A slight change of heart on HS2?

Kestrel Sprite

Yet more money we don't have to be frittered away on this preposterous scheme - railways are just so nineteenth century.

David Cockerham

Claims by politicians that every possible measure will be taken to minimise the environmental impact of HS2 don't add up to a legal hill of beans, because when the line has been built every developer wanting to build anything else along the route will argue that what he proposes does not damage the AONB or its setting because it has already been damaged by the construction of HS2. And Planning Inspectors will acccept that argument; they will not rule it out on the ground that it makes a nonsense of assurances given by the politicians at the time of construction of HS2 because, they will say, such arguments have no force in law. So be warned HS2 opponents: your absolute minimum demand should be a clause in the HS2 Bill saying that assessements by Planning Inspectors of the environmental impact of all future developments along the line should be made on the basis of what that impact would have been if HS2 had never been built, not on the basis of the degree to which it adds to the environmental impact of HS2.

AlanL

"There’s been an intriguing, if minor, development in the HS2 case this afternoon. The Guardian reports that..."

Strange - I read this over breakfast this morning in the Telegraph. I suggest that:

a) you don't read the Guardian
b) you don't believe they are first with every item of news.

TrevorsDen

There are suggestions that the £500 million comes from other ameliorating parts of the budget.
One man's 'find' is another man's loss.

Paul Maynard

I suggest that all look at High Speed Fail from the Adam Smith Institute.

http://www.adamsmith.org/publications/regulation-and-industry/high-speed-fail%3a-assessing-the-case-for-hs2/

This is a disastrous waste of money based upon the stupid green mania of this government. It will not save any CO2 anyway. The projections are stright from the fantasy department that produced the original numbers for the channel tunnel.

The capacity issue is simply wrong. On any peak train to Birmingham, the standard carriages are packed whilst the 4 First Class are empty. Complete market failure.

The time saving ignores the journeyt times at either end ansd thus makes the saving proportionately less.

HS2 Fail from H2B.

Paul

alexsandr

i am at a loss to know why the government are going ahead with this scheme. Some minor improvements on the WCML between euston and rugby, together with some capacity improvements between cov and brum will fix the problem.

and have they done the economic and carbon impact of running trains in a tunnel, where the air resitance is greater so will use more electricity causing more carbon release.
anyway, a train that goes faster will use more energey than a slower one.

daniel maris

Is it meant to:

"reduce aesthetic damage to the Chilterns" or

"reduce political damage to the Conservatives"?

Nickle

Yet another project with a negative return.

Congratulations to the people of Cornwall. We should thank them that the rich can save a few minutes off their journey times, for which they are going to have to pay thousands.

You could get more efficiency from existing trains by fitting free wifi.

disenfranchised

£500 million? chicken shit.
the bank of england's printers, out at the essex lock up, can knock those out while the boys are having their dinner break.
sorted dave.....

TrevorsDen

Why is it the rest of the world can have high speed rail but it must be kept from the British?

Ignorant bigotry rules again on Coffee House

In2minds

The HS2 goes ahead because Merkozy told Cameron to do it!

fergus pickering

Trevorsden, you took the words out of my mouth. High Speed Trains are the way to go. I travel on them whenever I can. On the other hand aeroplanes are the work of the devil and should be avoided whenever humanly possible. If God had meant us to fly he would have made us all angels.

Paul Maynard

Clearly Trevors Den has not looked at the Adam Smith paper. High speed trains needs tons of subsidy and are not solving Spanish unemployment.

The journey time to Birmingham is 1.5 hours in the crap Pendolinos. Taking 20 mins off that at a mere £40 billion is a WASTE of MONEY.

Paul

David Cockerham

'The journey time to Birmingham is 1.5 hours in the crap Pendolinos. Taking 20 mins off that at a mere £40 billion is a WASTE of MONEY.'

This argument is valid only if you believe the line will never go beyond Birmingham to the north of England and eventually to Scotland. And to believe that the politicians intend only taking it to Birmingham is to believe that all three of our main political parties are just a bunch of morons. You have lots of good, valid arguments against HS2, anti-HS2 campaigners; please do not undermine your case by asking us all to believe this. If we did believe it we would have no option but to slash our wrists.

Edward McLaughlin

"And to believe that the politicians intend only taking it to Birmingham is to believe that all three of our main political parties are just a bunch of morons."

Arf arf.

boudicca

We shouldn't be wasting billions on HS2 - period.

This minor change isn't anything to celebrate. It is just another demonstration of the Government's determination to implement the EU TEN-T directives - with the British people picking up the bill.

Pathetic.

whatawaste

The fastest current route takes 1 hour 25 minutes but it also stops at Milton Keynes and Coventry. The journey time taken is not comparing like with like, but as with anything linked to the EU (in fantasy land in Brussels it is called E15 not HS2) truth is of little consequence.

Part of the project has earmarked the closure of one of the routes which is against the government's own transport policy! But rail travel is already very expensive compared to road and air travel - this waste of money will push prices even higher. The last PM was often labelled as bonkers: Cameron is mimicking him perfectly!

Ferrophile

HS2 is the wrong way round. There are already 2 good routes from London to Birmingham.
Have you ever tried getting a train Manchester or Leeds to anywhere in the East Midlands? It takes hours and requires at least one change of train.
I can't understand why not "start from the other end" and in the interim use the MML to reach London.
Once the SouthEast sees what they're missing out on, the opposition will melt away.
I would wager the idea has never even been evalluated.

In2minds

@boudicca - Agree, how about repatriating our own transport policy?

Rhoda Klapp

I think we need the Thatcher/chunnel solution here. Let the builders fund themselves and make the money back, if they can. What, no takers? Well, no public funds then. All tied up on the Indian Space program and their carrriers.

Mike.

If this hare brained scheme goes ahead, it is likely to become a charter for terrorists. Just think about it !Furthermore, the powers that be are unable to maintain their existing track to acceptable safety standards. Heaven help us !