Cameron has diagnosed the problem, now he must prescribe the cure

Neil Turner

Absolutely right - this is THE fundamental issue

ie that the politicians SHOULD control the fundamentals, and that the electorate MUST keep the politicians accountable, and hold them on a short leash

Much of New Labour's agenda (and Maastricht before that) has systematically and deliberately acted for the opposite

This is absolutely why most voters have lost faith in the political system. It is also the root cause of almost every bad piece of legislation enacted over the last 20 years

Everythin else, icluding "expenses", political correctness, Human Rights law, and loss of sovereignty to the EU is merely a symptom

Rhoda Klapp

"Bringing back powers from Brussels"

How exactly is that to be achieved? Let me list the powers that the Eu has given back so far...

The Reluctant Revolutionary

I fully agree. Unfortunately Cameron is yet to show any signs that he has the backbone to lead the radical reform needed.

The Labour and Libdem parties are disgustingly perverted in their self-serving nature. They are both lost causes.

If the Conservatives fail this time they will be so to. None of the smaller parties actually get it.

There may be only one course left if nothing is done in the next Parliament.

Overthrow Brussels, Westminster, the party system, the public sector the whole damn lot.

Time is running out for this intellectually bereft, corrupt and dishonest political class.

They have wrecked this country and the time is coming when we the country must return the favour!

John Leighton

Cameron really does understand peoples wants. So, the people will vote him in.

He should be worries about delivery now. He needs to be preparing a tentative legislative timetable right now

Herbert Thornton

The disappointing thing is that Cameron lacks not just the stomach, but the heart. He may - hoping it will attract votes - admit that he has some idea of what people really want - independence from Europe, a stop to immigration and a solution to the presence of Islam - but his belief is that doing all that for them is too much trouble, and in any case they ought not to want it. Is it any wonder that people are turning to the BNP?

Grumpy Old Man

Getting rid of the quangocrats is a no-brainer, as is obliterating the Regional tier of govt. both are in place because local opinions are steadfastly opposed to Govt. "initiatives". DC is very ambivalent over the whole European question, and has still not given a firm assurance about the promised referendum over Lisbon.

Vulture

I think we already know what Cameron is made of: pure pink blancmange. Asked in the West Country last week what his Govt would do if the Liebon Treaty is already ratified when he gets in, the cheer leader replied: "We'll just have to live with it".

For all those Tories who do not want to see our country reduced to a glorified county council rubber-stamping Brussels diktats only one course remains: resistance.

That means in practice: voting UKIP at the Euro elections; ensuring the election of hard Eurosceptic candidates rather than Dave's lists of vapid celebs in upcoming Westminster seats suddenly and unexpectedly vacated by their current occupants (eg. Bracknell & Bromsgrove) ; and generally making life for a Dave Government so damn difficult and miserable - a la Major's Maastricht bastards - that he will be made to concede. Getting a naturally soft Dave hard and keeping him that way will be a long, gruelling, painful campaign but it must be done.

Verity

Read his words very carefully, because Cameron's sentences are artfully constructed to give one impression, while making no commitments.

Sue

That is it in a nutshell.

That our legislature has been absorbed in fiddling expenses on naff cushions and floaty duck houses is bad enough, but in doing so, has participated in giving away the sovereignty of the country, smashing the economy, and disestablishing the rights, ancient liberties and freedoms of the peoples is unconscionable.

That Cameron has only just realized this is truly, truly appalling. What did he imagine Her Majesty's opposition was for?

mac

Hurrah! Now we're talking.

I can contemplate voting for Cameron if your final paragraph typifies the Tories' approach, James. A programme of serious national repair - ignoring assorted Pollyanna-ish and vested interest squealing - is needed, and this sort of realism will do for starters.

TGF UKIP

Absolutely, James, and back to last Thursday's special edition of Question Time on MP's expenses. As I noted then the comment from the audience that got most widespread agreement and applause was from a youngish guy in the back row who said it's not just the expenses, not even the expenses, it's the way they always all talk down to us.

Dead right mate! And who, James is more guilty of this than your dearly beloved Dave.

In two weeks time there is going to be much wailing and hand wringing from yourself and the other villagers over the number of voters in urban areas who vote for the BNP and why the fuck shouldn't they! At least the BNP make some semblance of an effort to connect with them and appeal to them.

The respectable native working class has been ignored, despised and patronized by the London villagers, political and media alike, for decades.

And off-hand I can think of no bigger offender here than Cameron who doesn't even make the slightest pretence of concerning himself with the preoccupations or priorities of the core of the Conservative Party, preferring to always talk down to them about what he thinks should be their concerns.

