Why is it the money that gets the English so cross?

Ted

Perhaps because in England it isn't apparent there is, for example, an English NHS or an English Education system, so the fact a Scottish NHS offers a different service to that in England appears nonsensical - just a form of post code lottery. It obviously a benefit to Labour that this isn't very apparent because then the WLQ would arise.

Lee Jakeman

If MP's can't see that there is only one logical solution to the WLQ - independent national parliaments within a federal UK, which effectively means replacing the union with a federation, then they must be incredibly stupid.

Scottish Conservative

Oh find another dead horse to flog - u lot r becoming the pub bores of the blogosphere. This excellent response was posted on another blog by richard thomson who is not of my party allegiance but who has got it spot on. "All those drugs available in Scotland but not England? Well, that's what happens when you have 2 seperate bodies (NICE in England; the SMC in Scotland) charged with licencing treatments and responding to 2 different sets of ministers responding to 2 different sets of priorities. Incidentally, many of the drugs mentioned are not prescribed routinely, or are only made available as a last resort. In any case, it works both ways - in England, you can be prescribed Sutent for kidney cancer; Elaprase for Hunter Syndrome; sundry other enzyme therapies; enjoy a strategy for dealing with COPD and can get liposuction for overweight kids. That's except for viewers in Scotland, though, but do you hear us complaining? No."

ThunderDragon

It's because money is a tangible thing that can be seen and quantified. It can be directly compared Political power, on the other hand, isn't obvious in the same way - and Scottish MPs have not yet been used to push through a policy that only effects England that is of wide enough interest.

David Lindsay

Free prescriptions, free school meals: introduce these nationwide and deduct the cost from the block grant to a body which, after all, has fiscal powers of its own, but has never used them. Do the same for student feees, for free personal care for the elderly, and for whatever else might come up. Easy. And there is no West Lothian Question: the Parliament of the United Kingdom can still enact overriding legislation in any policy area it likes. Don't Brown and Darling have any policy ideas for their own constituencies? Well, then, let them get on with implementing those ideas, and thus with implementing the devolution legislation in full for the first time. Anyone who objects should be asked if they voted against devolution either in the referendum or, where applicable, on the floor of the House. I bet they didn't.

T. Yke

Actually, you are wrong Mr Forsyth. Campaigners have been complaining for years about Scots/Welsh/NI voting on English issues and the need for an English Parliament. Letters to the press can be dated back to devolution. It is the media who have prevented our voices being heard, though you can hardly blame people for being furious that their loved ones are told by a Scottish MP that he can't afford the same life/ sight saving drugs for the English, which he happily provides the funds for, for his own nation. If the boot was on the other foot, Cyber Celts would be urging war on the English nation and Scottish MPs would be organising hate fests.

tally

There is only so much you can get in a video clip. There are others that highlight the West Lothian Question.
Politicians and the media deliberatley confuse problems in England by saying Britain or our country, or this country or the NHS. People in England should not be lied to and led to believe these issues ar uk wide.Politicians should be forced to say England when they mean England and not britain.
There is a petition if any would like to sign.

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/sayEngland/

Henry Toller

Excellent video. I wasn't aware how far the Scots had gone with their power over us. This makes me sick to my stomach and those who don't care had better explain themselves if they want my vote I'm an ex Union man from this day on!

Tiberius

Middle England is paying a high price indeed for the pleasure of having despatched the Tories to the political wilderness for all those years, and for acquiescing in the political colonization of England by a band of Scottish raiders.

Ian Campbell

Brown's administration and Blair's before him have disguised the problem by talking about education and health 'in this country' when in fact they mean 'in England' or 'in England & Wales'. Labour MPs have been saying for some time that the 'English Question' would become a live issue. It has; their postbags are full of complaints about different standards in health and education in Scotland and England. Barnett was not a problem before devolution. Now it is a proxy for the WlQ. The Scots are now free to spend money how they wish and the decisions are made by in Scotland by a Scottish government elected by PR. The English feel completely powerless. They did not elect Brown as their First Minister. There are no 'English' MPs - all the MPs at Westminster are UK MPs (and those who sit for Scottish seats voted through foundation hospitals and higher tuition fees for England). Who speaks for England? No-one. England is not represented on the British-Irish Council, nor in the EU. There is not even a minister for England at the Department of Culture, Media and Sport. Is it any wonder that 'the natives are getting restless' when they see goodies apparently distributed north of the border when there is no English government to defend and promote their interests? All Brown can say is that to allow the English to run domestic matters in their own country would break up the Union. Why should it? And even if did, isn't it up to the people of the British nations, not politicians, to decide whether or not they wish the Union to continue? Other than for the personal aggrandisement of our ruling political class it is hard to see what purpose the Union serves. None of the Unionist MPs seems able to spell out the benefits for England, if there are any. They regard it as Good Thing, like Motherhood. Their failure to set out the advantages suggests that they are rather unconvincing if examined in daylight.

