The new German Question

strapworld

How niave.So the German race have remade themselves. Mr Korski you would have been at home in the Thirties. Appeasement has raised its head once more. Our defences are down. We have another Chamberlain in Number 10 The aristocracy believe that we should be in the Euro and our proud history forgotten. It does appear, to me, that the Spectator is of that view as well.

Where is Cromwell, Churchill or Maggie when you need them?

toco

Germany should be honest and say the only other country capable of sharing a joint currency is the UK.Even Eurosceptics would accept this logic.Apparently the boy Miliband thinks our PM should get involved to a greater extent-silly boy should concentrate on his lessons!

salieri

“How Germany carries out the task and how others, including Britain, react will be key to how inter-state relations develop in Europe in the next few years.”

No shit, Sherlock. Not even C- this time.

For the record - and for the growing number of irreverent readers who start from the proposition that DK's opinions are likely to be the opposite of the reality - it might be a good idea to present at least some factual basis for the assertions that Germany (a) abhors its close relationship with France (b) abhors dictating things to others and (c) is not a power-broker but a ‘Handelsnation’.

What is this vacuous distinction supposed to mean? Which European countries are not ‘trading nations’? Why do people who don’t know that German nouns have capital letters consider themselves competent to write about Germany?

And what was the point of this jejune article?

TK

Germany's assertive new role as arbiter in other people's democracies might be somewhat more combustible if it were led by a bewhiskered male and not by a deceptively meek hausfrau.

Faustiesblog

"The second thing Berlin abhors is to dictate things to others."

Says who? The events of the past week suggest otherwise.

Mike Spilligan

"....next few years"?? If Germany is having collective self-doubts that's not at all comforting, and should make its mind up pretty damn quick - though perhaps not before the weekend's over.

Paul Hughes

"Where is Cromwell, Churchill or Maggie when you need them?"

Maggie signed the Single European Act, Churchill spent most of the 20s praising Mussolini and Cromwell failed to appreciate that supporting the rising power of Europe (France) against the declining Spain was hardly conducive to England's traditional role of seeking a balance of power.

What we need is a withdrawal from the stage, a la Disraeli or Salisbury. We need to get out of the EU, out from the pockets of the Yanks and on with trading. It works for any number of mid ranking nations., Why we continually seek to compensate for losing an empire through seeking to hang onto the coat tails of the "next big thing," rather than simply getting on with business, is beyond me.

MI

Amidst all the current gloom, this is a rare ray of light to be offered two marvellous offerings from the pen/keyboard of Mr.Korski within a few hours.

I must be tired, or over-excited at this treat, as I cannot work out what on earth he is trying to say in the final paragraph.

TomTom

Korski is off-base again. Germany is a country with a deadbeat government heading for disaster.

TomTom

France is a busted flush that thought it had built a European Empire after 1956 and strapped Germany down as a Milchkuh.

Boudicca

Mr Korski. It is no good making sweeping statements like this "The second thing Berlin abhors is to dictate things to others" when all the evidence is to the contrary.

The EU has always been a joint Franco-German operation; initially with just their respective satellite nations and subsequently spread wider afield. But the two core nations run it and always have. The UK was permitted to enter in order to pay substantial sums towards the bills, so that France wouldn't have to.

We are now in a position where the Francfort group - led by France and Germany - are dictating both economic policy to independent nations and who will lead their Governments in order to enact it.

This is nothing less than Fascism. Democracy in Europe is being killed by the EU, the Euro and the Francfort Group.

Meanwhile in the UK we have a wet, weak Prime Minister who prides himself on being the Heir to Blair (shyster in chief) whilst more and more resembling Chamberlain and Heath; the worst Conservative PMs of the 20th century.

Cynic

"Nobody in Berlin welcomes this turn of events, but believes it is necessary." Is this the German equivalent of "the big boy made me do it"? I am reliving the 30s!

Edward McLaughlin

That bit about Germany not being a power-broker, but a trading nation? How is that supposed to work?

All developed nations trade. Do it well enough and power is unavoidable.

john

I heard today that ECB buying Italian doesn't require unanimity, so why don't the non-German Euro organize a vote ?

Andy Leeds

The EU always has been an embryonic Fascist State. By their recent actions Merkel and the poison dwarf (Sarkozy) have shown what they are.

Now who was it that said Monetary Union was merely a 'German plot to take over Europe'.

Dennis Churchill

Boudicca
November 10th, 2011 9:56pm
We also seem to have an EU representative in the UK cabinet:”Returning powers to Britain is not our priority, says Clegg.”—Telegraph 10th November.
“Our”?
As he receives payments from the EU in the form of a revocable pension I’m not surprised that is his view.

'mandy

Why is the esteemed editor no longer fiddling the blog figures and, in effect, admitting that Liddle has assumed the post of ueber-blogger?

Even if Swedish education is not the main topic of the day, why is Liddle not being reeducated, which is obviously required under the new regime?