Is anything more at a complete tangent to the central concerns of the average Joe Bloggs Brit than Cameron's central obsessions of climate change and foreign aid. Indeed, could there be anything more likely to rile Joe Bloggs than the thought of his hard earned taxes not just being scammed by MPs but handed over to dubious African regimes and competing economies like India and China.

No politician is less entitled to speak about the disconnection and disenfranchisement of voters than Cameron.

Carly Anthony

Exactly right James. The more I see and hear of Cameron recently, the more I think he really does 'get it'. I hope he does become Prime Minister because he is intelligent, principled and could go down as one of our greatest leaders along with Thatcher and Churchill. This country is in such a state right now, he has a herculean task ahead of him but I think he is up to it.

Andy Leeds

Exactly. It's not just the political class which is hopelessly out of touch: it is you lot too. The 'chattering classes' simply live in another world too, divorced from reality and the real concerns of ordinary people. So welcome to the real world. Time to listen too.

Julian Boulter

Sounds like he has been listening to Carswell and Hannan and reading "The Plan". I picked up on those words on Sunday and it made my mind up to vote Conservative on 4 June, when I had been wavering on a UKIP protest vote.

Stan, UK

Dominic Grieve would be no loss to a Conservative Government. Why he's even in the shadow cabinet is beyond me.

JHill

How can people have faith in current sentencing policy? Baby P's mother could be out in three years yet Chris Lewis gets 13 years for drug smuggling. Both serious crimes of course but the memory of this defenceless child is demeaned by the paltry punishments handed out to the perpetrators. The short sentences handed out for death by dangerous/careless driving also infuriate people.

Rather than bemoaning the current state of affairs I would like to know how the conservatives will address sentencing policy.

Laura

Never mind overriding Dominic Grieve, just sack or move him to another brief and put someone at Justice who, like Cameron, actually gets it. The situation requires the kind of radical thought that Gove has brought to the education brief.

wonderfulforhisage

Come on Verity, how about a bit of 'joy in one sinner that repenteth'?

On the other hand, I do take your point.

Still the good news is that much as Dave is seriously light in the leadership department he's a first rate follower of focus groups. If he does gain the keys to no.10 let's hope the focus groups of the day are as fed up with the EU as they are at the moment. Realistically it's the Country's only hope.

chris

Now we're finally getting somewhere. We want a bottom up Democracy, which will result in our 'Federal' (oops) central Government sticking to those areas where overall national interest is the over-riding factor and allow local democracy to thrive (ending the current ludicrous box-ticking operation which drives local authorities). How do we get there? By discussing it, voting on it, and getting what we want. This process will then make it clear to us how our international obligations and trading needs can be best put in place within our membership of the EU., and other global organisations which are essential to not only our own appropriate global contribution, but for the benefit of the human race.

We must, meanwhile, as Martin Wolf points out in a recent FT article, "diversify our economy away from finance. The 'old normal' was simply unsustainable. The 'new normal' must be very different. It is far from clear that industry and government recognise this grim truth."

David Cameron, please note.............

David Cameron has correctly diagnosed what the problem is. Amen for that.

The problem he has identified has not just happened it has come about by design.

It is part of the EU's raison d'etre that power must be taken from national parliaments and away from the people and vested in to supranational / federal institutions, such as the European Commission, European Judiciary etc. In addition too any powers are given to Quangoes and are out sourced.

The Lisbon Treaty expands and deepens this process even more.

The party(s) that can address this problem gets a long period in Government (Accountable Government!). The party(s) that fail to address this will preside over mounting discontent, social unrest and increase in extremism whilst themselves being despised.

You have a golden opportunity to do something Mr Cameron. Take it and be admired or reject it and be despised!

UKIP Gaze

You're in the EU and play by their rules or you're not. As simple as that. Cameron won't reform the damn thing from within and is deluded if he thinks otherwise.
http://ukipgaze.blogspot.com/

Chris

There are few things as hateful as anyone who thinks that conforming to the most basic international standards on human rights is a bad thing.

Olaf Rye

The political classes in Westminster all have some sympathy with the European Union and relinquishing their responsibilities to another body. It is not too difficult for them to repatriate our rights--abrogating treaties is not nice, and the EU will squeal, but it is scarcely difficult to achieve. The fact that Cameron, and all the other leaders, dare not contemplate this is an admission of their comfort with the idea of subordinating our rights to a supra-national body.

The Europeans feel that this prevents fascism, or at least this is their excuse for such moral cowardice. Ultimately, the only protection from fascism (both red and black) is a defence of civil liberties and the support of the old-fashioned liberal stance which recognises that freedom from state interference is our best guarantee of prosperity and independence. It shows how much our political classes have abandoned the liberal tradition that there is not a single one willing to defend individual liberty.