J Hutchings

Typical metropolitan journalista slow to catch on .They pride themselves on being so cute , so perceptive . I reality they are docile dupes . Campbell was right about them hence his contempt for them . The governmnet can feed them rubbish and these lazy , compliant prats just regurgitate it almost verbatim . For the most part , such people only ever speak and congregate with other such people ie a pretty closed in crowd . He ought to get out a bit . The financial aspect of the constitutional situation is just that , the financial aspect . It is a glaring and growing inequality enforced on trhe English by the British government . He might have noticed if he'd got out of the bar long enough . The Barnett Rules have existed since 1976 and their inbuilt tendency to overfund the celts at the exepense of the English has been growing steadily over the years , not diminishing as some journalists like to pretend . They have been operated , particularly in England , in semi secrecy with a pan party conspiracy of silence in alliance with seccessive British governments . Censorship of the situation in England has not been entirely complete but effectively almost so until quite recently . It is only because Salmond has decided to break ranks and use the Barnett Rules excess funding of Scotland deliberately to aggravate English opinion that it has come to the fore now . Thank God for Salmond . Forsythe doesn't appear to know this . It points up a major failing in journalism In England in general and with Forsythe in particular . This whole area of how the British government got away with it for so long needs examination . it can only have been doe with the active compliance of all the "British" national newspapers ie the English ones . To its credit , The Scotsman has never fully played the omerta game on The Barnett Rules .

Craig Healey

To Scottish Conservative, perhaps you'd like to remind the rest of England about the time we had a referendum regarding devolution for Scotland? Oh, that's right. We weren't given the choice over 2 separate governments and 2 separate health services, unlike the Scots. Any chance of the Conservatives giving England it's own government and parliament, on a par with Scotland? Not a chance, all they can come up with is the mess that is "English Votes on English Matters". Not that Labour or the Lib Dems are any different. We need either full devolution for all the nations of the UK, or no devolution for any of them. Only then will this dead horse lie down for good.

Chris Paul http://chrispaul-labouroflove.blogspot.com

This sad sack of a video does not have "a whole host of examples of how England is disadvantaged by the Barnett formula". It has some bare figures - unconnected to service costs in different territories - and does not unpack England figures to show London also getting a high share on those bare figures. It does not deal with the income side of the equation with both Scotland and London contributing quite well in revenues. And it does not accept the most simple principle of locally devolved power. *** If we let a local health provider have a devolved budget they may make different choices to others. That is after all the point. So how can any sane commentator welcome the choice and then expect every HS to be the same? Same goes for Education. if you go to the comments that Mr Dale has passed for public consumption at the link you have provided you will find a number of people giving costed examples of how this video is misleading propaganda which does not contribute much to the debate. Except I suppose to out a few people with problems with numeracy as well as economics and taxation. The Vid is DRECK.

Stephen Gash

Actually I hear more and more English people say the Scots can go away in a peculiarly rhythmic manner (or words to that effect). Any talk of an English Parliament is routinely suppressed by media and politicans. My guess is the Lib Dems would become the second largest party if they had an English Parliament as a manifesto pledge. Instead Geoff Huhne has taken it upon himself to attempt to bribe the Scots with control over their maritime affairs (now that the EU constitution has given control of oil to Brussels). So the English will get no joy from any of the three largest parties. So all three can just go away in a peculiarly rhythmic fashion.

The English Tax Payer

Welsh block grant = c.14.5bn Welsh GDP = c.9bn And the block grant only covers Health, Education & Local Govt with the short change proping up a dead language. Every fibre of my being opposes devolution but if it is to stay, how about scrapping the barnett formula for a directly linked treasury contribution linked to develoved public expenditure. Lets see how long devolution lasts then.

Irish Independent

Britain suited the English while they felt they had the power - now that Broon is in charge they don't like it up 'em!

