By inviting Ahmadienjad to deliver its alternative Christmas message Channel 4 has forfeited its right to be a public service broadcaster

Fred

Nonsense. This is just the sort of police state, control freakery approach that has become characteristic of Brown. Disappointing to see it espoused by people who write here. Guess you believe in freedom only when people support you. The Gordon Brown definition. Good on ya, Channel 4.

Bob

This may well turn out to be the equivalent of that silly Oxford Union debate in the thirties which left Hitler thinking that the British had no stomach to fight for King our country. Channel 4 are silly pranksters safe in their ivory tower.

Paul B

And to think I was sympathetic to the idea of it getting some of my license fee!!!

It has a right a broadcast whoever it deems fit, I`m not by inclination one likes to reach for the censors rubber, but it that right, comes the responsibility of exercising judgment. To my mind Ahmadienjad is a big a threat to world peace, as Hitler was in the 30s. He is as equally talented at manipulating , the feeble minded, sorry, the appeasement brigade, as was old uncle Adolph was.

Channel 4, which owes its existence to the great lady, ends, up as a quasi 21st century Lord Haw Haw. Sad, very sad.

David

Fred, talk to Ahmadinejad about freedom, and then come back to me.

David

As a point, things like Big Brother allow 4 to subsidise programmes like, say, The Ascent of Money and other programmes, such as its excellent dramas, which are culturally uplifting. 4's financial problems are coming because programmes like BB are no longer bringing in the ad revenue. You may not like such programmes yourself, but they pay for the ones you do like but which otherwise get small audiences or the wrong demographic to pull in much revenue. 4 has never claimed programming like BB is anything other than populist, and a commentator with sense should be able to see that programming should be for all. However, I've seen little by way of sense from you, ever.

To the issue at hand, this is a disgrace-4 should be ashamed.

David

"Ordinary shareholders would never put up with such an outrage."

How do you know?

Austin Barry

Oh, I don't know, a last message from Ahmadinejad a couple of months before the IDF blow his Bushehr nuclear plant to buggery will imbue his words with a rather plangent, melancholic quality: Ahmadinejad, the Tiny Tim of our times.

Bob

Is it any surprise that Ch4 invites the President of a country that is actively killing British soldiers to make this address?

If they were a private company, fine, I get the choice to not watch their shit.

Ch4 like Pravda, sorry, the BBC are state funded. Which of course means the state is funding a platform for a lunatic who is actively involved in killing British soldiers and at odds with the aims of the British government, bizarre as that Hoon Milliband would say.

I also wonder how this adds up in terms of Iran stringing up gays, doesn't that stick in Ch4's throat a bit, no pun intended.

Women's rights anybody?

chris

Wot we want from politicians, whoever they are, is a bit of honesty (that means tell the truth). We don't get it from our lot and you certainly won't get it from this man.
Goodness knows what all the decent Iranians will make of this.

mitch

There is an off button you know. free speech and all.
you cant just have it your way.

Nicholas

I wish there was a one word pejorative for the "Jon Snow School of Political Thought" in the way that Tories is used.

Liberal Left is a travesty because they are far from being liberal. Lefty is too innocuous. Guardianista is too contrived.

These repulsively self-satisfied, self-serving people, who have done so much destroy the best of Britain, really do deserve their own special term of abuse.

Steve the Student

Is "Fred" (if that IS his real name...) a Guardian reader or something?

Yourprodigalson

Stop being silly. Different is good. Whether you agree with the point of view or not is hardly the point.

Perhaps the Barclay brothers could learn a thing or two about people they don't agree with?

Agent Digby

Doesn't bother me. I don't use TV and have no license. What surprises me is that the ever leftie Beep hasn't tried to pull this stunt.

Tiberius

Nice to see the fifth column alive and thriving.

You'd better hope, Fred, the rest of us retain our senses, otherwise you (and we) may one day lose the freedom to write on the blog.

Ben Stevenson

Channel 4 are also following their well established habit of giving Robert Beckford 2 hours to argue for Christianity being based on lies.

http://www.channel4.com/tv-listings/daily/2008/12/25

They can make these silly programmes if they want - but I don't want them to get a subsidy (free broadcasting spectrum) to for it.

http://www.e-n.org.uk/2828-Who-wrote-the-Bible.htm

Philipe Du Bois

Please go to the OFCOM website and complain about Channel 4 airing this message from the anti-semite holocaust denier!

Channel Four have contravened OFCOM’s Broadcasting Code - Section (Religion) by transmitting this crap. It has already been shown online. Make you complaint here:

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/complain/progs/specific/

Presumably by the reasoning they used to justify this broadcast, they would have given Adolf Hitler airtime in the thirties?

As a public service broadcaster they should hang their heads in shame - this is nothing to do with free-speech but everything to do with the clowns at Channel Four maintaining their reputation for being controversial. What a great way to boost their flagging audience figures!

Tell OFCOM to tell Channel Four precisely where to get orf!

Alf Tupper

Fred.

Do you think your refined sense of fairness, and the protective nation state whose continued vigilance affords it a space to exist, just fell into place naturally and have secured the inalienable right to exist?

Are you seriously arguing that any and every viewpoint has equal right to be broadcast, in order that balance be observed?

Pete, Scotland

I may be wrong, but I think that Iran probably has a healthier democracy than we do here in the UK.

Ahmadienjad is not on a banned list.

Equally, there should be allowance for substantive retort.

Verity

This is the man who captured our ship in the Strais of Hormuz and humiliated the ragbag crew purporting to be members of HM Navy. Remember their "treat bags" that they brought home with them?

