Is Cameron cowering in the face of Labour attacks?

cmp

Agreed.

fr

Did DC pinch your parking space, Fraser ?

Dividing Lines?

Agree entirely that there is a need for at least some occasions (of substance) when Labour says "you don't really mean that do you?" and Cameron says "yes we do". If only to stop him looking like a 100% wimp.

Not sure whether in my book marriage would be one of those, but it's for DC to choose his ground.

Prodicus

The leftie bots are making hay with your name on this one, Fraser. Well done.

strapworld

Mr Nelson. A leader LEADS. Cameron is proving, yet again, that he is a follower. Ask yourself, Would Maggie have been diverted from her aims, visions or policies by a purile Labour Government? Of course not.

A leader would say THIS is what we will be doing. THIS is how we will do it. Then sit back and allow the people to either vote for or against them.

Cameron is as weak as dish water. Slippery and insipid. He really has to strengthen himself for the attacks on a daily and hourly basis or else he will crumble in front of the camera's.

The country is crying out for a Leader, for someone with a vision. ANYONE who will take us away from KIM SUNG BROWN and his rotten communistic government, which has bankrupted this wonderful country both financially and morally. IF Cameron cannot do the job HE HAS to stand down now.

John

Another anti-Cameron post from Fraser "Will this do Mr Barclay?" Nelson.
Fraser, you're too much of a clever-dick for your own good.
Cameron's doing a difficult job. He could do without armchair critics like you.

Martin Cole

It is a sure-fire lost cause unless the Tories rapidly dump Vapid. My blog archives have the reasons in all their archives since 2005!

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

Maybe the penny has dropped for Cameron. After all these years of Nu Labour indoctrination, marriage has gone out of fashion. At least between men and women!

mart

Why not give the benefit of the doubt.. IMHO it is reasonable to say taxes will go up for everyone and spending will go down. Think about it. It doesn't do a married couple much good if they get (say) a small increase in the threshold, yet, with everyone else, gets that wiped out by a hike on the basic rate. We'll have to be philosophical about high tax in the next 10 years. After all, the money is already spent and we are paying it back.

Tiberius

Keep it up, Fraser. Just remember the choice you have to make when the ghost of Jacob Marley comes to visit you.

Minnie Ovens

Mr Nelson,
I am beginning to think you would have a better PM elect than Mr Cameron.
That remark reflects my head scratching at the Tory "policies". Are they policies or vague wish lists.
Everything is so will of the wisp. Here I am, a Conservative voter for many of the post war years and who really wishes to go their way once more, yet I'm uncertain who Mr Cameron is, what he stands for and why he is calling himself a leader.
To me a leader has beef. He has principles. He bases his policies on these principle and he leads by exhorting the electorate to vote his way because of his arguments.
I'm sitting here wondering whether we made a terrifying mistake.
David Davis would never have generated the type of attacks a desperate Labour party are making and which are landing heavily.
His cabal (if not cabinet) would not have been Eton and Notting Hill based; would not be raally worrying about what shirt, tie, shoes to wear and where is the location to be?
It would not be quiche and white wine, feely touchy.
There is a perception that Mr Cameron and his team are terrified of Brown which I find astonishing in light of the appalling disaster the New Labour project has been and its draconian cost, long term, to the Brirish public.
Why aren't these poll figures continuously wandering between 8% and 14% and not well over 50% (more up because of the continuous splat of Brownian bugger ups and lies not Cameron's actions)?
It's early but so far I am unimpressed.
They have so much to work from, why don't they use it?
It's my opinion that many will vote for Mr Cameron, not because they like him and his policies...certainly don't empathize with him and his crew! but because they are so desperate to get rid of New Labour.

Oliver Deed

Oh come on Fraser, you couldn't see this coming. Your man is a complete an utter lightweight who'll do anything to get himself elected.

He is right to u-turn on this policy as far as I'm concerned. Social engineering to appease the religious right (which does exist) within his party. Don't think this will be the last Cameron u-turn we see.

freedomscaresme

Nasty prejudice against the unmarried.

