No place for porkies in digital politics

Will Straw

Fraser,

The article clearly stated the following: "Chris Grayling has condemned the principle behind his own leaderâ™s new banking policy." That is accurate. His statement that a financial transaction tax cannot be carried out unilaterally also applies to Cameron's new unilateral bank levy.

There was no mischief taking place here. I merely pointed out that Grayling's remarks were inconsistent with Cameron's policy (which they are).

Best wishes,

Will

Richard

Cameron doesn't give much detail on this proposal .... certainly not enough to understand what kind of levy or tax he means.
You must have inside info because his statement can be taken either way.

This does seem like one of those on the hoof statements that will be reworked once the jackals in the press have got a hold of it. We will see in the next week or so just how serious he is.
Moving in on the banks without global synchronisation will have limited effect.

There is always another way! Make all financial transactions that either source money for or from the UK be subject to the tobin tax. Any bank that wants to have foot in the UK market must comply regardless of where the bank is based.
All hedgefunds dealing in UK stocks and companies must pay the tax in the UK or be banned from the UK stock markets.
All insurance companies selling policies that cover UK interests and assets must pay the tax regadless of where they are based.
Effectively closing the door to those companies who won't comply.

Nash

Will Straw is the son of Jack Straw. Are you surprised!?

jennywren

The BBC in the Today programme this morning were very quick off the mark in talking about Cameron 'proposing a tax on the banks regardless of international agreement'. Nick Robinson clearly didn't understand what was being proposed since he spoke about it being a tax but 'less onerous' than competing proposals for an internationally imposed charge. It had me reaching for the smelling salts briefly until I actually heard Cameron's speech.

hmmm

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So amongst others who are funding this abomination, we have:

- the Foreign Minister of Europe
- the man from Yougov (who conveniently finds the highest Labour share)
- the union which mortgaged the future of Royal Mail

Does anyone know who the others are? Time for some "evidence-based" digital retribution.

TGF UKIP

But Fraser, why is it always Labour doing it to your mates and never your mates doing it to Labour?

Poodles and Pitbulls.

Harry Smith

The Robin Hood Tax website is using similar tactics to put their spin on today's events:

They say: "The political argument has shifted decisively today, the myth that Britain can’t act alone to tax banks has been exposed for what it is. The Conservatives proposal for a unilateral tax on banks has shown that Britain can go alone.

http://robinhoodtax.org.uk/homepage/robin-hood-tax-campaign-initial-reaction-to-david-cameron-proposals-on-a-unilateral-bank-levy/

Percepied

There is also an issue with vaguary in how the story is being reported for which the Conservatives have themselves, in part, to blame.

The Cameron speech was trailed this morning on the Today Programme, which got me wondering what the tax being proposed was - was it a Tobin tax or some other mechanism? The BBC website carries the story, but there is no mention of what the tax actually is.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8577603.stm

Cameron's speech was not online at the Conservative website when I checked late morning, although PoliticsHome did link to a Reuters release which described it as an insurance levy. Finally I find out what the tax proposal actually is!

The Conservative site does now carry the speech, but the press release associated with it carries no detail on the mechanics of the levy. If the Conservatives don’t make it easy to find out what the proposal is, it is hardly surprising that others will make up their own description it.

Craig Montgomery

Hang on. Yes, he was talking about a transaction tax, but he said it was "a principle nobody could oppose". As Grayling agrees, it cannot be done unilaterally, for reasons which apply equally to Cameron's proposals.

Disorganised1

The rush to be first outweighs the need for accuracy.

Irene

Straw obviously doesn'tunderstand the difference between the so called Robin Hood tax and a Banking levy.

Jock Coats

Yeah - terribly difficult these days for politicians and the media to keep up with each other's announcements isn't it:

"The key issue for the UK is whether to proceed unilaterally or wait for broader agreement. The priority must and should be to make the UK safe. And if necessary that means proceeding unilaterally. Until the process of breaking up the banks is complete, we believe that banks should pay an insurance premium – in the form of a 10% levy on supplementary profits for registered banks in the UK (excluding mutuals). This levy would be to cover counter party risk as opposed to depositor protection, covered under existing arrangements. There is a growing consensus that such an insurance levy is right. "

That would be Vince Cable then, *last* Saturday. Do keep up DC!