If he captured one of our warships, he is our enemy. Surely Channel 4 is committing treason? And giving aid and comfort to the enemy - given that they know how this will play in Teheran and Arab countries?

What's our doughty Home Secretary going to do about it?

Kevin

Can someone delete Fred's remark?

John Smith

Oh don't be silly. Channel4 is controversial, it provokes debate and discussion. That alone makes it far more worthy than any nonsense ITV puts out, usually just reprinting the latest Tory/NF press release.

Baz

British servicemen have been killed by advanced IEDs supplied by Ahmadienjad's regime.

JohnAnt

Leaving iran to one side for the moment, isn't there an issue here about broadcasting on a public service network a speech made by the Head of State of a foreign power? I'm sure Medvedev, Karimov and whoever's running Malaya this week would all welcome their chance to preach to the UK about their wish for peace and their sorrow at the US's constant thwarting of same. And we all have to sit and listen to this rubbish on our tax-paid tellies?

Jo

Good for channel 4, as much as some people find it unpalatable, I am grateful that we see alternative views in this country, unlike the United States, where ADL and other foundations make sure sponsors are threatened, professors and journalists get kicked from their jobs, because they provided alternative or critical views.

Sam Armstrong

I am disgusted with C4 and I hope they rot in hell.

George Steiner

Ahmaddindin knows a right one when he sees one. And does he ever see one. Keep it up fellows, it makes lovely reading.

Verity

John Ant - "I'm sure Medvedev, Karimov and whoever's running Malaya this week would all welcome their chance to preach to the UK about their wish for ...".

Read this sentence twice: There is no such state as Malaya. Read again.

Malaysia has been a stable democratic country for around 60 years. Regular elections (unlike Britain, which has an unelected dictator).

All views accorded time on the media. It's wondeful. Representatives voted in and then get their say in Parliament and vote on Government proposals. All covered by a keenly interested media. I love it.

Malaysia is a stable, friendly democracy in good standing in the Commonwealth and the world at large. How dare you!

Verity

Jo - as you are shockingly ignorant of the context, may I make a suggestion?

Can you intuit what that suggestion might be?

Wilhelm

The lefty liberals squeel '' Its freedom of speech, Channel 4 can do what the hell it likes, stuff you.''

Well , why doesnt Channel 4 have David Irving or a BNP person on then ?

Verity

Bob - don't understand your point: "also wonder how this adds up in terms of Iran stringing up gays, doesn't that stick in Ch4's throat a bit, no pun intended.

"Women's rights anybody?"

Leave aside that "women's rights" were 30 years ago, what do they have to do with homosexual men being hanged off cranes?

Don't get the connection.

Alan Lawson

Thanks, C4. Out here (in Afghanistan), the concept of an 'independent broadcaster' is pretty much laughed at - and, as C4 is funded by the Govt (i.e. taxpayers) it is seen to be as much part of the State as is the BBC. So, anything they do will be taken as having the implicit support of the Government. The Taliban are being drip-fed support (guns, explosives, etc) by the Iranians - just enough to keep them killing Westerners, not enough to make them too powerful - so the Iranians are, without doubt, causing the death of UK Soldiers now. To give them this 'official' support makes us look even more foolish than we normally manage - and, sadly, that's really saying something.

Wilhelm

Pete Scotland says

'' I maybe wrong ''

Yes, you are 100% wrong, no question about it.

Paul B

Said Tarquin to Tristam one day, "I have just thought of a wonderful idea - how about we get Gary Glitter to read Jackanory, how terribly post modernist and ironic. Be one in the eye for all those reactionary knee jerk right wing fundamentalist floggers and hangers that frequent the Coffee House"

Old Hack

Top marks to C4 for outraging the people it seeks to outrage.

If Jesus were alive today he'd encourage forgiveness - no? In which case George W is as entitled as Pontious Pilate was.

Have C4, in their zeal to provoke publicity gathering outrage chosen the best messenger for the need for peace in the middle east? No.

So for C4, as for Ahmedinajad, this is a petty exercise in point scoring.

Liam

Sorry, some of you clearly don't live in a democracy given some of the statements you are making! All this "They would have invited Adolf Hitler no doubt" stuff, reacting to your own imagination, is pathetic.

Channel 4 was not set up to be mainstream. This decision is difficult but more power to Channel 4 for making it. By his words shall he be judged...

Wilhelm

If Channel 4 really wanted to be controversail, why dont they put on the very popular 1970s The Black and White Minstrel Show ?

Or is Channel 4 just cowards ?
They crapped themselves over the Shipla Shetta Big Brother racism row last year, didnt they ?

Jo

Verity
You exactly prove my point. Rather than acting like a dictatorial thought police, give the the audience a chance to make up their mind, you will be surprised by the result.

Not your tart

I don't think any of you lot believe in freedom. That's why you love being at war so much, it gives you an excuse to ban things, and lock people up who disagree with you. What do you think is going to happen when this little man opens his mouth on Channel 4? Trouble is we can no longer believe the press or the Government when it comes to Iraq, Afghanistan or any of the other messy bits in the world. So let's hear what the man's got to say, and make up our own minds.

Andy Leeds

'I wish there was a one word pejorative for the "Jon Snow School of Political Thought" in the way that Tories is used.'

There is a two word pejorative which captures the matter perfectly - 'Fascist Left'. Sums them up rather well.

David Parker

I have never approved of the Race Relations Legislation, since it is frequently abused by the PC Brigade and probably causes more resentment and friction than harmony.