This country is built not only by those fused together with a wedding band. Perhaps be more tolerant for a happier world?

Andrew

Perhaps it shows that Cameron is human afterall in making a gaffe...

I wonder Fraser, are you trying to actively help Brown win the election?

toco

Fraser you are being a tad naive.I know your strategy is to keep up the pressure and prevent Tory complacency but in the world of honest Cameron politics it is simply just not appropriate or candid to promise people everything they wish to hear.More respect will be earned by levelling with the voters rather than adopting the deceptive Brown tactic of misleading and spinning.

David Ossitt

David Cameron could do a lot worse; if when in doubt on any subject he should ask himself, what would Margaret do?

And when he found the answer, then do it, come what may.

Margaret Thatcher was not a ditherer; Margaret Thatcher did not court the good opinions of lesser men, Margaret Thatcher knew what was best for Britain and got on and did it.

Wake up David Cameron; and while you are at it grow up.

Ben Philips

If Cameron buckles in this General Election run-up with endless policy feints and retreats he won't deserve to win.

I want to RESPECT him and I simply don't at the moment, because I think he's a chicken

Simon

Sadly I think its against the temperament of Cameron who comes from a PR background to stand with his shoulders square on ready for the fight to counter the lies and spin of the Labour machine.

Surely spin will not ultimately prevail against labour spin. Sure wisdom and cunning yes but you have got sometimes lose the argument to win in the long term!

Surely you dont need an MBA and an overpaid PR man to work this one out. Its just good old fashioned integrity coupled with wisdom.

Verityred

Oh do give us a rest Frasier, your posts of late have been little but a rather tedious synthetic gloom and doom. Have you been supping with the bovine dinosaur Heffer a little too often?

Short the UK

It's the dreaded curse of triangulation and spin. Straight talk and no bull should be the order of the day. Fraser, keep hammering him, he deserves it. Cammie was behind the curve for his first few years, now he sits on the curve and is scared to go ahead of the curve. It all boils down to confidence and leadership.

perdix

Typical lazy journalist headline.

TGF UKIP

Fraser, I'm disappointed in you. Difficult I know, but you actually seem to be putting a gloss on the extent of the cock-up. It was far worse than you make out as the BBC made gleefully and painfully clear when they made the farrago centre stage in their TV Six O'clock News.

First, Dave said very specifically on camera in an interview, presumably with Nick Robinson, that there couldn't be tax breaks for marriage only for "his spokesman" to issue a statement in Dave's name shortly afterwards saying there would be.

Having nailed your colours to their mast for so long, aren't you becoming just a teeny bit embarrassed by the inadequacy of your friends, Fraser?

Irene

Since you went "upstairs" you have changed -and maybe you think you should change in your new position.

But your blogs are practically worthless now, they all seem to be along the same lines, pick pick pick IMO.

Though you do seem to write nicely about Mandy!

I did not enjoy your Sky interview either, you were almost as bad as the so called "economist" cutie sitting beside you, who I think is probably from the Blachflower school of economists.

Really fed up with you!

Verity

John 6:50 – Another anti-Cameron post from Fraser "Will this do Mr Barclay?" Nelson. Most of us around here don’t mind trolls as long as they have a pointed wit and are entertaining and neither quality was apparent in your post.

Fraser is one of the most astute, grounded and articulate journalists currently plying the trade in Westminster. (Although he chickened out on Neather.) Wit (such as it is, in your case) isn’t amusing unless it rings true.

Minnie Ovens is correct when she says everything is so willow –the-wisp. I have absolutely no idea what the Conservative platform is.

In fact, Strapworld says it all, above. But I’ll add my tuppence worth anyway.

Cameron is driven by ego, not a strong will to serve his country. He comes across as not having a set of fixed principles. I have been saying for 18 months that the Tories will not win the election unless they replace him with someone who has principles and a bulldog spirit. All this dinky twizzling around and having new little announcements and concentration on presentation rather than substance of content is irritating. That photo op in the Garden of Remembrance was shameful. And who can forget the Swedish ice floe in the company of two A-List Huskies?

