.

The ‘Spectator/Compass Middle Class Tax Cut’ is now almost official party policy.  I fully expect it to be the cornerstone of the PM’s speech. If I were Mr Osborne I would be worried, really worried.

Last night’s Guardian do was a lively affair – the standout moment was Mandelson/McDonagh/Ryan/Flint thing going on in the corner- the plot thickens. Retreated to the bar and then bed by 2ish. As I left I saw Tom Watson MP on manouvers- he is the PM’s top political guy and runs the whole conference. He is the only person I know who can sleep standing up; a legend.

Hopefully Gordon will nail the speech."

1415:
The TV cameras are spending a lot of time on David Miliband in the crowd - the leadership rumours really are threatening the overshadow Brown's speech.  No sign of Brown yet.  Expect him any minute now.

1420, James Forsyth: After Miliband’s failure to seize the moment yesterday, the stage is set for Brown. But it is crucial for Brown that he remembers that he is speaking to two audiences: the hall and the country at large. The faithful are going to love a litany of Labour achievements, the video they are playing is self-congulatory in the extreme, but the nation will want contrition and a recognition that things have gone wrong.

1423: Sarah Brown is addressing the crowd.  This is unexpected, and a little reminiscent of the American presidential race.  She introduces a video of "what Labour has achieved" so far.

1424, James Forsyth: Sarah Brown is introducing Gordon in an effort to humanise him. Sarah Brown is not someone who likes the limelight so this is a sign of how bad things are.

1427, James Forsyth: This self-congratulory video is touting the achievements of the Blair government not the Brown one.

1427, James Forsyth: Could Barack Obama have looked and sounded any less convincing than he did in that video?

1428: Here's Brown now.  His demanour: relaxed.  His tie: purple.  His teeth: luminous.  The applause seems warm.  He says "you can see why I'm proud of Sarah".  It would be sweet if it didn't feel like a desperate attempt to shore-up his beleagured premiership.

1428, James Forsyth: An almost Gore-style smooch for Sarah. Messsage: Gordon is passionate.

1430: Brown's really pushing the "I'm the best person to get us through the economic storm" message.  He says: "If some people say I'm serious.  Well, that's because there's lots to be serious about."

1434: "What happened with 10 pence, it stung me ... on the side of working families is the only place I've wanted to be. And from now on it's the only place a will be".  That sounds half-way like an apology to me.  Again, pushing the "let me get you through the hard time message".

1434, James Forsyth:
Delivery poor so far. The class card is being played early, another sign of how bad things are.

1434, James Forsyth:  Vicious—and unpleasant—swipe at Cameron, “my children are people not props”

1437, James Forsyth: A mea-culpa on 10p tax and then a self-interested warning that the public won’t put up with a Labour leadership race. So far, this hasn’t sung.

1438: "In the 1990s, Tony and I asked you to change policy to meet new challenges". Showy nod to Blair - maybe to appease the Blairites.

1440: First sign that the City should be scared.  "Those who believed in the unbridled free market have been proved wrong once again".

1443, James Forsyth: Brown tries to triangulate on big government/market fundamentalism. But everything so far sounds very 1990s. Brown could have given pretty much this speech anytime in the last ten years.

1444: Talking about the "green economy" now.  Hefty commitments: 80 percent reduction in carbon emissions; 1 million new jobs in the "green services industry" (CoffeeHousers, did I hear that right?).  As usual, it's all long-term commitments.  Nothing so far on how he'll help the UK - and its families - now.

1446, James Forsyth: They love that JK Rowling money. Indeed, Labour are clinging to her and the Olympics in a hope that some of their popularity will rub off them.

1449: Brown's peddling the "3 million new jobs" line - "lives changed ... 3 million times over".  As Fraser's pointed out before, some two-thirds of those jobs have gone to immigrants.  Meanwhile, 5 million in the UK are on benefits.  British jobs for British workers, he said last year...

1451, James Forsyth: A bit of passion accompanies the ‘not by accident but by our actions’ line. ‘The real power of Labour to change lives’ is not a bad line either.

1453: Brown talks of "lifting up those in the middle who want to get on" - does he have a measure for the middle classes in mind?

1457: And there's the "free nursery places for two year olds" pledge.  One we already knew about - details here.  Still waiting for a surprise.