However, for better or worse we are saddled with this legislation. I have not yet seen a transcript of the full speech, which has presumably been vetted it by Channel 4's lawyers, but it would seem that the publication of this speech was clearly intended to shock or offend people of certain races or religions and, as such, was likely to promote racial disharmony.

mohamed

Shame on channel4 for giving time to the president of a terrorist and bloodthirsty regime. the clerical regime and its torturer president have no respect for human being, let alone religion.these imposers misusing religion to rule. channel4 is giving opportunity to a dictatorial regime to poison viewer's minds and thoughts. look at the regime and its president's record of violation of human rights and exporting terrorism and fundamentalism. does C4 give time to Hitler to deliver Christmas message as well?

gmc

"has really scrapped the barrel." - Is that a typo, or a neologism? - (I like the latter, and may well use.)

Gil

Jo, there is a difference between 'acting like the 'dictatorial thought police' and actually behaving like them. Like the Iranian regime, of which Ahamadienjad is the president.

Are you really that stupid?

Travis Bickle

Whatever the merits (or otherwise) it says a lot when Channel 4 can do this and hardly anyone bats an eyelid yet if they'd invited the BNP leader to make a similar broadcast the protest camps, with 24 hour BBC coverage, would be assembled outside the Channel 4 studios for weeks to come. Personally I wouldn't watch either of these "gentlemen" if paid, and with a choice of about 400 stations for most (albeit showing largely rubbish and fools and horses repeats) not really difficult to find something else to watch is it?

Worried for Western Civilisation

What's next, a tax-funded New Year's Message from Osama Bin Laden?

Verity

Jo - Sorry, my dear, but you prove my point. Ignorant, illiterate people such as your good self often feel they are being refreshingly open minded and cutting edge by approving the unthinkable. And in your case, you are very open minded, given that there is nothing but an empty space with a wind blowing through it between your ears.

What is "a dictatorial thought police", by the way? And could you explain this illiterate sentence - "give the the audience a chance to make up their mind," audience is singular, dear girl, "you will be surprised by the result." There needs to be a conjunction between "mind" and "you".

I assume English is your native language and I assume you went to school, where you were "taught" by "opened-minded", "liberal" teachers whose job was indoctrination.

Verity

Not Your Tart - Only a few more days left of saying "Bush" to encapsulate the complex arguments of your mind. "So let's hear what the man's got to say, and make up our own minds." We've already heard what the man has to say - or did you miss it? He believes in nuking Israel and the West. He believes in seizing ships of the Navy of a country with which Iran is not at war and holding the crew prisoner. He believes in cheap tailoring. What can I say?

gmc - first laugh of the day. Thank you. I'm going to adopt it myself.

Travis Bickle, you miss the point. No one is complaining about lack of viewing choices. They are complaining about employing Western rights and values to assault Western rights and values.

The Laughing Cavalier

The simple answer is not to watch it. Viewing figures of absolutely zero would soon stop Channel 4 from perpetrating this sort of nonsense. It does stick in the craw though, that the President of a country assisting in and actively encouraging the killng of our Forces and those of our allies should be invited to give an address to the Nation.

Michael Sweeney

'The solution to today's problems is a return to the call of the divine Prophets. The solution to these crises is to follow the Prophets - they were sent by the Almighty for the good of humanity' Interesting that C4 have given time to this man after the Pope recently upset the gay comunity. I now look forward to the Archbishop of Canterbury or Ian Paisley being given an equivalent platform to promote their religious views. But I won't hold my breath.

Jo

Verity
I disapprove of what (you /Ahmadienjad) say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.
I think what you are looking for is, something like fox news. I suggest you subscribe to it.
Poor you, any one that does not agree with you have to be called names.

THX1138

We created the monster that is Ahmadinejad when along with the Yanks we a instigated a coup in the 50's that ousted the conservative democratic government of Mossadegh.

All because he had the temerity to want control over his own countries oil which of course, are ours not theirs.

The coup led to 25 years of terror, atrocities & general barbarism under the shah , which led finally to revolution in 79 & Ahmadinejad. If we had agreed a fair deal for Iranian oil all those years ago Iran may now have been a successful democracy, not threatening it's neighbors or Israel & C4 wouldn't be broadcasting Christmas messages from it's pyscho ruler & you lot wouldn't be getting so hot under the collar.

molesworth 1

I'm watching the broadcast now. Are you?

Winston Smith

You know, I don't know what upsets me more. The airing of a very dangerous man, who epitomises Muhammad's use of taquiya, or the completely and utterly ignorant British public, congratulating CH4, disrespecting their country(all those who died so they could be free) and using this as a "stick two fingers against society and the West" while they live in its safety as the man they praise's regime is funding the very Islamist groups killing the very people protecting them and allowing their worry-less lives.
The word disgusted doesn't come close to how I feel at our government's allowing of this programme, who incidentally fund this channel, to be aired. I am not the only person in the UK and the world who simply is astounded that the contemplation of this broadcast was even contemplated. British troops are dying in Afghanistan and Iraq. Many of them don't want to be there trying to protect people who don't want them there. Fighting against an ideology, our government allows Saudi Arabia to pump into the UK unfettered and Ahmadinejad's administration promotes in Iran.
How on earth can people hate their own country so much when our society, although certainly not perfect(thanks to NuLabour) is years ahead of many regimes in this world including Iran. We have no death penalty yet Iran has. Iran despises jews, we don't. We allow homosexuals the same rights as us while Iran kills them. We allow any faith to live in the UK and convert to whatever they choose and yet Iran kills apostates of Islam and persecutes Christians. We punish rapists and murderers yet Iran protects them and instead murders the victims.
What is wrong with all of you, so wrapped up in anti Western/pro Palestinian propaganda and hate for Israel, that you can defend Ahmadinejad and Ch4's decision? For the love of God, if not for humanity, how can you condone CH4's decision when we know of Iran's history? How can you not see that Iran wants nuclear weapons with which to further arm Islamist regimes and the destruction of Israel.
Have you lost your minds? Has years of living in apathetic, peaceful, safe Britain made you into imbeciles? I pity you if you support Ahmadinejad. I really truly do.