Cameron’s all over the place like a rash. He has no fire in his belly. No outrage at what the slimy Students Union Marxists and Gramscis have done to our country over the past 13 years. There is no strength in his wispy ideas. The only strength is his hunger to be PM. It will not happen.

And, among Conservatives, there is no hunger for Cameron. Read the blogs, including the literate, articulate ones in The Telegraph. Read what the bloggers over on Iain Dale say.

It is not too late to get a new broom, or, I guarantee it will be a hung Parliament or the Marxists will slither back in under the lintel.

Daniel Hannan could skewer Gordon Brown with five or six sentences. In fact he did, in Brussels. He completely undid Brown who was reduced to false laughter to pretend he thought it was a joke. Grimly satisfying. Cameron does not have that lightning a thought process nor that fine a rapier.

Edward

"Sadly I think its against the temperament of Cameron who comes from a PR background"

This is the problem, isn't it? His instincts - whatever his rational judgement may say - are those of a PR man.

Martyn Rowe

I know this is only 'Day 1' and all of this will be cyber chip-paper in the morning but I think Fraser is onto something very serious here.

As the election nears Labour will throw the kitchen sink at the Tories. They will lie, obfuscate, act completely shamelessly and hypocritically and will things will get nasty and personal.

At the last election, I remember Michael Howard's team (an experienced lot) getting spooked under Labour fire. I hope Cameron doesn't go the same way.

I'd advocate aloof 'yeah whatever' tactics. The Boris Johnson "how dare that lot lecture me?" route.

For instance today, when Labour released their dossier, CCHQ should've kept schtum and let the media do the work for them. Everyone knows Labour are in the shite with the economy, that they gutlessly opted out of a comprehensive spending review, that they are coy about the real state of the public finances. The Conservatives should've let them have their moment, risen above it and answered by saying "we'll accept no lectures or criticism from this failed lot".

Easy.

By flailing with rebuttals they've gotten themselves into the trap and now look a bit silly over the married tax credits.

ajs

A clever boxer does not reveal his strategy nor his punches. The punches will come when he has drawn -or foiled- his opponent. And meanwhile, he does not listen to the armchair/wheelchair critics.
Give them hell, Mr Cameron, when you are ready - and that includes the Conservative wet-knicker brigade who figure so loudly on this site.

Chuck Unsworth

Short answer: No.

Next?

JONNY

'Would Maggie have been diverted from her aims, visions or policies by a purile Labour Government?'

Ah yes, strapworld.
That is indeed the question.
(Assuming of course that her crude incitement to greed counts as a vision).

JONNY

'Would Maggie have been diverted from her aims, visions or policies by a purile Labour Government?'

Oh My God strapworld.
Perish the thought.

merlin

Fraser give it a rest you are now turning me away from your paper

Chris lancashire

Give it a rest. If Cameron was the worst leader the Tories ever had (which he's not) he'd still be a country mile better than cowardly Brown. As the useless PM might say, that's the real choice - Brown or Cameron.

JONNY

Afraid to say Fraser Nelson
there's been more than a touch of the journeyman about your pieces since Christmas.
Do sparkle it up a bit.

Helmholtz Watson

Fraser - please get some perspective; I expect more from you than this shallow petty piece. Particularly on a day when the Chancellor has produced a 150 page report from the Treasury about what they imagine the Tory plans might be. This is a department that is paid for by our taxes - what are they doing producing party political literature??? Ignoring the fact that much of the dossier is speculation and just wrong, who authorised this misuse of public money?

And remember to put all DC's comments about spending / cuts / taxes / deficits into the context of the current government - this is a Chancellor who has not produced a comprehensive spending review in over a year because he claims the economic situation is too uncertain. So the incumbent government - with all the facts and resources - can't predict the spending of its own departments.

Ask the serious questions - what are the Labour plans (not evasions, real details)? Who authorised this report ? If a private sector CFO was not able to produce financial projections and budgets he/she would be deemed incompetent....why are you allowing AD to get away with this ? Or are you and other journalists now so used to the misinformation and evasions of the current government that you've lost the will to keep asking ?

