How much longer must we wait?
Lloyd Evans 3:13pm
Cameron had little choice today. At PMQs he played it sober and he played it statesmanlike. The Afghan issue, which is close to becoming a crisis, dominated the session. Both main party leaders were standing shoulder to shoulder, and Cameron used five of his six questions asking the same thing. ‘Are we both right in thinking we’re both right?’ Yes, said the PM, we’re right.
Afghanistan’s salvation lies in the usual mantras. More ‘training up’ of security services, more help for the economy, greater attempts to root out corruption etc. It must all be ‘better targeted’ and ‘more focused’. The question of a ‘single, strong co-ordinating figure’ is being discussed in Washington. Nothing has been decided.
Only Nick Clegg showed signs of chipping a hole in the façade. ‘How much time is the prime minister giving President Karzai to clean up his government?’ Brown repeated his earlier arguments but his answer didn’t matter. Clegg’s question conceals the key point. ‘How much time?’ Evidently Clegg thinks Karzai has had ample opportunity to straighten out his bent regime and he should be put on notice and perhaps threatened with withdrawal. The LibDems have sorely missed the ‘Not In My Name’ effect, and with the Iraq issue moribund they need a new war to protest against. Here it is. The clock is ticking, not so much for Karzai as for the LibDems. It can’t be long before they suspend their support for the mission. Machievellian pacifism, for sure, but if they can complete the hand-brake turn before the election it may save them a few seats.
Labour backbencher David Winnick echoed this sentiment. ‘The country is entitled to know how long troops must stay.’ But Brown and Cameron are contemplating nothing as robust as a timetable. They boasted competitively that they had witnessed impressive mentoring programmes in Afghanistan. One wonders about the value of such trips. A visiting politician is bound to see only well-motivated Afghans snapping to attention and beaming with joy at the training initiatives that help feed their families.
The consensus seemed a mite too sweet and cosy today. Paul Flynn split the fig open and laid out its bruised and grainy innards.
‘Does the prime minister have confidence that Afghans will be prepared to slaughter their brother Afghans in support of a foreign power and a corrupt president who has just rigged his re-election?’
Put like that our mission appears – and can only appear – like an occupation. And it won’t matter to the Afghans if the new colonists arrive with shiny new social policies, equality initiatives, burqa-free zones, unisex playgroups and No Smoking signs. As for the mysterious ‘co-ordinator’ who may or may not be appointed, he too will seem like a sinister proconsul despatched from the capital of a distant empire.
There were a few lighter moments today provided unwittingly by Labour’s whips. These parliamentary gangsters had spent a busy morning getting backbenchers to memorise questions. Here was their plan. (Decide for yourself how brilliant it was.) The stooge was ordered to refer to a promise Labour has fulfilled thus providing the PM with a chance to needle Dave over the Euro-referendum. Brilliant or not, the scheme misfired. Asked about cancer waiting times Brown cheerfully launched into ‘a quote from the shadow health secretary’. Mr Speaker promptly cut him dead. ‘I don’t think we need to go into that today, prime minister.’ The yellow card should have warned David Blunkett to alter his question but, no, he surged onward into the waiting trap. ‘What does the prime minister think of the credibility of a party leader who has made a cast-iron guarantee that turns out to have been made of plywood?’ The Speaker instantly ordered Brown to refer only to government policy. This effectively muffled the PM’s guns.
During the occasional moments of levity, Brown seemed in a jolly mood today but he didn’t realise the joke was on him. Briefed to keep mentioning Labour’s ‘cast-iron’ promises he continually repeated the phrase ‘iron-cast promises’. Time for this idiot incompetent to call an election general.
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Jez
November 4th, 2009 3:46pm Report this comment"The Afghan issue, which is close to becoming a crisis, dominated the session."
NO IT WAS NOT!
The main issue for the Westminster MP's, by the uproar, noise level and outright protestation was at 12.33;
BBC News; "1233 PMQs finishes and Speaker Bercow announces that Professor Sir Ian Kennedy will be the first chair of the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority. He will be paid a maximum of £100,000 a year. ***MPs don't like this - there is uproar at the mention of his salary which is considerably more than a backbencher earns.***"
5 British lads murdered for a corrupt Westminster elite.
All they're bothered about is that they won't be getting as much money as someone else in their trough.
We all heard it! On the radio!
Filthy pigs busy wallowing in their mire whilst the lives of young British Army personel are on the line, right now as we speak!
A total outrage!
logdon
November 4th, 2009 4:15pm Report this commentKim Howells, I suspect speaks for a nation.
Brown's deceit on this issue, 'protecting us from terror on our streets' is risible.
Why there and why not where it counts, here in Bighty?