Verity

Jo: We've all read Voltaire, but thanks anyway.

No. I'm not looking for Fox News. I already know where it is.

You failed to advance a reason why C4 giving a platform to an enemy of our country is acceptable. He illegally detained a Royal Navy ship in the Straits of Hormuz and illegally held the crew prisoners. That act of aggression makes him an enemy of Britain.

Go back and report to your trollmeister that we at The Speccie demand a higher quality of literacy of the trolls on this site.

Jack R

What the dhimmis of Channel 4, and the political left beyond are in denial about is the long existing and expansionist Islamic Imperialism. While the slogan of 'American Imperialism' comes automatically to much of the political left, the notion of, and understanding of Islamic imperialism is off the political radar.

Much of the political left state that the rest of us must give free speech to The-Thug-In-Chief, but this same political left is totally intolerant of the BNP.

The British people should not allow a public service broadcaster to be publicly subsidised to put out such political propaganda from such a sub-Hitlerian type.

Wilhelm

Remember a few years back, Channel 4 put on a programme in which convicted child molester and rapist Jonnathan King was trying to justify his crimes.

They did the same with child molester Chris langham on that silly show '' Shrink Rap '' with dumb blonde interviewer Pamela Stephenson.

I suppose Channel 4 likes that sort of thing.

Jack R

THX1138.

-Hugh Fitzgerald:
"There is a certain kind of left-wing Iranian, the kind who at first supported the overthrow of the Shah and then found that the real and only winners were the Ayatollah Khomeini and the primitives who make up the Iranian masses. (These masses are not our sort -- not the Nafisi or Bina or Tabatabai sort, the sort who have names like Cyrus and Darius rather than Mohammad, but the sort who actually make up the masses of Iranians that those upper-class secularized Iranians in exile still can't quite recognize or allow themselves to understand, because it would be too painful.) For these left-wing Iranian the entire Khomeini phenomenon can be explained by two words or, possibly, three: 'Mossadegh.' 'Coup.' 'England.' In other words they want to believe, and want us to believe, that Shi'a Islam is just fine, and that if only Mossadegh had survived, and thrived, and the Shah had the feathers of the Peacock Throne clipped, everything would have been all right -- because such people still can't see how the very forces of modernization brought about by oil wealth would naturally unhinge the country.

"And its unhingement would in turn naturally cause Islam, the Islam of Khomeini and his ilk, to make a comeback. In this these Iranian leftists resemble the secular Shi'a in exile, who couldn't imagine what Iraq would turn out to be like, and how it would not conceivably rise to the fantastic occasion offered in by the American removal of Saddam Hussein. These 'unrepresentative' Best People, in Iraq and in Iran, simply can't face up to what most of their countrymen are deeply like, and deeply like because of Islam. They are embarrassed. They are personally and civilizationally embarrassed and don't know how to face it, deal with it, talk about it."

(For full article, Google: 'Fitzgerald -Blaming England'.)

Wilhelm

Hmmmm let me see

1. Nutty Achmed Dinnerjacket believes the holocaust didnt happen.
2. Wants to wipe Israel off the map.
3. Put all jews in Alaska.
4. Kidnaps British sailors.
5. Wants nuclear weapons.
6. Sends aid and guns to the taliban.

I suppose the multicultural facists love erroneous thinking and nutty logic.

Verity

Winston Smith - I support your heartbreaking shout at 7:32.

Paul

Oh get a grip folks. Similar to the Mad dog Gadaffi, Ahmadienjad will be invited to roll his heated tent in Paris and will get hugs from London, once he coughs up few billions to smooth things and reverses his nuclear status. It is only politics, don't believe the hype.

JohnAnt

Veerity - stable? friendly? democratic? You must be thinking of somewhere else. Admittedly Badawi is a (very slight) improvement on the awful Mahathir Mohamad, but corruption is still rife: see The Economist's article
http://www.economist.com/research/backgrounders/displaystory.cfm?story_id=8896739

also John Donovan's blog on 21 June 2008 in which Badawi is seen as another corrupt Malaysian politician.
http://royaldutchshellplc.com/2008/06/21/rampant-corruption-in-malaysia/

Read the whole of Mahathir's truly mind-bogglingly anti-western and anti-semitic speech
http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/malaysian.asp
which included the following "1.3 billion Muslims cannot be defeated by a few million Jews. There must be a way. And we can only find a way if we stop to think, to assess our weaknesses and our strength, to plan, to strategise and then to counter attack. As Muslims we must seek guidance from the Al-Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet....We are actually very strong. 1.3 billion people cannot be simply wiped out. The Europeans killed 6 million Jews out of 12 million. But today the Jews rule this world by proxy. They get others to fight and die for them."

