Democracy in the BBC

Commentator

Left-leaning upper middle class patricians hate democracy. The last thing they want is ordinary people questioning their perks and privileges or worse, seeking membership of their closed elite. The problem is not confined to the BBC. Look at the top of the Conservative Party.

DtP

We could do the same thing with government in general.

Swiss Bob

"I am not saying get rid of the licence fee. In fact I am not ashamed to admit that I like much of what the BBC produces, and even think her innate left-wing bias"

Why should people be forced to pay on the pain of imprisonment for Pravda like propaganda? And the fact that you like that! FFS.

I never watch the BBC news and much of their current affairs, they're not only pathetically left wing, they're juvenile rubbish and that is reason enough to scrap the licence fee.

TomTom

The BBC was a private company until the Crawford Committee in 1926 proposed nationalisation. The licence fee was not criminally enforceable until 1949.

Whoever heard of a Mutual Organisation with Compulsory Membership on pain of imprisonment ?

ollie

Left-leaning upper middle class patricians hate democracy. The last thing they want is ordinary people questioning their perks and privileges or worse, seeking membership of their closed elite. The problem is not confined to the BBC. Look at the top of the Labour Party.

Simon

"In fact I am not ashamed to admit that I like much of what the BBC produces, and even think her innate left-wing bias is healthy for Conservatives, as it means that ‘the right’ have to be that much better and sharper when presenting their case on BBC programmes"

Hilarious

No wonder the Conservative Party is in so much trouble with comments like this

Logz

"I am not saying get rid of the licence fee."

Why not?

Can someone please explain to me why I have to pay the BBC, for owing a television set.

oldtimer

Democracy in the BBC should begin with the taxpayer deciding whether or not he wishes to subcribe or not.

Miliband has got the cart before the long suffering horse who is required, on pain of criminal conviction, to pay the licence fee whether he likes it or not. That is the first reform to be enacted.

The second reform should be a management/employee buyout - I am sure that they could raise the funds required with no trouble at all. It just requires a little imagination and gumption from the politicians and the panjandrums running the BBC. Chances are, however, that they will run scared.

strapworld

"I am not saying get rid of the licence fee"

I am!

Why should government decide what we watch and listen to? Why should we have a public service broadcaster anyway? Government could make billions by just selling off the BBC channels and those buying can decide how they wish to proceed, but not by taxation.

The BBC was created at a time when the Lord Chancellor decided what we could watch, listen to and see. Those days have gone thankfully.

The BBC does do some really good programmes but they waste an awful amount of money both by paying extraordinary large salaries for ordinary people with extraordinary large ego's, and by producing programmes which apparantly neccessitate involving umpteen presenters and backroom staff.
(I can remember when the Light Programme played music and did not have the constant chatter! - now most programmes have to have a number of people in the studio having fun amongst themselves, reducing us, the listeners, to an almost voyeur status! The great Terry Wogan was guilty of this as is his successor. But the sports programmes be it golf, football or athletics have to be seen to be believed.

Yet the sports coverage of the recent European Games by Eurosport was far more comprehensive and far far better with just a handful of presenters!

I do not mind stating that I pay for Sky and I love it. Sky Arts programmes are brilliant and their coverage of the opera's from the Metropolitan Opera House was superb. They give live plays and performances and provide far more than the BBC do. Classical Radio is far better than Radio 3 and its outer mongolian tap dancing programmes these days!!

There is no need for a licence fee (tax) Government should let the BBC be sold off and save us all a lot of money. Then perhaps there will be competition to Sky which will give us the customers better programmes.

David Booth

Democracy at the BBC? whatever next MP's being frugal on their expense claims!
.....and pigs will be seen flying over The Palace of Westminster and Broadcasting House instead of having their snouts in the trough.

strapworld

Sorry to retrun but I just realised the author was a Member of Parliament. Can he explain why a vote will help me in the running of the BBC?

I had a vote in the Nationwide Building Society's AGM but that did not stop the huge salaries being paid to the Chief Executive and others!

Lastly, am I the only one to be so bloody annoyed by the way all BBC programmes be it the Countryside programme or whatever all produced by Blue Peter type presenters, having to explain everything as if we are all idiots?

