Andrew MacKay to step down

Rhoda Klapp

You might want to edit the first sentence for ambiguity.

Pete Hoskin

Rhoda: done! Thanks for pointing it out.

Kevyn Bodman

And SkyNews is running vox pop interviews in Bromsgrove and giving out the clear impression that Julie Kirkbride has lost so much support that her position is untenable.

Also I don't care how big a 'personal loss' this is to Cameron. And I suspect he won't either. Nor should he.

His 'personal loss' is of no importance whatever in a case like this.

UKIP Gaze

Good riddance.
http://ukipgaze.blogspot.com

John Noakes on Blue Peter

I hope he hasn't put his toupee on his expenses. If he has, not only have we been diddled, but so has he. It looks like John Noakes made it for him on Blue Peter.

Fraser Nelson

Rhoda, I did just that. Apologies to other coffee housers - in our rush to get this out the first version read as if it was I - not Mackay - who had spoken to Cameron this morning.

strapworld

You might wish to edit your last sentence for ambiguity too!

Lets face it, Mr Nelson, he has not done anything at all about his shadow cabinet colleagues, especially the odious Maude!!

There does appear to be an anti tory aspect growing in relation to expenses. Cameron can only go the whole hog and clean out his stables.

Any MP in or our of the shadow cabinet who have been named and shamed must be whoen the door!

Only then will Cameron be able to stand tall.

GeoffH

Meanwhile, Brown is p*ssy-whipped by his wimmin, Bears and Flint.

Well, done DC.

strapworld

You might wish to edit your last sentence for ambiguity too!

David Cameron has only one option now, as it does appear that the Tories are coming off worst in this expenses scandal. That option is the nuclear one. Rid the party of ALL MP's who have been named and shamed. Only then will Cameron be able to stand tall.

David

"Rid the party of ALL MP's who have been named and shamed. "

What if they've been named erroneously? The Telegraph is using hardly any judgement as to whether those it names for claiming expenses have done so legitimately or not.

perdix

BBC R4 spinning that the revelations on MPs' expenses due to Labour's FOI Act!Tell that to The Speaker!

jon dee

Re Kevyn Bodman 4.49pm

Agreed.Julie Kirkbride has lost local sympathy and she should stand down.

Proactive management of the crisis will get public support but MacKay type prevarications look weak.

David Cameron must continue the fair and swift action to which you refer.

Andy Leeds

I too think it is turning anti-Tory. The 'moat cleaning' is what has stuck in popular imagination, rather than two Labour MPs who claimed mortgage interest for mortgages which did not exist. Did anyone say fraud ? Labour have behaved disgracefully and they should carry the can for it.

Jeremy

"It is often asked which party has suffered most due to all this, and I suspect the party that emerges best will be the one that deals with the problem most decisively. So far, Cameron's swift action puts him ahead in this increasingly important regard."

In principle, I think that you are right. But there is a danger that if Cameron keeps on drawing the media's attention to the Conservative Party by repeatedly taking action against those of his own MPs who have transgressed, then that attention may, in itself, serve to disguise the fact that Brown and Labour have done, and are doing, nothing - or next to nothing - about their own transgressors. There may be a political risk associated with this strategy of Cameron's.

I suspect that a very subtle political game is beginning to emerge and be played in precisely this area.

I also do not think that Cameron should allow himself to be conned by Brown into forming a coalition government with Labour and the Liberal Democrats, because (from Labour's perspective) that would merely serve to keep a discredited government, a discredited Prime Minister and a discredited Labour Party in power. In a wider context, a coalition government would also enable a discredited and corrupt "political class" to come together and present a united front to the electorate. Something which, in their calculation, might also serve as the excuse to avoid a General Election and therebye prolong their own rule. This, I think, would not be desireable.

My feeling is that the "political class" does not wish to see itself wiped out at the polls, so in the current climate it will avoid a General Election for so long as it possibly can.