According to Shad Saleem Faruqi, the constitutional expert, the Constitution has been amended 42 times over the 48 years since independence as of 2005. However, as several amendments were made each time, he estimates the true number of individual amendments is around 650. He has stated that "there is no doubt" that "the spirit of the original document has been diluted". This sentiment has been echoed by other legal scholars, who argue that important parts of the original Constitution, such as jus soli (right of birth) citizenship, a limitation on the variation of the number of electors in constituencies, and Parliamentary control of emergency powers have been so modified or altered by amendments that "the present Federal Constitution bears only a superficial resemblance to its original model". The rights of the executive have been strengthened to make it all-powerful today. And Article 10 (the right of freedom of speech) has been so qualified
and restricted as to be virtually useless. Equality? Certainly not. Malay citizens who convert out of Islam are no longer considered Malay under the law. Hence, the Bumiputra privileges afforded to Malays under Article 153 of the Constitution of Malaysia, the New Economic Policy (NEP), etc. are forfeit for such converts. n five states — Perak, Malacca, Sabah, Terengganu, and Pahang — conversion is a criminal offense which can be punished by a fine or jail term. In Pahang, convicted converts may also be punished with up to six strokes of the cane.
Don't try to get in as a refugee. The U.S. Committee for Refugees and Immigrants named Malaysia as one of the Ten Worst Places for Refugees on account of the country's discriminatory practices toward refugees. Malaysian officials are reported to have turned deportees directly over to human smugglers in 2007, and Malaysia employs the RELA, a volunteer militia, to enforce its immigration law.

Thiery Rommel, the European Commission's envoy to Malaysia, told Reuters by telephone on November 13, 2007 (the last day of his mission) that, "Today, this country still lives under (a state of) emergency."[15] Although not officially proclaimed as a state of emergency, the Emergency Ordinance and the Internal Security Act had allowed detention for years without trials.
Only ethnic Malays and certain indigenous minority races such as the Orang Asli and Iban enjoy full citizenship; the Chinese and Indians are not classified as Bumiputras ("people of the soil") and thus do not enjoy the same rights and privileges. Every citizen is issued a biometric smart chip identity card, known as MyKad, at the age of 12, and must carry the card at all times.
Malaysia's foreign minister last week:
"The best show of retaliation so far is the shoe throwing act by that remarkable reporter who gave President Bush his final farewell last week," Foreign Minister Rais Yatim said at an event to commemorate the 63rd anniversary of the United Nations.
"That shoe throwing episode, in my view is truly the best Weapon of Mass Destruction (WMD) to the leader who coined the phrase 'axis of evil' to denote Iran, Iraq and North Korea," Rais said, according to the advance text of his speech.'

Malaysia is certainly no worse than many other pseudo-parliamentary democracies. And Malaysians deserve our sympathy. But their government does not.

David Alexander

Homosexuals are hanged from cranes in Iran.
Women are raped and then hanged as adulterers from cranes in Iran.
Girls are stoned to death for having boyfriends of other faiths in Iran.
Merry Christmas Channel 4.

Nicholas

Winston Smith, I second that. Unfortunately the same nutty leftists you characterise so well will just dismiss your heartfelt acumen as "a silly right wing rant" or urge you to "grow up". They always seek to diminish rather than disagree, to abuse rather than argue. Which is why I decided some time ago to play them at their own game and just express open and utter contempt for them as pariahs responsible for the destruction of much of the good that was in Britain.

Their warm and tolerant feelings for freedom of speech also depend entirely on the message and the messenger. Try them out with something on their non-PC list and their appetite for free speech will disappear quite suddenly and remarkably, to be replaced by that knowing, cliquish, conspiracy of disapproval so familiar from the BBC and CH4. Bigots.

Their calls to combat fascism make me laugh. They are usually the biggest fascists on the planet. Their Political Correctness, imposed on a majority by a minority, is just the extreme fascism of thought and speech. Their ridiculous "struggle", inane given the once-omnipresent qualities of tolerance and goodwill in the country they were born in, has turned them into something far worse than the imaginary giants of the reactionary "establishment" they set out to tilt against. Since cutting their hair, camouflaging themselves as something other than revolutionary extremists and slithering into the corridors of power, whether in Whitehall, Westminster, Scotland Yard, the BBC or the local council offices, they have achieved a level of bigotry, intolerance and repression far beyond the mythical monsters they used to lampoon. The saddest thing about their sad, little lives is that they just can't see it.

And Andy Leeds I agree that the "Fascist Left" sums them up factually. It is just not pejorative enough and does not fully convey their inherently destructive, bigoted and corrupt ideology.

And, btw, before they accuse me of being right wing, or a Little Englander, or a bed-wetter, or whatever, I did not used to be right wing. In 1997 I was not right wing. It has taken almost 12 years of a ghastly, intellectually impoverished, cynical, self-serving, incompetent, idiotic and insane "Fascist Left" Labour government and its equally repulsive cronies to make me turn right at the crossroads. Now my ideology is to advance the complete and absolute discrediting and destruction of the "Fascist Left" in Britain. We need to get them before they get the blogs otherwise it will all be over.

Morecambe and Wise

this is proof positive that Brits have completely flipped out; another example is to have OASIS on the cover of the NME every bloody month. I suppose there is no chance your island will sink is there?

Wilhelm

Forgot to mention

7. Achmed Dinnerjacket believes gay people dont exist, because Iran doesnt have any gay people.
8. Public executions in the town square.
9. Beheadings and floggings

The leftwing facists must all be sado mashocists, Go figure.

TomTom

Die Welt reports that 100,000 Christians were murdered for their faith - that 90% of those suffering religious persecution are Christian....so on one of Christianity's two holiest days a Persecutor of Christians is given airtime.

Channel 4 is a self-indulgent coterie of spoiled children in need of trust fund revocation

Fred

It has taken great will power not to jump in and respond to various posters commenting on my original post. However I believe that comments on blog posts are just that, and not a mechanism for other individuals to engage in argument, or, as so often here, slanging matches. I treat the various questions as rhetorical.