Matthew Blott

As my newly elected MP I was interested to see how you'd get on and the fact the first thing I've heard you utter is this post fills me with gloom. I agree with Daniel Finklestein, it's a really stupid idea. The net result would be a neutured organisation and this may well be your aim. If so, stop the disingenuous nonsense about supporting the licence fee and join the Murdoch campaing for the BBC's abolition.

EC

strapworld,

No, you are not alone. The presenters are mostly idiots, albeit highly paid ones.

Democracy? I'd like to see all the so called BBC comedy programmes to be Pay per View. Then we might see just have funny some of the self styled comedians are. Marcus Brigstocke? Jo Brand? Russell Howard? Mark Steele? Dara O' Brie-man? Don't make me laugh! Er NO, they don't actually.

Roger Davies

It appears and opportune moment to break up this State Broadcasting Organisation and sell off the component parts to the highest bidders, using the revenues to pay down Brown' Burden.
I would be happy to pay around a£7.00 PM subscription for R3 & R4 plus BBC1.

Andrea Gill

Having just voted on our local co-operative regional board (via STV <<--- HINT ;-) ) I really like the idea, as you well know :)

John Thomas

"‘the right’ have to be that much better and sharper when presenting their case on BBC programmes." - Oh really? Do 'the right' have a chance, a fair chance, to put their case, or even appear? Peter Hitchens often says he's blackballed out of the MSM, and others seem to have the same experience. Yes, regarding the BBC, "No taxation [licences] without representation"!

Verity

Robert Halfon: "I am not saying get rid of the licence fee."

Why not?

The public is being forced, by law, to support a communist-lefty-gramsci setup intent on disassembling the mental and moral infrastructure of our country.

It is heinous. Even the very idea of forcing people, by law, to pay a "license fee" to own a TV is evil.

Always, the market forces should prevail. Nothing should be hammered in by some "authority". Let mentally fragile people subscribe to the BBC if it comforts them to do so. But it shouldn't be compulsory.

I doubt that the BBC would find enough voluntary subscribers to keep more than a small presence. Certainly, if people were free to not subscribe, the BBC empire would be greatly diminished ... perhaps by as much as 80%.

I cannot imagine any private broadcast enterprise, battling it out in the marketplace, paying 20th-raters like Jo Brand, Jonathan ross and the rest of them more than minimum wage. In fact, I cannot imagine these people finding employment in the private sector.

Verity

The headline to this post: Democracy in the BBC.

Is this what they call 'irony'?

Marcher Baron

Why are you not advocating an end to the licence fee? Owing to its left-wing bias I seldom watch the BBC, but if I own a TV I have to pay for the privilege. I'd rather see the BBC accept paid advertising (they spend enough time advertising their own programmes).

edgeplate

But, my central point has always been this: why is it that those who go to such lengths to defend the licence fee, are so opposed to some form of democracy?

------------

Because given a choice between being paid a lot of money to indulge themselves and do as they please without reference to anyone much else, and having to deliver things which are in demand but which are not to their taste, they'd far rather take the first option.

The better way is for broadcasters to make programmes and stand or fall by whether anyone wants to pay for them.

I don't see how Miliband's co-operative idea would work, unless the point is to carry out apparent reform leaving the BBC in the hands of a clique he considers would be sympathetic.

The BBC came about in a very different world and it's time to have a long hard look at whether it should be there at all and if it should, whether a couple of TV channels and a few national radio channels, with an appropriately reduced telly tax would be the way to go.

Bob

Signal encryption is possible in the digital age so why not do so with the entire BBC output. If you don't buy a licence you can't watch, simple as that.No need for a costly bureaucratic system of government reviews, collection and evasion chasing departments and dragging people through the courts. If the BBC wants to raise money it will need to attract viewers. If viewers want quality programmmes they will subscribe.

alexsandr

Mebbe the beeb could start charging Facebook and Twitter for all the product placement they do for these US companies. Save a bit of the cost anyway.

AndyLeeds

The BBC hates conservatism and has certainly set itself up as part of the 'opposition'. In that case why should I, and millions of others, be compelled to fund this nest of fascists ? Lets abolish the licence fee and let the BBC sink or swim.

HFC

The Grauniad recently conducted a poll on this question: Is it time for the BBC to become a subscription service?

The result was:

43.9% Yes, TV viewers shouldn't have to pay for channels they don't want

56.1% No, the TV licence may seem anachronistic but it works

Well, if the left want to keep it that confirms to me that they think of the BBC as theirs and not to be tampered with.