1458, James Forsyth: Name-checking colleagues now on the fairness agenda. Harman, Ed Miliband, John Denham and John Hutton get a pat on the back. Now, we’re all waiting to see what he says about the other Miliband in the foreign section.

1500: Audience Watch: Is it just me, or is Jack Straw looking particularly nervous?

1501: He's moved on to the NHS - "we're the party of the NHS" etc.  He returns to the story of his rugby injury and - "what I didn't tell you last year" - the story of how the NHS helped when he started losing the sight in his other eye.  Brown's delivery doesn't make these personal interludes feel natural.  They seem as what they are: forcefully wedged in by No10.

1504: Policy annoucement: From next year, people suffering from cancer will not pay for prescription charges.  Brown seems to suugest this will eventually apply to everyone suffering from a long-term illness.

1505, James Forsyth: The crowd love the tribute to the NHS. He tells the eye story again but with added extras. It’s a powerful story but its deployment is another sign of how Brown is using anything and everything to try and prop himself up.  

1508: This just in from Fraser Nelson:

"When Sarah Brown came on stage, it looked for a glorious split second that there had been some last-minute leadership coup. But no, she was just introducing old Brown, back on typical plodding form. A huge smile at the start which vanished almost as quickly as that grin he practised for American Pop Idol.  So how does he get around the expectation for a good speech? By not even trying, and seeking to make a virtue out of his lack of verve. It’s like he decided from the start: I can’t do uplifting, inspiring speeches like Blair, Obama or other people who have won elections in their own right so I won’t even try. “Now let’s come straight to the point” he starts - at least, sparing us another of his Papal Nuncio jokes.

And then we’re off. “I was brought up seeing my parents juggle with their budget like the rest of us” – code: unlike Cameron and Osborne. He has a new phrase “people on middle and modest incomes” – something he’d know about, given how his taxes turned middle incomes into modest ones. “Those who argue for the dogma of unbridled free market forces have been proved wrong,” he said – like all those idiots in the Treasury from 1997 banging on about “light touch” regulation? Oh. Anyway.

Not very many Brownies, but this one is a bit rich:-“When we talk about three million more people in work since 1997, that’s not just a number. That’s a life that’s been changed – three million times over. That’s the young woman laid off in the mid 90s who’s now built a booming business of her own.” Actually that’s a Pole working his guts out, living on baked beans and stale bread, in pretty grim conditions. As I never tire of saying, 2m of those 3m new jobs are imported: accounted for by immigration. The remaining 1m are pensioners and public sector. There are fewer British-born people working today than in 1997. “When things get tough, things get tougher. We don’t give in and we never will” – code: I don’t give in. “I want to unleash on this country a new wave of social mobility” – shame he didn’t get this brainwave in 1997.

Okay, the script has arrived. It’s twenty pages – leaden, turgid, not even anything controversial enough to Fisk. All stuff like the above. For example, when he’s started going backwards on his child poverty target, he’s compensating for it by claiming to legislate for it. As if passing a bill will make it better. I just despair. It’s typical Brown: a laundry list without a narrative, only this time at least twice as long as it should be. It reads as if about 20 people submitted paragraphs, and instead of editing them down he kept them all in. I swear I can hear the applause fading, as if even the audience have realised they are in Room 101 territory – listening to a neverending Brown speech. I suspect even Blair, watching wherever he is, would have switched off halfway through on the basis that you only live once. If this speech was genuinely make-or-break, he’d be broken. But he’d get a standing ovation if he’d read the phone book (which, at times, it sounded like he was doing). “United we fall” is the unofficial theme of this conference."

1511, James Forsyth:
Brown does the tub-thumping ‘fight for’ stuff well, it’s the strongest part of the speech so far. But I think it goes over a lot better with the Labour faithful than the country at large.

1514: The first extended attack on the Tories, a (dubious) list of what the UK wouldn't have if the Tories were in power - "No investment in the NHS ... no independence of the Bank fo England ... no minimum wage." etc. etc.  Brown ends the list with: "We did fix the roof while the sun was shining".

1514, James Forsyth: A migrant charge for public services’. How is that going to work?