It is also possible - given Brown's remark about the "chaos" that he says would ensue if there was a General Election - that if he is given the excuse (or opportunity) to declare a state of National Emergency and with it a National Government (therebye, again, avoiding a General Election and prolonging the rule of "the political class"), then he will take it.

I also think that Lord Tebbit's advice in relation to this matter is both good and should be heeded - that there should be a General Election, but not until later this year, in order to give the political parties themselves the chance to properly identify and kick out the wrongdoers. If we hold a General Election in haste, then those not yet identified may be returned at the polls and have their behaviour, by this means, "legitimised".

john

Cameron should only fire those who broke the law or who seriously took the p***.
Any teacher, doctor, civil servant, etc, on being told we can't give you a rise, but we'll increase your expenses, would say thank you very much.
Let's stop being hypocrites, for God's sake.

Nicholas

" . . . it does appear that the Tories are coming off worst in this expenses scandal."

How? What? Eh?

TGF UKIP

"Cameron has been prepared to say goodbye to Mackay." Come off it James! Typical heirite Speccie gloss. Mackay had no option and plainly neither did Dave.

Not only was Mackay freeloading on the taxpayer, he also had the unfortunate burden of an appearance and manner of a man who it would be very hard not to dislike.

Kirkbride is history too and Strapworld is as usual bang on with his analysis.

Trevorsden

I do not see the Tories coming off 'worst' - it seems Tory associations and the Tory party are behaving more responsibly than Labour ones. After all Blears is still standing, Hoon is given a green light.

In terms of reporting - is anyone surprised that the BBC is picking on Conservatives and going soft on Labour?

Such comments seem to betray the hysteria rampant. The Telegraph is pushing its own agenda. Searching thbrough the records is clearly going to take time and the telegraph is peddling the story to suit its circulation needs.

I wonder at other papers happily dancing to the Telegraphs tune. they must be losing orders if the Telegraphs are up.

TGF UKIP

Sorry, James, that should read "come off it Fraser."

Whitewash brushes all round I guess at Old Queen Street.

TGF UKIP

For those interested, The Sun has a petition demanding that Gordon call a GE at thesun.co.uk

WhatDoIKnow

This is good news; too late though; the Tories have lost the battle in the last few days. The Telegraph has already ensured Labour are now likely to remain in power after the next general election, probably with the Lib Dems or maybe with a small majority. The news media have already decided this is all about Tory sleaze: it's the only story in town. 'Tory sleaze' and 'Tory cuts' will wreck us.

Verity

Strapworld, even if I liked or respected Cameron, I would not agree with you here.

For one thing, NuLabour, despite being panicked, has manipulated this saga to make it appear that Tory toffs are the worst offenders, when it is, in fact, overwhelmingly Labourites with not just their snouts but their trotters in the trough.

Were Cameron to sack all the Tory MPs implicated, that would be playing into the socialists' hands. They then would read the riot act to their own apparachiks, but not sack anyone, and everything would continue as before, except the Conservative presence in Parliament would have been decimated.

Frankly, I'm not even certain he should have sacked MacKay, because he has been manipulated into it by people who are cleverer tacticians than he is.

True Bred Pomponian

Only when Cameron is ready to get rid of Gove will he be fit to lead this country.

Dave

It gets worse. According to reports on Sky Julie's house was occupied by her brother and registered as his office!

TGF UKIP

For those interested, The Sun has a petition demanding that Gordon call a GE at thesun.co.uk

Fraser Nelson

strapworld, Mackay was a frontbencher and on a practical basis more important to Cameron than Maude. But I do agree that Maude's case was petty bad.

Common Place

The Tories are in danger of looking like the Stupid Party.

Time for some pretty deft footwork starting with Kirkbride.

strapworld

LEST YE FORGET.

