European election results: live blog
Peter Hoskin 8:46pmStay tuned for live coverage of the European election results, and their aftermath, from 2100.
2057, JGF: Harriet Harman is seated in the BBC studio. She really has been a trooper for the Labour party in the last few days.
2058, PH: Just before the results come in, it's worth noting that turnout was 43 percet - a record low for Euro elections.
2059, JGF: The rumour reaching me is that projections show that Labour will finish third behind UKIP.
2100, PH: Sky showing dramatic footage of police clashing with anti-fascist campaigners trying to enter the Town Hall in Manchester. Nick Griffin is there.
2103, PH: Fraser's on Sky, folks. Tune in, but don't leave Coffee House!
2106, PH: The debate on Sky is whether we'll see a BNP victory anywhere - Manchester seems like the most likely place.
2111, JGF: If that projection I mentioned earlier is right then, like everything else so far in this leadership crisis, the result is neither one thing nor the other. Labour haven’t come fourth but they have come behind UKIP. In terms of the mood of the Labour party, how the BNP does will be important. As Labour people have been saying these past few days, losing to the Tories is one thing letting in fascists is something else.
2113, PH: Jackie Ashley's latest column has just appeared on the Guardian website. It's headline: "To save Labour, Gordon, go with grace and go today".
2116, JGF: Another rumour doing the rounds is that the Labour vote is in the teens.
2122, JGF: If the Lib Dems have come fourth, then this has been an awful set of Local and European results for them. It does seem that the party’s pro-Europeanism is costing it support and making it harder for it to capitalise on the expenses crisis.
2122, PH: ConservativeHome are reporting that Labour are likely to come FIFTH in the South East. Not an area where they were expecting to do well, but the scale of their defeat could ruffle a lot of Labour feathers.
2130, PH: Via Nick Robinson, here's what Lord Falconer writes about Gordon Brown in tomorrow's Times:
"It needs the leader to be the driver and the agent of very big change. This needs highly developed leadership skills. Gordon Brown has not displayed those skills. Whatever the length of time under this new leader, we would be more strongly united around both a new leader and an agreed programme, rather than clinging, disunited and dissatisfied, to the present position."
The big question is whether tonight's results encourage any Labour MPs to act against Brown who weren't intending to already. At the moment, it's hard to judge - not least because the actual results aren't in - but expectations that Labour would finish fourth may be dashed.
2138, JGF: Over at The Guardian, Andrew Sparrow is reporting that the politics academic Phillip Cowley thinks this is heading towards being Labour's worst election result since 1918.
2139, PH: ConHome are saying that it looks like the Tories will win Wales (other rumours are saying Plaid Cymru will, but Tim Montgomerie is embedded in CCHQ, so I assume he's seeing what the Tory leadership are seeing). The Cameroons will be especially pleased with that.
2147, PH: North East result in:
Lab: 25.0%
Other: 22.3% (BNP: 9%)
Con: 19.8%
Lib Dem: 17.6%
UKIP: 15.4%
That's one seat each for the three main parties.
2130, JGF: Mark Mardell is saying that the rumours in the European Parliament are that UKIP might have come second with 18 seats.
2152, PH: Labour may have come top in the NE, but their percentage is down 9 points on last Euro elections. Tories up one. Lib Dems unchanged.
2159, FN: I'm sitting here in the Sky News studio beside Prof Michael Thrasher who has an awesome computer being remote controlled, presumably, by one of his techies. It has just told him that the BNP has 9 percent in the North East. Thrasher estimates the BNP need 14 percent in the North West to get a seat - the activists I was out with last week said 8.5 percent. If so, and the NE result translates acorss the Pennines, then Nick Griffin will be heading to Strasbourg. Am blogging during commercials - but so far v little results to commentate on. News of a recount in the East suggests the wait for the full result will be far longer.
2205, PH: Glenys Kinnock, the newly ennobled Europe Minister, is on Sky right now, trying to explain away Labour's expected results: talk about being flung into the fire...
2208, PH: Hang on. Actually she may not be Europe Minister yet - she hasn't been formally appointed to the Lords yet(and her mandate as an MEP lasts until July), and she can't officially be a minister until she is. Adam Boulton and the Tories' Europe guy, Mark Francois, are trying to hammer it out. Francois keeps saying: "We don't have a Europe Minister." He has a point.
2215, JGF: Nick Brown just refused to comment on a report in tomorrow’s Times that the controversial Royal Mail bill will be deferred. Royal Mail could be the flashpoint at the PLP meeting on Monday night.
2219, JGF: It might concentrate Alan Johnson's mind to know that Labour have come second in Hull, where his constituency is, behind UKIP.
2221, PH: You feel some of tonight's results will have certain ministers breaking out in a cold sweat: Labour have just finished third - behind the Tories and the SNP - in East Renfrewshire, the seat of Scotland Secretary Jim Murphy.
2224, FN: We just had a hilarious interview with Glenys Kinnock, whom Sky News understandably described as Europe Minister. But as she inadvertently revealed, she isn't. She is still an MEP and needs to resign to join a legislature like the Lords. But if she does so before midnight on 13 july she would lose a substantial amount of pension. Mark Francois, sitting opposite me at the Sky table, gestured to jump in and make this point to her on air. Adam Boulton adjudicated. You can tell she is used to Brussels - she looked appalled to be spoken to by Francois like that. Well, we do politics differently in Britain, Glenys. She'd better get used to it - as and when she resignes from Strabsourg. Until then, on the night of the European elections, Britain has no Europe Minister. What a farce.
2228, JGF: Allegra Stratton has an interesting piece in The Guardian on how one senior rebel is challenging Brown to call a secret ballot of the PLP on his leadership, saying that if they lose the rebels will then shut up and back Brown.
2230, PH: Tories worried that they've finished fourth behind BNP in Barking and Dagenham.
2234, JGF: The BBC are saying that Labour will finish comfortably behind the SNP in Scotland. Tim Montgomerie says tonight's results show that Darling, who has been conspicous by his silence in the last few days, would lose his seat based on these results.