I find it curious that no one has taken up the issue of realpolitik. All the remarks about the offensiveness of Iran's leader could just has well have been made about Gaddafi, with whom we now work with. Or Saudi Arabian leaders, or in a different context, the leaders of the IRA. I have no doubt that Milliband is talking to Ahmedinajad or his colleagues, in secret, and potentially we will invite him or a successor to this country.

Anyway, the postings, to my surprise, have revealed that too many people think freedom is something that applies to approved people and ideas. What we have here is a world divided, on one side: Gordon Brown, Ahmedinajad, many of the posters. On the other side, Channel4, me, and some posters. I hope for a better result in 2009.

Alf Tupper

Not your tart.

"I don't think any of you lot believe in freedom. That's why you love being at war so much,..."

Freedom is not the given that you appear to think it is. More often it needs to be put in place by the actions of brave people. Unfortunately, once in place, it will always be vulnerable to attack by those who would gain by its fall.

The defence of it against those attacks, we sometimes name 'war'.

Your freedom as well as mine was preserved by war.

Paul B

Reflecting overnight on this issue, and have come to the judgement that the issue is not issue of freedom of speech/curtailment of it.That is a diversion.

No, rather, this is is an issue about exercise of judgment & good taste. Its the same as the Ross/Brand issue at R2 and their lack of judgment.

Those people responsible for the decision to broadcast Ahmadienjad, have shown themselves up to nothing more than moronic, immature arseholes. They think they are when really they are hardly out of short trousers and the level of a group of 12 year old boys discovering toilet humour for the first time.(as were Ross & Brand)

They probably think they have struck some of meaningful victory for freedom of expression, when really all they have done is expose themselves as the village idiots. I laugh at their cretinously crass behavior and feel deeply sorry for them and those who support their actions.

luke

Couldnt agree more. Totally outrageous behaviour from C4. And a gross misjudgment. There were resignations over the Jonathan Ross thing, this is far far worse.

Trumpeter Lanfried

I am told Channel 4 have Robert Mugabe lined up for next year. For 2010 they've pencilled in Ian Brady.

Fergus Pickering

Oh come. Ama whatitis an ignorant fool. Isn't he a peasant? Even the religious sssholes find him an embarrassment. Hitler? More like the National Front. All those nasty things that happem to homosexuals and women happen in EVERY Muslim country more or less. Except Saddam's Iraq, that is. They had symphony orchetras there - and women playing violins in them. But we put a stop to all that. Tony Blair giving the elternative Christmas message - now THAT le really offensive.

Mr Boyce

I like Channel 4's annual "Fuck Christmas" scheduling on the 25th. I don't see what harm this program has done.

Winston Smith

THX1138,

Why do you use the word "we" when speaking of history? All I ever hear is 'We did this' and 'we did that' when it comes to many things in life such as Iran, or Afghanistan and the Taliban or Saddam Hussein.
I and I repeat 'I' did not do anything regarding the creation of Ahmadinejad's regime.
I'm really sick fed up of people that constantly use the pronoun and nominative plural of I to describe events that had nothing whatsoever to do with myself.

Let's get some things in perspective. If you are going to state that 'we' created Iran, why not be truthful in stating the government politicians involved in creating it?
As someone living in Britain, there was a second world war, but I did not fight against the Germans as I wasn't born. To state 'we' fought against the Germans, in grammatical terminology implies I had a part in the fighting.
Would you say that 'we' created 'The Haywain' or did Constable? Did we create the telephone or did Alexander Graham Bell? They were British after all like you and I. How much of a timescale do we give when talking in the collective 'we' to great events?

In fact, there is no need to use 'we' unless we are directly involved in the outcome. Sure we all pay taxes, where some people can equate our involvement, but then we have no choice in paying them.

So let's get realistic here and if you're going to mention such events, then put with it the names of those who were responsible in its creation. We the British didn't create Iran, politicians did, so name them.

mitch

Two small points
1 use the "off" button,dont watch him if you dont like his opinions.

2 Does anybody really believe he actually believes what he says eh?(think gordon on the economy)

Steven Smith

I commend channel 4's alternative christmas message: http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/politics/international_politics/the+alternative+christmas+message+/2892692

I didnt see any message of hate. It was infact 'insightful'. I recommend anyone with an open mind, as opposed to a narrow mind (like this blogger), to view it.

Finally, bear a thought to the 'human rights' we have for women in the west. Are they not raped here, are they not trafficked on your streets of london and manchester for forced sex, are young children not abused here?, was it not only recently that women had the right to vote?

Some people on this thread should look at their own backyard before criticising other nations. Maybe they should visit iran and see what it is really like. every country has its bad and plus points.

Thankyou channel 4. Happy new year!

Mar

I wonder whether Channel 4 would have invited Meir Kahanne to send a goodwill message to the British people during Ramadan. What they've done is utterly disgusting; words cannot express my revulsion.

Mar

Shall we be looking forward to seeing Nick Griffin address the nation next year on Christmas day? Oh God, is this Great Britain we are talking about?

Wilhelm

Fred 8.11am

Its a word salad, son.

Rob

There are far too many public service broadcast channels in this country. It's not just Channel 4 that should forfeit its right to be a public service broadcaster.

Andy Leeds

Ahmadienjad heads a vile regime where homosexuals are hanged; a young girl was hanged last year for a 'lack of modesty'; the state sponsors terrorsit activity and movements - the list could go on and on.

It is such a person that Channel 4 and the likes of Fred think we should sit and listen to. Why didn't Channel 4 ask for a message from President Bush for example ? They hate him with a passion.

It is all part of a pattern. It is time the overpaid morons at Channel 4 and the BBC were given a strong dose of reality. Let a load of them be shipped off to Iran and lets see how many of them end up in prison or being hanged from a crane some Friday.