At least we know now why the Lib Dems chose an election slogan that is an amalgam of both Labour's and Conservatives' ones - so whoever nicks their policies can just Tipex out the bit of it that doesn't apply to them!

SuperBlue

Master Straw must think we are all on something if we believe his clear misrepresentation.

Anan

Oh Will Straw, that one who was arrested soon after Labour won in 1997 on drug charges? We really should believe him! not.

Tiberius

Nice one, Fraser. A triumph in the art of flushing out Labour critters.

Nicj Leaton

Bankers tax? ie. Tax the succesful for the incompentence of the failures?

Hmmm.

Jail for all politicians for the frauds of the majority?

Yep. The ideas a good one.

EyeSee

If Will is a Jack product, then can he clarify just who owned the drugs found in Jack's home? I mean the man is claims he is interested in principles, though I suspect (and this clear lie suggests) he isn't.

Timmo

I hope Straw Jr got those jobs by merit not privilege.

Augustyn

Spin on spin on spin on spin. Once it was the innovation of the Labour Party.So much spin.
I don't think I'm alone in wanting transparency and truth and truth and truth.

Tiberius

It is common knowledge that you're a bit of a one trick pony, TGF, but it is worth picking up on your point because Charles Moore has expressed his frustration at the Tories' supposed toothlesness today in the DT (over the BA strike although I have heard plenty on this on the radio during last week).

Cameron is accused of anything and everything, amongst which is his going back on doing away with punch and judy politics, and not moving away from spin and PR.

If the Tories are going to match Labour blow for blow in this fight without Queensberry rules, they are, I'm afraid, going to have to spin and even lie.

The fact that they have come as far as they have without emulating New Labour (from a position of a no-hoper offical Opposition) suggests they can go the rest of the way without doing so. If our politics is to be cleaner post-New Labour, we don't want the Tories sinking to the level of Damien McBride and the above as revealed by Fraser. Such behaviour is not easily able to be turned off at the tap once released.

I suppose it depends somewhat on whether you believe the electorate can see through lies and will turn against them. William Hague said when leader that one day the British public will come to hate New Labour, and I think he is right. And as Ian Hislop said all those years ago on Question Time to Lady Archer, Tony Blair can only get away with lying to Parliament because of what your husband and those like him have done. Having resurrected the Conservative party from the undead condition, maybe Cameron has neutralized the predominence of the lie from the New Labour armoury.

I don't think we want the Tories to go down that road or anywhere near it because we want our politics to become somewhere near respectable again, even if that has to remain a relative term.

Anan

If some coffeehousers' (all?) pet Tory the now aged foetus Hague had actually fought hard when he was leader (as these Comrades are shameless doing now), with all the Mandelson money laundering scams, the Hindujah incidents and the Bernie Ecclestein frauds, not to mention the Prescott punching electorate affair (wonder what the media reaction would have been if a Tory did that to a voter - not "John is John" mollycodling I suspect), then we would already be in a Conservative government now. That is, he would have reduced the Labour majority significantly in 2001, paving the way for a victory in 2005 (under him or Howard or even Clarke).

Instead, it is clear to me now why he chose the ridiculous slogan of "save the pound" to fight on - because, as recent revelations have shown us all, he was extremely interested in saving pounds, all the millions and billions of pounds of his rich friends and their offshore tax-haven accounts, not to mention getting them peerages. If he had applied as much effort into fighting Labour (with the subsequent ability to appoint everyone and his uncle as a Lord of the Realm) then he could have actually done his job properly.

I hope this sordid affair by Straw today highlights just how hard these burnt out Comrades will fight - reaching depths of hypocrisy, arrogance and vileness never seen before - to stay in power. Let that be a lesson to you all, you trilobite Tories with your love of all things non-sensical and irrelevant.

pie

Left Foot Forward - Evidence Based Lies

TGF UKIP

It is common knowledge that you're a bit of a one trick Dave cheerleader, Tiberius, but even you should be concerned at the lack of bite from the Cameron Tories.As for the piece in the DT, I'm not too sure who should be the more worried, Moore or myself, that we are in such close agreement.