2237, JGF: Andrew Sparrow's typically excellent live blog has provisional results from Scotland from PA:
SNP - 28% - up 8 since 2004.
Labour -20% - down 6
Tories - 17% - down 1
Lib Dems - 13% - n/c
Greens - 9% - up 2
Ukip - 5% - down 2
2241, PH: Things looking very positive for the Tories in Wales. Here's Tim Montgomerie at ConHome:
"After 12 declarations in Wales Conservatives have topped the poll in Clwyd West, Preseli Pembrokeshire, Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire, Cardiff South and Penarth, Cardiff North."
2243, PH: It sure is looking bad for Labour: Andrew Sparrow has "Labour sources" saying their share of the vote may be around 16 or 17 percent. Absolutely dreadful showing, if so.
2253, PH: Are any CoffeeHousers watching Sky? Hilary Benn is parroting the same Labour spin that we've been hearing constantly over the past few days, but he somehow makes it slightly more palatable. Someone Brown may want to make more use of, if Benn can stand it.
2257, JGF: If Labour has polled 16 percent, that is really bad news for Brown. Anything below 20 was going to cause him problems but 16 really is appalling. I suspect there are a few Labour MPs whose fingers are hovering over the send button tonight.
2259, JGF: There's something deeply comic about Tessa Jowell doing the media rounds today. Her private views on Gordon Brown--very different from her public ones--are pretty much an open secret in Westminster.
2303, JGF: If the BNP has won a seat that is shameful.
2306, PH: On Sky, Chris Bryant is trying to puch Hague on whether the Tories will do as well as the 36 percent they got under his leadership. Hague replies that they won't - because of the rise of UKIP and other parties. You feel that this will be crucial to Brown's narrative; the idea that all the parties have been hit. Strictly speaking, it's true. But some parties have been hit harder than others...
2309, PH: For the Tories, one of the most encouraging stories developing tonight is how well they're doing in Wales. ConHome are now reporting that the Tories have come top in Wrexham - for the first time ever.
2312. JGF: No change in the party split of MEPs from the East of England but Labour's share of the vote is down six.
2312, PH: Tories have come top in the East of England, with 31 percent of vote. Labour vote down by 6 percentage points.
1213, JGF: Earlier the word was that Labour is going to come fifith in the South East, now the BBC is saying it is likely they'll come fifth in the South West as well.
2320, FN: In between the change of shift in the Sky panel, I chatted to a beaming William Hague - full of the joys. Not quite sure why, as a main theme of this evening is Tory failure to capitalise on the anti-Labour vote. It really doesn't look as if Cameron 09 will do so much better than Howard 04; perhaps due to the expenses collateral, perhaps due to something more fundamental. But with so few results in, it's hard to draw any hard conclusiona. And at the general election, there won't be this vast menu of minor parties to choose from, so Cameron will have a better claim to the anti-Labour vote. He'd far rather a pro-Tory vote, but even in leaked results there seems strikingly little of that. So far, at least.
I'm off now to Five Live, where my shift lasts from midnight till 1am. Hopefully, by then, we may even have some results.
2323, JGF : The BBC just flashed up the current national share of the vote, they have Labour in fourth on 14 percent. The Tories are top with 28 percent, hardly a great result for Cameron but few will notice. The story of the night is the Labour limbo: how low can they go?
2325, PH: North West results due in at 2am, apparently. Time to make a mug of coffee...
2337, FN: Ha! The Cornish nationalists have beaten Labour in the south west. Time to dust down my Cornish credentials (I am Truro-born) and raise a pasty in celebration. This really does look like the night of the minority parties.
2338, PH: So far, Labour are coming fifth in 36 councils (h/t: LabourList). This really is shaping up to be a dreadful, dreadful evening for them.
2339, PH: The BNP have won a seat in Yorkshire and Humber. Dispiriting stuff. This will be among the main stories of the evening.
2334, JGF: Andrew Sparrow points out that with the Tories coming top in Wales, it is the first time since 1918 that Labour has failed to win an all-Wales poll.
2336, FN: They're in. The BNP has a seat in Yorkshire - displacing Labour. Make no mistake, this the best day in the ragtag defeat-riddled history of what can be seen as the British fascist movement. Mosely didn't manage to get any wards, the National Front managed fewer than half a dozen. The BNP now have 57 council seats and - for the first time for them or any predecessor movement - a seat in a legislature.
2337, PH: Nick Griffin is being interviewed on Sky. He says that the seat on Y&H is a "major breakthrough". When pushed by Adam Bolton, Griffin also claims that the BNP only want to remove immigrants are "not loyal" to Britain - problem is, their definition of "not loyal" is considerably wider than everyone else's.
2340, JGF: I wonder if that result from Yorkshire and the Humber will prompt some Labour MPs to act. Labour weakness benefiting the Tories is one thing, but letting in fascists is another.
2342, PH: So here's the true face of the BNP: Nick Griffin has just said, "We are a Christian country; Islam is not welcome." Disgraceful - and, if he's actually worried about Islamic extremism, exactly the kind of thing to drum up hatred.
2346, FN: So Andrew Brons, the BNP candidate, speaks. "I don't need to tell you that my election is not universally popular," he says. Well-spoken, a lecturer, and when he referred to "the old Labour party when it really was Labour," you knew where his votes came from. There was a huge media campaign against them, he says (quite accurately) and "somehow we have overcome it". Somehow? When Labour has lost the working class, millions of votes are up for grabs. The BNP has tonight picked up just a few of the spoils.
2350, PH: Nick Griffin's performance on Sky was abhorrent. It's an immense shame that the failures of the main parties have helped gain the BNP a democratic platform.
2352, PH: Unofficial results in from Wales. The Tories are top on 21 percent; Labour second on 20 percent. The Labour vote has fallen by a staggering 12 percent. Still unofficial, but worrying stuff for Downing Street.
