CoffeeHousers' Wall, 8 March - 14 March

Andy

Why do charities and other similar organisations seeking 'jumble' not talk to each other?

We must get 3 bags per week through our door, sometimes all on the same day.

TrevorsDen

The news that during the election campaign war reporters will be withdrawn and censored and the only news from Afghanistan will be disseminated by the MoD is an utter disgrace and travesty of justice.

Our soldiers are supposed to be fighting for democracy and at the cornerstone of Democracy - an election - we have their activities censored.

There is no low to which Brown and Labour will not stoop.

Ghengis

Anybody notice an unusual rise in temperature for this time of the year?

Billy Blofeld

So the Tories can't even score open goals against Gordon Brown......

..... thus is it not time that a few like minded groups, The Spectator, Tax Payers Alliance, The Sun, et al.... funded a campaign to out Gordon over his massive economic failure.

Use your marketing budgets together to stoke a bit of controversy, a row with Gordon and increase your circulation.

If we carry on as we are - then the average person on the street will remain oblivious of Gordon's economic crimes.

Publius

1. Why is it taking so long for posts to get through?

2. What difference does registering make? What information do you harvest or have access to, that you don't have access to when posters post the regular way?

stephen

The following is probably heresy to put on the Coffee House Wall; but IMHO maybe the best result for UK plc is Brown to have a small majority and the IMF comes into sort UKplc in short order! Looking at other countries having to struggle with their deficits a Boy George approach would result in public sector strikes the like of which we have not seen since the Winter of Discontent! Boy George has very little credibility with ordinary people and his millionaires IHT scheme financed as it was to be by taxing non doms seems a real shot in the foot. Did he ask Ashcroft before he embarked on his crusade against non doms? I doubt if we will ever get a straight answers from the Cameroons.

Derek

For those interested in BBC's objective approach to reporting certain stories; for Rod Liddle, to the extent that he may still believe his position of some weeks back that criticism of Islam is a form of racism; and for all those who are not sure what purpose or national interest is served by the massive increase through immigration in the muslim proportion of our population:

BBC
"Some 500 people, including many women and children, are now reported to have been killed in a weekend ethnic clash near Jos in Nigeria, officials say." (BBC online homepage headline)

cf.

CNN
"Lagos, Nigeria (CNN) -- The death toll from weekend violence in central Nigeria climbed to more than 200 Monday after members of a machete-wielding Muslim group attacked mostly Christian villages, officials said. " (CNN headline quoted on Jihad Watch)

Mr. Fraser Nelson's continuing breach of his promises to offer an article on the Neather revelations is another example of the "keep mum" understanding among our political class on the matters of greatest concern to the people.

(“Mum” appears to be a word of imitative origins, referencing the “mmmmmm” sound that people make when their mouths are closed and they try to talk, or when someone tries to talk with a hand clamped over his or her mouth. Since the 14th century, people have been talking about “keeping mum” to stress the idea that they will not spill a secret or talk about an issue.)

Waiting for you, Mmmmmmr. Nelson...

Wilhelm

Regards to the Bulger case

'' Its not in the public interest ''

Thats a great line, that is, it covers their backsides, was it God who ordained that rule ? What they really mean is '' its not in the legal systems interest for the public to know.''

There's the law and theres justice and never the twain shall
meet. Lawyers who wear that pinstripe uniform outfit to give them an air of respectability are just hookers with no morals who defend the indefensible while judges are just silly old goats who live in ivory towers, suffering from a massive God complex.

Of course we should know because we are taxpayers and we are paying for it. Why are they running about in the shadows and the darkness ? Why are they so frightened of the truth and transparency ? The smokescreen story was John Venebles had a fight at work, we all knew that was a load of bull.

Englishman Abroad

Sitting across the Irish Sea, watching what seemed to be fairly straightforward election, I am deeply depressed that the people of the UK appear to be sleepwalking into disaster.
Say what you want about the Irish mess, but at least the government have shown some grasp of what is going on.
How is it that a large part of the UK public seems to be so inured to Brown's lies, deceit and total lack of any kind of plan to get out if this mess?
Who are the 33% -ish who still think he is in any way equipped to be PM?
I guess this must be a measure of a) scepticism in the political process, and b) the client state that he has built over the years.
I would love to know, what Coffeehousers think Brown must do, in order for the scales to fall from the eyes of that part of the electorate.

Frank P

This item dwarfs any other news that I have read this morning:

http://americandigest.org/mt-archives/punditinstants/call_me_shallow_but_this.php

wrinkled weasel

I am afraid I have to agree with Publius. Posting at the Speccie is such a saga. It takes hours for posts to appear and sometimes they do not appear at all. Whilst I commend Peter Hoskin's offers to help via email, this cannot be a practical solution.

There is a significant disadvantage to all of this, which is that, although we are interested in what people say, we cannot hang around all day waiting for their posts to appear, only to find the discussion has moved on. The delays play havoc with the running of a coherent debate.
Surely, there is a solution to this?

Ctesibius

The great thing about Guido's posting about Derek Draper, Roger Liddle and James MacIntyre http://order-order.com/2010/03/08/absolutely-brilliant-feminists/ is that it suggest there may be more unpleasant Draper / 10, Downing Street emails stashed away somewhere...

Noa Zrk

Daniel- 8th March, 2010 -Your posting on last weeks Wall refers.

All reasonable points and as a matter of good sense we should be looking for cheap and sustainable power where int doesn't threaten our strategic and economic interests.
I noticed a feature on Today this morning which covered the private generation of hydro power from our rivers. Aside from the usual major bureaucratic hurdles from planning permission etc there is a major threat to fish stocks and a multi-billion pound bill. The net result? A maximum of 0.5% of total electricity produced.

Leaving what no doubt appears as skepticism to one side my original point was that we are in danger of the lights going out not within 30 years but the next 5 and the Conservative party doesn't not have so much as a jump lead, much less a clue, to address what will be the most pressing public issue after national bankruptcy.

Tiberius

Englishman Abroad: simple answer to your final point - he would have to become a Tory.

Frank P

Things are hotting up Stateside:

http://newzeal.blogspot.com/2010/03/we-people.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Cannot some of you right-leaning techies drum up something similar for our own dire political decline? What we need is a general erection, not a general election.

TrevorsDen

Yes - Ctesibius .... Will The New Statesman still employ McIntyre? Will The Independent still use Rod Liddle? Now that they are proven misogynists?

Just another example of stinking labour hypocrisy.

adenuff

Who am I describing?

‘Gained power in a bloodless coup. Held on to power by imposing a reign of fear within his inner court and by refusing to hold democratic elections. Gained the loyalty of the common people by ensuring that they had low paid jobs (if at all), no ambitions and depended upon state handouts for survival. Neglected the health of the common people. Ruined the economy of his previously wealthy country. Survived numerous attempts to depose him. Prone to making long rambling speeches. Arranged for the destruction of opponents. Bolstered his own self-importance by staging gatherings of his ‘loyal’ troops. Liked to stage events to show his ‘human side’. Censored reports by critical journalists and threatened those who spoke up against him. Blocked critical internet publishing. Thought that he had saved the World. Had delusions of ruling the World. Even when exposed did not accept any responsibility for failures, blaming those around him.’

Is it an insane, psychologically damaged Third World or Middle Eastern dictator?

Or is it someone closer to home after (we hope) the next General Election?

It is surely time for a regime change!

daniel maris

Well Noa, if the concern is the next five years, then don't rely on nuclear for sure.

The fact is that in the modern age no government would last five minutes if they let the lights go out for no good reason.

In the short term LPG, brought in by boat, is one of the better solutions as there appears to be something of a glut. Better that than relying on Russian pipelines.

But, as I say, longer term I would like to see us move to green energy solutions. This doesn't preclude coal or gas if we can make them much cleaner.

TrevorsDen

Adenuff -- its the same person who has crippled our armed forces defence budget.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/7397808/Gordon-Brown-hasnt-given-MoD-enough-cash-for-defence.html

As outlined again at the Iraq enquiry.

Governing Principles

BBC’s Broadcasting Model

This has been irritating me all week. Every commentator, pundit and blogger has been discussing the BBC cuts without anyone having looked at the BBC’s own “Future of Broadcasting” lectures that took place in 2009. Upon hearing these lectures it becomes clear why channels like 6Music are up for the chop whereas Radios 1 & 2 are not.

As David Attenborough’s lecture explained (http://www.scribd.com/doc/22601976/The-Future-of-Public-Service-Broadcasting-by-Sir-David-Attenborough) the BBC was set up to make news, educational and cultural programs. It only delved into entertainment in order to draw people to the educational stuff. According to this model, the BBC’s entertainment programming was a means to an end. It was designed to draw mass audiences that could then be introduced to the BBC’s cultural output.

6Music is under threat because it doesn’t fit well with the BBC model. It doesn’t draw a mass audience (Radio 1 & 2) or produce a cultural/educational output (Radio 3, 4 & 5). 6 Music is in a weird dead zone (unfortunately shared by my favourite channel BBC3) of producing excellent non-populist entertainment. Unfortunately, the BBC does not need this for its model to work. It does, however, need Radios 1 & 2.

Commentators are correct that the BBC is attempting to protect is bigger stations. However, no one seems interested in the underlying reason; that the BBC model relies on these commercially orientated stations for its public service broadcasting to work effectively. I just find is gobsmacking that this massive back and forth has been going on about saving or cutting various bits of the BBC without anyone looking as the BBC as a single entity.

Another interesting “Future of Broadcasting” Lecture was given by Stephen Fry: http://www.stephenfry.com/2008/06/18/the-bbc-and-the-future-of-broadcasting/

www.governing-principles.com

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

Even reluctantly conceding that Jack Straw is acting correctly by not divulging information about Venables, there is another issue which should be addressed, and need not jeopardise a 'fair trial' for this monster. The Lord Chief Justice in 2000 was Woolfe. He had the two murderers released early in 2001, and ranted about how all the good that the juvenile remand facility had achieved, would be lost if they were made to remain in the penal system. This was typical Lord Woolfe piffle, rubbish, something he is excellent at doing. Woolfe, the archetypal bleeding heart, doing the dirty work of an establishment which wants Io keep its own hands clean, and dumps the job of judge on a person who will do anything to prove he is an upright Englishman, a liberal to his very core, with the interests of the most evil topmost in his order of priorities. Dispensing justice, with his eye always on the glory and honours which will be bestowed on his own self, righteously following the political agenda, a bewigged, begowned old fool.
I have stated before on CH Wall, that the man is either suffering from dementia, or is criminally insane. He should either be in the dock facing prosecution as aiding and abetting a criminal, or he should be sectioned for both the protection of the public and his own welfare. Woolfe should be summoned before a judge and jury and accused of wilfully allowing criminals to enter the community without any repentance or reformation taking place. If found guilty, Woolfe should participate in paying a portion of the huge sums of money laid out to create new identities. His pensions and other monies should be confiscated and he should be made to bear responsibility for his gross indifference to real justice.

oldtimer

PoliticsHome has now produced the results of its survey into whether the public believe G Brown or the generals over the adequacy of equipment provision.

51% say Brown did not produce the kit;
26% say he did but is was inadequate;
6% say he did and it was adequate.

This result is not obvious, but it can be found here:
http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/6339/most_voters_say_brown_failed_to_fund_troops_properly.html

2trueblue

daniel maris/Noa Zrk. Liebore have spent 13yrs not worrying, and ignoring the fact that we are too reliant on other nations for our fuel. Germany and the US are still using a lot of coal and we should be too. We would then be independent and right now should be looking at cleaning up the use of coal and maximizing our use of it to keep the lights on. It would also speed up our recovery to use our own coal as the cost of mining today is cheaper rather than being reliant on others

Malfleur

The answer to dependence on other nation's oil is to oust Gadaffi, seize the Libyan oilfields, and restore the constitutional monarchy of Libya in a limited coastal enclave.

If British intentions and capabilities do not match this robust challenge, it will be left up to the Americans; we should therefore consider a strong and unambiguous alliance with Israel who announced on 2nd March that "Production at the offshore Tamar field, which may hold as much as 7.7 trillion cubic feet of gas, is on schedule to start in 2012" and other surveys in the region are being carried out by them.

Of course we need a general shake up of our polity and a purge of our political class first...

