More trouble for the government over the military covenant
David Blackburn 4:22pm
The news that serving soldiers have been given notice by email has been met fury from ministers. Liam
Fox has answered questions in the House about this story and why 100 RAF pilots discovered they were redundant in
yesterday’s newspapers. Fox was both livid and contrite, decrying the ‘completely unacceptable’ practices and reiterating the MoD’s ‘unreserved apologies’. He
announced that an internal inquiry has been called, which Patrick Mercer believes will expose negligence among those officers who manage personnel. Fox also conceded that the sacked pilots, many of
whom were ‘hours from obtaining qualification’, cannot be retained in some form of volunteer
reserve, such is the squeeze on the MoD. This enabled Fox to attack the reckless conceit of ‘no boom and bust’, and, less vocally, the timeless incompetence of MoD procurement.
It was an adept performance. But the government is fast developing a reputation for neglecting the military covenant, something the Tories championed in opposition. Last week, there were reports about the poor quality of care for veterans and newspapers ran profiles (£) of hard-pressed army wives, revealing that many of our servicemen’s families still live in poverty. Meanwhile, colossal administrative waste continues and Mi6 has an artist in residence*, a rather good one as it happens.
These contradictions are unhealthy – although Labour’s attempts to capitalise are attended by a particularly sharp irony, considering the party’s recent record on this issue. The last government strained under criticism of its relationship with the services; so is this one.
*Though I should point out that he was not paid; but, I think it's a question of priorities and presentation.
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Rabyrover
February 15th, 2011 4:54pm Report this commentThere is no point in training more pilots for planes we do not have. Millions of people in all walks of life find that their skills are no longer required or even relevant. Pilots, like everyone else will have to transfer their undoubted skills into new areas. They have the advantage of being skilled in an area with civilian job prospects, and at an age when retraining is feasible.
El Sid
February 15th, 2011 5:19pm Report this commentCheap shot, but note :
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/14/james-hart-davis-mi6-artist
The artist "Hart Dyke...was given access to M16, but not paid by the service."
strapworld
February 15th, 2011 5:31pm Report this commentThe army has absolutely no consideration for anyone within it. They talk about a 'family' utter nonsense.
My son, who is due to go to Afghanistan next month, has seen his son for twenty four hours in the past five weeks. He was 'allowed' to go home on Sunday last, to return Monday evening (a journey of some three and a half hours each way) so he can do a ten mile run, with full kit, today. Then he will have two weeks off starting Thursday. You can bet your life that the caring senior officers in charge will allow the men to leave camp at 5pm and not before. One lad has a wife and family in Edinburgh. No consideration for the wives and familes whatsoever.
I could go on about the incompetence of the civil staff, the hopelessness of the medical care and other things. I just pray that in Afghanistan the senior officers pull their socks up and ensure they lead properly.
The way these long serving soldiers have been dealt with is absolutely disgraceful. The way those young intelligent men and women training to be pilots have had their ambitions ruined is equally disgraceful.
I like Fox, BUT he should have resigned today. Yes they, like the Labour Government of blessed history, blame officials, armed service personnel but NEVER themselves.
What a Fred Karno's! This is not a government this is a shambles. Military Covenant safe with the Tories? Absolutely not.
It is time the Armed Services had a representative body. How can anyone have faith in their senior officers?
David Lindsay
February 15th, 2011 5:34pm Report this commentLook up Luke Coffey. There is a longstanding neoconservative scheme to abolish the RAF within a single EU defence "capability" under overall American command and run by the Germans, although that role might now have passed to the French in these days of Sarkozy.
The Military Covenant must include not sending them to fight pointless, unwinnable and in at least one case illegal wars. And it must, since they are British too, preclude huge transfers of money from public services, private pockets or both into the fighting of the Crazies' endless wars. But I doubt that the military top brass, never mind the rank and file, wants any such transfer, because I doubt that any of them wants any such war. Knowing what war is like, they are extremely averse to it if at all avoidable, like Jim Webb or Jacques Chirac; old brothers in arms of John McCain were aghast at his views on the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, on bombing Iran, on torture, and on veterans' issues.