2357, PH: The results from Wales (see last entry) are official now. Tories are delighted, and rightly so.
2359, PH: Andrew Sparrow reports that Labour are now "pretty sure" that they've only scored 16 percent of the national vote, and are "starting to worry" about finishing fourth. If so, this is an annhilation for them
0003, FN: Not often I'm pleased to see Nick Griffin's face, but I am right now. He's on the Beeb and he's frowning - that can only be good news. He's talking about "radical and aggressive Islam" - a reminder that the driver behind BNP support now is agitation about Islam, not racial issues. This is why Griffin put himself on the North West list, not the London list. And you do wonder: if the mainstream parties spoke more openly about the jihadi menace, would the BNP have such traction? There are lessons aplenty in its success tonight.
0008, JGF: If you want an example of just how sensitive the Tories are about Lord Ashcroft, look at Tim Montgomerie's election blog - earlier it had a photo from CCHQ with Lord Ashcroft watching the results with some other people, that has now disappeared.
0009, PH: On Sky, Chris Bryant is pushing the line that the country "hasn't fallen in love with David Cameron". If the Tories score under 30 percent, spinning this as an election in which all the major parties took a big hit will be a massive part of Brown's gameplan. Problem is: if Labour get 16 percent, then it's clear that Labour - and Brown - are bearing the brunt of the anger.
0015, PH: With two boroughs to go, the Tories are leading in London (on 22.5 percent), with Labour in second (on 19.5 percent). Official result soon.
0016, PH: Bad news from ConHome: "It is looking almost certain that Nick Griffin will become an MEP for NW England."
0018, PH: Sky have just run through the covers of tomorrow's papers. Almost all of them dwell on the terrible results for Labour, and refer to tomorrow as "Judgement Day" for Brown, as he faces the PLP in the evening. The tone of the coverage suggests that Brown is in major trouble.
0022, PH: SNP are confirming that they've won in Scotland. They suggest that Labour's showing in Scotland is their worst since World War One. It's hard to exaggerate just how badly Labour are doing. This really is a historically poor performance, and one that might make Labour MPs think twice about Brown's leadership.
0029, PH: BNP currently down at fifth in the North West. Maybe Nick Griffin won't get that seat after all.
0031, PH: Chris Bryant sill pushing the line that "It's not a particularly good night for the Tories - they haven't even got the 36 percent share of the vote that they got under William Hague." Eric Pickles' response: "Well, it feels like a good night."
0034, JGF: The Labour mood tonight is grim; the BNP’s victory is a significant blow to the party’s self-esteem. 16 percent, losing Wales, second in Scotland, fifth in the South East—it has been a horrendous night for Labour and proof of just where Brown is leading the party.
I get the impression that Brown will have to move significantly on policy tomorrow night at the meeting of the Parliamentary Labour Party to survive. It was put to me just now that another speech like the one he delivered to the National Policy Forum after the Glasgow East defeat, would finish him off.
0037, FN: I'm in a Five Live studio now with Tony Travers and John Pienaar and we've just worked out that, with the low turnout, the BBC's prediction would mean just 6 percent of those eligible to vote have gone for Labour. That is, if my memory serves, smaller than the percentage that thinks Elvis is still alive. Labour will finish third, according to the BBC's predictions, but only just. Con: 27, UKIP: 17, Lab: 16 and LibDem: 14. A mere percentage point separates second and third place, but psycologically the difference will be huge for Labour as Brown prepares to meet the PLP tomorrow night.
0040, PH: London results are in: Tories first (getting 3 seats); Labour second (2 seats); then Lib Dems, Greens and UKIP (1 seat each).
0048, FN: Our new Health Secretary, Andy Burnham, has told Five Live that "we're at a point now where waiting lists have been eradicated". Boy, does he have a lot to learn about the NHS.
0048, PH: London vote-share, via Andrew Sparrow:
Tories - 27% - up 1
Labour - 21% - down 4
Lib Dems - 14% - down 2
Greens - 11% - up 3
Ukip - 11% - down 2
BNP - 5% - up 1
0056, PH: Things are ticking along a little quicker now, and the East Midlands is the latest region to declare its results: Tories win with 30 percent; Labour second on 17 percent; UKIP on 16; Lib Dems on 12; BNP on 9. That's 2 seats for the Tories, and 1 each for Labour and the Lib Dems.
0103, PH: Article in Monday's Independent by Labour MP Graham Allen on why "Brown must go". Read it here.
0105, PH: Jon Craig on Sky is saying that Brown loyalists claim these results are "bad, but could have been worse". To my mind, it's a misleading point: sure, Labour may finish third, rather than forth, in the national vote - but a share of 16 percent would be historically terrible for them. Quite simply, Brown has lead Labour to their worst ever defeat.
0109, FN: Is this a good night for the BNP? Tony Travers, in the Five Live studio with me, says not - their share of the vote is up from 6 percent to 8 percent he says. Tiny. That's one way of looking at it. Another way is to say its vote is up by a third and today is a breakthrough for them: it has a toehold in a parliament, which marks a giant leap towards the mainstream. I'm sitting next to Simon Wooley from Operation Black Vote, who says that tonight will be a failure for the BNP if Griffin doesn't get in. When they celebrate the opening of their new Brussels office it won't feel like a failure.
0113, PH: Given the numerous scandals he's embroiled in, it's pretty astonishing how well Silvio Berlusconi's party has done in these elections. Seems like not every electorate across Europe is protesting against the incumbant government.
0117, PH: One of the best things about listening to the election results live, is hearing the names of some of the more obscure parties. Who knew that a "Roman party" - called "Ave" - was contesting the election in the South East?
0118, PH: It's official. Labour came FIFTH in the South East.
0119, PH: Dan Hannan is addressing the crowd at the South East results. He says bluntly: "Prime Minister, how much clearer do we need to speak before you hear us?" This is similar in tone to his famous European Parliament speech - although, it has to be said, not quite as punchy. Still, expect to see it on YouTube shortly.