Scrap the licence and go pay per view, I say!

yank

Here, in plain sight, we have a "conservative" apparatchik of the government class advocating for unlimited government.

Take full note.

No need to split the baby, as Mr. Halfon seems to prefer. Keep it whole, and return it whole to its minders.

The minders will avail themselves of the thousands of available broadcast television, internet video and audio outlets... or not... as they prefer. They will not suffer, and will likely be enriched, financially and otherwise.

And if you'd like to save yourselves a few pounds, you can start by eliminating the subsidies for this "BBC America" business that bleeds red politically here, and undoubtedly bleeds red financially there.

Yes... yes... I know we the unwashed mob here are in desperate need of the BBC's tender ministrations, but as their ratings don't show up with other than electron microscopy, I'd say the unwashed will likely stay that way, so you might as well save yourselves some cash.

Noa Zrk

"What better way than giving licence fee payers a vote?"

Why, by giving them the option to pay for services wanted and received, or not.

Srap the licence fee, in entirety, now.

strapworld

Mr Halfon, May I make a suggestion. Why not propose a referendum of we the people on the future of the BBC.

Do you agree to continue to pay the licence fee?

Do you believe the licence fee should be abolished?

Do you believe the BBC should be sold to the private sector?

Something along those lines. The time has come to ask the people. Not by one of Blair's/Brown's 'debates' which never take place or 'consultations' or 'Let us know by email' type of asking the public exercise which politicians delight in. Let us have some real open democracy. Ask the people what THEY want. They that pay the piper SHOULD call the tune.

JohnBUK

What planet are you on? If you want democratic output then make it pay-per-view and you'll see exactly what people want (and more to the point, prepared to pay for).

edgeplate

With all this talk of democratising, what about the voices of people who don't want to watch what the BBC churns out? Are they still to be forced to pay? What if the democratic voice is that it should be broken up and sold off or don't these ideas for democracy go that far?

As for the co-operative idea, co-operatives are a group getting together for mutual benefit. Why should those not interested in the aims of the co-operative be forced to pay?

It keeps coming back to the licence fee and why those not interested in the BBC's output should be forced to cough up. If they are, democratisation and faux co-ops are just a gloss on what we have now.

Baron

Verity and most of the others are dead right:

Scrap the licence fee, now.

Cassandrina

The Bolshevik Broadcasting Corporation (previously Blair's and then Brown's BC) needs to be restructured. On the TV side pay as you go in a structured manner needs introduction.
Radio needs to have BBC 1 go as it is commercial and really dumb. Radio 2 upgraded, Radio 3 encouraged, and Radio 4 purged of the fellow traveller loony left editors and presenters, and real unbiased and balanced content introduced. This to be stringently enforced with power to the licensed listeners within a fully open and transparant complaints system.

Roy Smith

What an insult the BBC is to ordinary thinking people. Many I'm sure don't even know how browbeaten they have been through their life time. Even if the BBC is abolished tomorrow it will take another lifetime for the new generation to gather what a phenomenal delusion users have been led to believe. What a mess they have inherited with no action from this grand Cinderella of British integrity. How the truth has been manipulated, how they have been indoctrinated with this left wing twisted ideology, with it's way of news presentation for maximum effect to mislead for so long. Political decisions that have gone unquestioned to the utter detriment of the country. The way it sees its purpose to stay on side with the political policy makers. Sickening.
Most in these comments know only too well the truth of the matter and have expressed it well.

Paul C

When I first got a TV licence it was for 2 TV channels and 4 national radio channels. But over time the mission creeped and we got:

- a collection of banal useless local radio stations
- 2 extra TV channels that I never watch
- about 3 extra national radio channels - I lost count

I never got asked if I wanted all this extra crap, and the answer would have been NO. None of it is necessary. It should be detached and allowed either to sink or move to the private sector (if anyone is willing to pay for it, which I doubt).

I like the documentaries and quality drama, but a lot of that is provided by separate companies affiliated in some way. Why not farm it all out? Let people pay for what they want.

If you go to a bookshop, you don't get forced to pay for a load of rubbish you don't want, you pay for the book you like. Same with music, movies, and loaves of bread.

