Cameron's close shave

TrevorsDen

Confirming that the taliban were right just confirms to them their rightness.

Of course confirming they were right when they were wrong is also a clever move

Walsingham's Ghost

Clearly Karzi's governmnet leaks like a sieve. As such, one must now question the benefit and wisdom of such high-profile visits by our senior politicians if they run the very real risk of being blown out of the sky for their trouble.

WG

Richard of York

Oh well....there's always next time.

Walsingham's Ghost

@ Dick of Pork

As everybody said when the taliban missed the opportunity to take-out McBroon on his final visit to Kabul.

Then again, they probably felt he could do more damage to the UK if they let him stay in office...

WG

strapworld

Richard of York. Normally I do try to understand what nonsense you write. Today's effort is not just sick it is quite disgraceful.

I hated Brown and his cabinet colleagues for not giving our troops the proper equipment. At no time did I wish what you have wished Cameron.

WEasy sitting in a warm room placing such tripeon the web. Just rememmber that young servicemen and women would have been in mortal danger at that time. Young people who make the likes appear just what you are gutter snipes indulging in gutter politics.

May I wish you everything you have wished for David Cameron!

TrevorsDen

PS
re timetables.

You clearly think we should be bleeding in Afghanistan for ever.
We are there to create an Afghan Army. The Afghans have to look after themselves and they need a strong incentive to do so. Even when 'gone' we will be providing air power and training and probably special forces. As long as the US and to a lesser extent ourselves do this we can keep the Taliban at bay

Our war aims are now clearly defined - stop willing the lives of our soldiers away on a dreamland diplomatic escapade. I confess i think its right we are there and thought the war would take a different course to what it has. But this war has taken a quite unexpected turn; given that we are not putting sufficient resources into the affair to create an outright victory then in those circumstances its criminal to keep our soldiers there indefinitely.

London Calling

The Taliban are the unseen enemy, they have spies everywhere and rely on gorilla warfare, therefore it comes as no surprise that David Cameron’s visit to Afghanistan was picked up on the Talibans radar…luckily an attack was averted, but the risks still remain. Personally whilst I think its honourable for David to visit troops and further diplomatic ties, if his presence puts his own and others lives at an unnecessary high risk any further visits to Afghanistan should be heavily scrutinised before becoming a security nightmare.

As far as setting a timetable for departure, The Taliban will still remain and would have become more sophisticated by our presence rather than our departure and the Afghanistan Government will be too distracted by its own corrupt power vacuum to form any kind of structural democracy, although for many I know this is the desired outcome. In my view the invasion of Afghanistan to dismantle Al Qaeda should have been mainly focused on Intelligence and infiltration rather than mass troops on the ground, I say this with a heavy heart due to the loss of life so far, as we cannot proclaim success in preventing global terrorism by brute force when networks are increasingly mobile and global From the Talibans point of view they know the faces of their enemies and in that knowledge our exposure has contributed to their success and our failure to complete an impossible mission on the ground.

Richard of York

@Strop wold
Oh Dear ... can I refer you to Walsinghams post?
I have only ever hated two people in my life to the extend I would not mind if they stopped breathing Thatcher and Cameron are each one of both components.
Do not be so touchy babe its a view shared by many. Ask yourself why the people with the means always go for Tory leaders?
The IRA were a bit smarter than the Taliban I suspect but then the Taliban have better weapons and support.
Iran will have to put off the street parties for a bit longer.

General Zod

Karzai is clearly not to be trusted.

Why don't you hate Osbourne to the same extent, RoY?

What a moronic post.

I'm a little surprised not to ahve seen something equally idiotic from Verity.

yank

We interrupt this little Brit-spat to bring you an American dispatch from Afghanistan:

The 72-Hour Expert: Everything you always wanted to know about Afghanistan .  .  .

While a scholarly erudition is the Brits' gift to the world, candid observation joined to smart-ass commentary is ours, and P.J. O'Rourke is one of its better practioners. Albeit a long read, you might find it worthwhile. A sample:

Then, around the corner from the blast walls, there’s a third Kabul, an ordinary city with stores and restaurants open to the street and parking impossible to find. The architecture is overseas modern in cement and chrome with some leftover Soviet modern in just cement. It’s a bit worn and torn looking but less so than Detroit or Anacostia.