0121, JGF: No Labour MEPs elected in the South West region as the party comes fifth with a mere eight percent of the vote.
0124, PH: In his speech to the South East crowd, Nigel Farage complains about those folded-over ballot papers - says he may contest the results in certain boroughs.
0130, FN: Word from North West is that Griffin has won his seat. Very bad news if true - and, of course, the story of the election.
0132, PH: A victory for Nick Griffin would be of massive symbolic importance for Labour MPs. In the backs of their minds, they may be thinking it was Brown's premiership wot won it for the BNP.
0145, PH: It's not yet official, but it really does seem certain that Nick Griffin will win a seat. The other parties are preparing some form of protest up in Manchester.
0150, JGF: We’re now just waiting for the results from the West Midlands and the North West. The North West one is expected shortly.
0154, PH: And those West Midlands results are in now. Conservatives come top; then UKIP and Labour. Percentage shares when I get them.
0155, PH: Here they are:
Conservatives - 28.1% - up 0.7
Ukip - 21.3% - up 3.8
Labour - 17.0% - down 6.4
Lib Dems - 12.0% - down 1.7
BNP - 8.6% - up 1.1
0200, PH: Just the North West to go. Expected any minute.
0205, PH: It's official: Nick Griffin has won a seat for the North West - boos ring out as his name is read out. With 2 seats, the success of the BNP will be the main talking point of this election. This is a dispiriting turn of affairs, and one that our current Parlimentarians should feel partially responsible for.
0206, PH: Final results in the North West:
Conservatives - 25.6% - up 1.5
Labour - 20.4% - down 6.4
Ukip - 15.8% - up 3.7
Lib Dems - 14.3% - down 1.6
BNP - 8.0% - up 1.6
0208, FN: So it's confirmed: Nick Griffin has done it. He has easily eclipsed John Tyndall and Oswald Mosley - neither the National Front nor the British Union of Fascists had anything like the popular electoral support which the BNP tonight commands. It has taken a monumental failure from the Westminster parties to get to this point, chief among them their failure to address immigration. Result: Nick Griffin's off first-class to Strasbourg and his next step will be to try to lead the fascist group in the European Parliament (not all of them accept the f-word, but that's in effect what they are). What an indictment of the Westminster parties that the new face of European fascism could be a British one.
And on that bleak note, I'm finally signing off for tonight.
0209, PH: Addressing the crowd in the North West, the main Conservative MEP laments the election of Nick Griffin, calling it an "aberration". Cheers - and a few boos - ring out from the crowd. I wonder what will happen when Griffin takes to the microphone.
0214, JGF: Monday is going to be another day of high-political drama. What happens at the PLP meeting is going to go a significant way to determining Brown’s fate, whether the rebels can get the 70 signatures they need. These results, which have been utterly terrible for Labour, have undoubtedly weakened Brown still further before that meeting.
0218, PH: Here's Griffin now, and the other candidates leave the stage in protest. Sections of the crowd are filtering out of the building too: no booing, no whistling - just near-silence. Griffin exclaims at the BNP's success: "The waters of truth and justice are now washing over this country." Yes, this is a democratic result. But there's something depraved about this man standing there, on a new, legitimate platform.
0223, PH: The Scottish and Northern Irish results are due tomorrow. But this is how the national tally looks so far:
Conservative -- 28.6% -- up 1.2 -- 24 MEPS
UK Independence Party -- 17.4% -- up 0.5 -- 13 MEPs
Labour -- 15.3% -- down 7 -- 11 MEPs
Liberal Democrats -- 13.9% -- down 1.1 -- 10 MEPs
Green Party -- 8.7% -- up 2.5 -- 2 MEPs
British National Party -- 6.5% -- up 1.4 -- 2 MEPs
The success of the BNP will grab all the headlines, and - coupled with that awful 15.3% showing by Labour - it all spells trouble for Gordon Brown. Monday, 8 June, is going to be one of the most fraught and potentially explosive days of his premiership. Watch this space.
0230, PH: Right, I'm going to call it a night now, and get my beauty sleep. Many thanks to CoffeeHousers for joining us. We'll have more on all this later.
Previous
Verity
June 7th, 2009 9:04pm Report this comment20:59 - I hope so! I'm a Nigel Farage fan.
Verity
June 7th, 2009 9:09pm Report this commentWell, tell us something, Pete! You've been blogging for four minutes and haven't turned up any scoops yet!
Dave
June 7th, 2009 9:15pm Report this comment43% turnout? Sounds high for an EU election.
Tankus
June 7th, 2009 9:17pm Report this commentFarage is a muppet , but an amusing one
Dave
June 7th, 2009 9:23pm Report this commentActually, 30 minutes gap on a 'live blog' is well past rigor mortis. Must be too busy listening to Dale.
Chuck Unsworth
June 7th, 2009 9:25pm Report this commentExpectations management in a big way. This is about Brown's survival and it's clear that senior Labour figures are in that business alone. What they know is that if Brown goes there will have to be an immediate election unless they wish to accept Mandelson as their new boss. Labour hasn't got the cash to run a campaign, and they all are desperate to hang onto their large stipends right up to the last minute, clinging to the hope that something will turn up. They are all deluded.
Pete Hoskin
June 7th, 2009 9:26pm Report this commentDave: 30 minutes "gap"? Are you meaning us?
Verity
June 7th, 2009 9:26pm Report this commentFarage is an effective, articulate leader with presence. In other words, the opposite of the British Prime Minister.
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 9:28pm Report this commentSo far Labour are fifth, fourth, third behind UKIP and in the teens.
I heard that, at the last minute, Labour had pulled out of the election altogether and decided to send some of their Lords over to Strasburg instead.
Happy Vulture
June 7th, 2009 9:29pm Report this commentSo far, so good - ie. looking TERRIBLE for Liebour!
Short the UK
June 7th, 2009 9:31pm Report this commentIt is startling to watch the elite in meltdown. They can't bring themselves to acknowledge that Mr Brown is a psychopath.