We might also try to discover from the government whether we are going to get any taxes in kind from the incipient Falklands oilfields. No doubt there will be donations to the Labour Party therefrom...

Are we assisting Chile in any meaningful way with reconstruction after the quake? That might be a really mutually beneficial donee of aid, if we have any real money left, as the strengthened alliance with Chile resulting would shore up the Falklands' defences against the usual South American suspects and our dear allies in North America.

Beer Moth

Englishman Abroad

"I would love to know, what Coffeehousers think Brown must do, in order for the scales to fall from the eyes of that part of the electorate."

Perhaps an appearance on Coronation Street, as a really nasty person. Maybe strangle a puppy outside the Rovers; or ask for some hard-core porn in ye olde laste white-runne newsagente inne Engelande.

Out on his arse.

Verity

Iain Dale's running an entertaining post called "What's My News", with some funny one-liners from posters. http://iaindale.blogspot.com/

EC

adenuff, "It is surely time for a regime change!"

Yes but neither of the other two teams has enuff talent on the benches to make up a convincing first eleven. Surely the time has come to import some foreign talent?

My favourite for PM would be Alexander the Meerkat, closely followed by Churchill, oh yes, the nodding dog.

Verity

Malfleur - Yes, we should have seized Libya´s oilfields quite some time ago. I wouldn´t mind the monarchy being re-instated as long as we occupied the oilfields come what may.

Re Chile, I would be astounded if they were not with the rest of Latin America in supporting Argentina.

Derek

Verity

"As in 1982, it is highly unlikely that Chile will support the South American diplomatic offensive against the UK, given the orientation of the new Chilean President." http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=88658

In that context, see also http://www.spyflight.co.uk/chile.htm

If anyone however has the skill to alienate discreet Chilean support rather than to reinforce it, I am sure it is our gang boss, Mr. Gordon Brown.

Vulture

Did anyone see that long Channel 4 docu last night called 'Cameron Uncovered'?

Conducted by the rather reptilian Blairite and now notorious Andrew Rawnsley, Dave was too vain and stupid not to pass up the opportunity to let Rawnsley skewer him with some pretty obvious and rusty skewers.

Suffice it to say that Dave and his clique came over as shallow as a saucerful of milk ( and weak with it); out of touch as only a pink-cheeked pack of Old Etonians can be; and more concerned at how some speech or poster went down than what the hell he's going to do to pull us out of the biggest economic, social and political crisis in modern history.

They did some very effective quick cuts between Blair and his heir Dave and its true what Orwell said at the end of 'Animal Farm' - "the animals looked from pig to man and from man to pig and already it was impossible to say which was which".

He's going to let you down, guys. Big time.

Nicholas

Another day in New Labour occupied Britain and another proposal for a legislative sledgehammer. This time all dog owners to be imposed upon and punished because a minority breed "intimidating" dogs. Dog owners will be compelled to take out third party insurance from the scam, rip-off British insurance industry against the risk that their dogs might attack someone.

Oh, joy. And no doubt there will be some lucrative tax for the government involved, a whole new recruitment drive for more government non-jobs and yet another aspect of our lives to be red-taped, data-based, jobsworthed and policed.

Waiting for the demise of these crazy bastards is like watching paint dry. Just imagine what they might dream up for us if they should get another 5 years in power.

Minnie Ovens

What happened to Tamsin?
Did UKIP offer free hay for horses?

AngloWelshDragon

Quite agree with Nicholas (as usual!) about the proposed dog insurance scam dreamed up by postman pat. Yet again the law abiding public is to be financially penalised becuase of the bad behaviour of a few inner city louts.

This scam will penalise my elderly neighbour with a toothless and arthritic labrador who would never hurt a soul - even if he could catch them (the dog, that is, not the neighbour). As for my two shih tzus - in the unlikely event they ever savaged anyone, I doubt the victim would even notice!

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

Rather than enforcing the Dangerous Dogs Act, and going after the evil men who are involved in dog figting, which is in itself illegal, as usual the authorities are planning to take the easy way out and punish innocent dog owning citizens. The plan to make dog owners have insurance will be ignored by the criminal elements, and poor Joe Blogg will mutely fork out. The Stasi here will pursue innocent people, being too cowardly to get involved with violent types. Next, I expect those who have children will be forced to take out insurance to cover those who incur damages from Joe Blogg's offspring. Naturally, the oiks who wont buy dog insurance wont bother with the kiddie cover either. "Big Brother" is now really in charge.

adenuff

Mandelson a hypocrite or what! Remember what he said about Rawnsley then he appears on his doc about Cameron. But we must not believe any of it Mr Mandy.

Noa Zrk

2trueblue
March 8th, 2010 5:58pm

I agree with your assessment.

Labour has been as profligate and willful in the husbandry and use of energy and natural resources as it has been in its management of the public finances.
The prudent maintenance of a democratic society has been entirely sacrificed in propping up a flourishing benefits culture and pandering to a suite of post communist state ideas.
I'm in favour of the efficient and cost effective management of power; using nuclear, oil and coal resources where we have them. They would provide skills, jobs and revitalise our industrial infra-structure.
We sould look to minimise possible adverse economic and financial consequences of course, but not at the expense of our economy or standard of living.
Foreign imports of oil and gas have to be paid for. With a staggering and increasing balance of payments deficit its madness not to use what we have before we become an offshore dependency of India and China, neither of whom have the sort of sensibilities that preclude them from using their resources to the full in increasing their GNP and their standard of living.

We should remember that our power usage is approximately 3% of the world output, with India, China and the US being the major users and polluters.
For the government to reduce energy capability to the position where it will have to turn off the lighting and heating is nothing short of treason. For the Conservatives to propose a continued policy of inaction is a complete disgrace.

I'll also repeat my previous comment that if we want to keep the US$ 7 trillion of oil in the antarctic we'd better be prepared to fight for it. That £30b a year we spend on defence suddenly looks both cheap and inadequate. If we want to continue spend £100b a year on maintaining a benefits culture we need to find the wherewithal for Gordon, or George or their successors to waste.

Noa Zrk

In the light of 6 British soldiers deaths in the last week our political and military leaders might like to take a lessons learned exercise from those realpolitikians, the Byzantines:
Edward Luttwak's excellent article points the way on how to manage and fight wars against peasants in far off places. V and V1 are particularly to be commended

I. Avoid war by every possible means, in all possible circumstances, but always act as if war might start at any time. Train intensively and be ready for battle at all times -- but do not be eager to fight. The highest purpose of combat readiness is to reduce the probability of having to fight.

II. Gather intelligence on the enemy and his mentality, and monitor his actions continuously. Efforts to do so by all possible means might not be very productive, but they are seldom wasted.

III. Campaign vigorously, both offensively and defensively, but avoid battles, especially large-scale battles, except in very favorable circumstances. Don't think like the Romans, who viewed persuasion as just an adjunct to force. Instead, employ force in the smallest possible doses to help persuade the persuadable and harm those not yet amenable to persuasion.

IV. Replace the battle of attrition and occupation of countries with maneuver warfare -- lightning strikes and offensive raids to disrupt enemies, followed by rapid withdrawals. The object is not to destroy your enemies, because they can become tomorrow's allies. A multiplicity of enemies can be less of a threat than just one, so long as they can be persuaded to attack one another.

V. Strive to end wars successfully by recruiting allies to change the balance of power. Diplomacy is even more important during war than peace. Reject, as the Byzantines did, the foolish aphorism that when the guns speak, diplomats fall silent. The most useful allies are those nearest to the enemy, for they know how best to fight his forces.

VI. Subversion is the cheapest path to victory. So cheap, in fact, as compared with the costs and risks of battle, that it must always be attempted, even with the most seemingly irreconcilable enemies. Remember: Even religious fanatics can be bribed, as the Byzantines were some of the first to discover, because zealots can be quite creative in inventing religious justifications for betraying their own cause ("since the ultimate victory of Islam is inevitable anyway …").

VII. When diplomacy and subversion are not enough and fighting is unavoidable, use methods and tactics that exploit enemy weaknesses, avoid consuming combat forces, and patiently whittle down the enemy's strength. This might require much time. But there is no urgency because as soon as one enemy is no more, another will surely take his place. All is constantly changing as rulers and nations rise and fall. Only the empire is eternal -- if, that is, it does not exhaust itself.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2009/10/19/take_me_back_to_constantinople

Noa Zrk

Malfleur/Verity

I had assumed the idea of seizing Libya's oilfields and replacing the Gadhaffi government with a constitutional monarchy was promoted in jest.

Having read of the pro British monarch Idris el Senussi, the subject of Gadhaffi's coup, I can see this was not so.

Nevertheless, having considered this proposal for the armed invasion of an independent country, I disagree with the imposition of a monarch. The perpetuation of such taxpayer funded supra benefits scroungers has no place in the political structure of a vibrant modern democracy, as is amply demonstrated by the performance of our own incumbents.

Noa Zrk

To our beloved Spectator Moderator.

Why is is the CH Wall link still to last week?

Wilhelm

Fraser Nelson, you know him ?if you dont, he shuffles from SKY to the BBC news rooms reviewing the newspapers with his chum Kevin McQuire like a couple of old media tarts and wiitering on about Gordon Broon and Cameron and other such piffle .

Well he's written, drum roll please, an expose on pooches, the mutts shouldnt be muzzled he squeeled. Its the scoop of the century, he really has the finger on the pulse, hasnt he ?

Meanwhile on Neathergate, cue tumbleweed, church bell tolling in distance, tap dripping, door creeking.

Malfleur

Noa Zrk

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that the House of Windsor, whose head is fielding long-stop for our liberties in case our wicked-keeper lets one too many balls through to the boundary,paid more to the Exchequer than it draws down under the Civil List. There seems to me no reason why the House of Idris should not stand in a similar relationship to its country's economy and constitution and that the Libyan people, in a rich coastal enclave and with their liberties guaranteed by a friendly power, enjoy a happier lot than under the present usurper.

Your reference to the "independent country" of Libya is well within the usual bien-pensant border of western Europe's modern foreign policy la-la land. I am sure that all liberals will get that feel-good buzz knowing that our country has collapsed without oil in the name of the independent right of action of a mad and murderous colonel and his family and familiars.

Nicholas

Noa, remind me again what happened to the Byzantine empire? ;-)

Rhoda Klapp

Noa, I think you'll find most of those precepts are being used as appropriate in Afghanistan right now. Not by our side though.

EC

Did anyone else see "The Wonders of the Solar System - Empire of the Sun?" Professor Brian Cox's all expenses paid tour of planet Earth? The was some stunning location filming in exotic, far flung places but was it really necessary? The cash strapped BBC seems addicted to sleb tourism. Well, how else could we cash strapped licence payers afford to experience life, except at second hand.

I still remember watching Blue Peter as a kid. Seeing all the exciting activities that posh kids could afford... "and for the rest of you at home here's some jolly excitingly cutting edge shite that you can make out of conflakes packets and plastic bottles."

I watched Horizon the other night. A load of dumbed down hogwash for the masses. Why do they bother?

Rant over.

Noa Zrk

Malfleur

Who would invade Libya, with what, and for what purpose? The imposition of a monarchy? I beleive the Senussi line has died out, so who would be a suitable successor? We certainly have a few spares in the UK who would no doubt willingly perform an Emperor Maximilian type role. We have, I consider, a constitutional monarchy system where the reigning monarch's intervention will occur when it is directly threatened, in orther words, not at all. Nor is the tax argument particularly relevant, we all do that if we live and work here, what's so different about the Royal family?
I suspect the Libyian people, if duly liberated by the armed might of the UK armed forces, might well have different views on the matter of their future government.
However, given that the purpose of this expedition seems to be a grab of the nearest oil resources, you might perhaps wish to consider an more feasible alternative, the seizure of Norwegian North Sea oil. It's nearby,there's a lot more of it than we have and those naughty Vikings have got quite liberal, or would they to be spared a re-run of D Day by virtue of their already being a monarchy? I look forward to the flutter of tiny union jacks as our triumphant troops conduct a victory march through the streets of Oslo. To be follooed, no doubt by the thought police of the EHRC under the control and direction of Reichs Commmissar Harman and Deputy Trevor Philips.

Or we could be prepared to keep, by force of arms if necessary, the estimated 50 billion barrels of oil the present crew of appeasers appearc ready to hand over, upon US request, to Argentina.