Athesius the Facilitator

No he is not cowering. He is trying to deal with the semantics that the press throw at him. His policy on married couples is blatant and obvious yet the press have this thing about picking over every word that a Conservative leader says.

My wife who takes not a lot of notice of these things understood that he would love to give married couples a perk in the tax system but is worried about the "dosh".

So Fraser, give it a rest. Your job is to help get rid of this government who are getting away with murder.

Why did nobody ask Balls where his 50 mill is coming from for his latest wheeze to give late developing nippers a one on one teacher. It just doesn't make sense to me that the media do not care about the semantics of labour spending yet pour over everything the opposition do or say.

echo34

Just for a couple of days, could you journos not have look at what Labour is up to instead of beating on the tories continuously.

Brown goes on tv on sunday looking like a bag of s***e and drowning Marr in doodoo and all your supposedly conservative rag can do is nit pick through tory policy. (At least they have some!)

Grow some balls and go after those who are currently governing us with ineptitude.

And to verity, Cameron this, cameron that, you really want more labour dont you? Sitting there in some far off land telling us how things are.

People would take you more seriously if your perception of politics in the UK wasn't purely through your broadband connection.

Too much dissection, new story, move along please, next?...

seb

I'd like Verity or another violently anti-Cameron poster to explain in plain terms how a Labour victory would be such a wonderful thing for the UK. I'm not sure what you would like to happen. The deficit soars to one and a half trillion and then...? Credit dries up for Great Britain and...? People riot and....? Or is it just the fact that Cameron, the dirty sob, is not Margaret Thatcher in drag that disqualifies him from replacing Brown?

[strapworld, Johnny - 'purile' is not an English word. Puerile, from the Latin for 'child', is.]

General Zod

You didn't like Fraser much when he wasn't feeding your pathetic frenzy over the Neather shower in a teacup, Verity.

This is another ridiculous article. Why the Hell would Cameron cower before such weak attacks from Labour. He's probably still shaking from a fit of hysterics after watching Brown with Marr yesterday.

JONNY

Don't blame me Seb.

Strapworld's the purile one. Not me.
All I did was copy one of his errors.

THX1138

General Zod I hope you don't mind but I'm starting to like you. Ignore Verity she lives in Mexico and doesn't even have a dog in our fight..

Victor Southern

Fraser. You need to read the example I gave of taking over a filthy kitchen. It was only yesterday on your own blog.

This anti-Cameron line day after day is OK coming from the Verity's and Vultures of this world and the UKippers - it is their obsession. From you it rankles for it shows you are no longer a journalist who reports news but one who makes the news.

We all know you consider yourself to be far smarter than Cameron - so do Hitchens and Heffer. So, if you are so smart will you tell us one simple thing? Will Cameron have a better crack at rebuilding our country than Brown would?

If you don't think it is Brown then I suggest you do not make a daily habit of monstering the Conservatives. Switch to a new disc occasionally.

Noa Zrk

The Cowdenbeast is a hapless punchbag, to be demolished and dispatced at will, with the consummate politician's armoury of wit, scorn, truth and passion.
His wretched party is in no better state
; a laughing stock abroad, a crying shame at home. The Matador's sword should by now have be being used to apply the coupe-de-grace.
So why isn't it happening?
No point in asking the Millbank Gauleiters that patrol these blogs as the mildest demurral attracts their insensate fury. Victory at any price is their motto.
But, if someone knows the answer to why the beast still lives when he should be long gone, then whisper it, quietly.
After all, it cannot be because the Chosen One, is not...can it?

wrinkled weasel

Insight is a non-partisan affair, but if you believed some of the spleen-venting on this thread, you might expect to see poor Fraser strung up from a lamp post with the word "Quisling" on a card around his neck.

Give the guy a break, guys! Some of us realise that Dave might just snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. This is not a time for complacency or anodyne awards of consolation prizes. This is war and instead of Rommel we've got Captain Mainwaring.