I was scared that his mini-me (Mr Balls) was going to become Chancellor, this was another sign of total lunacy.
Thankfully, Mr Darling refused to go.
The lefties are saying that Mr Brown saved the economy, which is trash talk, it was Mr King taking interest rates to 0.5% what done it.
Dave
June 7th, 2009 9:43pm Report this commentI do mean you. Your last post has been showing at 20.57 since, well, 20.57, and I am nice enough to keep hitting refresh.
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 9:46pm Report this commentWhy, what happened in 1918?
Can you imagine if by some incredible mis-chance, Peter Mandelson could become Prime Minister? It would be fantastic, the chaotic finale in a Brian Rix farce. With Hazel Blears returning as Foreign Secretary and Ernie Wise as Chancellor.
I'd almost pay to see it.
Pete Hoskin
June 7th, 2009 9:47pm Report this commentDave: strange - we've made plenty of updates since then, and there'll all showing on my computer.
We're working down the page - so more recent updates are lower down the page - but don't expect that's the problem.
Are other CoffeeHousers not seeing any updates?
ChrisD
June 7th, 2009 9:49pm Report this comment"Thankfully, Mr Darling refused to go."
Judging by the reports of the Euro result in his own backyard, the voters might managed where Brown failed.
FonyBlair
June 7th, 2009 10:01pm Report this commentI can see all updates. Keep up the good work.
Dale seems to be leading the way with results so far on his radio show
Stephen
June 7th, 2009 10:02pm Report this commentThe glee at labour dropping 9% in the NE must be balanced by the disappointing 1% rise in the Tory vote.
Tankus
June 7th, 2009 10:03pm Report this commentI so hope Darling resigns by wed, his position as chancellor due to his tax dodge is untenable...anyway ...
might as well do the deed on gordo for Queen and country
Dave
June 7th, 2009 10:10pm Report this commentI am in Dubai, where elections don't happen very often, so the the watchers may be confused. :-) Have rebooted and all appears like magic!
FonyBlair
June 7th, 2009 10:11pm Report this commentWatching Glenys Kinnock on Sky...is she really saying she won't be a minister until after she ceases being an MEP in July? No Europe Minister until then!? Farcical!
Can you gusy look into this please?
Lee Jakeman
June 7th, 2009 10:18pm Report this commentI'm not BNP, but I'm actually looking FORWARD to them doing well, if only to take our smug, self-satisfied elite down a peg or two.
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 10:19pm Report this commentIf Nick Griffin or any other BNP candidate is elected, does that mean that he will be a member of the same party bloc, within the European Parliament, as Cameron's Conservatives?
Susan Hill
June 7th, 2009 10:20pm Report this commentI`m seeing updates fine Peter
Ian Walker
June 7th, 2009 10:22pm Report this commentRonnie @ 9.46
There is a convention that the Prime Minister cannot sit in the Lords, which developed at the same time as the Parliament Act 1911.
But given this bunch's disdain for plenty of other conventions, I wouldn't put it past them.
Verity
June 7th, 2009 10:22pm Report this commentWho's JGF? Someone we should know by his initials?
The radio link to Iain's show is very difficult to access. If you go to his blog you will see that dozens have given up.
Pete Hoskin
June 7th, 2009 10:24pm Report this commentVerity: JGF is James.
Sir Graphus
June 7th, 2009 10:27pm Report this commentWho's betting Sarah Brown is looking lastminute.com right this minute?
egh
June 7th, 2009 10:28pm Report this commentWait... somebody with the name "Francois" represents the Tories in euroland? Give me strength...
Verity
June 7th, 2009 10:29pm Report this commentWell, Dave, I'm in N America where it's too early for a drink ... although as it's Sunday afternoon I might have one in a few minutes anyway. Or perhaps I'll wait until there's something to celebrate. Don't want to jinx it.
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 10:34pm Report this commentJolly Green Footballs.
john miller is nearly asleep with boredom but
June 7th, 2009 10:35pm Report this commentSo we don't have a europe minister?
The crucial question is - will it matter?
Lee Jakeman
June 7th, 2009 10:38pm Report this commentRonnie @ 10:19: No - Nick Griffin would join another group, with Vlaams Belang and Geert Wilders lot.
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 10:39pm Report this commentBrown doesn't do secret ballots. He's an old-style NOLS fixer and that is the top and bottom of it.
euSSR GO HOME
June 7th, 2009 10:40pm Report this commentI hope they are re-counting in the northeast. How that many could vote liebour anywhere beats me. I also agree that 46% sounds far too high for euro turnout: unless a lot of those were spoiled votes.
And 'rumours in the European Parliament are that UKIP might have come second with 18 seats.'
They do notice some things about us then? All the to know how better to fix the next set of results?
Vulture
June 7th, 2009 10:43pm Report this commentBBC 2 coverage is its usual disgracefully biassed self - its been on for 40 minutes and there have only been Liebour spokespeople: Jowell, Nick Bruin, Glenys Kinnock - and none from the night's winners - the Tories - or indeed any other party! Dave will really have to sort these pinkoes out.
They also announced Liebour vote in Leicester going UP by abt ten percent to 37 percent. If true, clearly fraud.
Tiberius
June 7th, 2009 10:46pm Report this commentVerity: you do sometimes remind me of Shirley Porter.
An acquaintance of mine once met her at the opera, and during an exchange about why they were having trouble making out some of the words, she suggested that they might turn up the microphone.
egh
June 7th, 2009 10:49pm Report this commentMore than 27 million Britons turned out to vote in euro election? Who's kidding whom?
Verity
June 7th, 2009 10:50pm Report this commentPete - Thanks. I wondered who that masked stranger was. Why did he suddenly acquire a middle initial?
Ronnie
June 7th, 2009 10:50pm Report this commentThank you Lee Jakeman.
Verity
June 7th, 2009 10:56pm Report this commentTiberius - How exciting! Who is Shirley Porter?
Should I be thrilled or offended?