Nor, I'm afraid is it just "the pack", to use your flattering description, who are so derisive when it comes to Dave & Co's attacking capabilities,for as you well know over these past few years so many Coffee Housers have been reduced to intermittent rage and incomprehension over their failure to score in front of open goals (and without need to have recourse to spin or lies). And among the hacks, even your fellow cheerleader, James Forsyth, has been known to express some impatience with them now and again.

This "toothlessness" as your mate Chazza describes it, would not be so bad if they had been giving the voters solid reasons to vote Tory, but they weren't. It was this anodyne, Mekon inspired strategy of (to use another Tiberian phrase) not frightening the horses and trying to coast through by saying we're new and different and wouldn't Worcester woman love Dave as a husband or son in law. Unfortunately for them, the voters weren't as gullible as the Tory hacks when it came to swallowing the Mekon's "brand decontamination" spin.

That they've ended up on a knife edge against Britain's worst ever government is certainly no surprise to"the pack", it was always so predictable. As you may well recall even when they had a 20+ lead in the Summer of 08, I was saying, to some derision from your sidekicks, that Labour had everything to fight for because their lead was obviously so soft and was entirely anti-Labour in nature and not pro Tory because your boy had given them so little to be pro Tory about.

Impossible for you to face up to, I know old mate, because you have invested everything in him, but your boy has been an absolute disaster as Commander in Chief and what really should be keeping you awake at night, apart from those decimal points and zeros, is the thought that Dave and the Clique might actually have to form a government. Then just think what a disaster they'll be for after all opposition is a damn site easier than governing and if they can make such a cock up of opposition, God only knows how bad they'll be at governing.

If the Tory Party are lucky, they'll lose this election otherwise Dave really will do what I've often predicted he will, which is destroy the Conservative Party.

Rory Murray

The world has changed but politics hasn't...

Recently I've heard similar phrases in the context of Social Media and the Freedom of Information Act. We now live in a world where research can be conducted in seconds and information gathered, processed and shared globally at the speed of light.

In computing terms, the 80s were about data processing, the 90s brought us Information Technology, we're now into the era of Knowledge Management and the probable next innovation will be along the lines of Wisdom, where the next innovation won't just give us everything we need to make a decision, it may actually be able to make the decisions for us at some level of complexity yet to be discovered.

In this brave new world, politics has no option but to change because almost everything that happens does so with the potential for discovery and, therefore, there is no room for the kinds of subversive, covert, conspiratorial behaviours that have been the norm until very recently - e.g. the expenses fiasco, where some MPs actively tried to prevent the information becoming public knowledge!

So, in an era where the voting public have 24/7/365 scrutiny of what is going on, we need politicians who are ready, willing and able to work with us and be accountable to us - MPs who understand that it is our hard-earned, over-taxed money that pays their salaries, generous allowances, London accomodation, expenses, etc.

The days of MPs being unwilling to work with us, the voters, openly and in a true spirit of partnership have now gone, but I get the feeling that Labour and the Tories haven't quite understood this yet!

New Media and soundbites and blogs and websites and Youtube videos are, to them, just new ways for them to conduct the same old megaphone politics they always did, but without needing to drive around in a car with a rusting public address system precariously strapped to the roof.

They haven't yet worked out that it's a two-way dialogue that's been facilitated by Social Media and they need to be listening TO us, instead of shouting AT us!

http://hung-parliament.blogspot.com/2010/03/world-has-changed-but-politics-hasnt.html

Major Plonquer

Hahaha! The boy of Straw has now posted a note on his blog to the effect that he's closed the comments because: It seems that commenters are unable to follow our comments policy. We’ve suspended comments as a result.

Caught with your pants down and no toilet roll, Willie. There's nowhere to hide in the blogosphere and you, dear boy, are finished.

Pass the drugs.

TrevorsDen

Dear Mr Straw - Good of you to comment on someone else's blog - one which has not had the comments turned off (like yours).

You are a dissembling lying smearing lying socialist bastard and I shall enjoy immensely voting against the snivelling party you snivel before and lie on behalf of.