I for one would love them to say so, and for our Forces to bring themselves home in such a way that Cameron, Clegg, Fox and the rest would only find out when they switched on their televisions and saw the triumphant marching through the cheering, flag-waving crowds. Without a shot's needing to be fired, our rotten and decadent, blood-thirsty but battle-cowardly Political Class would be brought crashing to the ground. Now that really would be the defence of this Realm, the honouring the Military Covenant from the Forces' side.
TrevorsDen
February 15th, 2011 5:39pm Report this comment'Poor quality of care for veterans'? Today the papers are full of poor quality of care in NHS for the elderly.
I hope this does not come as too much of a shock for labourites but all this happened under Labour.
I do not see this as bad for the govt - it is appalling from the Services and MoD and is perhaps a little chink into viewing the totally incompetent way the services and the MoD run themselves.
I see this as a great opportunity to sack the top level of MoD bureaucracy.
How on earth can you say the govt is neglecting the 'military covenant'? The govt inherited an absolute mess at the MoD.
Great sacrifices are being made (eg not training pilots for planes we do not have; cutting Harriers in favour of Tornado) precisely to spend money to support troops actually doing the fighting.
Please - cut out you absurd rubbish.
Scotty
February 15th, 2011 5:41pm Report this commentwe read that the MoD has nearly 700 staff involved in PR - its a no brainer for the government to demand that this be significantly reduced and the front line pilots and soldiers can be saved and still savings can be made - the MoD is indeed full of donkeys leading our lions at the front end - its time to cut the donkeys out.
TrevorsDen
February 15th, 2011 5:50pm Report this commentStrapworld - I greatly sympathise with you and your son.
This is what comes from greatly overextending the commitments of our army and having the wrong sort of Army for our needs.
I get the impression that the full force of Afghanistan is falling on a relatively small part of our Army. There are not many armoured regiments being rotated through Afghanistan.
Indeed I think the strain on our forces is probably greater than the army in 14-18.
Having said all that we have withdrawn from quite a number of our Afghan commitments - they having been taken over by the USA.
So it may be (I am not sure) that we can more readily cope with what we are currently doing.
John B
February 15th, 2011 5:57pm Report this commentI would like to accept the statements which are being made about the need to save money, and the unavoidable cuts that have to be made.
I would like to, but I can't when at the same time we are giving some £9 billion in foreign aid, and over £1 billion to India, plus the £ billions which are going to the EU.
Who is left to vote for to restore some kind of sanity?
Woody
February 15th, 2011 6:35pm Report this commentOn Radio5Live this morning, someone rang up to say he was sacked via email when he was serving in Bosnia. Do I recall that Labour were in power then and yet we had Jim Murphy fast out of the traps this morning putting the boot in. No-one called him to account over this and there lies the problem. The appallying lack of fightback by this government.
We keep hearing about these inquiries into leaks from the MOD but then never hear the result. Until people start losing their jobs, then nothing will change.
Paddy
February 15th, 2011 7:17pm Report this commentIt's about time the coalition put the boot into New Labour.
They stand up in Parliament with crocodile tears.....making out they care.
They do not care. They left the country bankrupt and we will never let them forget it.
TGF UKIP
February 15th, 2011 7:18pm Report this commentWhy on earth would it be a surprise that the Cameron Clique have blown the Tories' reputation as the party that can be trusted by the Armed Forces and with the nation's defence. After all they've blown practically every other reputation the party had.
As for Fox, strapworld, he should have resigned long before now and on numerous occasions starting with Dave's notorious foreign and security speech to German parliamentarians in Bonn.
strapworld
February 15th, 2011 7:30pm Report this commentWoody, It is ont of the first fall backs of any minister. "I am calling for an inquiry into the leak, the emails" etc. We never get a report published, because we would have forgotten about it.
TrevorsDen there is no need for sympathy for my son or me. He is PROUD to be serving his country. He and his colleagues WANT to go to Afghanistan. They have been training almost daily for over a year now. They are ready to go. I am so impressed by my son's friends and colleagues. I have nothing but pride for him and for them. But it is the same old story, Lions ruled by donkeys
My gripe is his wife and son, my grandson who is two shortly, hardly sees his dad. The army bosses couldn't care a tinkers cuss for the families of their men.
doppelganger
February 15th, 2011 7:40pm Report this commentTrevorsden should remember that it was under John Major that massive unthinking cuts were made in our armed forces and ancillary services such as hospitals and housing. There was a lack of clear thinking then and the Tories are repeating their mistakes now.