Severely curtail all immigration from Pakistan. Monitor all to and fro travel by British Pakistanis. Stop the importation of brides. Stop automatic access for family members.
Fifty two people died on 7/7 at the hands of British Pakistanis. That was a declaration of war. We are a now de facto Dar el Harb, the land of war in the eyes of many and the self made video's claim as much.
They started this. We must end it.
"It would be better to bring home the great majority of our fighting men and women and concentrate, instead, on using the money saved to secure our own borders."......
Kim Howells, http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/howells-uk-must-quit-afghanistan-1814324.html
Moraymint
November 4th, 2009 4:37pm Report this commentGiven the cripplingly low level of resources that our political class is prepared to allocate to defence and security (and it'll now get worse, before it gets better), I would prefer to see us switch our "main effort" to securing our borders, cities and towns and preventing atrocities within these shores by watching, tracking, arresting and locking up (or deporting) the psychopaths that strive to destroy our way of life.
This must be more cost-effective than sustaining thousands of poorly equipped troops in Afghanistan, propping up a corrupt government in a country where the people have no interest in being governed and watching men die and be maimed with sickening regularity. The task is futile as previous expeditions throughout history have shown. Leave them to it, I say.
The problem with this proposal is that it would mean reversing the Labour Party's precious policies of encouraging unfettered immigration to the UK and the establishment of a so-called multicultural society: policies which are destined to have a disastrous effect on the cohesion and stability of British society, if the damage is not already done.
The alternative is to put three-quarters of a million troops into Afghanistan and colonise the country; I don't think so.
Watt Tyler
November 4th, 2009 7:03pm Report this commentIt doesn't matter who the idiot calling himself British PM is.
Vote UKIP
logdon
November 4th, 2009 7:27pm Report this commentFive British soldiers killed today in Afghanstan by 'rogue policeman'
Now this?
"Muslim men plan complaint after being ‘treated like terrorists’ by airport police"....
"One, Mr Hussain said: “We (the UK) have gone to Afghanistan to promote our way of life – that is a very tolerant society that is very accepting. While here, the picture is different and is getting worse. It’s a very sad situation.”
And who do they think is to blame?
London Bombing, 21/7, Tiger, Tiger Nightclub, Glasgow Airport, Liquid bomb plot.
Maybe they'll begin to realise that there's a pattern here and that British Pakistani's are responsible.
What actually do they expect after that lot?
Muslim men plan complaint after being ‘treated like terrorists’ by airport police
Nov 4 2009 by Abby Alford, Western Mail
A PARTY of Muslim men who claim they were singled out and treated like terrorists by airport police vowed last night to push for an independent investigation.
The seven-strong group say they plan to approach the Independent Police Complaints Commission over the incident at Cardiff Airport.
The men, who are from Pakistani families but were born and brought up in Cardiff, said they were questioned and had their details and passports checked by police officers.
Two of the group also said they were singled out for hour-long interrogations, during which they claimed they were asked if they had extremist views and if they had ever been asked to carry out a terrorist attack.
Garage owner Sajid Hussain, 30, from Cyncoed, Cardiff, said: “It was clear discrimination. We were the only Asians in the airport. We understand they have a job to do and have to pull some people over, but it’s just the fact that it was all seven of us. And some of the questions they asked were ridiculous. It was like they were saying to me, ‘You have got a beard, so you look like a terrorist’. I felt quite bad that, just because of my appearance, I am considered half way to becoming a terrorist.”................
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2009/11/04/muslim-men-plan-complaint-after-being-treated-like-terrorists-by-airport-police-91466-25085895/
logdon
November 4th, 2009 7:32pm Report this commentYou signed a petition asking the Prime Minister to "resign".
The Prime Minister's Office has responded to that petition and you can view
it here:
Wednesday 4 November 2009
please-go - epetition response
We received a petition asking:
“We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to resign.”
Details of Petition:
“There are many reasons why we might want Brown to resign, but rather than having lots of narrow petitions on this topic (most of which have been rejected), I wanted one for all of us.”
• Read the petition
• Petitions homepage
Read the Government’s response
The Prime Minister is completely focussed on restoring the economy, getting people back to work and improving standards in public services. As the Prime Minister has consistently said, he is determined to build a stronger, fairer, better Britain for all.
Pramston
November 5th, 2009 7:32am Report this commentI can seldom be bothered to get angry with politicians but David Blunkett's smug attempt to rile Cameron for 'betraying' his promises had me literally screaming at the radio. The man has no shame, the deceptions and betrayals his party have engaged in over this matter are simply breathtaking and will have serious consequences far into the future. The link between the governed and the Government is now dangerously obscure and close to breaking point as we move from a democracy into the unknown; looking to that future it is possible that rebellion may be the only answer for those who want that link restored. Labour has done this not the Conservatives.
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