Andy Carpark

SPOILER ALERT. Anyone planning to read Andrew Rawnsley's 'The End of the Party' may wish to skate over this message.

Those who can take it or leave it may enjoy the following snippet, which has the ring of truth. Some might say that one of the protagonists has been locked in the mental khazi all his life.

_______________________________

'The biggest legend was that the bargain took place on 31 May 1994 at Granita, a now defunct restaurant in Islington. The meeting there was actually the culmination of a series of highly charged encounters, at least ten in all. ... One negotiation took place on the evening of John Smith's funeral in the Edinburgh house of Nick Ryden, a friend of Blair since their schooldays at Fettes. [Ryden takes himself off to the pub, leaving them to their negotiations.] Their arguing was interrupted at one point when Brown disappeared to use the lavatory. When time passed and he didn't come back, Blair assumed that the other man had stormed off in one of his rages. Then he heard the phone ringing and a familiar Scottish voice growling into Ryden's answering machine. Brown was calling on his mobile from the lavatory. The door handle had come off, imprisoning him in the loo. Blair picked up the phone. "I'll let you out, Gordon, but only if you give me certain assurances about the leadership."'

_______________________________

radgie gadgie

Any sign yet on the article on the Neather regions of slybour's immigration policy?

David Bouvier

Verity - Chile you might recall was a good friend during the Falklands (certain boys on exocet hunts who had helicopter problems have a lot to thank them for). Thatcher was very clear about her debt of thanks when Pinochet had problems over here.

Anyway, I believe there are rivalries between the two over antarctic seas and possessions given the complexities of coastlines and borders down at the southern tip.

Verity

David Bouvier - It would be nice if you are right. It seemed to me that all of Latin America, is behind the Argentinians. I hope you're right about Chile.

Noa Zrk

The latest rumours on Today concerning the Strategic Defence Review intimate that the conversion of the Conservative party to Zanu New-Labour is almost complete and that the long planned aircraft carriers will be cancelled.

So much then, for force projection and the ability of the UK to protect its strategic supply lines.

Forget the oil in the Antarctic as Argentina will be quietly allowed to annex it.

Forget too, any surety of food supplies required from overseas to feed the 70 million plus that Postman Alan doesn't lose any sleep over.

James Murphy

I've been pondering the question as to why, of those two equally disastrous political ideologies, Communism should have triumphed so roundly over Fascism in the moral judgement of the general public over the past half century? It is, as we all know, an utter condemnation to call someone a fascist - but a communist? No, that gets an indulgent (parental) smile, at worst a bemused shrug. The answer, it seems to me, is that Fascism donned the pantomime villain moustache the moment it introduced the (super)racist element into its philosophy. At that instant it came to be seen as a divisive, exclusive creed, setting man against man, nation against nation, etc. Communism, in contrast, could commit any number of atrocities, yet still proclaim its great belief in the brotherhood of man as it did so. Ethically- speaking, We all knew what Hitler stood for - and could abhor it articulately, but Lenin and Stalin? They never declared themselves against anybody specifically, (vague notions of Kulaks and capitalists apart - and even the latter could recant and come back inside the political fold in a way that the Jews under Fascism never could).- Communism has thus been able to profit from occupying a very convenient grey area - in a sense, from its very lack of psychological definition. Why is this interesting? Because night has fallen, we have welcomed the wolf into the corral.. and there is blood on the ground...

Verity

James Murphy - what an absolutely outstanding post!

Communism promises everything to everyone, while tightening the noose of control quietly, under he guise of 'caring'. The tragedy of so many young teenage pregnancies can be solved by teaching toddlers about sex - thus removing the child from its parents' and making it a cog of the state ... to grow up into an adult cog. In fact, the communists don't like families at all, as loyalty is supposed to be to the state and the Nomenklatura. The ideal will be Brave New World where babies are grown in test tubes and never know their parents. And it has been talked about in Britain by the foul "Baroness" Warnecke, who for some reason is in charge of these ethical questions.

The communist suppression of the indigenous people, who, with their progeny throughout the Anglosphere (and France and Germany) invented absolutely everything, in favour of being "fair" to primitive intruders and invading settlers. The inclusion of immigrants in HoC shortlists to represent the indigenous people in their own Parliament. The further degradation of the family of a mother, a father and children by forcing gay adoptions through Parliament, regardless of the effect this would have on little children who had no say in how they were being disposed of.

Dumbed down schools so the slow witted can get pass marks that belie their intelligence and abilities.

All of this is communist and presented as being "fair".

Your contrast with fascism was absolutely fascinating.

Verity

"Because night has fallen, we have welcomed the wolf into the corral.. and there is blood on the ground...".

Chilling.

David Ossitt

James Murphy

“Communism should have triumphed so roundly over Fascism.”

Communism is drab, unattractive and slyly evil.

Fascism was attractive; in that it had the very best uniforms but was pure evil.

Sam Armstrong

James Murphy

I always use 'communist' in the pejorative. If you say it the right way, and add a slight sneer, it is a wonderful insult.

daniel maris

You might also ask why monarchy and nationalism which killed many millions in its bloody wars, before Communism or Fascism got going, is given a bit of a free pass.

Even Imperialism seems to be looked on somewhat indulgently these days with eyes averted from what it meant in practice - genocide, near slavery, oppressive taxation, land theft, sexual exploitation etc etc.

I think the reason Communism is looked on more benignly is because its ultimate vision - Marx's fishing, farming 'n' philosophising in a utopian setting - is generally considered more pleasant than the Fascist alternative of herrenvolk, gas chambers and eternal war.

I think the more pejorative "Stalinist" shows this to be the case. Stalinism is considered a betrayal of the ideal and is almost on a par with Fascism.

I think the modern rankings in terms of epithetical impact are:

1. Nazi
2. Racist
3. Fascist
4. Stalinist
5. Imperialist
6. Trot
7. Communist
8. Nationalist

But nationalist merges into approbation!

Nicholas

"Because night has fallen, we have welcomed the wolf into the corral.. and there is blood on the ground...".

But we have a FBG and the night belongs to us. The wolf in the corral is in our territory, close up, easy to see and easier to kill. The surest way to defeat is to believe that the enemy has superhuman powers. Stay calm, shoot low and make sure any blood on the ground is theirs not yours.

Nicholas

" . . . genocide, near slavery, oppressive taxation, land theft, sexual exploitation etc etc."

Sounds like New Labour's vision for Britain. Personally I'd rather take my chances with Pax Britannica. At least we had the bloody pirates sorted.

Verity

David Ossitt notes that Fascism had the best uniforms. It also had the best cars.

James Murphy

David O and Verity - you're dead right about the Nazi style thing. I think not only of the cut of those mysterious forest-green/gun-grey greatcoats, but of the sculpted German helmets which retained, stylistically-speaking, more than an echo of their medieval heritage. Could it be that a nation's sense of style is in its DNA and keeps coming out over the decades, regardless of transient fashion? It's amused me in the past, for instance, to note that the helmets of the three great West European antagonists in the Great War were later to be replicated in the shapes of those countries' most popular motor cars. French Great War helmets looked like the 2CV, the Brits round, almost bowler-hatted nonchalant tin-hat like the Morris Minor, and the Germans' like the VW Beetle. Dogs, too, seem to be favoured nationally according to said shapes, i.e., the Dachshund, Poodle and round-headed Labrador.

James Murphy

Indeed, Verity, is it not a blatantly stated article of faith in the communist credo that the family, insofar as it looks after itself, trusts in its own moral integrity and is inspired by its own successes, is the enemy of the state? Surely it was in this sense that Margaret Thatcher roundly declared her enmity towards the state as an unhealthy, faceless abstract? True culture retains a love for the ideal of the family because, for all its flaws, 'family' deeply nourishes the spirit of human individuality and creativity -qualities which communism has every right to be terrified by...

David Ossitt

Nicholas; FBG?

Would that be Fasting Blood Glucose, Frozen Baked Goods, or the delightful Fat Bottom Girls?

James Murphy

Daniel M, you make some good points about the evils of Nationalism and the 'divine right of kings' - evil does indeed have many faces. But I can't agree that imperialism is by definition uniformly wicked. Yes, of course, depravities are committed in the name of empire - but so, at the same time, are acts of great virtue: the transmission to primitive cultures of aspects of high culture, literature, music, law, etc. Did not we British (or Celts as we then were!) profit from these aspects of Roman life, for example?

Noa Zrk

Nicolas
"The wolf in the corral is in our territory, close up, easy to see and easier to kill. The surest way to defeat is to believe that the enemy has superhuman powers".
Reminds me that my grandmother used to tell me tales of her grandmother shooting wolves in North Dakota in the 1870's. As I recall they were not match for a determined matriarchal great great Zrk with an FBG.

Noa Zrk

James Murphy

Some fascinating thoughts on the how and why of the evolution of political theory and governments, good and bad.

We rightly extol the role of the family, but families can become too powerful, nepotistic and then dictatorial; and there are innumerable historical examples.
In one way or another though, Darwinism operates in politics as species; all governments, whatever their origins, will evolve. If this is a flexible evolution, accommodating the needs and ambitions of the majority, it will survive and flourish. If not it will fail, or be overthrown.
Without doubt all governments seek to acquire ever more power, which is why the ability to change them regularly and peacefully is so important.

I would suggest that when such a change of government only perpetuates an oligarchy of the political elite, it is moving towards the end of its lifecycle.

Wilhelm

Daniel Maris squeeks

'' nationalism killed a lot of people.''

Yes, I quite agree Dan, Gandhi was a dangerous thug in a nappy.

Nicholas

David: FBG - in this case f***ing big gun, something that will become more important than tinned food as we explore the full consequences of New Labour imposed "progress".

James, on the esoterica of helmets. The French helmet was known as the Adrian ("Casque Adrian", attributed to Intendant-General August-Louis Adrian) and my grandfather brought one home from his Great War service with the French Army, together with a nasty looking trench club with sinister notches on it and a German belt buckle inscribed "Gott Mit Uns". The colour of this helmet was surprising - a beautiful pale blue-grey. Unfortunately it was stolen from us.

egh

James Murphy: Did not we British (or Celts as we then were!) -- Oh, I think we still are Celts.

Both Bryan Sykes ("Blood of the Isles") and the other Oxford geneticist tell us that our DNA is primarily Celtic. Apparently there are varying amounts of germanic overlay, probably Viking, in the north and northeast - but the majority are still Celtic.

Obviously my 'us' is about indigenes: not invaders. My 'classification' will continue to exclude invaders - who refuse to be British anyway, except in terms of appropriation of territory.

To dub the intruders British just pays into another deconstructionist (commie) ploy: Reinscription, they call it. Our masters believe that if they apply and use a label then they create a new perception: and their words have the power to change reality, and facts. ... And so to 'advertising,' propaganda, and their concomitant slander and slush.

Nothing new under the sun, of course. For
example, Normans like Geoffrey of Monmouth played the 'hate the English' card for generations: even though their Bastard had massacred most of the Anglo-Saxons by 1069.
Divide and Conquer: they did this knowing that even though we quarrelled among ourselves, we had the power to unite against them - as Boudicca et al had done against the Romans.

British=Celtic, nonetheless.

Wilhelm

Danny Maris waxes lyrical and gushes.

'' communisim was fishing, farming and philophising in a utopian setting in the Russian cornfields.''

Cue the Red Army choir singing '' Moscow Nights.'' Check it out on YouTube.

I think this joker Danny has been at the old vodka, he sounds like Fred Kite, the Peter Sellars character from '' Im allright Jack. ''

John Richardson

Regarding Fascism/Nazism/Communism

In the simplest terms; I think we suffer from 'victor's history'.

If the Axis Powers had held on a few more years, then the USSR would have disintegrated.
GB/USA would have
'deplored the early excesses'
of The Third Reich; whilst looking to a shared, peaceful future.
Trade. Perhaps even shared technological projects.
Rockets even. Or is that too far fetched ?

Every British product of tertiary 'education' would be imbued with a sense of the 'horror of the Gulag'.
The Total Tyranny of the creed of equality.
The fundamental differences between peoples.
The necessity of maintaining 'Cultural Identity'.
As for the Concentration Camps ?
What Concentration Camps ?
How many Post Grads. know about the Ukrainian Socialist Famine ?

I remember a (wonderful) Latvian child telling me proudly about his Grandfather's Iron Cross, about four years ago in East London. He was nine.
In 'the East' Stalin is still hated. Adolf ?