1515, James Forsyth: 'We did fix the roof while the sun was shining’, further evidence of just how much Osborne gets under Labour’s skin. He really is the Tory they love to hate.

1517: Here's the "same old Tories" attack proper.  Cameron's strategy is to "Change [the Tories'] appearance - to create the appearance of change".  Brown's also majoring on the "Tory spending cuts" theme - potentially boxing his own party into raised taxation or (more likely) raised borrowing, as the Exchequer's funds dry up.  Scorched earth, anyone?

1520, James Forsyth: ‘No time for a novice’, Brown says playing the experience card. He is sticking with the line that the Tories are hiding something. The Purnell ‘real thing’ approach would be more effective.

1521, James Forsyth: Brown delivers the easy hit on the Tory’s inheritance tax cut plan. Making the allowance transferable, effectively raising the threshold to £2 million is a political liability.

1524, James Forsyth: David Miliband gets the briefest of mentions and Brown makes clear that he is his boss. Considering what he said about other colleagues, this is going to be seen as a slap.

1526: "All the polls, all the headlines ... will all be worth it if I make life better for one child, one family, one community."  A line that 's just too cheesy to work.  And I suspect that not everyone in the party will be agreeing with his "it's all worth it" take on the situation...

1528, James Forsyth: He's doing the Hillary ‘this is not about me, it’s about you’ thing. She pulled it off better, though.

1528:
"Together we will win for the sake of our country."  And that's it.  Brown gets a stadning ovation and what sounds like hearty applause.

Round-ups from Team Coffee House

James Forsyth: That was a lot less good than I expected. He used everything he could to try and establish an emotional contract, to borrow a Stephen Carter phrase, with voters but to my ears it fell flat. The chances of Brown being ousted by Christmas just increased signficantly.

A super-smart friend texted me half-way through to say that ‘this is the speech he should have given last year’ and I think that’s right. The public don’t want to hear about Gordon the man, they want to know what he is going to do. He also missed an opportunity to show that he is the man for this new, uncertain world. This speech compares very poorly to Blair’s post 9/11 conference speech.

Peter Hoskin: 
 Even this speech's very, very best parts were mediocre - and they were few and far between.  Perhaps the biggest question hovering over it is: where's the beef?  Although some of his policy announcements will be welcomed - particularly those on prescription charges - none were particularly groundbreaking, and most were either recycled or timed for the far-flung future.

There was nothing here to tell the public that Brown is really the man to lead the country through the hard times; nothing to convince them that he will make today and the day after better for them. By extension, then, there was little to convince the Labour party that Brown should lead them into tomorrow.

In the end, I suspect no-one who thought Brown should go will have been swayed.  But some who thought he should stay may well be having second thoughts.

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Comments Post comment

dave, surrey

September 23rd, 2008 2:31pm Report this comment

so the video of 'what labour has achieved' was only 1 minute long..

Polly's mum

September 23rd, 2008 2:34pm Report this comment

14.34 I think I am going to be sick.
What a scumbag this man is.

Michael Hargrave

September 23rd, 2008 2:39pm Report this comment

More time spent applauding than speaking.

David

September 23rd, 2008 2:45pm Report this comment

This is dreadful; no content, no flair or style. Just slogans, vague or over-reaching promises, bad jokes and familiar phrases.

LSS

September 23rd, 2008 2:49pm Report this comment

Polly's Mum, I think you'll find that was small glimpse of the real Gordon Brown.

Michael Hargrave

September 23rd, 2008 2:52pm Report this comment

Tugging at the heart strings really do not do it for Gordon.

Mike. Brighton

September 23rd, 2008 2:52pm Report this comment

Truly awful, vapid, meaningless guff. What is Brown going to do TODAY????

Policywonk

September 23rd, 2008 2:53pm Report this comment

"My children are not props." This after just having been introduced by his wife!

Morice Mendoza

September 23rd, 2008 2:56pm Report this comment

Did anyone notice the lifting from Sarah Palin's VP speech - where Mr. Brown talked about not getting into politics to be part of the establishment but rather to serve the country? Very similar line from Mrs Palin in which she said she was not in politics to please the media elite but rather to serve the country/people etc. Seems he or his speech writer was influenced by the impressive right-winger from Alasaka.

mac

September 23rd, 2008 2:57pm Report this comment

"This just in from Jon Cruddas . . .' Same old, same old: situation excellent, j'attaque - only with an unreal plan and uninspired troops.