Matt Lowe

Chris Paul, Labour Party luvvy lover disses video - SHOCK! Thanks Chris, your tone is superior, your argument about as sophisticated as Jack Straw trying to defend Gordon Brown's supposed mandate to legislate on education, health, transport and planning in England. (not very convincing, mate!) For example - your reference to the supposed freedom of choice for health authorities in which you state- 'If we let a local health provider have a devolved budget they may make different choices to others. That is after all the point. So how can any sane commentator welcome the choice and then expect every HS to be the same?'..... - Are you confusing 'local' with 'national', Chris? Don't you know that 'NICE' uses the old 'not approved for public consumption' tactic when trying to deny expensive life saving drugs to English patients on a NATIONAL level? (Even though those self same drugs are available to every other 1st world country - including Scotland and Wales, obviously). NICE has power across England and Wales - but because Wales has its own legislative assembly, they at least can override the penny-pinching straitjacket that NICE has been forced into, courtesy of their UK Government masters. Same goes for education - I have 4 sons, only 1 has gone to Uni'the other 3 are in McJobs... the reason? That's right! Tuition fees. 3 grand a year and rising (English only, obviously). And hey, guess what? That legislation was made real by a poodle claque of Scots Labour Westminster MPs, doing what Uncle Tone demanded and nodding it through (even though the Scots Executive had obviously refused to implement such anti Labour legislation). NOTE: The Welsh Assembly are helping their Welsh students with grants etc. Do you think I am bitter Chris mate? Well do you? Six months ago I watched a guy from our village whither and die from Bone Cancer because he was refused drugs from the local PCT - drugs that would have saved his life. His wife appealed to everyone she could, she even wrote a heart wrenching account in the local paper - it was all about how, if she had been living just 200 miles up the road in Scotland, she would have got the drug for her husband that might have saved his life - AS OF RIGHT. Chris, do ya think a little bit of the old, 'HA making their own choice' speil would work for her, well do you? Chris, you also completely fail to say just why it is (if every local HA are making their own choices) that every single nurse working in England has had their pay rise of 2.5% deferred - unlike those working in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Yeah, never mind. Also, if you've got a few minutes, why not research how many nurses have been given the old heave-ho via redundancy in England.. Compare and ontrast with the figures in Wales and Scotland. Go on, give it a whirl, see wha you discover mate. Anyway, believe it or not Chris, I am a lifelong socialist and democrat - and because I am, I obviously do not support the current Stazi Labour Party. They have nothing to do with democracy. I voted Labour for 32 years solid - but saw the light after 1997. It was reinforced in 1998 when Labour's bizarrely skewed devoution plans were unveiled. (Hint: they sort of forgot about England). I come from a staunch Labour family - my Grandfather knew George Orwell extremely well - and helped him in his research on his book 'The Road to Wigan Pier'... He also stood for Parliament in the '30's under the slogan 'The Man That Cannot be Bought' and ended up as Bessie Braddock's agent.... I just wonder what he would make of today's Labour Party - an organisation so ready to disenfranchise an entire nation, - If he were still alive, I reckon he would be sick to the stomach at the lies, the spin, the mendacity of it all. What do you think, Chris? You rubbish the video, I happen to know that the figures and quotes were carefully sourced and cross checked..... I know because I am the person who made the video. All the quotes are faithfully reproduced, all the figures are gleaned from Government sources, I gathered them and made the vid. I hope that's OK with you, Chris. Unlike you and your slavish devotion to a flawed constitutional system, I still have a belief in EQUALITY and the democratic rights of the individual. We can start with the restoration of a pariament for England and the installation of an English First Minister. When that happens we will have someone who will actually represent England on a national level - hey, what a novelty, eh Chris? Nah, better not, what would Gordon say?

Lee Jakeman

Irish Independent - Injustice is injustice. Devolution is unfair to England. So things should be changed, not denied or suppressed or dismissed.

Fred Forsythe (Not the)

Irish, We won't blow you kids to smitherines to get it!

graeme mccormick

Apart from Unionist politicians like Gordon Brown who have to retain control why not devolve all powers to the consituent parts of the UK and have an agreement for each part to contribute towards common defence and the crown? each part could then prosper accordig to its own efforts? We Scots don't think we are a drain on Britain's finances. We think we are a net contributor. Whether this is the case or not is nether here nor there if my suggestion was implemented.

Terry

The arrogance expressed in this article is staggering. Consider this… “The constitutional settlement created by New Labour is clearly iniquitous.” “Iniquitous” is one word. Another could be “undemocratic” or “unfair” and if you wanted to string two words together, you could say “downright wrong”! “But what is interesting about the current debate is that it is based around the higher public spending per head in Scotland. I always though that the devolution chickens would come home to roost when some controversial piece of legislation which did not apply to Scotland was pushed through using Scottish votes. But that’s already happened and it hardly kicked off a constitutional firestorm. The Barnett formula, though, seems to consistently spark off arguments” That’s because the Barnett Formula translates into free tertiary education: health care for the elderly: dental treatment: prescription charges: foundation hospitals: nuclear power plants: Cancer drugs: smaller class sizes: Sunday trading… ad infinitum, ad bloody nauseam! Yes this is enabled by higher spending (more than ANY English or Welsh region) but people see it as a statement that a Scottish life is worth more, a Scottish child deserves a better education, an elderly Scots person deserves better care, etc. and this is the UK’s third richest region!! “…which existed before devolution, not the West Lothian question.” This IS the WLQ. This is the manifestation of the English Question; it includes the WLQ, and the answer to both is an English Parliament.

JL

This video is a very effective propaganda for the dissolution of the Union. The only logical response to Scottish manipulation of UK government is the end of the political system that was inaugurated in 1707.