Oh. I never spoke to a (non white) ex Imperial Subject who hated Empire.
Actually, they all loved it.

Nicholas

John Richardson: "Oh. I never spoke to a (non white) ex Imperial Subject who hated Empire. Actually, they all loved it."

Yes, that's my experience too. A legacy of hatred would never have left the legacy of institutions across the Commonwealth. Too often Britain's unique and largely benevolent approach to Empire is compared on a par to the European colonisers and through the red-tinted glasses of the revisionist self-haters of which we have too many. France, detested in Indo-China. Holland, detested in the East Indies. Belgium and Portugal, detested in Africa. Those who were not there don't know. I was and do.

Herbert Thornton

I see that Verity and James Murphy both draw attention to the Communist belief that the family is the enemy of the state.

That belief is now entrenched in the tenets of Communism's bastard offspring - Political Correctness and the Human Rights Industry. It accounts for their eagerness - among other things - to debase the status of marriage by pretending that it is natural for Gays to "marry". Among normal people, it accounts the wholesale abandonment of marriage.

Debasement of the family was also encouraged in China by Mao Tse Tung. During his 'Cultural Revolution' children were encouraged to report their own parents for any sign of disloyalty. Political Correctness and the Human Rights Industry (which has become a racket as unconscionable as Chicago gangsterism) have caused a disturbingly similar Cultural Revolution in Britain, Canada and western Europe - with however, a profound difference in the results.

Mao's Cultural Revolution failed. It failed because when it came in conflict with the Chinese family system, the Chinese family proved itself much the stronger. China, as a result is now growing rapidly more prosperous.

In Britain, western Europe and Canada on the other hand, the Cultural Revolution has gone from strength to strength. Unlike Mao's, it has - from the point of view of Political Correctness - been a tremendous success. For all practical purposes, the ties and loyalty of the traditional family have ceased to exist. The outlook for the future, compared with that of China, is dismal.

Have you ever asked yourself where Islam fits into this picture? Islam too relegates the family to a status inferior to that of being a Muslim. How else is it possible to explain the frequency with which fathers kill their own daughters and brothers kill their own sisters because they have failed to obey one or other of the codes of conduct imposed by Islam?

I suggest that Political Correctness and Islam have a great deal in common. Is that why the Politically Correct are so eager to support Islamists and to treat their doings and demands - no matter how unreasonable, distasteful or outrageous - as exercises of their "Human Rights"?

egh

Yes, Nicholas 11/3 @10:22. That's my experience, too. Only a few months ago I met a Jamaican who said the very same to me. "Don't try to tell that to the rest of them round here," was my response. "Their agenda is to "prove" the opposite!"

I wouldn't have dared to say anything about the europeans - given the surrounding surnames. The Pakistanis in residence were similarly vicious and, according to their own definition: hate-filled.

paulg

I have just watched question time tonight and it was a cross section of women. I was quite clear that Labour have lost their trust.

labours incompetence over the economy;but more so, their disregard for our soldiers has turned women against labour.

Without the support of women and their confidence in you, you cannot rule a nation.

Labour are absolutely finished because it is innate in a female to smell a winner.

Herbert Thornton

Nicholas and John Richardson - It's interesting that your experience is that ex Imperial Subjects generally loved the Empire.

I lived from 1957 to 1964 in Tanganyika (now Tanzania). Elderly Africans who remembered the time before WW2 when Tanganyika was German East Africa held similarly high opinions of the way the Germans administered the country.

Indeed they used to say that they preferred German to British rule. Their reason, they said, was that with the Germans they always knew exactly where they stood, and what was required of them and they appreciated that.

Under British rule, on the other hand, they said that everything was much less clear & they seldom knew exactly where they stood - and they disliked the uncertainty.

From the behaviour, deviousness and unreliability of British politicians in Britain nowadays - especially from the leaders of the Labour and Tory parties - I begin to wonder whether the characteristics of British rule that the folk in Tanganyika noticed not only persist in Britain itself, but have become even more marked?

Verity

Herbert Thornton, you are right.

Re China, Polish children were also encouraged to report their own parents to the Stazi. There was the instance, published at the end of the Berlin Wall, of a family who were all reporting to the Stazi on each other, including the husband and father.

I don’t need to say this is abnormal, but what these people are engineering is, making families and family/clan/patriotic ties “abnormal” and an issue for the state to deal with. Sluicing the country with flotsam and jetsom who have no ties to us and have not contributed any science or literature ever, accorded permission to shape us.

And forcing the British to accept this detritus of a weird desert sect as equal to us intellectually and morally.

Taking emotional nurturing, including growing up, including information about sex, out of the hands of parents and putting it in the hands of paedophiles eager to introduce tiny children to information about sex... This would include many Labour councils and school boards who should be arrested wholesale.

The arrestees could include those who investigated, and ignored, a paedophile father who raped his own daughters and who produced children, for 20 years.

And, given the family, they would have plopped them out on the NHS. Yet no questions about the father asked. Or if asked, the answers ignored because it wouldn’t be politically correct – the new iron thought fascism – to ask the girls questions about their father because that might be “judgemental”.

Yet his behaviour, despite 20 years of evidence of incestuous children popping out of his daughters, is excused because he is disturbed and disturbed gets you a career path in the socialist brave new world. And no education needed! Benefits.

My question is, what is it for? How many hundreds/thousands of children born in abnormal circumstances, so free for adoption? Taken away from their mothers and used for social experiments?

The destruction of society, bien sur!

But what do they envisage next?

Jack Straw deciding on genetics? Jack Straw, who slithers under every open door instead of walking though it?

What is he hoping to do? What’s the end game, Jack, with your phony middle class accent? Your father, a refugee who had been generously accepted by a country that was barely feeding itself, refused to be called up to fight for Britain and went to a nice, safe, warmish prison for the duration of the war.

Are you angry, Jack, with your poker face and false accent and pretended lightness of humour?

Why is Labour so ghastly? Such an affront? Look at Tony and Cherie Blair. Yobs who grew rich on the back of Blair’s bizarre job as British prime minister. How stupid were the British to elect him and let his coterie get a toehold?

And riding in on Tone’s back, the egregious David Cameron, who isn’t even good enough to be Blair II.

The one comfort in all this. No charm. No empathy. No Dave.

But who or what?

I hope to hell there's a cabal going on.

EC

paulg 12th March 1:00am,

" ... it is innate in a female to smell a winner."

What would appear to be becoming 'increasingly' innate in the modern female is the ability to smell cash!

From The Indy, Jan 2009: http://is.gd/aj9Ka

"A survey of 100 City analysts, stockbrokers and hedge fund managers by law firm Mishcon de Reya shows more than a fifth believe divorce proceedings would be launched ahead of a recession as spouses try to secure cash. One divorce specialist is reporting a threefold increase in inquiries over the run-up to Christmas."

Hell, they really need their bonuses!

AH, but dontcha just love Christmas.... all that peace and goodwill. Personally, I blame EastEnders - and Michael Grade for launching it.

EC

egh, March 11th, 2010 8:58pm

"British=Celtic, nonetheless"

and "My father was in the RAF..."

Vulture

Jamers Murphy has written a couple of excellent posts on the reasons why Fascism is a dirty word while Communism is OK; and the derivations of uniforms.

It is scarcely surprising that Nazi uniforms were chic - they were, after all, designed by the original Hugo Boss. The Nazis put a lot of thought into style and aesthetics - the British seemed to have farmed out the design of their WW2 uniforms to the chap who made potato sacks.

As for the Communism v. Fascism debate. Fascism is often confused with Nazism but the former originally entirely lacked the fatal Nazi racial obsessions. There is no doubt in my mind that Mussolini's Italy and Franco's Spain were better places to live than Stalin's Russia or Mao's China.

In fact we owe Franco a deep debt of gratitude. Had the Stalinists won the Spanish Civil War, Hitler would have occupied Spain in 1940 and with it the Med and Britain would have probably lost WW2.
So the Generalissimo saved Spain from
Stalin - and then saved it from Hitler by refusing to join his war.

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

Verity: Good morning, Verity,
I mostly support your postings, with the result that anger vented upon you is also hurled at myself. But this time, Verity, I am annoyed with you. Despite pointing out twice that Jack Straw's father was not a refugee, and that his grandfather was a normal immigrant, you insist on going for the more dramatic scenario of stating that his father was a refugee. Please check your facts. The father was a nasty creature born and educated in Britain, a product of the British communist society, and he was imprisoned for refusing to serve in the Second World War. The grandfather was an immigrant, not the father,

Ronnie

Good old Franco! He also bought Real Madrid.

Nicholas

Verity: "the British seemed to have farmed out the design of their WW2 uniforms to the chap who made potato sacks."

Can't let you get away with that. When introduced the British '37 Battle Dress was an innovative and radical design based on contemporary ski clothing. It was far more modern than the German equivalent which was rooted in the styles of pre-1914-18. As the war progressed the German Army, largely for logistical reasons but also for practicality began to imitate the British design.

The '37 pattern, designed originally for comfort and practicality, was nevertheless subject to "bulling" in barracks, being tailored to fit snugly with the trousers "bloused" with lead weights to fall over the "anklets, webbing, KD" in the requisite sharp-edged inverted 'Y'. The post-war "best BD", badged, lanyarded, tailored and tweeked, was a far cry from the original concept. It was undoubtedly smart and I remember it fondly as being synonimous with that tough "old army" which liberated Europe.

Wilhelm

Here's a a Russian joke told by Russians amongst themselves against the commies.

A Russian walks into a car show room, '' I would like to buy a car.''

Salesman '' There's a very long waiting list, if you buy the car today, we will deliver it to you in 10 years time.''

Customer '' Will that be morning or afternoon ?''

Salesman '' What difference does it make ? ''

Customer '' Well Ive got the plumber coming in the morning.''

Wilhelm

Another Russian joke

A communist commisar goes to a collective farm, '' How's the crops doing ? ''

Farmer, '' The crops are just wonderful .''

Commisar, '' What about potato production ? "

Farmer '' Great, if we put the potatoes in a pile, it would reach up to Heaven , to God . "

Commisar, '' This is the Soviet Union, there is no God.''

Farmer, '' Thats all right, there is no potatoes ''

Peter From Maidstone

Just received an email advert from the Spectator about their 'Spectator Manifesto'. Here are their ten ideas..

• Fix broken economy


• Make every minute count


• See off the Westminster mandarins


• Overhaul Britain's planning system


• End public sector waste for good


• Cut our fuel bills


• Get Britain off benefits


• Give us democracy


• End pensioner poverty


• Abolish quangos

There is nothing there about Immigration, Europe or Islam? I would rather have hundreds of quangos and yet have immigration or europe or militant Islam dealt with. Why does the Spectator consistently refuse to discuss or even mention immigration, europe and islam?

radgie gadgie

Peter from Maidstone. The speccy's omission of 3 of the biggest issues facing us today must surely be down to advice or agreement given over various dinner tables in view of the forthcoming election. dave doesnt want to be seen banging on about the most important issues and so doesnt need the agravation of these issues being debated anywhere, including in small circulation magazines run by his friends.

Their absence, however, just screams of establishement cowardice and contempt particularly for committed voters (of any stripe) The list is anaemic to the point of inducing a coma. Restoring democracy? the fact that it appears near the end of the list indicates that 'democracy' isnt quite what they want, if by democracy you mean genuinely competing ideas and/or ideaologies and not as we have now which is Brown driving the car and dave bleating every now and again from the back seat that he too would like a turn at driving but he promises not to change direction.

Derek

Peter From Maidstone

May be, as far as Neathergate goes for instance, the Spectator doesn't have a position on it because the editor doesn't know what he thinks till he sees what's he's written - and as he hasn't written anything, only promised to do so, we have to infer that he doesn't know what he thinks about the subject and therefore cannot include it in the Manifesto...or may be it's some other reason.

Vulture

PFM: 'sfunny - I was going to say the same as you. I would also add : nothing about cutting the violent crime that is making increasingly wide areas of our country hellholes for the poor, weak, old, vulnerable and decent. Or about rolling back the surveillance state.

AS to your question: the Spectator is part and parcel of the ConLabLib consensus that has adopted the politics of the ostrich with regard to these issues. If we want to fight them, the solution lies in our own hands.

