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Monday, 22nd March 2010

Entente nouvelle?

David Blackburn 3:17pm

Could Britain and France share defence assets? Julian Glover’s column in the Guardian concludes:

‘As for the new carriers, they are, unlike much defence equipment, adaptable and manoeuvrable. They could sail to the rescue in Haiti or feed the hungry in Mogadishu as easily as obliterate Tehran. We should build and deploy the first, and persuade the French (whose own grandiose carrier doesn't work) to complete and equip the second: a shared fleet for two European nations that have yet to reconcile themselves to their more modest place in the world.’

Politicians on both sides of the Channel speak eagerly of deeper entente. But there is not always a way where there’s a will. A shared outlook is insufficient; France and Britain would have to share assets. Aircraft carriers, jets, helicopters, tanks will have to be joint owned, joint managed and joint run. Inevitably, that will raise a sovereignty issue. If that wasn’t hard enough, France remains wedded to the European Union and its defence institutions, such as the European Defence Agency. British governments of any hue are deeply opposed to pan-European defence initiatives, and rightly so if NATO's performance in Afghanistan is anything to go by. The poltical obstacles to entente nouvelle may prove insurmountable.

Filed under: Britain (679 more articles) , Defence (343 more articles) , Europe (699 more articles) , Foreign Policy (311 more articles) , France (218 more articles) , International politics (717 more articles) , NATO (121 more articles) , Nicolas Sarkozy (96 more articles) , Public finances (704 more articles) , UK politics (4910 more articles)

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Frank P

March 22nd, 2010 3:31pm Report this comment

Caption for Picture:

"If I hold my chin up like this, I'll look even taller than the little turd."

TomTom

March 22nd, 2010 3:33pm Report this comment

Britain and France have a modest role to play with Britain as junior partner. First in SST aircraft such as Concorde which Britain wanted to cancel and France refused, so the TSR-2 was cancelled instead.

France cannt afford aircraft carriers so needs Britain tied in to make it feasible to sustain French shipyards. They have just built a guided-missile frigate for the Russians and the rest of the order will be built in Russian yards under French licence, so desperate is France not to lose DCN as a shipyard.

Britain should roll over and ask France what it can do for La Grande Republique - after fightin two world wars for France, engaging in the disastrous Suez affair for France, building Concorde for France and joining the EU to fund French agriculture and imperial ambitions in Europe; it seems only fair to ask France what else Britain can sacrifice for the greater glory of the French Republic

TrevorsDen

March 22nd, 2010 3:37pm Report this comment

'may' prove insurmountable?

When will the Spectator stop sending little boys to do men's work?

Bruce, UK

March 22nd, 2010 3:40pm Report this comment

Good lunch, David?

Noa Zrk

March 22nd, 2010 3:41pm Report this comment

Timeshare carriers with the French eh?

If its Tuesday we fly the Rafales, not the Harriers...Bomb Teheran? Vous must be joking! What, and scuttle a French arms trade deal with Iran?

Why not just moor them off Calais and turn them into asylum seeker accommodation.

Zoo keeper (Elephant house)

March 22nd, 2010 3:46pm Report this comment

April 1st is not for another few days.

Roller

March 22nd, 2010 3:53pm Report this comment

God no

This is the last thing we should do - As an above poster pretty much stated we will just end up rescuing France every time it gets itself into a little pickle.

On a serious note - Britain remains, somehow, in posession of one of the most mobile and powerful armed forces in the world. To commit itself to another state's armed forces, whether it be France or the United States, would sacrifice our ability to act on our own accord. A potential sticking point would be our deterrent in the Falklands...

We have plenty of other ways of co-operating internationally, for example, NATO and the UN.

brooks

March 22nd, 2010 3:59pm Report this comment

I am speachless; what a load of ... no, I really am speachless.

Frank P

March 22nd, 2010 4:00pm Report this comment

I assume that under the new arrangements Sandhurst will run a course on how to surrender on hearing the first shot fired by the enemy? And the Women's Institute will be given guidance about offering themselves for the delectation of the invading armies?