A thought . . . He is paying you to post these
fantasy burbles, isn't he? Honestly, the Millipede photos and the potted bios of the 'contenders' have been entertainment enough.

Michael Hargrave

September 23rd, 2008 2:58pm Report this comment

the audience are clapping, but all are glum.

GWG

September 23rd, 2008 3:05pm Report this comment

The mans got more integrity in his little finger than Cameron and Osbourne have in their imaginations.

Polly's mum

September 23rd, 2008 3:07pm Report this comment

13.05 Well so far he is going to sort out the world finances, cure the world's sick, bring world peace, and now seemingly world equality.
Is this really Gordon Brown or an imposter? He'll be promising us eternal life next.

Verity

September 23rd, 2008 3:09pm Report this comment

I understand from today's Telegraph that Brown has, in a wild flash of inspiration and daring, promised the old communist plan of "fairness for all". He sincerely does not understand how destructive Marxism is - and is intended to be.

Blair understood and relished it and used it to wreck our ancient country. Brown is too thick to grasp this:

Frankly, I don't want fairness and free money and services for bigamous, illegal "wives" of muslims. I don't want fairness for the legions of Pakistani babies born with genetic birth defects due to generations of incestuous first cousin marriages. Thirty-one percent of all birth defects in the NHS are Pakistani. This 31 per cent derives from a mere three (OK, they're lying) - four percent of the population. I don't want fairness for Somali "asylum seekers" who have no business in our country, nor European criminals who are allowed to stay on after release because sending them back would be against their yooman rights.

I don't want "fairness" for able-bodied men who sit around watching TV, smoking and dreamily planning what they're going to do with the dosh when their scratch card hits lucky. I don't want fairness for sluts who have clutches of children they cannot support by half a dozen different men who passed through their free flats.

I want fairness for Britain by Blair being sent to prison for life for treason. I want fairness by our dumping the EHRA without the ceremony of denegotiating the treaty. "Sorry chaps, but as of today, we're out. We'll leave the paperwork up to you. In French, English, Romanian , we don't care as we won't be reading it."

Etc.

Read this carefully Brown, because this is what the British people want. Not what you and your advisors believe they shouldwant. Human life - indeed, all life - is built on self interest. So do as we instruct you. It's in your self-interest to do so.

Michael Hargrave

September 23rd, 2008 3:09pm Report this comment

"Justice seen is justice done"
WOW

Nick

September 23rd, 2008 3:12pm Report this comment

Yes but sat in the north of England having been through the Thatcher years thank goodness he is in the chair as the Tories have to be kept out

CS

September 23rd, 2008 3:13pm Report this comment

Hilarious hypocrisy.

My family aren't props are, just to prove it, here's my wife to introduce me.

CS

September 23rd, 2008 3:15pm Report this comment

GWG, that would be the integrity that led him to crap on immigrants to appeal to the nastier side of his support, would it? Or were you thinking of the integrity that led him to abolish the 10p tax rate as a PR gimmick?

David

September 23rd, 2008 3:16pm Report this comment

GWG - I didn't know they had WiFi in the conference hall.

Frank Pulley

September 23rd, 2008 3:20pm Report this comment

You're phrase "Brownies", Fraser, now means something at last. You're right! Each one of them nine inches long, impacted faecal matter, now spewing forth from the wrong orifice of a constipated and craven clown; a tsunami of turds before an audience of copraphiliacs from the ugly club, clapping like trained seals. You know he's in trouble when he has to drag the egregious Kinnocks out of their luxury retirement mansion to bolster the bollocks!

I think that even the infinitely elastic credulity of the British electorate will snap under the weight of this avalanche porkie pies. Surely ...???

Adam

September 23rd, 2008 3:23pm Report this comment

1515 - Osbourne is the tory the Tories love to hate with his sharing the proceeds nonsense!!!

TrevorsDen

September 23rd, 2008 3:24pm Report this comment

"The mans got more integrity in his little finger "

hah- GWG what a joke. Any integrety Brown ever had is long since totally shredded, like when he taxed an extra 5 billion a year out of our pensions.