Wilhelm

Nicholas says

'' The 1937 British army uniform was modern, radical and innovative.''

That still doesnt make it stylish, does it ? It still looks like a potato sack, yucky brown colour , itchy wool, ill fitting. In a word, crap.

British tanks were crap as well, unlike the Tiger tanks, the Germans called them ' Tommy cookers ' because they kept blowing up all the time.

Frank P

You beat me to the punch Peter from Maidstone

Dear Spectator

1. Fix broken economy. [Oh indeed! But how?]

2. Make every minute count. [An ad for Rolex?]

3. See off the Westminster Mandarins. [WTF?!
What with a Rottweiler].
4. Overhaul Britains's planning system. [To which plans do you refer? HAven't witnessed any for years, except the one outlined by Mr Neather!]

5. End public service waste for good [Public service waste is never good]

6. Cut our fuel bills [Agreed - but how? Invade Russia?]

7. Get Britain off benefits. [WTF??!! x 10].

8. Give us democracy. [Bwaahahahahahaha].

9. End pensioner poverty [Which pensioner was that, and why].

10. Abolish quangos [No problem with that - but when? A large proportion of your mates are so employed. Who's kiddin' who?]

Suggested additions to your list.

11. Stop writing wooly bollox

12. Campaign for sovereign powers to be repatriated.

13. Address inimical Islamic invasion and infiltration by stringent immigration overhaul.

14. Surcease from giving employment and column inches to left propagandists

15. Get a conservative editor and reinstate some conservative hacks who can write and who don't waste their time composing bullet-pointed bollocks as above.

Then I might resume my subscription.

Thank you,
Frank P.

Wilhelm

The scruffy English have never been into uniforms because they are not a stylish people like the Italians.

Oswald Mosely said that '' Facism will only come to Britain if it comes in tweed jackets and plus fours.''

So its no suprise that facism took root in Italy first, its all about style and aesthetics harking back to Imperial Rome, ripping off the Roman salute, eagles and banners because it looks great.
Dont deny it.

Verity

Nicholas writes: Verity: the British seemed to have farmed out the design of their WW2 uniforms to the chap who made potato sacks.
Can't let you get away with that.

Nicholas, that quote was the property of our esteemed colleague Vultue. Can't let you get away with that.

Interesting information, though.

Wilhelm – Thanks for the laugh with my first cup of tea!

What Radgie Gadgie said.

And Dave is a nasty piece of work. Greedy, doesn't give a damn about his country as long as he can get his tootsies under the desk at Number 10 ... and further the ceding of our beloved country to the EUSSR and the muslims.

That he is standing as a Conservative absolutely boggles the mind. It's as bizarre as if Sarah Palin was suddenly decided to stand on a communist ticket.

I think they're trying to turn the norms which have been accepted for centuries upside down to destabilise the population. Raising the question: why are they intent on destabilising the population?

To chop us up into little easily consumable bits to feed to the EUSSR.

Madame Arcati

Frank, they are employed. They are doing their masters' will. Where will it all end? Call me for an appointment.

David Ossitt

Peter From Maidstone

Writes

“There is nothing there about Immigration, Europe or Islam? I would rather have hundreds of quangos and yet have immigration or europe or militant Islam dealt with.”

I agree wholeheartedly with his valid points on Immigration, Europe or Islam but not with his acceptance of hundreds of quangos.

These are very expensive; non democratic, and their only purpose is to protect ministers from their own bad decisions, every single one should be shut down.

It is high time that the Spectator acknowledged that a very high proportion of the readers are unhappy with Immigration, Europe and Islam and wish to stop the first, get out of the second, and stop pandering to and bullshitting about the third.

Frank P

And another thing: I received my Inland Revenue annual notification of tax code this morning.

The page was worded thus:

>HM Revenue & Customs [embossed insignia]

HERE IS YOUR TAX CODE FOR 2010-11

It will be used by your
employer or pension provider
from 6th April 2010

Please visit our website for more information www.hmrc.gov.uk/income tax

WHY DO I NEED A NEW TAX CODE?
Your new tax code ensures your employer or pension provider deducts the right amount of tax from your income.

WHAT DO I NEED TO DO?
Nothing unless your tax code is incorrect. Please check the Coding Notice and keep it for your own records. We will tell your employer of pension provider, along with any agent acting for you, what your new tax code is.

WHERE CAN I GET MORE INFORMATION?
Please read all the notes on your Coding Notice. You can find out more about income tax, allowances, taxable benefits and tax codes on our website at www.hmrc.gove.uk/income tax.<

What's wrong with that - you may ask?

Nothing - had not the first two paragraphs been superimposed on a colour photo of a lady (apparently West Indian) bedecked in jewellery, seated at a desk, gazing into the screen looking very sensual and self satisfied.

Well then, what's wrong with that, too - you may ask?

Well, if the bottom half of the page had been illustrated with a photo portrait of Andrew Neather, captioned "See what I mean?" I would have no objection whatsoever.

As it is, the complete pointlessness (?) of the photo illustration and the cost incurred in producing it is iniquitous. I would also like to see published the notes of the meeting where this layout was discussed; who decided on who would be chosen as the subject of the illustration; why was she chosen how much she was paid for the privilege of the use.

I won't even ask what she was looking at on the lap-top screen - it might be embarrassing for her - and the rest of us.

I think the Spectator mentioned something about 'ending public waste' in their 'manifesto'. Well guys, manifest that!

John Richardson

Wilhelm.

The Germans did not call British tanks 'Tommy Cookers'.
Instead they called the American Sherman tanks 'Tommy Cookers'.
The British called the Sherman a 'Ronson' after a contemporary advert for the cigarette lighters, promised that they 'Light first time every time'.

--------------------------------------------

'Vulture' 12:50pm

Your answer is surly correct.
However, the treacherous and dangerous Party System is worse than an ostrich with it's head in the sand.
The scum have knowingly imported millions to delibarately change the country.
They may have done more lasting harm than any other postwar blight we have suffered.
Supporting the current Party System represents complicity in their crimes.
Or moral/intellectual cowardice. Or both.

Wilhelm

The Spectator Readers top 10, this is what I think it should be.

1. Stop the tsunami of immigration, NOW.

2. Kick out ALL illegals and muslim shit stirrers. PRONTO.

3. Ban the burgua , Turkey did it, and mineret, Switzerland did it.

4. Withdraw from the EUSSR.

5. Abolish the multyculty BBC, its anti British.

6. Kick out liberal judges, build more prisons, adopt the Texas chain gang, 50 years for murderers, rapists, child molesters, send them to the Falkands.

7. Abolish the Foreign Office and embassies, replace it with a telephone and a fax machine, it'll save £Billions on the cocktail drinks bill.

8. Cut the 650 MPs, a bunch of chancers and troughers down to 100.

9. Bring back Grammer schools. Make Enoch Powell required reading in schools.

10. Have a British military coup, the Greeks had one in the 70s.
I think the British generals would be better running the country than that litlle pip squeak James Purnell.

11. Try Ted Heath , Blair and Broon for treason.

Nicholas

Verity, my apologies it was indeed Vulture.

Wilhelm, the description "Tommy Cookers" was applied to Sherman tanks, which were American in origin, but used in large numbers by the British, because of the rapidity with which they caught fire when hit.

The curious admiration for all things German military in WWII is an established phenomenum, shared by the Speccie's Taki, so I know that I'm swimming against the tide. But to the inmates of Belsen those scruffy "brown" uniforms probably looked very much more attractive than the departing stylish ones.

daniel maris

For those nukies here who don't see the danger of terrorist sabotage at a nuclear power plant, perhaps the following from Jihad Watch may be of interest:

New Jersey jihadist arrested in Yemen worked at nuclear power plants
His mother says he is a "good Muslim." She said it. "NJ Terror Suspect Worked at Nuclear Power Plants," by Vince Lattanzio for NBC Philadelphia, March 11 (thanks to Benedict):

The South Jersey man who Yemini officials are calling a terrorist with links to al-Qaeda previously worked at three local nuclear power plants.
Sharif Mobley, 26, is being held in a jail in Yemen after he allegedly killed a police guard and seriously injured another during a shootout at a hospital on Monday.

The Buena, N.J. native has also been accused of taking part in several acts of terrorism, Yemini officials say. He also purportedly has ties to the same branch of al-Qaeda who are suspected of attempting to blow up a U.S. airliner on its way to Detroit on Christmas.

As details of Mobley's arrest trickle back to the U.S., more people who knew him are coming forward.

Former high school classmate Roman Castro says Mobley was always fiercely religious and tried to convert high school friends to Islam.

Castro says he ran into Mobley during an Army tour in Iraq around four years ago. The two had a short exchange, with Mobley telling him to "Get the hell away from me, you Muslim killer," according to Castro.

A former neighbor said Mobley moved to Yemen two years ago to study Islam.

Mobley, who was born in the U.S., also worked as a laborer at three Salem County nuclear power plants, power company officials say.

Working for several contractors, Mobley carried supplies and did maintenance work at the plants on Artificial Island in Lower Alloways Creek from 2002 to 2008, PSE&G spokesperson Joe Delmar said.

Mobley also worked at other plants in the area, Delmar said.

Speaking to NBC Philadelphia Wednesday, Mobley's mother denied claims her son was a terrorist. She called Sharif a "good Muslim" and said he's "absolutely not a terrorist."...

daniel maris

Dear Spectator,

My take:

1. Fix broken economy. [Yeah, well we won't do that by cosying up to the bankers again. The Speccie was as much to blame as anyone in calling for de-reg when we needed more-reg. We could do worse than look at why John Lewis Partnership, where there are no employers and employees, can give out 15% bonuses in the middle of an economic crisis - they must be doing something right]

2. Make every minute count. [What does that mean? I'd prefer it if the goverment didn't create thousands of new offences every parliament.]

3. See off the Westminster Mandarins. [Well you can't do that if you are going to get rid of quangos can you. Or are you going to sell off the quangos, in which case goodbye democratic accountability.]

4. Overhaul Britains's planning system. [The government's beaten you to it with its Infrastructure Commission. The real problem with the planning system is the failure to pay proper, generous compensation for loss of amenity.]

5. End public service waste for good [Who wrote this stuff? You will never eliminate waste in any organisation and the idea that private sector companies are lean, mean efficiency beasts is - well incredible. We haven't forgotten how the banks were lazily rubber stamping credit swaps.]

6. Cut our fuel bills [Is this code for nuclear power? Hah-hah! The new generation reactor in Finland is already 3 billino Euros over tender. If it's code for "tell the private electricity and gas suppliers to cut prices by 3% for the next three years", then that might do some good since they are incredibly inefficient.]

7. Get Britain off benefits. [Well this is the first exciting proposal. We certainly do need to tackle the sofa-dope-baby club crowd and stop people adding to the benefits queue. But how? You gotta get tough, not caring-Cameronish].

8. Give us democracy. [Well yes,. Get us out of the EU and into the EEA please.].

9. End pensioner poverty [Hmmm. All for that. But it means an element of politically unpopualr compulsion to ensure we all save for retirement.].

10. Abolish quangos [OK, but see above. Who's gonna get 'em - Whitehall or some spiv?]

Wilhelm

Another Russian joke.

Two communists in a pub.

Comrade Ivan '' Is this it, have we achieved the ideal, socialist communist, utopian, paradise ? ''

Comrade Sergei '' Oh no, things are going to get a lot, lot worse than this.''

Wilhelm

John Richardson and Nicholas

The British used Sherman tanks because their own tanks, Crusader, Comet and Churchill tanks kept breaking down, badly designed crap, a hallmark of British industry.

Tiger Ace Michael Wittman destroyed a whole British tank column with his single tiger tank at the battle of Villers Bocage in Normandy. What a guy !

Some people get mixed up that if you like the facist, nazi look that means you agree with facist, nazi ideas, its called guilt by association.

Verity

Daniel Maris writes: 7. Get Britain off benefits. [Well this is the first exciting proposal. We certainly do need to tackle the sofa-dope-baby club crowd and stop people adding to the benefits queue. But how? You gotta get tough, not caring-Cameronish].

How? By disenfranchising the welfare/dependencey sector so they can no longer vote themselves an ever larger cut of other people’s pay cheques.

10. Abolish quangos [OK, but see above. Who's gonna get 'em - Whitehall or some spiv?]

No one. See, that’s what “abolish” means. Poof! Gone! No longer exist! Dead parrott.