Tiberius

March 22nd, 2010 4:22pm Report this comment

I can only surmise that the "non" will carry even more disdain than usual now that Carla's charms are off limits.

Stevie

March 22nd, 2010 4:29pm Report this comment

Perhaps now we can build our own equipment too instead of awarding defense contracts to the Septics to the detriment of British workers?

Boudicca

March 22nd, 2010 4:36pm Report this comment

The Entente Cordiale ended with the 1st World War. The French then built a wall to keep the Germans out - never thinking the nasty Hun would walk round it - so we came to their rescue again.

Why would anyone think a new Entente with the French is a good idea. Haven't they done enough damage to the UK in the last century? What was it the Yanks called them ... cheese-eating surrender Monkeys.

El Sid

March 22nd, 2010 5:11pm Report this comment

Err - TomTom, the French haven't sold any frigates to Russia. However they have sold up to 4 Mistral class helicopter carriers, equivalent to HMS Ocean.

There is a fair bit of logic in combining the carrier fleets, one reason for US military superiority is just the sheer economies of scale they get from buying ships by the dozen where the UK or France might only buy 1 or 2. Carriers are too visible for national willy-waving though, I suspect this is more about combining the nuclear deterrent fleets. There's a big difference between operating Rafales and F-35B's, but it doesn't really matter if Beijing is obliterated by a Trident or an M51.

We'll see - it's a good test of how serious the next government is about facing up to the disaster that is the public accounts.

Ctesibius

March 22nd, 2010 5:11pm Report this comment

Well at least let's build the carreir(s) with catapults and wires so that French aircraft can land and take off from them. Nuclear power plants would be a great idea too.

Dave B

March 22nd, 2010 5:11pm Report this comment

This is a terrible idea.

If we have to ally that closely with another nation, surely we should choose a more reliable partner.

I seem to recall another article suggesting a similar arrangement with Australia.

Naomi Muse

March 22nd, 2010 5:31pm Report this comment

Love the photo!

It could all be a way of getting round Angela Merkel's daily initiatives to add to the Lisbon Treaty, if Dave and Sarko thought as partners for a short while. It will all end in tears though.

Austin Barry

March 22nd, 2010 5:50pm Report this comment

Share assets with the French? A nation with an army so inept it has to leave its fighting to a Foreign Legion. Perhaps we can assign them non-scary semaphore duties -just as long as we keep them away from the white flags.

Richard

March 22nd, 2010 6:15pm Report this comment

This is a non starter!
The French would never allow it...they hate the tories more than Gordon Brown does.....absurd to even think it could happen.
Anyway once the French have taken over the city of London we won't need to fight another war because no-one will be interested in us....
Tory wastelands with wall to wall little Englanders manning the ports with their handle bar moustaches, tweed jackets and black Labs at their sides. "Chocks away lads chin chin!"

Chuck Unsworth

March 22nd, 2010 6:37pm Report this comment

Never, ever, trust the French.

TGF UKIP

March 22nd, 2010 6:40pm Report this comment

Like the legendary French tank, any carrier they build is bound to be able to go faster backwards than forwards.

Don't think Dave's EU and French integration plans stop at defence though. Oh non, non, non! I quote from the new Tory energy policy document "facilitate greater interconnection between the UK grid and neighbouring networks; recognize the importance of European and global co-operation in achieving shared objectives."

Remember folks, you can't trust Calamity Cameron on Europe, or on anything else.

Herbert Thornton

March 22nd, 2010 10:57pm Report this comment

I should have thought it better to renew La Belle Alliance of some 200 years ago - of which this is an inspiring reminder -

http://www.1st-art-gallery.com/thumbnail/104316/1/The-Meeting-Of-The-Duke-Of-Wellington-And-Field-Marshal-Blucher-On-The-Evening-Of-The-Victory-Of-Waterloo-At-La-Belle-Alliance.jpg

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