Simon Denis

But Germany does dictate; only it doesn't realise. Where once it asserted itself plainly in the name of its own ambition, it now asserts itself in the desperation for yet more sackcloth and ash, twisting the fates and destinies of all other European powers towards guardianship of its unreliable soul. They have run so far from the shadows of the thirties that they are pulling us into the prison of their hyper humility. Why can't they quite simply live as a normal, peaceful nation state, neither bossing people in the name of their superiority nor bossing them in the name of their inferiority?

pete-s

"for you, zee economic vaw is over"

'Mandy

Where is Fraser?

lola

The germans I have met and spoken over the last 15 years are of the post war generation. They are justifiably proud of the way they have rebuilt their country, but none of them hold any ambition for lebensraum or any other imperial policy. But, they are well aware of the 20th century legacy and have no wish to go there again. I also sense a sense of guilt as to that which IMHO they have to get over to move forward. Meanwhile the French have tried to emasculate Germany by binding it into the EU on the French model for exactly the same reasons.
Discuss.

Hexhamgeezer

'In political lingo, Germany is a ‘handelsnation’, a trading nation, as opposed to a power-broker'

No it isn't. They have accepted the WW2 financial and moral reparations as codified by Rome to Lisbon, but that most surely does not, repeat , not, mean they have accepted that they are primarily a trading nation.

Mr K, you really need to get out more. Talk to mid-ranking German diplos. Talk to regional politicians, talk to assimilated 'gastarbeiter'. They are not content to carry on overproducing to enable Greek union members and Italian MP's to acquire 3 and 4 residences.

They aren't aiming for a 4th Reich but they most certainly not willing to provide lifetime crutches for the disciples of Monnet n'Gramsci.

Unlike dave'n nick'n ed.

Nick B

It's in Germany's interest alright. At the start of the "Euro Project" they were running a trade deficit. Italy was running a trade surplus. Look how things have changed with German businesses selling their goods cheaply to Eurozone countries. They don't want that to end.

Italy and Germany both have massive gold reserves. It might be a signal of their faith in the currency if they sold it to pay down debts (their own or others - together we stand... united we fall).

2trueblue

Germany has been dictating what, where and when for years. What Germany is now doing right now is seeing how much to hold back, how far the damage will go, and how deep the damage will spead to Germany herself.

Foundavoice

Google the author of this piece. He is a Senior Policy Fellow at the ECFR, but fails to mention this conflict of interest during all his pro-EU pieces.

Foundavoice

I posted before to Google the author and to see his EU conflict of interest.

My post hasn't appeared - first time ever.

fergus pickering

Boudicca, we really do not need right-thinking persons throwing round the world Fascist, meaning 'vile bastard'. Left-thinking persons do that. And strapworld, do you really believe your first sentence? And whoeveritwas, can Cameron really be reincarnated Chamberlain and reincarnated eath AT THE SAME TIME. Besides, Chamberlain was only carrying out the policy of Baldwin. Is he included in the diatribe?

Bob Dixon

Lets count our blessings.
The common language in the world is ENGLISH.
GB is off the north west coast of europe.
The gulf stream keeps us warm in winter & cool in summer.
We have coal,oil & gas.There are fish in the seas around us.
How can we fail.

Boyders

Strapworld - Cameron is Chamberlain and Boris is Churchill.

strapworld

Foundavoice. You will note from most of the comments here and in Korski's previous rants, that he gets very little support.

That he is on the payroll of the EU does not surprise me. I wonder how many more of the Speccy's writers are also paid servants of the EU? Perhaps they will be open with us.

Korski should apologise for not declaring his interest, as should Clegg, Cameron, Maude and everyone else who are slaves to the EU. If they are Members of Parliament or The lords they should BY LAW have to declare their pension and interest before participating in any debate however loosely linked to the EU.

Common Purpose is another area no newspaper/magazine wishes to investigate. An alleged charity, yet follow the tentacles of this organisation and they go right back to the EU. Maude would do well to explain his links...and the other cabinet ministers who are CP trained!

Vulture

Thank you, Daniel for once again demonstrating the truth of Vuulture's Law : that any opinion you hold is the exact opposite of reality.

If Germany really doesn't like throwing its weight around it has shown a funny way of going about it over the past week: deposing two democratically elected Governments in seven days and installingt your own Quislings is an achievement even Adolf would have marvelled at.

And the last time that a referendum was cancelled at the behest of a German Chancellor was in March 1938 when Austrian Chancellor Schuschnigg called one to decide whether Austria should remain free or be absorbed into the Reich. The Anschluss followed, the referendum was cancelled and Schuschnigg ended up in a concentration camp. Georege Papandreou must be a worried man.

EC

This is the biggest pile of crap Korski has foisted upon us - since his last one.