Simon Stephenson
June 7th, 2009 11:12pm Report this comment2303, JGF: If the BNP has won a seat that is shameful.
Shameful in what sense, James? That so many voters have chosen the BNP? Or that mainstream politics has, apparantly, so little to offer to so many people?
Stephen
June 7th, 2009 11:15pm Report this commentResult in East is not good. No increase in our vote at all! How is that?
tally2
June 7th, 2009 11:18pm Report this commentTell me - if the major parties lie about everything else, why should we believe what they say about the BNP?
Why is British Nationalism so awful as to make it shameful that they should win a seat?
Suki
June 7th, 2009 11:22pm Report this commentWell done, Geert Wilders.
I'm absolutely ecstatic for him and his party.
Lee Jakeman
June 7th, 2009 11:30pm Report this comment"... perhaps due to the expenses collateral, perhaps due to something more fundamental" Isuggest the latter. A non-racist, English Nationalist Party will emerge from all of this. Just give it a few years.
Stephen
June 7th, 2009 11:31pm Report this commenttally2: What is shameful about the BNP is very simple. They define British with being white.
David
June 7th, 2009 11:35pm Report this commentUrgh, to think that we will have fascists representing the country. How depressing and shameful.
Given the expenses scandal, I think anything around 30% will be fine for the Tories. The idea that there is something more fundamental is not, I think, borne out by the trends being seen in polls prior to the scandal breaking.
Simon Stephenson
June 7th, 2009 11:37pm Report this commenttally2 : 11.18pm
I have some bad news and some good news for you.
Bad is that the main parties don't lie, they just deceive us.
Good is that you're still wise not to believe what they tell us about the BNP. Or about anything else, for that matter.
David
June 7th, 2009 11:40pm Report this comment"why should we believe what they say about the BNP?"
Find out for yourself. Visit the Stormfront website.
Verity
June 7th, 2009 11:41pm Report this comment"2303, JGF: If the BNP has won a seat that is shameful."
How dare you in your "inside the Beltway" arrogance tell Britons it is shameful for them to vote for a legally constituted political party?
As Iain might say, "How very dare you?"
What an intolerable snob. Like most lefties.
Suki, where did you see the news about Geert Wilders?
David
June 7th, 2009 11:44pm Report this commentI feel ill about the BNP. As someone they'd like to expel, or worse, it's awful to see them doing this well.
Colin
June 7th, 2009 11:46pm Report this commentIf only Boulton and his ilk would be as robust when interviewing other party leaders...
He's now starting to make himself look and sound ridiculous.
Verity
June 7th, 2009 11:46pm Report this commentStephen, but they have senior members married to people of other races, and a couple of them are bringing up "mixed race" to use the nauseating British term, children. What is your problem?
I am seeing an interesting, condescending pattern becoming apparent here, which is no surprise. The left is nothing if not condescending.
dearieme
June 7th, 2009 11:54pm Report this commentCan anyone split the votes into blocs, please? Along the following lines:-
1) Eurosceptic i.e. Tory, UKIP and minor
2) Working Class i.e. Labour, BNP and minor
3) Silly-billy i.e. Libs, Green and minor.
Thanks
dearieme
June 7th, 2009 11:56pm Report this comment" "mixed race" to use the nauseating British term ": what's nauseating about it? What would you prefer?
David
June 7th, 2009 11:59pm Report this comment"How dare you in your "inside the Beltway" arrogance tell Britons it is shameful for them to vote for a legally constituted political party?"
The fact it is legally constituted is neither here nor there. The BNP are shameful, particularly when you consider the number of British people* who dies fighting their predecessors.
* Contrary to their political broadcast, the armed forces of WW2 consisted of more thna white people.
David
June 8th, 2009 12:00am Report this comment"The left is nothing if not condescending."
The BNP, with their Marxist derived economic policy, are of the left. Right wingers like me are dead set against them.
john miller is asleep this is his mum
June 8th, 2009 12:06am Report this commentThis being a post on the European elections, I've just noticed that of the 2362 councillors elected in the local elections, 7.5% were Labour. And Brown is under the impression that we want him to get on with the job?
I think he's suffering from the Yarwoods.
Stephen
June 8th, 2009 12:09am Report this commentVerity: My problem is that they do not recognise people who are not white as being British. To find that a problem is not condescending. It is certainly not 'left wing'. If the BNP was not racist then British people who are not black and asian and who do not wish to be 'repatriated' would be allowed to join the party. But they are not.
john miller
June 8th, 2009 12:11am Report this comment@ dearieme.I'd give it a go on my old spreadsheet here, but where do I put Peter Rigby?
Derek
June 8th, 2009 12:12am Report this commentThe BBC World service in its bulletin at 7.00am Monday in Shannhai mentioned the BNP winning a seat but otherwise summed up the outcome as an increase across the EU for the Centre Right. One would have thought that with the British constitution in the throes of its greatest crisis in the last 100 years, the BBC might have mentioned that the Labour Party has been hammered; but this is not of course the "narrative", is it...
Sharon
June 8th, 2009 12:19am Report this commentAdam Boulton's interview with Nick Griffin was very ill-informed. Everything that Nick Griffin said is backed up by plenty of Muslims. Here's Muammar Gaddafi: "We have 50 million Muslims in Europe. There are signs that Allah will grant Islam victory in Europe, without swords, without guns, without military conquest.
"The 50 million in Europe will turn it into a Muslim continent within a few decades.
"Allah mobilises the Muslim nation of Turkey and adds it to the European Union. That's another 50 million Muslims.
"There will be 100 million Muslims in Europe. Albania, which is a Muslim country has already entered the EU.
"Bosnia which is a Muslim country has already entered the EU. Fifty per cent of its citizens are Muslims.
"Europe is in a predicament and so is America. They should agree to become Islamic in the course of time or else declare war on the Muslims."
Since when has any of that exercised Sky News? The rouble with this kind of bias against the BNP is that it only makes people want to vote for them.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNUqLztI4mQ
Derek
June 8th, 2009 12:22am Report this commentPactio Olisipiensis censenda est.