Peter From Maidstone

Hi David Ossitt,

Just to be clear. I did not say I was in favour of quangos, but thta if it came to a matter of prioritisation I would prefer that the government dealt with immigration, europe and islam rather than quangos first and none of the above at all.

In reply to Daniel Maris, while I agree with most of your points, I do not agree that many quangos need to have any existence whatsoever whether in private or public ownership. A great many quangos are just interfering busybodies which exist solely for the employment of those constituting them. Very few do a job that needs doing at all.

Peter From Maidstone

Nicholas writes..

The curious admiration for all things German military in WWII is an established phenomenum, shared by the Speccie's Taki, so I know that I'm swimming against the tide.

Then I am swimming with you. Just outside Maidstone we have a massive military show once a year with people dressing up from all periods and conducting re-enactments. One of the scariest things was walking around and seeing a column of English people dressed as Germans marching across the site. It made my blood boil.

That year the organisers decided that the Germans would win the re-enactment. Not a popular decision. As the faux-German troops crested the brow of the hill and came into view I knew that I could willingly take up arms to defend England.

Nicholas

Wilhelm, remind me again how Michael Wittman died? ;-) The column he destroyed was not exclusively tanks but consisted of half tracks and bren gun carriers too. It was an unusual feat of arms as much to do with the circumstances (the British were halted and not expecting the sudden appearance of a Tiger tank at close range). The unit, from the 7th Armoured, was allegedly sloppy as a result of their desert war experience and not attuned to the risks in close country warfare.

I think you will find that the use of Shermans by the British was logistical and concerned numbers rather than because British manufactured tanks were no good per se. Although the latter point is made often and variously promoted/defended.

The Comet was an underrated late-war British design that served post-war. It was fast, well armoured, had a good gun and was generally liked by its crews. Some pundits compare it favourably - and unfavourably - to the German Panther. The Churchill was an "infantry tank" designed specifically to support Infantry Divisions - which it did well. It could be considered successful, especially in its "Crocodile" flame-throwing configuration. The Crusader was a mid-war tank to the "cruiser" design, moderately successful in the desert. You missed out the Cromwell, perhaps confusing that with the Comet?

The British improved on the Sherman by fitting 17 pounder guns to them, initially at the rate of one per troop and called "Fireflys". These were deadly and did much damage to the Panzer IV types that still formed the bulk of the German panzer units. They had to camouflage the long barrels of these guns to avoid them being singled out amongst the shorter barreled standard Shermans. The Israelis went on to use upgunned and improved Sherman variants until relatively recently (in my terms).

Although the Panzer Divisions get all the limelight, in Normandy the bulk of the German Army still consisted of marching Divisions with horse-drawn transport, whereas the British Army was fully mechanised. The post D-Day British Army gets a bad press, not least because of all the anti-Montgomery American literature of the period and the Hollywood mythology of stopping for tea, etc., but if you can be bothered there are a number of very good (and humbling) first-hand accounts from British tankmen that paint a slightly different picture.

Wilhelm

Peter of Maidstone

Did you not play cowboys and indians as a child ? Its the same thing, it doesnt mean you are going to hold up a bank or rob the Deadwood Stage, these guys who dress up in German uniforms are just big kids.

Noa Zrk

daniel maris @ March 12th, 2010 2:14pm

"For those nukies here who don't see the danger of terrorist sabotage at a nuclear power plant, perhaps the following from Jihad Watch may be of interest...".

Daniel, Given the respective threats I would far rather get rid of the stone age Jihadists than the nuclear power stations.

I have no wish to be driven back to the stone age by murderous third world religious peasants.

Malfleur

Noa Zrk "I have no wish to be driven back to the stone age by murderous third world religious peasants."

But a wish not sufficiently strong, apparently, to annex the Libyan oilfields and restore the House of Idris to a coastal enclave under benign British protection in alliance with Israel,thus securing a supply of oil through the Strait of Gibraltar and base against further depredations by the Islamists and their coteries..

The ghosts of our ancestors in Sabratha and Leptis Magna look on and despair.

That's modern Britain for you, talking the talk - but not walking the walk.

Peter From Maidstone

Wilhelm, no they are not big kids. My Dad did a nazi salute as they walked past and they wheeled to a halt and looked very intimidating and more or less threatened to beat him up. They looked, and I am sure they were, a front for a neo-Nazi group. No real Englishman would dress up as a Nazi for fun.

Austin Barry

Amazing, isn't it? Three parties and none of them can bring themselves to discuss Islam, massive unsympathetic immigration or Europe - the hot topics outside the Westminster Village padded cell.

The only thing they can discuss is "Change" apparently the key to Nirvana where an Obamaesque deity awaits us to the strains of Lennon's "Imagine".

We are ruled by raving lunatics.

daniel maris

Verity -

So you don't want anyone to regulate price setting by private gas, electricity and rail companies? You just want them to be able to set any price they like. (That's just for starters.)

Noa Zrk

Malfleur

"That's modern Britain for you, talking the talk - but not walking the walk...".

Wow! Nice one. My refusal to bow to the threat of Islamic terrorists turning out the lights by destroying nuclear power stations is, too use one of the more gross americanisms, "not walking the walk".

I have to admit that the idea of invading Libya is not completely insane, though I would normally expect the wasp swallowing vicar of waspington to produce such entertainment after high tea.

Well, do walk the walk on this, I'll repeat the questions you loftily ignored before,tell us how you will invade Libya, with what, and how you will retain control. Don't let me continue to think you're a windbag, show me I'm wrong!

Sam Armstrong

Made a train trip today in Blighty.

Why on earth do the British make such a mess? The gravel all along the track from London to Southampton is littered with disused bags, girders, concrete slabs, cones, etc. It's like workers who repair the lines just leave their mess behind and nobody is there to tidy up again. Same with roads; cones, litter, discarded things...

When you go abroad even the building sites seem tidier.

Houses: mouldy, exposed plastic guttering, junk in front gardens.

Why on earth is urban Britain so awful looking?

Verity

Daniel Maris - Yes.

I trust the market more than a sleazy government minister.

Verity

Noa Zrk - I am often on your side of an argument, but I find this offensive: "to use one of the more gross americanisms, "not walking the walk".

Why is this "gross"? What's gross about it?

Americanisms often slice right to the point. They're practical people. The pre-text of that "Americanism" is: "You talk the talk, but you cain't walk the walk."

Brilliant!

As are so many Americanisms that British regard with such condesension ... yet use. All the time. As you just did.

Don't be so condescending when Britain hasn't come up with a folk phrase used throughout the Anglosphere for ... oh, how many decades? Five?

America's the new Elizabethan England for language, fizzing with neologisms and phrases, and I love them for it!

Verity

Daniel Maris - Because I'm in a different, later, time zone, I don't know whether anyone has responded to this, from you: "Verity -

"So you don't want anyone to regulate price setting by private gas, electricity and rail companies? You just want them to be able to set any price they like. (That's just for starters.)"

Absolutely.

Free market. They will set prices the market can afford ... duh. They're not going to set prices that will drive themselves out of business. Double duh.

Why are lefties all so ugly? In revenge?

Verity

In fact ... can we have a competition?

Nominations for good-looking lefties, please.

John Shields

Ghengis, according to this morning's papers we're in for a bumper spring. Perhaps a 'barbecue summer' is on the way!

John Shields

Verity, bravo on all counts, but in particular re: Americanisms. American English has given us one of the most beautiful metaphors in the language - 'greased lightening'. That contribution alone would forgive any number of linguistic no-nos.

Frank P

Concise and utterly brilliant:

http://americandigest.org/mt-archives/enemies_foreign_domestic/i_had_a_thousand_words_pl.php

Hugh

Has anyone seen an article analysing what benefit the Taxpayer gets for the money transferred to the Unions as Development Fund contributions.
It would be interesting to revisit, anyway.

Vulture

Verity ( blessings be upon her) asks for nominations for non-ugly leftists.

Had to think VERY hard about this. While its true that people can't help what they look like, politicians as a species seem to bear out that adage abt politics being acting for ugly people - on average they are far more hideous than the common run of humankind.

If you look at the benches at Westminster, the Liebour tribe are particularly repellent: all overweight, beer gutted, noses like balls of plasticine etc. The Tories are a LITTLE better. Not much.

But to specifics: people often get to resemble their characters. Mandelslime looks like an oily, feline, repulsive reptile. Prescott looks like a thick, ignorant, foul mouthed oaf. Balls looks like a slimy, lying, malevolent toad.
Bruin just looks like something Dr Frankenstein stitched together in his lab from the sweepings of a vivisection experiment. Not human at all.

So pretty boy lefties. Hmmm - Kilroy-Silk in his youth? Mosley in his Liebour days?
Ramsay Macdonald was said to be one of England's most handsome men, though I don't share that view.

If you count Liberals as lefties then David Steel in youth, David Owen too, Jo Grimond, and Nick Clegg in a very bland sort of way.

AS for wimmin: many rate Caroline Flint, though she has Gucci bags under her eyes; the rest of them should be forced to wear niquabs when they are let out in public.

Needless to add, I am a thing of loveliness.

daniel maris

Verity - You clearly have no idead how economics works (among other things).

The idea that a "free market" would operate in the Thames Water area or the national grid is one of the better jokes you have foisted on us.

Wilhelm

Nicholas

I award you the Iron Cross, first class for fighting a rear guard action in defence of the British Army uniform, known to one and all as the potato sack, congratulations.

Now Nicholas, if you were a soldier would you prefer to be in a King Tiger tank, 80 tonnes , very well protected, captained by Joachim Peiper , looking very cool in his dashing uniform, his peaked cap cocked to one side, giving him a certain elan. Google a photo of him.

Or would you prefer to be in British tank made out of cardboad, bits of string and scotch tape ?

Its over to you, Nicholas.

Verity

John Shields - Yes 'greased lightning' is a beautiful, strong, evocative phrase. American inventiveness with our ancient language is heart-lifting.

Nicholas

Wilhelm, I'd rather be in a British tank wearing a "potato sack" and fighting for a just cause, even if that meant facing death. Millions of young men from this country and the Commonwealth faced the same risk and made the same choice, thank God.

I don't need to google Peiper. I know all about him, thanks. Despite their strange glorification by people like you the King Tigers and the Joachim Peipers were defeated, as was the terrible regime they fought for. Almost 5 million Germans died in those "dashing uniforms". And they were defeated in the field by young men in "potato sacks" who knew exactly what risks they faced and understood perfectly the war craft, equipment and determination of their enemies. To my mind that makes the boys in "potato sacks" something very special indeed and the glorification of their enemies nothing short of odd.

And the British tanks were not really made out of cardboard, bits of string and scotch tape you know.

Noa Zrk

Verity.
We must agree to differ on the use of "walking the walk" in this instance. In the context used it was inapposite and plain down right wrong.
Ironically i believe it came to currency in the UK after the release of Stanley Kubrick's "Full Metal Jacket", context and indeed offensive.
Otherwise I agree with the creative and dynamic aspects of the contribution to the English language by our American cousins, wose education system now seems to have supassed our own.
I note though, that your own postings rarely
if ever draw on such sources and are none the worse for that!

Verity

John Shields, sticking to the analogy of the sky, "flying under the radar" is also an evocative and telling phrase.

Wilhelm

Nicholas

We ALL know the nazies were insane so it doesnt need to be stated.

What Im talking about is the cut of the cloth and the tailoring.

Nicholas

Wilhelm, just a suggestion, but if you can take a trip to the USA, go to a firing range and get someone to fire a Bren gun at you, from say 500 yards range, as you crouch on the butts wearing one of those dashing German uniforms with your cap cocked to one side to give you a certain elan. I assure you if you do that the fall of shot will quickly make you forget what you are wearing or that the Bren gunner may be dressed in a "potato sack". I wish that I could go with you to demonstrate - it's been a long time since I fired a Bren gun - but alas it is probably not a practical proposition.

daifromwales

Sam Johnson complains about scruffy Britain.

Explanation is simple - we are just about escaping winter. Maybe he comes from warmer climes when spending time in the garden tidying it up in February is a little bit easier. It's cold, dark and damp when I come home from work. The garden will take a hit once Spring returns...

Verity

Noa Zrk - "Walk the walk" is term originating in US prison life. I don't know how old the film you refer to is, but this term has been around in the US for a long time.

