The Archbishop outclasses the atheists
Theo Hobson 8:25pm
In an interview with Stuart Jeffries in the Guardian, Rowan Williams has a nice little dig at Dawkins - he's calmly patronising, seemingly by accident.
"As he escorts me from his study, he tells me he admires Dawkins.
"There's something about his swashbuckling side which is endearing."
He invited atheism's high priest and his wife to a Lambeth Palace party last year. "They were absolutely delightful."
Again, classic Williams: the better man being nice about his foe…But the real reason the Dawkins were invited is unexpected. "My son wanted to meet Mrs Dawkins." Why? "She was in Doctor Who." Really? "Oh yes. She played an assistant when Tom Baker was the Doctor." "
More seriously, Williams' rationale for writing a book about Dostoyevsky is interesting. "I hope it encourages [Christians] to be aware that there are writers and thinkers who've plumbed the depths, who've looked at humanity in its shadows as well as its triumphs, but who still think it's worth sticking with the Christian gospel." It is therefore a very indirect response to atheist attacks – an insistence that 'Christian believer' cannot be defined by some stereotype. 'I thought it might not do any harm to put down a marker about that and say: "Here is a form of Christian engagement with the world and with the complexities of human experience that may be radically wrong but is not cheap or glib and any critique has to deal with this just as much as it has to deal with a southern baptist."'
It's a pretty smart apologetic strategy: don't forget about those deep and dazzling Christians of the past. It ought to make people like A.C. Grayling pause for thought (not that it will). I like the fact that Williams is coolly refusing to descend to the atheists' level, and respond to their teenage attacks; instead he is gesturing at the scope of their imaginative ignorance.
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Television is waking up to one of its central duties. To make us feel okay about society; to spread optimism rather than despondency. I'm talking about Jamie Oliver's Ministry of Food, of course. It's a genuinely important bit of culture. It's more about society than food, and it really does reinvent some of the old British spirit. Let's not just describe the brokenness of society but do something active and hopeful about it. And, most importantly, instead of sneering at the struggling masses, let's affirm them – let's find a surprisingly nice single mother and praise her efforts at reforming her life. The point is that this programme grasps what might be called the religious role of television: to be social propaganda, to help us feel positive about national life. Jamie Oliver is only secondarily a chef. He is primarily a shaman of social hope.
Previous
dexey
October 8th, 2008 10:24pm Report this commentI doubt that Rowan Williams sees himself as "the better man".
Chris
October 8th, 2008 10:54pm Report this commentMartin Luther King was a southern baptist. How cheap and glib was he? Two steps forward by the archbish, one stereotyping step back.
Chris
October 8th, 2008 11:19pm Report this commentBut God doesn't exist. What is so hard to understand about that?
Fergus Pickering
October 9th, 2008 3:28am Report this commentOf course God exists. If He did not then Gordon Brown might get away with it. But that is impossible. Therefore God exists. Got it? Besides, I saw Him only last week outside a supermarket. he drives a Lexus, as you might expect.
adam
October 9th, 2008 6:35am Report this commentChris,I'm afraid that most of the worlds population finds Gods' non existence hard to understand & no, its not because
1 You are more intelligent than they are
2You are more educated & have better knowledge
3You are strong minded & can face the harsh reality of death & the uncertainties of life whilst they are too weak to do so
The fact is that God is simply the best explanation for "life the universe & everything"
Pot Head
October 9th, 2008 7:16am Report this commentThis site always attacks Dawkins the atheist never Hitchens the atheist.
I wonder why?
Austin Barry
October 9th, 2008 7:28am Report this commentI always find it difficult to reconcile the existence of a loving, charitable God with Williams' befuddled, burst-sofa appearance.
Chris
October 9th, 2008 7:56am Report this commentSome more rambling drivel from Williams and (whoop dee doo) that proves Christianity must be right. Take that atheists. What utter rubbish. If the only examples are people from the past who would have faced imprisonment, torture and often death if they'd publicly admitted they didn't believe in his imaginary friend then his argument is incredibly weak. Well - non-existent really.
Ray
October 9th, 2008 8:14am Report this commentChris - because despite all attempts by atheists to extinguish God from our consciousness, His Spirit still cries out within the souls of men that we do not walk this life alone.
Or in those immortal words that once dawned upon a profane and disbelieving slave dealer, "I once was lost but now am found; was blind, but now I see"!
Chris who knows what the fool saith in his heart
October 9th, 2008 8:37am Report this commentThe Chris who says God doesn't exist isn't me.
Nick
October 9th, 2008 8:43am Report this commentWhen has Richard Dawkins ever been personally unpleasant to the Archbishop ? Never. So why is Hobson allowed space on Coffee House to insinuate otherwise ?