Paul B, Nicholas and some others hit the nail on the head.

oldtimer

I think that C4 should now show the recent film Persepolis so that we can all see a slice of modern life in Iran.

Verity

John Ant - Mahathir kept the country cohesive and not too Islamic.

Obviously, Chinese and Indians are not classified as Bhumis. "Sons of the soil" only means indigene. A West Indian living in Britain is not an indigene. I think giving special rights to the people who own the country is not a bad idea. They have a deeper, longer claim, much more dearly bought. Why should some destructive Islamic primitive from a cave somewhere have the same rights and privileges in Britain and me and my family? It is insane.

Since Mahathir retired, the whole place has become more Islamic.

Back on topic, Paul B and others, the left is malign and destructive. People like Jonathan Ross and Brand are simply stupid, adolescent egotists. Ross is in his mid-forties and is headed straight from adolescence to dotage, having skipped maturity.

My point of focus is, the Iranians captured one of HM ships and kidnapped the crew. This was an act of aggression and makes him an enemy of the British state. He should not be given a voice in our country. He is a war criminal who committed a crime against the British people. What he does to his own people and what he thinks of Israel are not my concern. He committed an act of war against Britain, my country. And his ego is being rewarded by the traitors at Ch4.

Verity

Winston Smith - What an interesting post! You are correct. WWII was fought by the British who were alive at the time, a braver and steelier bunch than those who coopt their bravery and determination by employing "we".

Mitch, re your first point: How frightfully clever. You really are the Noel Coward of blogging.

Re your second point: Yes. Everything he says is informed by Islam and he believes every last breath of it. Some of it is taqqya, and he believes that in employing taqqya he is doing the will of his diety.

James J

The real issue is about accountability and control. Channel 4’s managers seem to be in the enviable position of not being accountable to anyone really. As long as the views expressed would not upset a cross section of their peer group-say a Focus Group made up of Teachers, Social Workers and Media professionals, they can indulge their prejudices to their heart’s content.
What an amazing situation. No doubt they also set each other’s salary and pension entitlement.
The posters who suggested that ‘Controversial’ would not include the leader of the BNP are missing the point. This would be controversial: among Channel 4’s staff, the only arbiters of taste with any influence. The role of the tax payer in this is just to fund it.

A. Nobody

Having viewed both Christmas Messages I found the Queen's was again predictable in the way she delivered the usual bland reworked platitudes 'we've all grown to know and love' peppered with her religiosity which, of late, has got me personally feeling uncomfortable being as we now live in a tolerant, multi-faith British society. That the Queen as monarch over ‘her subjects’ who practice many religions, should be head of the Church of England surely needs now to be questioned? As for the President of Iran’s message pushing religious content made me equally feel uncomfortable that a ‘political leader’ has the wherewithal to prate while sharing perfectly acceptable ‘peace in the world’ and all that stuff. His speech was as valid or not as the queen’s depending on your point of view as to state religion or monarchic anachronisms.

Wilhelm

6 months ago Channel 4 did a programme about the great Enoch Powell to celebrate the 40th anniversary of his often misquoted speech in 1968.

You didnt see Enoch Powell and his words were spoken by an actor, this tells you all you need to know about the leftwing facist Channel 4.

Winston Smith

Steven Smith,

Were you born yesterday? Is your middle name Gullible? Have you no idea of Human Rights and the fact that Iran does not honour them? There is so much wrong with your post.
Think again about why Ahmadinejad is curtailing favour with us? Do you truly think that Iran wants Nuclear weapons for peace, when taking into consideration Iran's brutal Islamist regim ? Think also about taquiya? Yes, think about taquiya......

Thomas

For me, the issue is that Ahmedinajad has been ordering his troops/agents to kill British soldiers in Iraq. I wouldn't complain were it not for this fact. It's one thing to be provocatove, that can be healthy, it's another thing to give a man who is guilty of ordering the deaths of British troops a platform to pontificate. For that reason, I shall be complaining. I can only imagine the pain caused to the families of those soldiers killed by IEDs in Iraq.

Winston Smith

Nicholas(December 26th, 2008 1:16am),

What an erudite commentary on the left. I have to say, my thoughts exactly. Not a word I can falter as you have managed to grasp the epitome of their left wing ideology, albeit the fascist one. You are correct in that the easiest way to end a debate and stifle conversation is to sully and lambast their opponent, or write off their comments as a 'right wing rant', being a Nazi, a bigot and/or indeed a fascist.
It is also the left wing's biggest and most well kept secret that fascism's parents are the left and not, in fact, the rights. Our very own society plays parallel to the extreme views of the Left as we have watched it become more and more controlled, more Orwellian, with such laws as 'hate speech' and of course 'Incitement to religious hatred'.
And yes, they have camouflaged themselves expedientially. They have realised that in order to win against an establishment they could not attack from outside, as years of failure had shown, but instead to get inside, mimic and destroy. Yes, the hair has been cut, the suit has been adorned and they have successfully infiltrated every major establishment and institution with which to indoctrinate the public with their insidious dogma, of course, subtly disguised as well.
I have to say that I would class myself as a radical humanist, culturist, that tends to be quite libertarian although leaning more to the right. I do agree completely with your stance, as you have seen the damage wrought upon the country by NuLabour and you are not alone as there are many who were no doubt supporters of the left who have now drastically changed their stance. I do however believe that they are and always have been more libertarian than left wing Nicholas.
How even more damaging to their cause that one such as you and to a small point myself speak as we do, as it shows that with wisdom comes knowledge, something the left wing have yet to experience and I fear will when it is too late to change their ruinous road to destruction and cultural oblivion.