Like when he triple counted spending increases on NHS.

The list is endless - go to garbagegate.com

Integrity - the man does not know what the word means

Mike. Brighton

September 23rd, 2008 3:26pm Report this comment

I can't believe how bad it is. I really thought Brown might fight, but he's just read out a laundry list. The man is probably the most unsuited and incompetent PM we have had the misfortune of having.

Polly's mum

September 23rd, 2008 3:29pm Report this comment

13.27 Well thank goodness that's over. Has anyone counted the Brownies yet? Labour created the NHS? Tory cuts?
Look forward to hearing from you Fraser.

mac

September 23rd, 2008 3:29pm Report this comment

A free Gordon mug to GWG for today's best oxymoron - "integrity" and "Brown".

CS

September 23rd, 2008 3:39pm Report this comment

***That was a lot less good than I expected.***

Or, as we say in English, "worse".

David Parker

September 23rd, 2008 3:42pm Report this comment

Perhaps GWG meant that all of Brown's integrity was to be found in his little finger.

TrevorDen

September 23rd, 2008 3:47pm Report this comment

Even as Brown was speaking the stock market was shedding all its gains from yesterday.

Help me out - did he offer any solutions/ plans/ policies for the changed economic outlook?

He barely mentioned the armed forces he has been underfunding

Tiberius

September 23rd, 2008 3:55pm Report this comment

Brown's self-delusion is so complete that there doesn't even seem to be any trace of gallows humour in the speech.

kinglear

September 23rd, 2008 3:56pm Report this comment

GWG in particular - NuLabour's only thought ever was power. That's why there is nothing for Brown to say today or any day - he never had a principle bar control and staying in power.Integrity means doing what you say you will - which unfortunately Brown never has, except from making things worse for us.

David C

September 23rd, 2008 4:00pm Report this comment

Far from reining in the State, Brown is seeking to extend its scope and influence. The only brake on his ambition to smash the social and political structures of the UK is now the economic crisis.
Brown is stamping hard on the accelerator but the engine is starved of petrol.
Thank God he hasn't a clue as to how to fix the thing.

dave, surrey

September 23rd, 2008 4:03pm Report this comment

Nick 3:12, I was also in the north of England during the Thatcher years, I seem to remember they were better than the Callaghan years.

Nick Kaplan

September 23rd, 2008 4:09pm Report this comment

The speech was too long and too dull, typical Brown really.

Some good content if he wants to win votes e.g. his internet pledge, more free stuff on the NHS etc all good populist promises. However whilst these may be good vote winners they just prove how willing Brown is to sacrifice the public finances for short term poll gains making a mockery of the conference slogan “fighting for Britain’s future.” It seems that Brown still has not recognised the fact that people must be taught to live within their means, as should government. We must wake up from this Utopian dream (or is it a nightmare) that all the world’s problems can be solved now if only we spend more money. To make so many new spending commitments as the economy slows and whilst borrowing is already so high is deeply irresponsible.

Worst of all none of his words correspond to his actions. He claims to care about the poor yet he abolished the 10p tax rate. He apologises for this decision, yet although he has the power to reverse it he has not done so. He claims to care about Britain but has spent years destroying British values through the promotion of multiculturalism and by destroying British freedoms with the symbolic 42 day detention bill. He claims he wants fairness and better rewards for hard working families yet his government is taking the highest share of national income in tax in the last 30 years, what’s fair about that? He claims he wants to address the greed in the financial sector yet he established the regulatory framework that has failed so spectacularly, he emasculated the Bank of England by removing its supervisory role (against the advice of the opposition), he encourage the credit binge (to help win votes by making everyone feel wealthy) by knowingly appointing those who would set interest rates below inflation encouraging these ludicrous loans. He claims he is a progressive who cares about Britain’s future yet he has crippled future generations with incredible debts all so he can win some votes in the short term.

Frank Pulley

September 23rd, 2008 4:12pm Report this comment

He broke into a subliminal memory of one of his father's sermons towards the end. All we needed was the Nunc Dimittis and we could have sung aa-aa-men and decamped - which is what I did anyway; but instead of 'Amen', I shouted "Jesus Christ! I can't stand any more of this, I'll go an bring the washing in, love."