Denis Cooper

Parliament remains, ultimately, our supreme law-making body; its legal sovereignty is undiminished and unimpaired, but it is simply not being exercised.

If a majority of the House of Commons vote for Parliament to take back powers that were previously delegated to other bodies, or for specified EU laws to be disapplied within the UK, or for UK courts to disregard the case law of the ECHR, then that is exactly what will happen.

As presently composed the House of Lords might resist, but in the end the Parliament Acts will be applied and the Commons will get its way - with a very few exceptions, most notably any Bill to prolong the life of Parliament.

So it all revolves around getting a majority of MPs with the patriotism, and commitment to democracy, and the backbone, to do it.

They would have very strong public support, according to this:

http://www.taxpayersalliance.com/home/voters-ready-for-an-eu-revolt.html

"New Poll: Voters of all parties ready for an EU revolt".

Publius

Vulture. You say above:

'Asked in the West Country last week what his Govt would do if the Liebon Treaty is already ratified when he gets in, the cheer leader replied: "We'll just have to live with it".'

Are you saying Cameron said this? Is it a matter of public record? Can anyone on The Speccie team verify this? Because I, for one, most certainly do not want to "just live with" this Lisbon treaty that has so deceitfully been imposed on us -- and indeed mostly implemented even before it has been ratified.

Denis Cooper

Verity is right: Cameron is a politician, and every public statement he makes has to be carefully deconstructed in the context of all other available information.

My questions are always not so much "whether Cameron has the stomach for these fights", but rather "whether Cameron actually means what he appears to say", and "whether Cameron has any intention of ever doing what he seems to be promising".

Lisbon Treaty, for example; what exactly would he do if the treaty was already in force when he became Prime Minister, with his vague threat that "we wouldn't let it rest there"?

Nothing of any significance, I suspect; rather like somebody who's lost an argument muttering "You haven't heard the last of this" as he walks away.

TGF UKIP

Sorry, it seems to me that a lot of Coffee Housers are missing the central point here. This is far from being just about Brussels.

As Dave himself says about our simmering citizens "They want more control over their politics and their politicians."

Dead right, Dave, but the anomaly is that no politician more than you chooses to bypass the concerns of ordinary Brits. Nobody as a politician is more disconnected and nobody pays less heed to anyone other than a tiny target market of THX 1138s than David Cameron. And nobody but nobody lectures and talks down to the voter more than you Dave.

Jeremy

"People’s anger about expenses has been so great not just because MPs were playing the system and diddling the public purse..."

I think the point - at least from my own perspective - is that what has come to be called "the political class" has wholly financed itself into being at the expense of the taxpayer. That is to say, by knowingly and cynically defrauding the public's purse. I mean these people are not just living for free, they have actually prospered mightily - and wholly - at taxpayers' expense. They have been doing it for years and have bent over backwards to keep the knowledge of what they have been doing from those who actually pay their bills. I think this horrible state of affairs is compounded by the fact that - irrespective of whether or not they now lose their seats - they have already, de facto, escaped with their ill-gotten gains. Short of selling off their property portfolios, reclaiming (for the Exchequer) the moneys they have so spectacularly filched - as well as depriving them of their parliamentary pensions - I really do not see how they can now be touched. And there's the rub that ordinary people are feeling.

Irony of ironies - it is the Labour government and the "political class" that has grown up under its tenure of office that have been living more comprehensively and more completely off taxpayers' backs than ever the Bourbon monarchy could have dreamed of doing.

JONNY

Suddenly Cameron's clicked.
Anyone noticed?
Abracadabra He's the only news in town (with apologies to Cheerful Charlie Johnson with his half-baked AV Referendum gesture).
With very few exceptions, the rest are pygmies.
(The ones who aren't dead ducks).

It's called Seizing the High Ground.
What Napoleon did when he occupied the Heights of Pratzen.

Verity

Carly Anthony, referring to Cameron - "I hope he does become Prime Minister because he is intelligent, principled and could go down as one of our greatest leaders along with Thatcher and Churchill."

Good grief!

the white dragon of olde england

Verity is spot on. We have to purge the hold COMMON PURPOSE has on every branch of public life. Media. Politics. Education. Health. Armed Service. Social Service. Police. Councils. All have been infiltrated by this odious EU controlled organisation.

Not one newspaper. Not one journalist, not one editor, nor television or radio has allowed this to be mentioned at all. Now is that not weird?

Just people like me harping on about this 'charity' and being ignored.