Mike

The idea that Channel four provides a wider range of views is sadly laughable. The truth is its a comfortable protected niche where the left can thumb their nose at the public from the safety of tax payer subsidised sinecures. Their out put is predictable and uninspiring they know they will get publicity by abusing their position to push an anti semetic moron who is a joke even amongts the Mullahs in Iran. The left has become the party of privelage awarding each other jobs and rewards entirely divorced from their commercial success or talent. The degree of their entrenched privelage is such that they feel entitled and morally superior challenging our perceptions with a mixture of reality TV, soaps, porn and dated predictable late sixties politics. They substitute attention grabbing stunts for actual inovation and controversy for talent. Its pathetic but as long as we allow public money to be used for subsidies for these smug, hypocritical, self serving and mediocre timeservers we have no one to blame but ourselves.

Alf Tupper

THX1138.

Strikes me it's your collar that's becoming uncomfortable but that's maybe down to the fact that you're pretending to be a Brit.

Or maybe it's the fact that you lost so much on the jolly old far-eastern hedge-fund?

Coeur de Lion

There's a fragment to be gained out of this - given that A's speech was benignly statesmanlike, it would be nice to be able to quote chunks back at him/Iran from time to time when they behave badly.

Andy

"left wing tossers"

eloquently put.

you can do better than that.

Verity

Mike - I endorse every word and every thought. The long march through the institutions worked ... and will continue to stride forward until Britain is obliterated, unless you stop it ...

And how do you stop it?

I don't know. David Cameron is, essentially, an upmarket version of them.

Verity

Mike writes: "but as long as we allow public money to be used for subsidies for these smug, hypocritical, self serving and mediocre timeservers we have no one to blame but ourselves."

That's true.

And it's too late to wrestle the reins out of their hands.

You should have done it before Tony Blair. That he was elected by so many stupid, self-destructive people was the end of Britain as a free and sovereign country.

And also the end of the fresh air of liberty - the freedom to speak our own minds whenever we felt like it. In just 12 years, the entire population of Britain self-monitors before they dare say a word.

How bracing.

This destruction from within, of Britain is no mistake. They couldn't conquer us from without. But the British were supine in their own destruction.

Which tells us they're not as doughty as they thought. They let HM naval ship be boarded illegally in the Straits of Hormuz. The ship was under the command of a fat housewife called Fay and Fat Fay was a mother hen for all the upset boys on board.

Some dickhead in the MOD decided it would be OK for Fat Fay to make a penny or two out of the humiliation of the British Navy. And the plangent boy whose favourie CD got stolen and actually wanted sympathy from British taxpayers because it had been given to him by his girlfriend. Life doesn't get much harder as a sailor in the Queen's Navee.

This is the reason the president of Iran should not have been invited to address the British public (and supporter, through their taxes, of Ch4.)

Whether he hangs homosexuals from cranes and victimises Muslim women and doesn't like Israel is not the point.

Stay focussed. This is about destroying Britain.

This assault on Britain is the reason the president of Iran should not have been selected by Ch4. Although I'm sure, in their teen-agey way, they thought it "edgy". Cue the senile teen rebel Jonathan Ross.

Her Majesty's finest!

Justin Pearce

Maybe next year C4 will invite Sherry Jones's author of The Jewel of Medina, about Mohammed's six-year-old bride Ayisha.

stan mann

Has anyone else heard that as the sacred message went out,the Tehran offices of the BBC were being closed down by the authorities? If so,there's a message of some kind there,and I suspect it's not a sympathy protest about BBC license fees.Happy New Year,anyone?

THX1138

Winston -You're right I shouldn't have used "we". I should have said the British & American Governments in conjunction with the Anglo Persian Oil Company instigated a coup in the 50's that ousted the conservative democratic government of Mossadegh.

Peter Gompertz

Sorry Nicholas posting at 8.53 p m on 24th December I can't come up with a one word perjorative for John Snow and Channel 4, but how about 'wanky tossers'; and no I don't watch their feeble antics and I DON'T WANT TO READ ANY MORE ABOUT THESE CLOWNS! ALRIGHT?

NickB

Stalin is said to have had a phrase that fits so many of the people who are here defending Channel 4: "useful idiots." There's no suggestion that C4 should be banned from broadcasting scum like Ahmadienjad; merely that decency should preclude it. Idiots: ask yourselves this - would you be similarly enthusiastic in your defense of Mugabe, or the head of the KKK, or a defender of apartheid? I hope not - I'd rather they were hypocritical than utterly stupid.

richard bond

IRAN has much to fear reading these comments full of hatred. The President of Irans speech on CHANNEL 4 was graceful and respectful. Pity that we have no time to listen to a message of peace and hope..nothing changes. Rampup the western war machine for another short chapter on this doomed planet.

Michael

Verity: Malaysia has been a stable democratic country for around 60 years.

The constitution of Malaysia is rigged to ensure Malay rule. To ensure nothing much changes, the army & police are in the hands of the Malays. Some democracy!

Verity

Malaysia's more stable than Britain. That they protect the indigenes and ensure that they will remain in control strikes me as a rather good idea that we might copy.

Plus: it's their country. It is well ordered and peaceful. They don't trumpet it, but they are extremely, in partnership with Singapore, in the fight against terrorism and they do some outstanding detection work. They are a member of the Commonwealth in good standing. They are on friendly terms with all their neighbours - countries which are mainly Buddhist or, like Singapore, Taoist and Christian.

Finally, this thread is about the adolescent "edgy" obscenity of giving the president of Iran a voice during our Christmas celebrations, when he committed an act of aggression against HM Navy and thus Britain.