TWENTY HIGHEST EXPENSES CLAIMANTS

Total claims 2005-08 (excluding travel)

Liam Byrne £ 478,536 LABOUR

Joan Ryan £ 469,893 LABOUR

Dan Norris £ 450,985 LABOUR

Shahid Malik £ 446,314 LABOUR

Charlotte Atkins £ 443,244 LABOUR

David Wilshire £ 438,377 TORY

Tom Levitt £ 436,686 LABOUR

Diana Johnson £ 436,632 LABOUR

Fabian Hamilton
£ 435,999 LABOUR

Jacqui Smith £ 434,909 LABOUR

Margaret Moran £ 434,456 LABOUR

Ian Austin £ 434,409 LABOUR

A. Rosindell £ 434,149 TORY

Andrew George £ 434,062 LIBDEM

Dawn Butler £ 433,865 LABOUR

Roger Godsiff £ 433,298 LABOUR

Tim Farron £ 433,260 LABOUR

Peter Hain £ 431,905 LABOUR

Norman Lamb £ 431,683 LIBDEM

S. Hesford £ 431,527 LABOUR

Source: The Sunday Times 17.05/09

TGF UKIP

Fraser, I wonder if you saw Question Time on Thursday night?
It's a programme I rarely watch but did so on this week because of the subject.

However, the one thing which did strike me was that the comment from the audience which drew most all round agreement and applause was from a guy who said it wasn't just the expenses or even so much the expenses as "the way that they always all talk down to us."

And how right he was. They, and the Cameron Tories as much if not more than anyone, by and large ignore the public's agenda in favour of their own.

The most obvious manifestation of this is the green agenda which comes way down on the public's list of priorities but gets thrust down our throats day in and day out and by no one more than the Speccie's dearly beloved Dave.

Indeed, last year in one of his many green speeches Dave came out with the rather priceless opinion that those who didn't believe in global warming "should" do.

Truly his lectern should be replaced by a pulpit so determinedly is he The Heir to the Vicar of St Albions.

PS As the Mekon returns to this country in July no doubt we should expect to be even more preached at and talked down to on their greenery.

Austin Barry

The serial demise of these cheats and chiselers is hugely satisfying, even invigorating. I'm anticipating the banishment of Julie, Jacqui, Hazel, Margaret M, Margaret B, Hoon, Purnell, McNulty with glee. And then, ultimately, the baleful, cycloptic, imposter-PM hauled from his bunker to howls of execration. Oh frabjous day calloo callay, we shall all chortle as Mr Congealed Porridge is escorted to the Tower.

Verity

The meeting between MacKay and Cameron should have been kept private. MacKay should have returned to his constituency, and on Sunday or Monday announced that he had consulted with his constituents and all were agreed that his staying in the job would not serve them best. And resigned.

David Cameron should not have elbowed his way forward to be seen to be showing Leadership. It was unnecessary and, in my belief, weakening.

Notice that someone who has been far more effective at manipulating events over the past few days - having deflected rage from Labour's far more serious guilt onto the Tories has not been making any statements from No 10.

Cameron should similarly have kept his mouth firmly zipped.

David

"Only when Cameron is ready to get rid of Gove will he be fit to lead this country."

The fact of Gove doing hardly anything wrong notwithstanding, eh?

Peter Buss

For the Tories, sleeze is absolutely toxic and Cameron is spot on in continually getting ahead of Brown in this matter.Cameron has to keep showing he "gets it" and he really is not like the old lot. That he is doing with as much success as can reasonably be expected in this situation. Frankly the only reason why the Tories are not hovering around 30pts in the polls for a GE IS Cameron, as the voters see him as different from the old Tories.Just read the polls which show Cameron way ahead of his own Party's rating. I shall never understand why so many Tory bloggers keep putting the knife into Cameron when the guy is the biggest asset the Tories have.

Susan Hill

@john. Increasing expenses is one thing.. you can do this perfectly legitimately by making mileage, say, 70p a mile instead of 50p. and there would be no problem about anybody taking advantage of it. It is not a question of putting up expenses but of allowing downright fiddling and turning a blind eye. You can say, we will allow you, say, your full Council Tax. That does not mean someone can then claim for having their moat cleaned.

Rob

To those saying that 'Tory toffs' has stuck, not 'Labour corruption', I say bide your time. Labour may yet face some prosecutions once they think they have weathered the storm.