Tiberius

Your interpretation of events is a matter of opinion, TGF, and a wholesome one at that, but its flaw is that it ignores the fact that the Tory party was already destroyed as a potential force for government in the period before Cameron became leader.

One of his burdens as a result is the expectation put on him by those who don't want Labour to govern. Since they are not a uniform grouping, there is simply no way he can please all of them.

TrevorsDen

UKIP - as ever you dredge up total self serving garbage. Total codwallop to justify your total bonkers stance.
You are a grade A loony tune in a party of triple grade A loony tunes. Gathered together to deliver only one thing - another five years of Gordon Brown.

No political leader is perfect - Churchill Thatcher ... whoever.
We have a choice Brown or Cameron. I know where my vote is going - I would rather influence a government than an opposition. Sadly UKIP you live in the same perverse universe as Brown where the truth has to be twisted to suit your own warped paradigm.

TGF UKIP

"The Tory party was already destroyed as a potential force for government in the period bfore Cameron became leader." Oh dear, Tiberius it seems that Brown doesn't have a monopoly on disingenuity after all, for as you full well know any party that polls just 3% and less than 800,000 votes behind its principal opposition is very far indeed from being destroyed as an electoral force.

I would also make the point again that Howard achieved that result despite being relentlessly harried and sabotaged from the Left of his own party during the campaign itself to the delight of Labour and the Today Programme.

From our previous encounters, I know you always retreat to your default position of "nobody could have done any better" and for my part I will repeat that had Fox or DD been leader there would have been a consistent opposition to all Brown's reckless spending and borrowing together with a preparedness to make the argument for the alternative conservative case resulting in the Tory Party now being in the priceless electoral position of being able to say "we told you so."

The moment I will be waiting for in the debates is if and when Calamity Cameron has the temerity to try to lay into Brown for all his reckless spending only for Gordon to draw out a sheaf of quotes from Dave promising to not only match but surpass Labour spending.

Oh and by the way, old mate, if your second para really is the best you can now do to defend him, then it seems even you have finally thrown in the towel now.

TrevorsDen

Tiberius - UKIP's flaw is that the Conservative party took a look at the alternatives, saw Cameron and said they wanted him as its leader. Thats the Party - not some clique, not thin air, but the Party. The party want the policies that Cameron brings.

Labour descented into lies innuendo invective and a deceitful compact with the LDs to gain power. Nothing was too low for them. Look where that attitude has left us - labour continued with the deceit once in office, Browns budgets are a case in point as is the relentless rise in mass immigration.
Its a tough world the world of politics but I hope the Tories limit the invective as much as they can, be as open as they can in the forthcoming election. And lets hope that can continue into government.

UKIP as ever is in fantasy land. Fox as leader would be a disaster, and DD's judgement is horribly called into question by his resignation. The Tories have been attacking Labours spending - UKIP cannot face the truth as if he did his cause would be shot to ribbons.

paulg

This is a bit off message but cameron must play to strengths.

Scotland is being written off by the tories because in scotland english conservatism is a toxic brand. So as I keep on saying there are literally millions of scottish unionists, ergo, you drop the conservative element in scottish promotion and just call themselves unionists.

Unionists can define themselves as a distinct strand in a conservative government, advancing and protecting the interests of the scottish people.

This strategy will head of the SNP claim to being the only people talking up for scotland, ludicrous considering the scottish unionists will be forming the government of the U.K.

It would be a good piece for you to write Frasor and, you can claim the credit for thirty seats.

Tiberius

Sorry, TGF, but the reason the Tories did so "well" in 2005 was because of the Iraq war. Without that, we would have seen another 160 Labour majority. And as the polls show now, a Tory party without the Cameron reforms would lose again in 2010.

As for that second paragraph, well the truth often hurts. I've also made my mind up about who should succeed Cameron, btw, but a lot of water (very blue in colour) has to pass under the bridge before we get to that stage.

TrevorsDen: I completely agree about Liam Fox and DD (and indeed John Redwood). Please make sure you join me and TGF UKIP on election night on here. It's going to be one hell of a party. Hopefully all the regulars will turn up, and, yes, I hope Verity clears her diary for the day too.