"I'll come and give you a hand." she replied.

He's Brarn bread!

Libertarian

September 23rd, 2008 4:13pm Report this comment

This was unquestionably the worst speech by a party leader in many many years. Yes, even including IDS!
It said nothing new, said it badly, was self deluded, patronising, and above all very very boring.
What with his promises to cure all the world's ills and disease, I was half expecting to see him walk on water at one stage.
Awful, turgid, vacuous, vapid, soundbite driven nonsense!

Jon

September 23rd, 2008 4:13pm Report this comment

I'm a Brown supporter ... he's our best hope for change (of Govt in 2010)

Forlornehope

September 23rd, 2008 4:17pm Report this comment

At least if he had gone with Polly Tonybee's recommendation of a red blooded old labour programme for the next 18 months you could have given him some respect. It would have been mad and bad for the country but it might have shown he believed in something. This was just gutless.

McLovin

September 23rd, 2008 4:19pm Report this comment

Gordo is a gump. Miliband's face is so yellow it looks like it's been in a Frenchman's armpit all night. And what was all his gurning about yesterday?

Don't Labour Party members realise just how idiotic it all looks to a non-believer?

jon dee

September 23rd, 2008 4:22pm Report this comment

Dreadful delivery to a false self-centred speech.While seeking sympathy his delusion that he is indispenable seemed the primary message.Without real substance it was full of half-truths and worse.PR for zealots.

Ian C

September 23rd, 2008 4:49pm Report this comment

Thanks you lot for the 38 comments (atthe time of posting). Saved me from having to watch more than the soundbites on News/night tonight. I get the picture quite clearly and am so surpised that GB has failed again.... not!

If what you all have been saying is right (anywhere near right in fact) there will be a challenge ASAP, perhaps before the loss of Glenrothes.

Max Kaye

September 23rd, 2008 5:08pm Report this comment

1434, James Forsyth: Vicious—and unpleasant—swipe at Cameron, “my children are people not props”

Well, they are now.

David Lindsay

September 23rd, 2008 5:08pm Report this comment

I couldn't sit through it. The American-style spousal speech and Motown-musicked video beforehand had made me ill before Gordon was even on stage. And I love Motown.

I saw the first half-hour, though. They applauded his description of New Labour, entirely accurately, as "a pro-market party", indicating that neither they nor he ever read the papers or watch the news these days.

And then there was Oona King. Apparently on or very near the front row, lovingly lingered over by the BBC cameras - I mean, why? Plenty of MPs lost their seats last time, and plenty of Labour MPs in particular, several whom had previously done rather better than never so much as making PPS or Assistant Whip despite having voted for the Iraq War, the privatisation of public services, the destruction of civil liberties, the lot. (To be fair, Blair was very given to bringing in women and ethnic minorities at the lowest level and then leaving them there. At least Brown is honest - he won't have them at all.)

But they certainly do not enjoy Ms King's media profile. What is going on?

Cogito Ergosum

September 23rd, 2008 5:13pm Report this comment

Cameron may not find it easy to persuade me to be Conservative, but Gordon's speech achieved that effortlessly.

colin

September 23rd, 2008 6:02pm Report this comment

The eye story is so touching,he should wear an eyepatch like the pirate he is or at least to show milliband where to stick his finger.
Enough labour activists,it's time to elect a leader with the principles and moral compass that are truly new labour. KEITH VAZ I say!

TGF UKIP

September 23rd, 2008 8:22pm Report this comment

Like Ian C, I must thank the Speccie hacks and other Coffee Housers for their take. I was, very sensibly I think, playing golf, and life is far too short to have any wish to view a recording in full.

Two thoughts, though, firstly while Maguire will be having orgasms at the Mirror, how hard will the Sun sell it tomorrow and how will Gordon's mates at the Telegraph and Mail choose to portray it. Secondly, delivered on Tuesday so there will be ample to time to poll before the weekend and boy, are those polls going to be interesting! Any predictions on what sort of bounce Gordon might be hoping for and what he will get?

Tiberius

September 23rd, 2008 9:31pm Report this comment

David Lindsay: I knew there must be something we had in common - Motown!

Did you e-mail Clive about Norman Whitfield last week? I did, but sadly no reply.

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