Ken

Verity:
Liebour can try to be as "clever" as it likes, it is dead, deceased, off the perch, face down in a puddle of bile, hated and despised in equal measure, never more will it be resuscitated.

When the squatter in No 10 is finally evicted at an election, all his co-trotterers will be hauled off to the abbatoir.

Voters always win in democracy (unless their votes are stolen by Liebour postal voting scams).

Verity

Ken - The voters certainly didn't win anything except impoverishment of their democracy and diminution of their ancients rights in their own country - i.e., the butchering of free speech - in order not to offend or enrage uninvited incomers. They also won a wrecking ball taken to their second chamber, their Constitution and their Bill of Rights.

Other than that, Mrs Lincoln, "victors alays win in a democracy".

strapworld

LEST YE FORGET!

TWENTY HIGHEST EXPENSES CLAIMANTS

Total claims 2005-08 (excluding travel)

Liam Byrne £ 478,536 LABOUR

Joan Ryan £ 469,893 LABOUR

Dan Norris £ 450,985 LABOUR

Shahid Malik £ 446,314 LABOUR

Charlotte Atkins £ 443,244 LABOUR

David Wilshire £ 438,377 TORY

Tom Levitt £ 436,686 LABOUR

Diana Johnson £ 436,632 LABOUR

Fabian Hamilton £ 435,999 LABOUR

Jacqui Smith £ 434,909 LABOUR

Margaret Moran £ 434,456 LABOUR

Ian Austin £ 434,409 LABOUR

A. Rosindell £ 434,149 TORY

Andrew George £ 434,062 LIBDEM

Dawn Butler £ 433,865 LABOUR

Roger Godsiff £ 433,298 LABOUR

Tim Farron £ 433,260 LABOUR

Peter Hain £ 431,905 LABOUR

Norman Lamb £ 431,683 LIBDEM

S. Hesford £ 431,527 LABOUR

Source: The Sunday Times 17.05/09

toni

@Ken. (unless their votes are stolen by Liebour postal voting scams)

"Tory councillor jailed for using 'ghost voters' to rig local election"
By DAILY MAIL REPORTER 02/05/2009 12:34:34A
"former Tory candidate and five others were jailed on Friday for using 'ghost' voters to win a local council ballot"

David

"Cameron should similarly have kept his mouth firmly zipped."

Utter rubbish. The least thing Cameron needs is to look as ineffective as you hope he will be.

Verity

Strapworld, Well posted and thanks very much!

But the usual suspects are sitting in Downing Street quietly spinning, spinning, spinning and in the meantime David Cameron is making flashy self-serving displays of being in charge. He should either be attacking Labour or zip his lip and do things behind the scenes.

MacKay should have stepped down only, "after consulting with constituents". Cameron's self-elevating drama over this episode only served to make the Tories look as guilty as Labour, when they're nowhere close. As Strapworld's chart shows.

Denis Cooper

So when is MacKay standing down?

Next May.

Why not today?

If he's agreed that he must go, he should go now.

Disgusted Cheshire

last night "Oscar" said that C4 had said the "moat cleaning" and the "duck house" were claimed but refused by the fees office. So Labour "smears" have worked in smearing the Tory Party yet again by ensuring that a compliant press heads their articles on this disgusting expenses scandal "expenses such as moat cleaning or duck houses" before mentioning or ignoring Labour fraud!!

True Bred Pomponian

David, now let me see, Gove took advantage of the second hopme allowances to set up a second home. Then, when he decided he didn't like the arrangement, he changed it at our expense. This does not happen in the real world. He also has a second job, which may have caused problems. However, he is immune from Cameron's censure because he is a mate and seen as a key player. Being ready to ditch somebody when there is a personal cost is a yardstick of leadership.

David

"This does not happen in the real world."

Yes, it does. There were legitimate reasons for changing the designation, as there can be and are. I'm not being led by the nose by the Telegraph and media on this, and neither will I subscribe to the lynch mob mentality which states there is no such thing as a legitimate expenses claim for MPs.