TomTom
February 15th, 2011 9:11pm Report this commentPilots should finish their training and qualify. They can be seconded to the Australian, US Air Force or Luftwaffe....but training must be completed or the government commitment to qualified personnel looks very tenuous and MoD bonuses can pay for it
Cynic
February 15th, 2011 9:48pm Report this commentWill heads roll for sending out the sack via email? I doubt it. If we cut overseas aid and escaped the EU we could afford a decent defence of the realm. Day by day Cameron proves he is no conservative with or without the capital letter.
Keracka
February 15th, 2011 10:02pm Report this commentDr Fox's comment in Parliament about the warrant officer in Afghanistan was insidious. He asked the house to note that the warrant officer was only in Afghanistan on temporary duty and was not a combat soldier. That was an unnecessary but I suspect revealing distinction. All soldiers have the binding and limitless contract which silently underpins their whole career. Just because an individual is not at that moment in a combat role makes no difference to the treatment they should receive.
Dr Fox may have been furious at this slip up in handling, not least because of the political impact of it on his day, but many service personnel are equally furious at the pay freeze and cuts to their allowances at a time of war. But they have no voice and their treatment is inequitable. There is an erosion of trust gathering pace which will take a generation to correct unless it is checked now.
Fatbloke on tour
February 16th, 2011 1:46pm Report this commentStrapworld
Interested by some of the comments you have made regarding your son and his time in the military and his upcoming tour to A'stan.
Couple of points to make on this, I have been surprised at the level of complaint made by ordinary soldiers against the officer corps in both Iraq and A'stan.
The comments were made on defence blogs and rumour sites and included criticisms of both the high command in the UK and the low level guys on the ground.
It gives the impression that the whole exercise is wrong from start to finish, the leadership shambolic / arrogant and the tactics change with every new unit that comes into theatre.
One thing you say seems to back this up, you say that your son has been training for this assignment for "over one year", so twice as long as he will be in theatre. Surely this is not right, I think he will be going over-trained but under prepared?
The six month tour length needs to be questioned. Better to have half the training and twice the time in counry?
How many infantry units do we have in A'stan at one time?
3 or 4?
Back to politics:
TB + MOD = Match made in hell.
He wanted to do stuff, so did the top brass.
They told him what he wanted to hear, he believed them, no questions asked.
GB + MOD = Treasury hatred of all things military with a red rose attached.
Dave the Rave has surprised me.
After all his pre-election talk about the military covenant, even I have been surprised at how shameless he has been about his lack of understanding and the Treasury inspired hobbling, sorry destruction of the RAF and the Navy.
Time to start again, the MOD is a bascket case and the services are now only a public sector subsidy to the private education needs of a middle class officer corp.
Time to go a bit Commonwealth.
Time for a "New Model Army, Navy, RAF".
Scotty
February 16th, 2011 3:11pm Report this commentIt was disgraceful that soldiers were given notice by e-mail about redundancy, but don't blame the Minister blame the top bosses in the MoD - they sent the e-mail and they are the ones who should be sacked.
In the same way as the MoD hierarchy exploit the current need to take planes out of service to make savings and take pleasure in making an emotive and biased presentation of the action, even though the need to make these cuts is thanks to their own gross misuse of our taxes.
THye are responsible for improving teh conditions of the army personnel but they prefer to spend it on their latest technical whim and on their own contnued good life.
There are c700 staff employed by the MoD on PR, they have obviously learned about the value of spin from labour.
crowbait
February 16th, 2011 3:36pm Report this commentFollowing Gordon Brown and the Labour Party's successful scorched earth policy it seems that David Cameron is determined to destroy the armed forces. In the light of this might it be possible to list the number of the 'Fireside Fusiliers' amongst the tens of thousands in the MOD who are for the chop either by e mail or otherwise.
Insider
February 16th, 2011 10:59pm Report this commentFatbloke: "Time to start again, the MOD is a bascket case and the services are now only a public sector subsidy to the private education needs of a middle class officer corp."
You, sir, are a disgusting pile of shit!
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