Verity

John Shields and Noa Zrk - This seems an appropriate place to mention the sheer, life-affirming optimism of the United States, which is its most dazzling attribute.

And I believe this comes in a direct line from the settlers of the original 13 colonies in the 1600s.

Think about it. The days of being able to take even a primitive photograph were 250 years in the future, yet these people sold their meagre possessions and set sail across the vast Atlantic for a land they'd only heard existed.

They had no idea what to expect, but they prudently took some livestock and some seeds with them and set their faces towards the West, and the sun and the future. It was so brave it absolutely breaks my heart.

The climate was vicious and the flora were unfamiliar, but kindly Native Americans
showed them how to work the land and helped them through their first draconian winters - far harsher than anything they could have imagined, coming from the mild climes of Britain and Ireland.

They perservered, and that 'can do' spirit is still the backbone of the national character.

Think too of those who went West, travelling 2,500 miles by wagon train with no idea of what to expect on the way. Some of those wagon trains were a mile wide travelling in a long line. Babies were born, people died and were buried where they died, and the wagon trains rolled forward. The American talent for organisation!

Americans are confident that if they just have the grit, they can do it.

Back to the topic of 'greased lightning' et al, another fairly recent phrase which will be around forever is "We have lift-off". (Plus, "Houston, we have a problem.")

David Ossitt

Verity

“In fact ... can we have a competition?”

“Nominations for good-looking lefties, please.”

This has to be a trick question; it is a well known fact that anyone who is good looking, handsome, has a warm charm, is quick of whit, can not be of the left.

Next time you are watching prime ministers questions, just compare the two sides of the house.

Some of those on the left might start out as pleasant to look at, but then the socialist thought patters get to work, and the ugly inside shows itself in all of their faces.

Superficial Sexist

Good looking lefty:
Segolene Royal.

Surely even Verity will acknowledge that.

Verity

Superficial Sexist - Yes, but she's French. The don't have that mean-spirited, controlling, uppity, vicious leftiness that Brits like Harriet Harman have. Jacques Chirac's on the left, but he was nice looking too, when younger.

Re movie stars, I cannot think of one attractive lefty.

Noa Zrk

Criticising the BNP is an unthinking reflex for the Left and its range of allies. It's the political equivalent of football's open goal. In the Spectator blog the condescending disdain of the fouth estates inky-fingered minions is palpable. This weekhas seen the failure of the BNP's two MEP's to provide expenses details providing another opportunity for criticism.

However the media is wrong to attack the BNP as, its very existance seriously threatened, it now finds itself in the forefront of the fight for personal and political liberty and the very preservation of democracy in the UK and Europe.

The legal threat to its existence has been directly initialed by Riech Commissar Harman and her EHCR police. The ban on recruitment of members is a direct threat to a legitimate political party resulting from perverse and disgraceful legislation passed for the purpose of attacking political opposition by the would-be representatives of a future totalitarian state.

This threat has not been confined to the existence of political opposition. By the narrowest of margins and in the teeth of fierce opposition from the NUT, a review determined this week that it was "unnecessary" to extend the present ban on membership from the Police and Fire services to teachers. The credulous might think this is a blow for liberty. the cynical are likely to conclude that this is because the NUT is already almost completely under the control of the left.

Whether or not one agrees with the BNP's policies and as its rapidly increasing support shows, very many do. All people who love freedom of speech, association and the right to political assembly should recognise the very real and present threat to those liberties and and the absolute necessary for action to preserve them.

The Conservatives are very wrong to support Labour, overtly or tacitly, in this iniquitous campaign to politically cleanse the indigenous population's absolute personal right to be patriotic and nationalistic.

If the BNP is de-legitimised and its supporters driven underground and persecuted then all anyone of independent mind is a likely target.

The remaining free thinkers in the Conservative party will be next.

David Ossitt

Noa Zrk

Spot on.

Verity

Noa Zrk - Sparling with clarity and truth!

The victimisation of a political opponent in a democracy is illegal ... but a measure of the threat the communist/Common Purpose scum see in the BNP. I hope Nick Griffith is well protected, because they will be after him.

Noa Zrk

Wilhelm

Herewith an updated communist joke for you.

Following his election in May Brown dies. He then goes to hell (of course).

After a week the angel on guard is woken up by a loud banging at the Pearly Gate.
He opens the gate for Saint Peter,who sees a crowd of devils screaming desperately.
Saint Peter: "What is wrong with you, what are you doing here?"
Devils: "We are the first group of asylum seekers from hell and we demand political asylum in heaven.
Since Gordon arrived down there, hell has gone like Britain!"

Peter From Maidstone

It seems scandalous that there is no general uproar by the media (which only shows that they are entirely compromised, including the Spectator, and must be swept away) that a legal political party is not allowed to promote the integrity of the indigenous British peoples.

If we are not allowed to defend our own integrity by the forces of government then the government does not stand for us, or represent us, but is the enemy of the British people.

When did we last have a Government which acted so clearly and determinedly in such a way against the very existence of the British people? Has there ever been such a government in modern times?

Nicholas

Noa Zrk if New Labour had a free hand they would ban all political parties but theirs and deem all political dissent as extremist. Their articulated ideology conveys this already. The real criminal extremists in Britain today are New Labour themselves.

Nicholas

Speaking of New Labour's aspirations for a one party state this ranking of liberal vs authoritarian MPs has a solid soviet bloc of Labour at the top, many scoring 100/100. If anyone has any doubts about what another 5 years of having these scum in power over us would mean compare their ranking with the other parties.

http://rank.libdemvoice.org/ranked/

Jack Straw scores 76/100. David Cameron 12/100.

At the same time as being the most authoritarian Labour emerge as the clear winners in the troughing stakes.

Noa Zrk

Another Labour joke:

Gordon Brown is suffering from insomnia. He goes to his doctor and complains.
"I can't sleep doctor, no matter what I do! What should I do?"
Doctor: "Try listening to your speeches".

Noa Zrk

PfM/Nicholas

I never thought that the UK would become a totalitarian state. But that is what happening, step by step.

Noa Zrk

Nicholas

Thank you for the link to the Labour list of "dictators 'r us".

What a bunch of lumpen turnips they are.

Malfleur

Noa Zrk

The question, if I may say, is not how I will invade Libya or how I will control it. The question is how are Britain's fuel requirements and strategic security interests in the Middle East and the Mediterranean and North African region to be met in the next fifty or more years - a question which, to my mind, has not yet been answered in a way that lends me any comfort.

Since an admission has been made by Mr. Zrk that the annexation of the Libyan oil fields from the usurper coupled with the consolidation of Libya in a coastal enclave under a constitutional monarchy, an opportunity which one would think might come to the fore upon the usurper's demise, is not entirely insane, then I am glad to see that he has conceded the principle and has started to ask "how?". Once the ends have been justified and agreed as necessary, then adequate means must be found to achieve them. That is not my job, but as Bernard Shaw could have said to Mr. Zrk "Now we're just haggling over the price".

Verity

A most entertaining column by Nigel Farndale on what politicians really said and what they are reported to be said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7436878/David-Camerons-embarrassing-moments-are-all-his-own.html

Noa Zrk

Malfleur
Regarding your proposition for the invasion, conquest and imposition of a monarchy in Libya.

"Once the ends have been justified and agreed as necessary, then adequate means must be found to achieve them. That is not my job..."

Actually I believe it is. If you propose such a venture , involving the copious expenditure of your fellow country mens lives you do need to be able to justify it to them, not just ethically and practically, but face to face.

Let us consider some recent events which might provide us more guidance in your proposal than harking back to the remains of the civilisation imposed by the Romans following their total destruction of Hannibal and Hasdrubal.

The first Gulf war could be demonstrably justified by the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait and commanded general support. The second Gulf war was launched on the basis of the potential rather than an actual threat and its basis was much more problematic. However the consequences are much more profound; most notably the legitimisation of Islamic extremism and the transformation of Al Quaeda from a crackpot sideshow to a major political force. In invading Iraq we poured petrol on the flames of a conflict which has since spread around the world and does not look likely to be extinguished in the near future.

Undoubtedly, any such invasion of Libya by the crusading west would be seen as a threat to Israel and would have profound, unexpected and unpleasant consequences. I suggest that we would become the pariah of the west. The US would be alienated as would France, Italy and Spain. Indeed the breakup of NATO is a serious possibility. No doubt also Libya's neighbours and its allies, such as Russia, would actively support armed resistance of increasing severity.
All this would have to be done by using the British army to defend an imported and I suspect deeply unpopular monarchy. Moreover we do not have a good track record in such work. Suez was an embarrassing failure and that was when we could draw on a conscript army with a war and battle hardened core, similarly a powerful navy and air force and an ally.
Now contrast this with our current armed forces, depleted and demoralised by fighting Labour's un-winnable new post colonial wars. Struggling to contain Afghan guerillas; and that is with the US as an ally. A navy that is barely functional, carriers with low capability aircraft, destroyers without radar. A limited air force projection capability. Air cover would of course have to be provided from the UK, overflights of Spain and France would probably be banned.
Ignominious withdrawal, national and international humiliation. Our reputation for decency and supporting liberty destroyed for fifty years or more.

In contrast we have, we already own, and have a legal and moral right to extract a potential 50 billion barrels of oil in the Antarctic. That's US $7 trillion in todays values. We have the right and can and should develop the military means to keep it as soon as possible. In the meantime, difficult though it may be, we must seek to reduce our dependence on oil, especially middle eastern oil where we can and to develop alternative energy sources. Coal and nuclear sources should be included as a matter of national priority.

On such a basis, by legality and reason rather than force and conquest, we can proceed to bright sunlit uplands.

I look forward, my dear Mr Malfleur, to your refutation of the above analysis and to your detailed counter proposals.

daniel maris

Gordon is at his weekly meeting with his psychiatrist:

"Doctor, I have been getting terrible nightmares about the election result."

"Don't worry, fear of failure in such circumstances is something that is quite common."

"Failure? No - what really worries me is we might win..."

"Hmmm. Yes. I see what you mean...we better up the dose."

Frank P

For those that missed "Requiem for Detroit" tonight on BBC2, here is the ipod link. Do not miss it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00rkm3y/Requiem_for_Detroit/

Do not miss it: a deeply shocking, but brilliant documentary which should even make Jeremy Clarkson pause for thought about the history of the automobile. Some of the best vox pops and musical inserts ever. A perfect description of Dystopia but, eerily, the underlying message is one of human survival - despite the iniquities and idiocies imposed by the exploiters of both extremes of political dogma. 75 minutes; you'll probably need a stiff drink or two.

Noa Zrk

For a relaxing Sunday morning with a quiet cup of tea on the terrace readers may wish to muse on some of Lenin's sayings and their relevance, or not, in contemporary UK politics.

“A lie told often enough becomes truth”

“There are no morals in politics; there is only expedience. A scoundrel may be of use to us just because he is a scoundrel.”

“We need the real, nation-wide terror which reinvigorates the country and through which the Great French Revolution achieved glory”

“The way to crush the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation.”

"Under socialism all will govern in turn and will soon become accustomed to no one governing.”

“Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism”

“The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency”

“The press should be not only a collective propagandist and a collective agitator, but also a collective organizer of the masses”

"If democracy, in essence, means the abolition of class domination, then why should not a socialist minister charm the whole bourgeois world by orations on class collaboration?"

"A newspaper is not only a collective propagandist and a collective agitator, it is also a collective organiser".

When feudalism was overthrown and “free” capitalist society appeared in the world, it at once became apparent that this freedom meant a new system of oppression and exploitation of the working people.

Lenin, The Three Sources and Three Component Parts of Marxism (1913)

"People always have been the foolish victims of deception and self-deception in politics, and they always will be until they have learnt to seek out the interests of some class or other behind all moral, religious, political and social phrases, declarations and promises".

"We fully regard civil wars, i.e., wars waged by the oppressed class against the oppressing class, slaves against slave-owners, serfs against land-owners, and wage-workers against the bourgeoisie, as legitimate, progressive and necessary".

"Socialists must explain to the masses that they have no other road of salvation except the revolutionary overthrow of “their” governments, and that advantage must be taken of these governments’ embarrassments in the present war precisely for this purpose".

Verity

Plans for the abolition of the House of Lords to be revealed ... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/lawandorder/7437230/Plans-for-abolition-of-House-of-Lords-to-be-unveiled.html

On orders from the EUSSR?