Verity

Number Plate - I have a vote in this fight, sweet thang. Being a Brit an' awl. Indeed, my vote has exactly the same value as yours. One.

Pie

It's the divorce laws, stupid. Wouldn't cost a penny extra to tighten.

The Master

Darling! 32 billion black hole? What about the trillion and a third your shower have lost?

Pie

We can't argue for improvements to Tory policy before the election because that would hand a win to Brown? Rubbish.

Most of you wouldn't sign an important billion pound contract without checking the detail first would you? The sign date for the contract is the date of the general election, and until then we must analyse, evaluate, and criticise David Cameron's policies and proposals. Once he's in 10 Downing Street, he can do whatever he likes according to his manifesto/mandate/contract, and there's no need for new compromises or corrections. Now is the time for change to any mistaken policies, dodgy ideas, and bad thinking. Remember, a lot of these policies have been written by young post-graduates, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but you'd want to check the details before letting these youthfully inspired policies affect your country right?

What is decided in policy before the general election date will most likely decide what happens for the next 5 years. Don't be a fool with these Get Brown Out arguments. Don't scare us with Brown, refine those darned policies! If you see a hole in policy, tell everyone! Plug it now or it won't be filled for 5 years if at all.

Mike Towl

Are you getting enough sleep FW. Since the much heralded arrival of your latest ankle snapper you do seem to be writing some strange pieces about poor old Dave. Are you doing more than your fair share of 3am feeding? Still not mastered the art of a 5 second Nappy change in the dark? Or just a bit of Post Natal Stress? Since I was a lad, the old Speccy has had a reputation for un-biased comment(a bit right midfield maybe)but when it comes to Dave & Co., your slip is beginning to show from under your kilt.

Harry T.

THX1138,

Regardless of whatever pressing reasons caused her to decamp to that particular armpit of the globe, under current rules, Verity can apply for a postal vote for up to 15 years after leaving the UK.

Seeing those posters of Dave that were unveiled yesterday reminded me of one of Verity's more humorous observations about him. In the past she has likened him to the upmarket used car salesman Swiss Toni, from 'The Fast Show.'

However, Swiss was always impeccably dressed but Dave steadfastly refuses to wear his old school tie. Would you buy a used Bentley, Aston or a Jag from someone who cannot be bothered to dress properly?

Simon

If I could be bothered I would look back at some of your pieces when you where at The Scotsman. You remember the ones exalting the virtues of the Scottish parliament etc. Funny dont remember you banging on about marriage and cutting health spending then.

Pot Head

Verity point taken but do you have to live with the consequences of your vote?

Vulture

For a master of PR, Dave sure made a PR cock-up on this one.

It's significant that the Camerloons on this site don't defend their boy on the grounds that he's a firm, principled Conservative leader with a mind and will of his own and clear-cut distinctive policies.

No, their feeble argument runs thus: 'You don't want five more years of Bruin, so you will have to support Dave'. Hardly a ringing endorsement, is it?

That's because in their secret hearts they know what Dave is : pale pink candy floss dripping off the end of a stick who will melt in the heat of the dirty election battle.

Of COURSE we don't want a Liebour win. We are just saying that the Tories could and should do much better than with this fey fop at the top.

Malcolm Dunn

Admittedly the press conference was not very good but I thought Cameron was being honest. The economic situation changes everything and any tax cut like this has to be secondary to reducing the deficit.
This contrast with Brown who denied things we know to be true was marked.
You should have praised Cameron not criticised him Fraser.

Dorothy Wilson

Surely the key point is that we have a structural deficit approaching £200bn. Most of the blame for that can be laid on Brown, who is totally in denial over whether it even exists.

The first priority of any incoming government has to be to get a grip on that. Unless that is done it will be the markets and credit rating agencies who decide the extent of the medicine. And it will be harsh and bitter.

Noa Zrk

Pie
January 5th, 2010 7:28am

You are absolutely on the chart, or is it on the crust, with your comments here old bean.
As someone who has negotiated and signed high value contracts, and still does, you are right to say that everyone involved pores over the people the deal and the details. If it isn't working you can't fix it free later. And you're not signing a binding contract with politicians..."trust me" pays no bills, its "show me" that puts the money in the bank.
So Dave, show me you're really up to the job you want to do...