Dirty Euro
June 8th, 2009 12:28am Report this commentawful result for labour. No that surprising with expenses, Blears, the guardian turning against them, etc:
Suki
June 8th, 2009 12:49am Report this commentVerity, The Telegraph ran a small round-up that had a paragraph on Wilders' party. They've taken four seats, which is absolutely stunning.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/5471893/European-elections-2009-far-Right-and-fringe-parties-make-gains-across-Europe-amid-low-turnout.html
Verity
June 8th, 2009 12:56am Report this commentDearie Me - I'll respond tomorrow. Tonight I'm having too much fun! Check this space.
Nicholas
June 8th, 2009 1:01am Report this comment@ Verity: "They also announced Liebour vote in Leicester going UP by abt ten percent to 37 percent. If true, clearly fraud."
The oily Vaz was boasting about the Labour vote in Leicester less than thirty minutes into the actual count and his "prediction" of the percentage was almost spot on. His smirking demeanour suggested the confidence of someone who knew more than he should have done at that point. Fraud indeed. It would be interesting to learn how many postal votes there.
tally2
June 8th, 2009 1:10am Report this commentI think the word racist should be banned:))
I'm half serious: people hiss the word about and so avoid engaging with underlying problems.
It seems only accurate though, to distinguish between the indigenes of the island (and yes, we are basically Celtic-white) and recent immigrants - some of whom, I agree, are British: because they came from the Empire / Commonwealth. I agree it's shameful not to accept those British people as our own so long as they are prepared to live by our customs and our laws.
But there are also multitudes of white and non-white immigrants who refuse to accept the customs and laws of the British.
OK - this forum requires brevity, but if the BNP lean towards the former and against the latter - then I lean towards the BNP.
Is that how the Hull contingent see it? I look forward to the discussions: I'm very proud of my family roots in that area -not least because it was also home to William Wilberforce...
Verity
June 8th, 2009 1:18am Report this commentDavid writes: "he fact it is legally constituted is neither here nor there. The BNP are shameful, particularly when you consider the number of British people* who dies fighting their predecessors."
Why would anyone "die fighting their predessors"? Are you daft? Like all controlling socialists? The language of socialism is the language of the illiterate and over-emotional. Just look at Jacqui Smith, Margaret Becket, Jack Straw ... none of them can construct a sentence that makes any sense to the sane.
Frank P
June 8th, 2009 1:20am Report this commentBritain will be Brown stained for at least another year and his scorched earth agenda will leave nothing worth inheriting for anyone who takes over (supposing anyone remains who cares enough to vote them out by then). Stay where you are Verity; even under the flim-flam of Obama the prospects are better there than here. How long is it since you were here? In the three (or is it four) years since I think you were last here the changes are multifaceted, dire and deeply depressing. Wish I had taken my chances over the pond when I was offered them 25 years ago, when patriotism prevailed.
65 years ago on this day brave souls were fighting to the death in foreign fields to preserve what has now been destroyed or surrendered by idiot ingrates. What a waste!
Frank P
June 8th, 2009 1:30am Report this commentAs a matter of record: how were the Euro votes kept secret when they were separated from the CC votes for counting? We were obliged to put both voting slips into the same ballot box where I voted. Surely there was scope for gerrymandering when they were unsealed for the CC vote?
Verity
June 8th, 2009 1:38am Report this commentNicholas - assuming a Homer Simpson guise - "Mmmmmm .... fraud....".
The ghee poster boy, eh?
Suki, many thanks. I have followed Mr Wilders for several years. He is a very brave man. Like Aayan Hirsi Ali, he has been under smothering police protection for several years. Hirsi Ali decamped eventually to the US, but Mr Wilders remains to fight.
Verity
June 8th, 2009 1:49am Report this commentDavid 12 a.m. writes: "The BNP, with their Marxist derived economic policy, are of the left. Right wingers like me are dead set against them."
Absolutely agree.
I just like to watch the lefties wriggle.
Verity
June 8th, 2009 1:53am Report this commentFrank P, I could weep.
Lee Jakeman
June 8th, 2009 1:54am Report this commentFrank P - Spoken from the heart, as only a patriot can do.
CS
June 8th, 2009 2:00am Report this commentP.S. Verity, sweetheart, the Nazis were a legally constituted political party.
Napoleon
June 8th, 2009 2:01am Report this commentGreat live coverage guys!
Lee Jakeman
June 8th, 2009 2:03am Report this commentWhen do we get the Scotland results?
Verity
June 8th, 2009 2:08am Report this commentAnd HM not invited, despite having worn the uniform of the King and been on active service. And she and her family having made the same sacrifices the other British made (they lived on rations in Buckingham Palace). The mean-spiritedness of the left is awesome.
And I read that recently HM, when one of her cars broke down, told the chauffeur, "It's the crankshaft."
Yes, Frank P, what a terrible, terrible waste. I wish they could all come back to haunt us, all those young men who never married and never had families in order to preserve our right to do so.
I wish they could haunt us.
Nick Kaplan
June 8th, 2009 2:18am Report this commentFraser;
You might want to change where you have written Max Mosely to Oswald Mosley.
Pete Hoskin
June 8th, 2009 2:26am Report this commentNick: I've fixed that - thanks for the spot.
Catherine Evans
June 8th, 2009 2:28am Report this commentGlad UKIP did so well .Well done Nigel Farage.We are fed up with being 'bossed around' by Europe.It couldnt have done Labour much good either by insulting our Head of State Her Majesty The Queen by not ensuring an invitation to the D Day Commemorations.That was indeed shameful and treacherous.
egh
June 8th, 2009 2:34am Report this commentFrank and Verity -
Took my dog out today (in the US) and a couple stopped to talk to her: the old man was wearing a hat that identified him as a WWII Veteran.
So I said "Thank You"; and I hoped he doesn't know the insult and betrayal that the neu-fangled British have wrought. And at least that generation earned us the freedom to be British in my own lifetime - for that I thank them, and I thank God.