Security here is merely ubiquitous as opposed to omnipresent. Men, women, and children mingle. Women cover themselves in public but not more than my grandmother did at Mass. An occasional down-to-the-ground burka is seen but not as often as in London. In the malls, clothing shops predominate. Men’s and women’s clothes are shinier and more vividly colored than those seen in a traditional society such as New Hampshire.

Traditionalism being one of the things that makes Afghanistan so hard for Americans to understand. We Americans have so many traditions. For instance our political traditions date back to the 12th-century English Parliament if not to the Roman Senate. Afghans, on the other hand, have had the representative democracy kind of politics for only six years. Afghanistan’s political traditions are just beginning to develop. A Pashtun tribal leader told me that a “problem among Afghan politicians is that they do not tell the truth.” It’s a political system so new that that needed to be said out loud.

The Pashtun tribal leader was one of a number of people that Amin arranged for me to interview. Tribalism is another thing that makes Afghanistan hard to understand. We Americans are probably too tribal to grasp the subtlety of Afghan tribal concepts.

The Pashtun tribal leader was joined by a Turkmen tribal leader who has a Ph.D. in sociology. I asked the Turkmen tribal leader about the socioeconomic, class, and status aspects of Afghan tribalism.

“No tribe is resented for wealth,” he said. So, right off the bat, Afghans show greater tribal sophistication than Americans. There is no Wall Street Tribe upon which the Afghan government can blame everything.

Even the worst of Afghan governments never acquired the special knack of pitting tribe against tribe that is vital to American politics—the Squishy Liberal Tribe vs. the Kick-Butt Tribe; the Indignantly Entitled Tribe vs. the Fed-Up Taxpayer Tribe; the Smug Tribe vs. the Wipe-That-Smirk-Off-Your-Face Tribe.

“We are all one nation,” said the Pashtun tribal leader. “In the name of Afghan is included all the tribes of Afghanistan. Outsiders create divisions to serve their own interests.” Better than having insiders create divisions to serve their own interests, President Obama take note."

Edward Sutherland

Crikey, let's keep a sense of proportion. I'm mightily relieved nothing happened to DC on his trip to Afghanistan. But just remember what 65 year old Churchill endured in WW2: dashes to the States and Canada and back in warships through U boat-infested waters,lengthy flights in unheated and unpressurised bombers to the Middle East and Russia through airspace in which the Luftwaffe was operational. While the best protection possible should be provided, regrettably being in harm's way goes with the territory when you're a leader.

strapworld

Two wrongs to not make a right. As for asking myself a question, may I suggest you just sit down in a dark room and contemplate on that very question! Indeed WHY?

You are a small, grubby individual who indulges in bile. I do hope you choke on it soon! You I will not miss.

Richard of York

@Strop wold
Oh dear more bile... save it for someone who gives a sh*t.

Ian Walker

We have a bunch of nukes we don't need. We have an enemy that is hard to find. In my darker thoughts it's tricky to avoid the conclusion that one plus one equals make the whole place glow in the dark.

Probably best if I don't run for parliament.

Pedantic Virgo

"The Taliban are the unseen enemy, they have spies everywhere and rely on gorilla warfare" That's really sneaky, LC. Does the RSPCA know the Taliban are using gorillas?

Osred

RoY the monochrome Keith Boadwee of the Speccy boards.

oswyn

lets get this straight we control afghanistan airspace not the taliban. of course the generals get jumpy when a high profile individual visits, careers could be lost if something goes wrong but political considerations must overrule this.

Richard of York

@Osred
Wow what insight and wit.
However as boring as Stroppy is two faced.
first she complains two wrongs don't make a right then in the next breath wishes my demise from choking......only a Tory would not see the hypocracy.

Osred

RoY. It takes neither wit nor insight to see you for what you are. Incidentally - I am no Tory although as we speak I'm about 1000 ft up in the hills with a Ledaig in my hand listening to grouse being blasted out of the sky.

Richard of York

@Osred
Well enjoy the whiskey and the toffs version of space invaders.
I will get on with sun-bathing in the garden over-looking the Marina in Tampa Bay.

Incoming

Only listening to Grouse being shot at (and mostly missed)? Poor you.

Osred

RE: Incoming. I restrict my shooting to the recreational destruction of rats. They, like the grouse, are having a good year, and there seems to be a good number of big 'uns this year. Mind you, no matter how big the fckrs are a Jack Russell makes short work of them - but I digress. talking of Cameron and close shaves its difficult to trust a man who always seems immaculately shaved and groomed - that and lying about Europe of course.