When will we see the plans for the abolition of the House of Commons?

radgie gadgie

Two cheers for BBC TV News! At 10 last night they graciously allowed a 30 seconds mention of a little event 'up North' marking the 1600th anniversary of the Romans leaving Britain. The entire route was lit up by beacons - and what a sight it was from high up in the Pennines in the gathering dusk.

What was, however, worthy of much more time was the momentous 'news' that the South African authorites are training stewards for the World Cup due to start any day now (May) (I know, can you believe it?). They are being taught a dance.

Why couldnt they have reminded us about the fascist colonial oppression the British endured and the slavery rampant throughout the Roman Imperial Empire? We survived it and even invented some dancing (like that of Morris) - just like those noble South Africans.

Herbert Thornton

Noa Zrk - your suggested Sunday morning reading is disturbing enough, but I've just read a Daily Mail report with this exciting headline - "Jack Straw drawing up plan to abolish the House of Lords". It indicates that a Labour plank in the coming election will be the creation of an elected Senate - i.e. a profound change in the Constitution.

Who can possibly have any faith in this being what it appears to be on the surface? To my mind it is certain to be designed to entrench Political Correctness into the Constitution - as a matter of law.

I suspect that a substantial - and increasing - proportion of seats in the Senate will be reserved to represent immigrants (and Muslims in particular) under the guise of promoting social harmony and making immigrants in general feel welcome.

Nor will I be surprised if this new "Constitution" entrenches Politically Correct principles such as "freedom from discrimination", "Human Rights" and the "guarantee of freedom of religion" as fundamental parts of the Constitution, and declares that it automatically over-rides all other laws that are incompatible with those principles.

Might this new Constitution even give the Senate the duty to examine all laws passed by the House of Commons to see whether they comply with those principles - and the power to veto them if it decides that they don't? Will the Senators in the new Senate include substantial numbers of Islamic Clerics? Will we discover that Labour have created the equivalent of Iran's Council of Guardians?

Does this sound far-fetched, mad, and unscrupulous? Bear in mind that the proposal is coming from the very people who surreptitiously conspired to flood Britain with more and more immigrants not only to boost the Labour vote but to "rub our noses" in it.

Noa Zrk

Herbert Thornton

I've argued previously in Coffee House for constitutional and Parliamentary reform in order to provide a system of democratic checks and counter-balances.
Whilst I've not seen the new proposals I share your concerns. My gut feeling is that, if Slimy Jack, Brown's Himmler, is behind it we need to be very, very sceptical indeed. The wretched man would try to sell its own scent to a skunk.

Nicholas

What is it with modern rugby scrums? I watched the Calcutta Cup match yesterday and the scrums could barely stay up for seconds before collapsing. Every time. When I played rugby in the middle of the last century collapsing scrums were the exception.

Is it because the players are bulking up their upper bodies so much that they can no longer maintain balance once they shift that bulk forward in a crouch?

Nicholas

If Jack Straw has any plan it will be like the fin of the shark. The bit with the dangerous teeth will be invisible below the surface, circling ever closer. See his proposed "constitution" for the Falkland Islands which virtually makes the Islanders concentration camp inmates obliged to do this and do that at the behest of the State.

Straw, to use the Labour vernacular, is a scum sucking fascist of the worst kind. The sooner his reptilian claws are prised from the levers of power and he gets a well deserved boot up the arse the better.

To get an idea of what really goes through Straw's mind, refer to the Leninist principles posted above.

I wonder when British people will finally wake up to the fact that they are being governed by a bunch of insane, un-reformed, hardline old communists?

MikeF

A Horror Story:

There is a knock at your door that makes a dull, insistent booming noise. You make your way towards the door to open it. But you cannot shake off a feeling of cold, clammy apprehension that becomes almost overwhelming. You reach out towards the door tentatively, nervously, unlatch it and draw it slowly towards you to reveal what lays behind:

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/47468000/jpg/_47468372_brown_pa.jpg

Wilhelm

Nicholas says

'' You should be put up against the wall and shot.''

Thanks Nicholas, its nice to be wanted.

Malfleur

Noa Zrk

I may attempt a fuller response next week, but I need a little time to replenish the wind in my bag; but I do not see that you and I are engaged in a hostile polemic where I have to refute and then await counter-refutation. We are all here, I hope, looking for the means to secure the country economically and militarily, and this sometimes involves thinking and acting "outside the box" to find ways to remove obstacles to that desirable end, presently not entirely apparent, which some may consider absolutely beastly. To quote Shaw again therefore, if I may,someone sometimes as instructive as Lenin, "Liberty means responsibility. That is why most men dread it".

I would therefore, in the rump of this Coffeehouse, make an early observation on your post. You rightly highlight the difficulties which would, in present circumstances, be brought on in the military sphere when you write of our country's ability to defend its interests "A navy that is barely functional, carriers with low capability aircraft, destroyers without radar. A limited air force projection capability. Air cover would of course have to be provided from the UK, overflights of Spain and France would probably be banned".

At the same time, you invoke the attractive prospect of a "right" to "a potential 50 billion barrels of oil in the Antarctic",with somewhat longer lines of communication that to the shores of Tripoli but add, perspicaciously, that Britain "should develop the military means to keep it as soon as possible".

Oh dear, we don't have the means?

Well, yes, there are "claims" - not rights though which would presuppose that there is something called "international law" which can be enforced without the cooperation of nations (though it is studied in English universities, so it must exist...). These claims, which include a Brazilian "zone of interest" - Brazil being a close bosom friend of China - also include Norway, Australia, Argentina and New Zealand, not necessarily countries eternally devoted to respecting our interests. Mr. Zrk would be welcome nonetheless to rest confident , on his moral height, that our claim is a right, as the Plantagenets believed their claim to large parts of France was well-based - as of course it was...

Unfortunately, in the Atlantic, we have a navy that is barely functional, carriers with low capability aircraft, destroyers without radar. A limited air force projection capability. Air cover would of course have to be provided from the UK,and overflights of Chile and Argentina et alios inclding perhaps some other countries thought now to be more friendly would probably be banned. Ignominious withdrawal of our claim, national and international humiliation, might result. Our reputation for decency and supporting liberty resting, according to a view which the United States might decide to support, on a claim to Argentine territory, destroyed for fifty years or more.

Boo hoo!

Does he really think however that it would test British finances and military capabilities and resolve less to defend its claim in the Antartic than to expend some effort in constructing a military and diplomatic route to oil fields and a base to project military force from Libya? Well, perhaps with the support of Trident, but then by the same token in the Mediterranean Trident's area of projected influence might...

As the politicians like to say, when they are about to make their people eat dirt,there are no easy answers".

John Richardson

Regarding the current situation.

'Noa Zrk' and others, we already live in a Police State. It is just not considered polite to mention it.
People in the UK have not yet woken up to how poor the country now is. Therefore they seem prepared to ignore perversion, tyranny, corruption, or treachery as they imagine they will still get an index linked Pension or win the lottery (30% according to something I read in the D.M. last week ) or sell their homes for a fortune and move to a foreign country and live like kings.......

A commercial radio station, the countries biggest, is running a Government advert at present.
The voice tells use to watch and report upon anyone we have 'suspicions' about. Examples include 'the bloke at the next desk at work' or a neighbour.
Yes, the Government is spending our money on telling us to report secretly on our neighbours.
Not to catch the 'benefit cheats' the Government has created. Instead, to catch the 'terrorists' the Government has created. Or imported and refused to imprison or refused to deport or take off Welfare or impose 'Control Orders' upon or.......

Some above have asked when will people finally see the incompetence of New Labor ? They are not imcompetent or confused, they are bad.
They have been put into Office all across the European West. Left/Right are irrelevant. Political Party identity is irrelevant. Administering Crime/justice is irrelevant and possibly a target. National financial rectitude is irrelevant and possibly a target(how can anyone pretend to be surprised by Greece ?). The family is a target.
The phantom menace of terrorism gives the Agenda 'right cover'.
The phantom menace of 'AGW' gives the Agenda 'left cover'. Sometimes the (MI5/Special Branch) BNP is used for this (see above, Noa Zrk)as well.
Earlier in the week Verity asked 'What's the end game ?'
I have no doubt at all exactly where I think this is headed.
Regarding the current situation, as the estimable Alex Jones said a few weeks ago, "It's like I'm living in a Science Fiction movie!"
Yes, a dark Quatermass type effort with an opague ending.
Any other ideas regarding the end game ?

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

A little late as the Wall will soon be pulled down and built anew. There is one Leftie that I think is very good looking. I don't like her ideology, but Vanesssa Redgrave has classical good looks and is a brilliant actress. The rest of the Bolshie actresses all look like Glenda Jackson and Miriam Margolyse - old bags!

Noa Zrk

Malfleur.

I'm happy to agree that we are not not engaged in a hostile, but in a constructive debate on the matter of securing the UK's best interests in the competition for future energy resources.

We agree that our existing resources are inadequate. Our military capability has been squandered under Labour and will have to be re-built to meet future requirements. It will be interesting to see what the SDR's conclusions are. Current rumours indicate the cancellation of both planned carriers and that would preclude the invasion of anything except, possibly, Blackpool beach on a Scots bank holiday.

Contemplating the threat, let alone the use. of nuclear weapons in either scenario adds a new frisson of excitement and uncertainty.

Verity

AWK - Well, at least no one's nominated Jo Brand.

Yes, Vanessa Redgrave has a well built face, but there is that attendant little smirk of superiority habitually worn by those who believe they are morally superior to others.

BTW, the only attractive man in Hollywood is Bruce Willis, a strong right winger.

Superficial Sexist

I'm watching '30 Rock' on DVD at the moment and I really fancy Tina Fey.

No idea what her politics are.

What about Sandra Bullock and Ashley Judd?

If Verity's theory is correct they must all be right-wing.

But really,Verity, only one attractive man in Hollywood?

And isn't it good to have occasional light interludes on these pages.

If that were really the case the film industry wouldn't survive.

Anne Wotana Kaye 1

Verity: Alas, I've never been able to replace Robert Tsylor and Clark Gable. My mother told me I was taken to the cinema at the age of 18 months (when the baby-sitter) didn't arrive, and I kept shouting "Robert Taylor" for weeks. I also found Clark Gable very handsome, when I was an infant, and now realise both had moustaches. Wonder if they were right-wingers?

Maria

Very late but had to add this to any good-looking lefties: Michael Mansfield. Past his best maybe, but aren't we all?

Verity

Don't get me started on Tom Hanks (an awful looking man) and Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon and that coterie of lefties.

Y'awl 'll pleased to read that Dolly Parton is right winger.

paulg

Willelm, the nazis lost, the cut of their cloth did not help their cause, their tight fitting breaches were ripped at the arse as they ran back to Germany thru Belgium and Poland.

I recently read an account of the battles in russia by marshal Zhukov who killed about ten million of them and, not once did he think the tilt of their hat did anything for their effort.

Noa Zrk

John Richardson - agreed

Noa Zrk

Verity/Anne W Kaye/Maria.

Ladies.

Surely actors and actresses, of whatever political persuasion, should be in scenes and not herds

Wilhelm

paulg squeeks

'' we ripped their arses.''

Dont be vulgar, son, this is the Spectator, not the Sunday Sport newspaper or Readers Wives. Try and be a bit classy, just for me, eh ?

Wilhelm

Robert Taylor's real name was Spangler Arlington Brugh and he could play the cello, very right wing.

So was Adolph Menjou, who's career spanned the silent movies, great moustache, also very right wing.

Nicholas

Wilhelm says: "Nicholas says

'' You should be put up against the wall and shot.''"

Did I? Did I really say that? There is a difference, Wilhelm, between experiencing the fall of shot and being hit by it. Whilst the former can induce alarming physical and mental sensations they are not as fatal as the latter. I would never dream of suggesting that you "should be put up against a wall and shot". I merely posited that your admiration for stylish Nazi uniforms might be put into perspective by your coming under aimed fire whilst wearing them. You would of course be at liberty to scamper around on top of the butts too. A Bren gun seemed appropriate for the exercise and I can assure you that if I were firing it you need not fear for your life.

As you are clearly not a socialist I have no desire whatsoever to see you run up against a wall and shot. As to your being wanted, well, no promises, eh?