Believe me, this should be as great a concern to people as the EUitself. Cameron has not got a hope without killing off Common Purpose.

Maude is a member!

Rhys Burriss

Whilst all three PArty Leaders lack a lot to be desired, I am starting to get the impression that Mr Cameron'gets it' more than do the other two - the people's disgust with the incompetent time-servers - but the fact that it's by no means just about the frauds...... It is that these highlight how tawdry the MPs are - how they pay extremely detailed attention to what they perceive to be their entitlements [ 'pray where is my son supposed to sleep if you do not pay for his cot?' ) and zero attention to scrutinizing god-awful legislation - such as to take but one example, the 1991 Criminal Justice Act which required Magistrates and Judges to take no account of previous convictions when sentencing . Thus a burglar with a hundred previous convictions had to be treated as if a first time offender. This was under a Tory Government ( not a single MP pointing out its absurdities) and with Labour stating that they opposed that Bill because it did 'not go far enough in emptying the prisons'.

It's that kind of gross incompetence which has finally caused us all to blow our tops.

So - what is to be done? DC may be making a very useful start with his advocacy of OPEN PRIMARIES NOW !!!!! If these were indeed to become the norm (and/ or if the Approved LIst were genuinely opened up to people of real-life experience, even if over 50 [ there is an unofficial quasi- ban, effectively at present]) there would emerge a new intake of really well qualified / experienced individuals who have actually achieved some success in a career or trade over 20 or more years. And whose expertise and seriousness would be really useful in Government.

For example: People talk about staying in or leaving the ECHR ( European Court of Human Rights) set up. It appals me that there are so few MPs with interest or experience in International Law.
HAving that experience myself I would like to argue that ( although my own preference is in fact to leave the ECHR and repeal the HRA, I accept that for some the political difficulties are too strong) posing the alternatives that starkly overlooks the fact that it would be possible to overhaul and rebalance the Treaty creating the ECHR.
The UK would by no means lack political allies amongst , eg the Nordic countries, some of which submitted amicus briefs supporting the UK's stance when the ECHR considered the issue of whether persons in prison should be allowed to vote. This was debated in Parliament about 8 years ago and it was decided to keep the prohibition on imprisoned criminals from voting. One can see the opposing argument also has an appeal but so far so democratic. But it has been overturned by the ECHR and the UK Government is now slavishly turning the UK's policy upside down on the issue.
The point I am making is twofold: 1] the UK should not just accept a simple majority decision of the ECHR Judges as having validity to overturn UK legislation. There would be support amongst other Treaty States to re-balance so that only if a qualified majority - say 2/3 or even 3/4 of the Judges decided that national legislation contravened 'Human Rights' principles would they be entitled to strike it down.
That's point [1]; but point [2] is that it seems to have occurred to no-one at all in Parliament to argue this case - the expertise just isn't there. And neither will it get there ( or other expertise) unless the Approved List is genuinely loosened to intending candidates of all ages and the resulting increase in prospective parliamentary candidates put through their paces at OPEN PRIMARIES NOW !!!!!

strapworld

The only way, and the easiest, to bring back powers from Brussels?

Referendum IN or OUT. When the result comes OUT.

Open negotiations with the Commonwealth and let us get back trading with our old friends.

We can then re discover our old self and become the dynamic nation again, under Cameron and the EU will want to trade with us. I bet, in time, Scotland will want to come back to us!!

No chance.

drakes drum

A weak chin normally implies a weak character.

Cameron has a very weak chin!

Could you see him complete the Royal Marine's obstacle course?

He says he wants more people to become candidates. As long as they comply to the criteria demanded by him and be listed!! What chance have we the people got for change?

He is a weak man!

Edward

"There are few things as hateful as anyone who thinks that conforming to the most basic international standards on human rights is a bad thing".

Yes Chris, I agree.
Unfortunately human rights and its legislation left the territory of the adjective "basic" long ago.
Unfortunately, within the UK it has become a lucrative industry. Lucrative mainly for lawyers. It has become a game to be played. It has become a system to be manipulated. It has become a rod with which ordinary, responsible law-abiding people have their backs beaten.
Basic human rights ? Yes.
As a tool of the state ? No.

I presume you brought up the subject of "human rights" because you think that it's everyone's human right to have a government it can trust ?
Or am I mistaken ?

Jeremy

To JONNY:

"It's called Seizing the High Ground.
What Napoleon did when he occupied the Heights of Pratzen."

...and what Wellington did at Waterloo?