Fergus Pickering

What is this tie stuff? I hate ties. Youngish men wearing ties are usually crooks. Away with bloody ties. Brown and Blair wear ties. Hang 'em in their own ties. Silly and redundant garments. You'll be having us back in spats and sock suspenders next.

oldtimer

No, he is not cowering. However the confusion certainly qualifies in my reckoning as A&E #1, where A&E = political accident and emergency, or alternatively = an are you on your arse or elbow question, according to your preference.

To paraphrase Goldfinger, once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is incompetence. In short he cannot afford to do this too often or his campaign will be in very serious trouble.

wound-up

'ajs' has it.

To hell with 'policies'. Dealing with bombed-out Britain's problems requires competent people with integrity and the ability to adapt as complex circumstances change. DC and co. are fine.

JONNY

'Of COURSE we don't want a Liebour win.'

No you just want some zombified unelectable right-winger, out of touch with everyone and everything, to take the party into the permafrost wilderness.

Ghengis

Victor Southern said – “Fraser. You need to read the example I gave of taking over a filthy kitchen. It was only yesterday on your own blog”
An admirable example which together with mine of the same date, stand alone in fully recognising the gravity of a parliament in which the majority of “representatives” have claimed to used the system within the rules whereas public opinion is saying they have misused the expenses system and in consequence must forfeit the power to manage the system.
To continue debating mundane party political points regarding a parliament that is so fundamentally damaged is nothing other than a waste of time.

Vulture

@JONNY: Do you get out much?

I ask because you seem to seriuously believe that the majority of people in this country are thirsting for an Old Etonian sqillionaire who has never done a day's work in his life ( I don't count PR) and who surrounds himself with a gaggle of similar over-priveleged, inexperienced rich boy smoothies (Nick Herbert, Greg Barker, Oliver Leftwing, Francis Maude, George Osbourne and so endlessly on..) to come along and dig this country out of the deep economic and social hole that Bruin has tipped it into when they can't even get their agreed PR line of the day straight.

You have to - you really must - be joking.

Martyn Rowe

Fergus - I wear a tie. But nothing else.

Vulture - Does Jonny get out much? I'd say yep, to the same sort of places as me. Non reactionary, pragmatic and reasonable places.

General Zod

Verity, you may have a vote, but youare going to throw it away voting for one or other bunch of social inadequates (unless you really are a deep cover Labour troll).

THX1138, I'm touched.

(I tried to post something on these lines an hour or so ago. Still, at least it's working better than yesterday morning when the site started to demand a username and password just to read it).

General Zod

I shudder to think where Vulture goes when he gets out.

The Master

Were it not for this ridiculous cold snap I'd be out hunting not reading this nonsense.
However, that said, the one thing that seems plain from the tone of this discussion is that the Cameroons are perceived to lack any killer instinct.
I hope it is, rather, a muddle in strategy.
Trying to be first out of the gate just for headlines this far from the election is bound to lead to gaffs, after all, rehearsing in public is always a messy affair.

This is not the time to pull punches, By that I mean it is time to ridicule and humiliate the parliamentary labour party without let up, then produce the manifesto.

Edmund

Vote Labour get corporate socialism
Vote Tories get corporate socialism
Vote Liberals get corporate socialism

When will you people stop toeing the line of the authoritarian agenda.

They have destroyed your industries, they have destroyed your children’s education, they have destroyed your culture, they have destroyed England, and they will destroy the United Kingdom.

Voting for the main three parties is a display of cowardice. Nothing will ever change if you don’t help break this duopoly. In time even your liberty will become a mystery to yourselves if you don't break the cycle of deceit.

PAUL GILBOY

The health benefits of marriage are well established surely the money can be found from the health budget!