Yet again, Capn Korski boldly takes us out into the uncharted and choppy waters of his ocean of ignorance. His target audience are, presumably, those born yesterday and to which he spouts his NWO twaddle.

Normally I find the Korski "comedy slot" amusing, but he's starting to pall. His opinions are worthless. He gets paid for them?

starfish

I think is was Chirchill who said the problem with Germans is they either at your feet or at your throat

In this, as in so many other areas, he was spot on

Even the normally EU-reliable BBC seems to be getting conceRned about the Frankfurt Group

michael

Germany finds himself between a rock and a hard place.
Rock: Continue to prop up a rigged market, and paying for that illusive competitive advantage, risking insolvency and/or Weimar style inflation.
Hard place: Face the diktat of a FREE market, Germany's strength being reflected in a realistic currency valuation.
Now that the shit HAS hit the fan and is flying in every direction, For the rank and file business community like every business community, the choice is the latter. To them it really is a no-brainer.

TomTom

What utter drivel. Churchill was a Germanophobe who fawned over France with Jean Monnet even getting him to propose Joint Citizenship between France and Britain in 1940. He gave France an Occupation Zone in Germany even though it has capitulated in 1940, and that gave Mitterand the leverage to foist the Euro on Germany when Kohl needed French OK to Unification in 1990.

Mitterand even wanted an alliance with the USSR to repeat French Encirclement just as in 1904 and 1925. France is the key to Europe and has screwed it up totally since the 17th Century involving Britain in a series of wars which it only survived by having Prussia as an ally

exile on euro street

To all those criticising DK's assertion that Germany abhors dictating to others ask yourselves this: Why wasn't Germany more forceful about implementing the Stability and Growth Pact over the last decade? If they had been, they wouldn't be in this mess now. There was a lot of domestic grumbling that other Eurozone countries weren't pulling their weight but it was not translated into interfering in those countries affairs.

Dimoto

What an interesting and singular little continent is Europe !

Disagree with Korski, he should have said Germany is a mercantilistnation.

It is curious that those most abused by imperial Germany seem to have become it's greatest admirers: most of central and eastern Europe can't wait to become beneficiaries of the German "commonwealth", and a high proportion of those arguing for German leadership in Europe are European jews.

When the 'right' in Britain start carping about Germany, it is ritually accompanied by abuse of France.

What really upsets these people, is that Germany chose to chum up with France rather than these blessed isles - that hurts their fragile self-esteem, still trying to recover from our reduced standing in the international pecking order.

Anyone hear Cash, the Teutonophile this morning ?
If Britain was sitting at the "top-table", side by side with best buddy Germany, issuing instructions to the lesser Euro countries and generally throwing it's weight around, most of the strident anti-EU 'right', would be rather content.

Since we decided to engage with the European Common Market, our policy has always been the traditional one: divide and rule (or, worm our way into the "centre" in order to divide and disrupt).

There has never been any recognition that we are different, and should seek a permanent amicable settlement to remain different but part of the European bloc.

What we now have, by happenstance, is an unsatisfactory half-way house, with permanent acrimony.

In terms of 'democratic experience', liberal leanings and evolutionary experience, we are closest to Holland and the Scandinavian countries, but they have different geoeconomic imperatives.

We need to stop obsessing about the European "power game", and look to our real national interests.

EC

Re: Germany & Europe etc.

There has to be a connection between our Dan and Peter O'Hanra-Hanrahan.

*ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Bq_dkPkQUU

Widmerpool

@ Mandy

Yes it's about time Fraser surfaced and wrote/commissioned a non bleeding heart Europhile piece. IMHO

Andy Carpark

EC - Ah, yes. The immortal 'Hold up your notes!'

Thanks for doing the honours, BTW. I have had rather a heavy week and ripping apart DK's latest stream of drivel might well have precipitated a ruptured aneurysm.

old fox

The usual gallophobic rubbish from TomTom. How he can blame France for "encirclement" prior to 1914 when the alliance with Russia was a response to Prusso-German aggression - an aggression that victimised Denmark and Austria before it and was already breeding anti-semitism - see the recent biography of Bismarck. Germany - vicious, expansionist, self-righteous, spiteful Germany - was the villain of Europe's piece from the mid nineteenth century on. And at a time when the the dead of Verdun should be recalled along with their brothers in arms of the Somme, TomTom's irrational, bigoted, outburst of unjust sophistry should be treated with the contempt it deserves.

Heartless P.

.... could not rule supreme ... ?

Shurely shome mishtake!

bojimbo

Neither country could invade us by warfare , now it's by diplomacy .

Verity

Strapworld 8:11 "Where is Cromwell, Churchill or Maggie when you need them?"

Or Nigel Farage ...

Paul L

Pre-1973 Europe was dominated by Paris and Bonn.

Malfleur

EC

Yes,comparing their photographs (for DK see: ecfr.eu/content/profile/C22/) they both look as though in the Renaissance they could have been Italienische Stilettomenschen.