Joshua Chambers
June 8th, 2009 3:04am Report this commentIn Yorkshire we have a BNP MEP; I am sad but not ashamed.
http://joshuachambers.wordpress.com/2009/06/08/what-does-a-bnp-mep-mean/
Verity
June 8th, 2009 3:17am Report this commentCatherine Evans writes: ".It couldnt have done Labour much good either by insulting our Head of State Her Majesty The Queen by not ensuring an invitation to the D Day Commemorations.That was indeed shameful and treacherous."
No.
It was a road map.
Fergus Pickering
June 8th, 2009 3:39am Report this commentLeicester ooks fraudulent, doesn't it? Any postal votes? Verity, Gert Wilders' results were up a coupleof days ago. Four seats, making him the second party in Holland. 18% of the vote. Anybody, WHICH of Nick Griffin's eyes is the glass one. I can't make it out. Oh, we weren't fighting Germans in the last war because they were racists. We were fighting them because they were conquering Europe. Plenty of British people, alas I do agree, shared their views about Jews.
Thrasymachus
June 8th, 2009 3:40am Report this commentThe castigation of the BNP here and elsewhere is odd. I've been watching commentators shrugging resignedly, or patronizingly allowing their gaze to linger fixedly after mentioning the BNP gains.
But what are we suggesting? In this country diveristy and multiculturalism have been a creed for the best part of twenty years. We ram it down our kids at school. We make employees sign up to contracts proving their commitment to diversity, ensuring they are ideologically sound.
Are we really suggesting that hundreds of thousands of people have turned into rascist bigots overnight, and rejected their programming?
No, something is rotten at the heart of race relations in this country. And it has to do, simply, with the receiving culture making more allowances than the cultures which arrive. It's been like this for too long, let's just roll our sleeves up, stop being squeemish and sort it out; and then the BNP will wither and die.
tally2
June 8th, 2009 3:50am Report this commentP.S. - I see they've stopped the live blog-roll, for which: Many Thanks to Pete Hoskin and All. That was a pleasure.
So I took time out to look up 'fascism' since I can't figure out why all sides spit it out with the same venom they do 'racism.' The accusors seem seem to silence the accusee: who must accept Guilt with no chance of proving himself Innocent.
Should that word be banned too?
Aha - so Italian Fascism threatens the power of the Socialists and Communists!!! Said Lefties use the term against Righties exactly as described above!!! [Except - don't some say that the BNP is Left, not Right?]
Confusion arises, as well, because:
Fascists are judgemental of the personal behaviour of others!!!
Fascists are Authoritarian!!!
Fascists are Totalitarian!!!
Fascists believe in Corporatism!!!
Fascists are intolerant of the views and rights of others!!!
---- so: why are we accusing the BNP of Fascism, when these aspects of the epithet present a mirror-image of Liebour and the euSSR?
Oh, I see - FASCISTS ARE NATIONALIST!!!!!
So that's why all those intolerant, communist, judgemental, totalitarian, corporate federalists just stalked off the stage.
In such ways, the cultural 'invader' (euSSR) and its middle-men (UK Parliamentarians) shut down dialogue with the People: whose opposition they fear.
Oh yes, they fear the BNP.
Charles
June 8th, 2009 7:49am Report this commentI'm not sure that leaving the platform in protest at Grifin being elected is right.
Like it or not, he is now democratically elected, and to ignore that demonstrates contempt for the voters.
The mainstream parties need to engage with the issues that are persuading people to vote for him and find a way to alleviate those concerns in a more acceptable policy setting.
Ignoring cancer doesn't make it go away.
Andrew Zalotocky
June 8th, 2009 8:41am Report this commentKarl Marx! Polly Toynbee! Clement Attlee! Alan Sugar! Tony Blair! Gordon Brown - can you hear me, Gordon Brown! Your boys took one hell of a beating! Your boys took one hell of a beating!
Nicholas
June 8th, 2009 9:16am Report this commentOne particularly mad looking Labour wimmen-person when asked, last night, what is so wrong with the far right parties, said in hushed tones of horror that they were "climate change deniers". This is now I suppose akin to being "holocaust deniers" in Leftist eyes. Oh dear. How ever did these fruitcakes gain and maintain power over us?
Nicholas
June 8th, 2009 9:18am Report this commentAndrew I don't think Clem Attlee would have much time for Brown and his criminal gang - he served in the wartime coalition government that fought against a regime that shared many features of the "New" Labour party.
tally2
June 8th, 2009 9:22am Report this commentPPS: Just to clarify - Up above I was thanking the Speccie team for the live blog. It's beem terrific.
JONNY
June 8th, 2009 11:24am Report this comment'Farage is an effective, articulate leader with presence'
Presence Verity?
Presence?
Ha ha ha
Alright I suppose you might argue he's narrowly less repulsive than Nick Griffin.
But almost too close to call.
Roger (likes to see things for myself)
June 8th, 2009 11:26am Report this commentWhere can I find the results in detail for each country other than the UK for the european elections? please anyone
Verity
June 8th, 2009 1:53pm Report this commentJonny - Clearly you don't know anything about Nigel. Go and watch a couple of his extemporaneous talks on YouTube. When I lived in Britain, I found him a most engaging individual.
It must be so awful for you, Jonny, to always be on the outside looking in.
Verity
June 8th, 2009 2:01pm Report this commentf the BNP was not racist then British people who are not black and asian and who do not wish to be 'repatriated' would be allowed to join the party. But they are not.
Yet at least one of the senior people in the party is married to a Chinese. Chinese are Asian. They are from Asia. When you ignorant British use the word Asian, you do it in ignorance and also because you are afraid that the word 'Pakistani' is "racist". You people have yourselves so tied up in thought fascist knots it is comical to behold.
Nicholas, the phrase "climate change denier" was formulated specifically to echo (and acquire the mantle of horror) of 'holocaust denier'.
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