Mike, Brighton
October 9th, 2008 9:14am Report this commentYes but Dawkins is right and is highly eloquent in showing why.
Jim
October 9th, 2008 9:15am Report this commentDawkins also said nice things about Williams. So what?
Harold
October 9th, 2008 9:23am Report this comment"imaginative ignorance"
Say's it all really!
adrian adrummond
October 9th, 2008 9:44am Report this commentWhat utter, utter twaddle.
Forlornehope
October 9th, 2008 9:47am Report this commentChris,
In 1887 the Michelson Morley experiment demonstrated the non-existence of the aether and ushered in a century of reinventing physics. What was the experiment that you are referring to that did the same for God?
Imaginary Friend Botherer
October 9th, 2008 10:15am Report this commentadam- "The fact is that God is simply the best explanation for "life the universe & everything"
You're taking taking the piss, right.
Marcus Cotswell
October 9th, 2008 10:25am Report this commentIn the pages of the Spectator itself recently, Dr Williams, referring to attituds to the market, opined that "ascribing independent reality to what you have in fact made yourself is a perfect definition of what the Jewish and Christian Scriptures call idolatry".
For my money it's also a perfect description of religion.
Arbie
October 9th, 2008 11:49am Report this commentTheo, you paint atheists with an awfully broad brush. Neither I nor many others suffer from imaginative ignorance, nor have I launched teenage attacks on the Archbishop of Canterbury. You seem to be engaging in the kind of ad hominem attacks that you so disparage atheists for. Please stop being such a hypocrite.
Frank P
October 9th, 2008 11:52am Report this commentPot Head
>This site always attacks Dawkins the atheist never Hitchens the atheist.
I wonder why?<
As you have qualified the verb 'attacks' with the adverb 'always' you obviously never miss a word that is posted or commented upon on this blog.
I wonder why?
Austin Barry
October 9th, 2008 1:23pm Report this commentIt occurs to me that Williams at some level believes he is God, so he deliberately presents as a child's idea of God. Were you to ask him why he thinks he's God he would say with uncontestable logic, "Because when I pray I find that I am talking to myself."
Big Alec
October 9th, 2008 2:04pm Report this commentMike, Brighton - I have studied theology at university and read many books on the Christian faith. What a waste of time! I should simply have consulted you, as you seem to have all the answers to life's big questions.
Imaginary Friend Botherer
October 9th, 2008 4:37pm Report this commentBig Alec. Mike was spot on and you did waste your time.
Edward the Thirst
October 9th, 2008 6:40pm Report this commentEvery single time that this 'there is a God/no there isn't' thread gets going, I notice that the believers are, almost without exception, so much more gracious in their regard to others than are those who are without faith.
Anglica
October 10th, 2008 1:43am Report this commentFrank P - "you obviously never miss a word that is posted or commented upon on this blog.
I wonder why?"
As well said as ever - my own observation precisely :)
Anglica
October 10th, 2008 2:02am Report this commentMarcus Cotswell:
Are you practicing meconnaissance? Or, speaking metaphorically, why else would you confuse Oxygen with the circulatory system that supplies the members of the body?
Judaeo-Christians worship God, not religion. Further, Judaeo-Christians do not 'ascribe independent reality' to religion ... the religions depend upon God.
Big Alec
October 10th, 2008 10:00am Report this commentImaginary Friend Botherer - you quote Adam: "The fact is that God is simply the best explanation for "life the universe & everything"
And then respond to this comment by stating: "You're taking the piss, right."
Now, call me old-fashioned, but this hardly represents a compelling argument against Adam's point. Why don't you grow up, engage your brain and argue your case properly, rather than descending to the childish level of 'you're wrong, he's right, my dad's bigger than yours' etc.
Frank
October 10th, 2008 7:58pm Report this commentThere is no God and no buts!
Edward the Thirst
October 11th, 2008 8:48am Report this comment"There is no God and no buts!"
Oi Frank, who do you think you are? God?
Peter Greville Richardson
October 11th, 2008 10:05am Report this commentAustin Barry -- I love your burst sofa analogy. It made me laugh. If God is so loving, wise, omnipotent etc. why did he make it so difficult for ordinary ill educated Secondary Modern school boys like me to believe he exists ?
Tamara
October 11th, 2008 10:15am Report this commentReading some angry, full of hatred and insulting comments about others is sad. If one says "Religion isn't good enough for mental health because it's......etc..", you should write "It's good and .. give the reasons.." instead of attacking the owner of the idea.. Comments should be about "ideas", not people directly. When one starts the sentence with "you grow up and think properly", then it's better not to send it as a comment or go to the local pub and discuss it there with like-minded people.
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