Andy Leeds

Denis, perhaps Cameron should put down a 'marker' now. He should make a binding declaration that although the treat has already received Royal Assent his first action will be to repeal the Act and reintroduce the Lisbon Treaty bill with ratification being subject to a referendum as was clearly promised by the last government in its last manifesto. In other words he fires a warning shot to other EU leaders that at least in the UK the voice of the people will be heard. If we say no then the whole treaty has been rejected. They can hardly object: after all the Irish have yet to vote on it. The referendums could be held on the same day !!

TrevorsDen

"They want more control over their politics and their politicians." -- oh right! And when all this control drops us in the shit, where to then Mr UKIP?

No form of democracy is perfect - we get a chance to turf out numpties every five years. Thats the real power we have. Cameron and the present Tory party are a a sound alternative to the deceitful Brown who with Blair has done his best to neuter parliament.

So give us a break Verity et al, your pompous self righteous bleatings are just plain pathetic.

Jeremy

To Verity:

From my own point of view, I think that Cameron is making all of the right noises. The question is: Does he have the strength of character to see the business through?

I also think that since this crisis broke, Dave has been struggling manfully - even heroically - to, perhaps quite literally, save the Conservative Party. And that means staying abreast of events and responding to a turbulent and rapidly changing public mood. It also (and most fundamentally) means "doing the right thing". Dave is trying hard on all of these fronts. He is bound to make the occasional error along the way. But I think the "Connect with Cameron" events are a good idea. It is very necessary for Cameron to be out amongst (and communicating with) the people at this time. Whatever you may think of him, Verity, communication is his strong suit. And in modern politics, the ability to talk to people outside of and beyond one's own narrow band of supporters is absolutely crucial. Dave does have that ability. And not all politicians do.

Above and beyond this, there is the overriding question: Can he pull it off? Can Cameron save the Conservative Party from annihilation at the polls? On his current form, it won't be for lack of trying...

You have to give him his due. As a certain famous female politician once put it: "You cannot guarantee success, you can only deserve it."

TGF UKIP

White Dragon, thank you for your alert on "Common Purpose." I had not come across it before so considering how ubiquitous it appears to be from its wiki description it must be almost masonic in its secrecy.

Interesting that no journo appears to have done an analysis or exposee of it. Or are you all Common Purpose conduits Fraser?

Edward

"The more I see and hear of Cameron recently, the more I think he really does 'get it'. I hope he does become Prime Minister because he is intelligent, principled and could go down as one of our greatest leaders..."

Carly !
Please Google "David Cameron wisteria", read it, and then remind me again of his "principles".

Sure, Dave finally "got it", but only after "getting it" became a necessary tool for political survival.

Jeremy : There's a difference between "seizing the High Ground" and "seizing the moral high ground". To seize the high ground simply requires tactical ability and timing. To be able to seize the moral high ground requires not only tactical ability, but also honesty and integrity. Qualities in short supply by all accounts.
We're not talking "military", just simple ethics.

It's not that I'm so much against Dave or the Tories - I'm just anti-hypocrisy. I know... anachronistic eh ?

Just as we should not forget Darling's flipping, Hoon's property portfolio, and Jacqui's bathplug, we shouldn't be too enthusiastic in our hurry to gloss over Dave's horticulture.

Seems my previous comment on the subject of integrity was mislaid. Or maybe it's me who still doesn't get it.

wonderfulforhisage

Trevors Den 9:42

You write: 'Cameron and the present Tory party are a a sound alternative to the deceitful Brown who with Blair has done his best to neuter parliament.'

I thought Dave was the self styled Heir to Blair?

Verity

Trevor's Den writes: "Cameron and the present Tory party are a a sound alternative to the deceitful Brown who with Blair has done his best to neuter parliament."

How pathetically low are your aspirations.

Jeremy, who addresses me directly, writes: "Whatever you may think of him, Verity, communication is his strong suit." Well, I actually disasgree. I think he communicated that he was a prat jumping on a bandwagon when he donned a parka and flew to a Norwegian ice floe to pose with a pair of Huskies from Central Casting. Similarily, I thought his "hug a hoodie" speech was risible. (I know it was the media which dubbed it "hug a hoodie", but I am referring to the actual sentiments expressed by Cameron".) He has come several other croppers, including his absurd A-list, which he has now opened up to include ... well, everyone who feels like standing. (No disrespect, and thank you for your thoughtful post, but your points are arguable. One also needs to be a skilled rune-reader to negotiate his tricky use of language.)

TGI UKIP - I was startled to read that you didn't know about Common Purpose! It is a nightmareish outfit whose members are sworn never to admit that they are members or have even heard of the organisation.

I am still of the opinion that Cameron let slip the truth in his moment of glory when he declared himself the heir to Blair.