NM

Can someone please explain to me, a single bloke, why I should through my taxes, pay a subsidy to those in the population just because they are married? Do those already married get this subsidy? How many of them would get divorced without it? How many unmarried do we expect to get married due to this tax and what will the cost per additional marraige be? Having spent the last ten years gritting my teeth at Gordon Brown's breaks for "hard working families" while shafting the likes of me, this is pretty hard to take.

James Delingpole

What Verity said. God, you're so right about everything Verity. Please will YOU be our next Prime Minister.

TGF UKIP

James Delingpole, now there's a thought to cheer up this freezing, dark, snowbound, northern day.

Holly ......

NM.
What Cameron is doing is to take away the stupid situation where it is a financial advantage for couples to live apart,which costs you a heck of a lot more in subsidies than a tax break for staying together.
A couple living seperate with the children shared between them could both end up
getting working tax credit,housing benefit,
council tax rebate,etc,etc.
This is not practical and anything that encourages couples to stay together is good for all of us.
Where single people really that much worse off when this tax break was in place before?
As it is now you are subsidising two people with lots of different welfare payments instead of a much smaller tax break by one of the couple,hopefully the main earner.
You never know,you may not be single forever and it is not just hetro marriages it is ALL married couples.
It is a great way to get rid of the welfare dependancy in this country.
I do understand what you are saying and in an ideal world...

Holly ......

NM.
I have never had children and over the years,when the little dears are so uneducated and so malnourished and poverty striken that taxes have gone up to defend the little buggers, it has done my bloody head in.
So I do know what you mean.Paying for other people is just a fact of life.It doesn't need to be so much though, that it takes away personal responsibility.

THX1138

TGF -Watch yours and Delinpole's hero Ian Plimer make a total arse of himself debating Monbiot on Oz TeeVee

http://www.clivedavisconfab.com/2009/12/relax-ian-plimer-is-a-buffoon-2/

I still never got my money back from the non-debate the Speccie held, surprise, surprise I got no reply to my e-mail. Guys if you want to give me my £28 back you know where I am.

Naomi Muse

Verity is right. No difference between the main contenders except it was Brown and Blair that got us into this mess.

Think UKIP will be the leaven in the bread of the next parliament and Gordo will be off for a job at the World Bank....

TGF UKIP

THX 1138, you need to spend some time on wattsupwiththat.com to gain some balance and could I also point you in the direction of weatheraction.co.uk and take the link to Professor Piers Corbyn's (any relation to your MP mate?) presentation to UCL which I think you may also find persuasive. BTW he was the guy who predicted what the Summer would be like correctly and that we had this lot in store for us now - in complete contrast to your fellow bunch of headbanging zealot mates at the Met Office.

And what are the other scammers at CRU going to do with their calendar now - terminate 09 at the end of December and begin 2010 at the first of March, appropriate temperatures permitting?

And why hasn't my previous post responding to Number Plate's previous masochistic meanderings appeared?

Barbara

I sincerely believe that Cameron should have a long talk with Meline Philips who writes for the spectator, she seems more aware of the world and it's problems than Mr Cameron. Indeed we do have to repay the debt, but we have more pressing things happening to this country than the debt problem, the 'Muslim ?' is far more of a danger than the former. Ms Philips has done several articles that have been enlightening and educational, not always agreed with but again spoken with care and truth. Cameron will need nervous of steel to deal with these people who are well intent on dividing this country with the sole intent to rule if they can, of course they never will, for the people are waking up and smelling the coffee. However, will DC be the one to lead when the chips are down, I have serious doubts. Therefore he will have to think carefully how he proceeds, we don't want the EU, another, monster created without consent yet he let us down miserably, makes one think does it not? For me the Conservatives who used to be the true blue of the nation seem weakend and hell bent on saving money than saving the nation what use is the former without the latter? Is this why many will vote for the BNP or Ukip who speak loudly for the people and the nation, it answers it's self does it not.

A. Headhunter

This is a very interesting conundrum: If he is just a vapid PR man why can he not make himself look smarter and more principled? And if he is really smart and principled, whay can he not use his PR skills to get the message across? One has to hope he is a lousy PR man with sound principles, but one would prefer to be convinced, rather than hopeful, before facing the ballot paper.....