As for access to BBC programmes via iPlayer, I paid for the programmes, why can't I watch them when I want, instead of being given a time limit? I want the whole back catalogue online. I and the rest of the public OWN it.

Sam ARMSTRONG

Paul C, absolutely correct... we do in fact OWN those piles and piles of videotapes containing programmes that were produced using money earned honestly by the British public.

The licence fee should be scaled back to allow ONE television channel only. The 24 news service must be cancelled immediately. All BBC local radio stations must close immediately. BBC national radio must be scaled back to ONE radio station. Close BBC America.

As Paul C says, the whole back catalogue of programmes will be available online.

And, finally, a lengthy investigation will be launched on the BBC to try and find instances of treason and sedition with those involved being tried at length and punished severely to set an example to other broadcasters.

Nick

Sam Armstrong, are you Rupert Murdoch by any chance?

I congratulate you on the strength of your views though. Never have I chuckled so much on a Saturday afternoon. Well done that man! (and keep taking the pills)

Eddie

The BBC is run by a smug and unaccountable politically correct elite who think the purpose of the BBC is to promote their own careers and a particular version of PC multiculti diversity/equality that benefits them and allows them (in their opinion) to claim the moral high ground. I do not want to watch or listen to PC propaganda - made with my money! It didn't use to be like this, and it needn;t be like this now.

If the BBC is going to justify the licence fee, then it MUST get rid of these management layers and its entire PC agenda, and instead stick closely to its Reithian purpose.

The BBC should, for example, be making risky drama that no-one else will, for example, and not just churning out remakes of old shows and soapy, girly, lazy ratings winners which are essentially utter trash (mistresses, anyone?). And it should scrap a lot of reality shows that are just there to get ratings - and bring back the programmes people should be seeing on a TV channel they pay for (league football for a start). One feels that BBC TV exists to provide a channel of dumbed down easy viewing for a female audience, and nothing much else.

If the BBC cannot do this then it should be forced to: taken over by an independent body who will enforce independence and cut the cancer of PC from its bones. If it still is doing nothing different from commercial channels, then the licence fee should be scrapped.

Ron Todd

alexsandr

They should also be getting commision from Apple.

Minnie Ovens

like much of what the BBC produces, and even think her innate left-wing bias is healthy for Conservatives, as it means that ‘the right’ have to be that much better and sharper

In other words, keep the playing field as slanted as possible.
Another blow for democracy.

Dexys

If these cuts are anything like as bad as they are being touted then the Licence Fee simply cannot survive for another 5 years.
The BBC stopped being British a long time - it belongs to the global elite - the sort of people you see in funky rectangular glasses drifting between meeting rooms in Strasbourg and heading out of the car park at 4.30pm in their Mercs. I fail to see why ordinary decent British people should fund their tofu eating ways.

As Dexys Midnight Runners said - For God's sake Burn it Down!

alexsandr

We should also look at the BBC's involvement in Freeview and UKTV
The BBC is a shareholder in Freview. But many of the channels we are forced to receive are, bluntly, crap. Does anyone really watch 'price drop tv'? The available bandwidth on freeview should be for decent channels, and the remit of the operation should be quality of programmes, not a auction for the slots.
And UKTV, a joint venture between BBC and Virgin. This mainly shows reruns of old BBC shows. DAVE and Yesterday are on Freeview but the other channels are subscription. Excuse me, we have paid for these shows, we should be able to watch them free to view. OK, some royalties will need to be paid, but the substantial advertising on UKTV should cover that. It must do for the stuff shown on Dave/Yesterday.
Channel 4 manages repeating old shows (Like back to back time team and scrapheap challenge on weekend mornings) on More 4, the BBC should look to that business model.

Wibble Wobble

So can I surmise?

1. The government control what we watch through the BBC.
2. The BBC are inherently left wing.

Except the Tories have been in control of Government for over 50 years since the early 1920's, with arguably right-of-centre coalitions and national government for a another chunk of that. Left wing governments have been in a significant minority.

All I can conclude is that

1. Either governments are all left wing, even Thatcher.
2. They're not very good at 'interfering' with the BBC.
3. They actually don't interfere with the BBC.
4. Or perhaps anoither explanation: maybe most people aren't particularly right-wing, which is reflected in the BBC's output (and demand) and that upsets some of you?

So, what's it to be chaps? You can't have it both ways.