What Boris Island tells us about Cameron

JohnPage

He'll need to do more than sidle if we're not to end up with uncompetitively expensive energy.

Leonard of Quirm

Anybody who has been to a proper new airport like Hong Kong or Osaka will recognise the immense benefits of a purpose-built airport. Compare and contrast with the comedy third-world camp called LHR ...

starfish

Let's not confuse pandering to the renewable energy lobby and AGW crazies with environmentalism

Erecting eco-crucifixes all over the place is far from green

David Cockerham

It's good that David Cameron seems finally to be getting his head out of the environmentalist clouds. The trouble is the LibDems still have theirs firmly up there, and there is little chance of their ever changing, because holier-than-thou environmentalism is in their genes - it's one of the central things that makes them LibDems. So Cameron's ability to put his own clearer-sightedness on the issue to good use in the national interest is going to be seriously constrained for the life of this coalition. We can only hope it doesn't live too long

Sean Haffey

We'll then need a "Circle Line" of HS3 to connect Heathrow, Gatwick, Boris Island and Stansted.

Or we could shut Heathrow and build 100,000 homes there.

Jeremy

Peter Hoskin:

"...Boris Island..."

I think that sounds like a great place. I bet there's sand and sunshine on Boris Island. And they serve cocktails and everybody has a laugh.

Adam Nixon

Almost all of us live north and west of London. So let's build the airport to the east.

TrevorsDen

There is something to be said for closing Heathrow but there is a lot of related infrastructure there as well. If that could be moved to around Boris island then fine.
It seems to me the existing infrastructure around Heathrow is a negative to Boris island.

Alternatively we could just manage with Terminals 4 and 5 at Heathrow aster Boris island built and maybe connect it to Northolt and develop that long term.
This would allow further redevelopment around Heathrow - rather than housing perhaps a science/industrial park.

George Shepherd

More public expenditure subsidies for the South East of England !!

starfish

Heathrow is hopelessly congested and surrounded by busy roads, most of which are also congested

Shift the transit traffic to a new airport and you immediately ease pressure on Heathrow - perhaps an additonal runway would no longer be required

Environmental argumnets need to be heard by they are not necessarily a trump card. The proposed area is hardly 'natural', it has been shaped by centuries of industrialisation, maritime traffic etc

Better than spending umpteen £billion on HS2

Chris lancashire

Encouraging that this project is getting the attention it deserves and which should have been prioritised over HS2. I don't care who thought of it first, the UK desperately needs this.
I actively avoid Heathrow now which means that most of my money goes to foreign carriers flying out of Manchester.

Heartless Curmudgeon

Excellent news!

Be this a sign that the fatal pheromonic trap exuded by the Limpid Dimwits and the eco-loonies is wearing off?

Does this mean that the H2B is at last making progress in his therapeutic journey and achieving some kind of insight into the madness that surrounds him, and of which he created part? Will he shed Bliarism and the ordure that follows it?

So pull away my hearties! Boris Island beckons, and there'll be plenty of funds when the wretched HS2 nonsense is finally ditched!

Yam Yam

Or we could simply expand Birmingham Airport, which is already a little over an hour away from central London by train (or just over half hour once HS2 is built).

David Cockerham

@Adam Nixon: You don't seem to have quite grasped the idea that what's important for the location of the UK's main hub airport is not its convenience for you and others like you but its convenience for the whole world, and the whole world does not plan to visit the immediate north and west of London.

Dimoto

Adam Nixon definitely "doesn't get it".
It's precisely because "most live in north and west of London" (south doesn't count I suppose), that the airport must be built east - so that you can get a decent night's sleep and travel on slightly less congested transport Adam.

I wish the government would launch a public enquiry into "Friends of the earth", "Greenpeace" and the other sinister, secretive, foreign based, environmental lobbying industry names.

Who are they, and in whose name do they act ?
They must have been responsible for massive loss of economic value, yet are never questioned/investigated.

Tarka the Rotter

here's a suggestion - stop spending taxpayer's money until we can afford to do so...austerity? Meh...

daniel maris

LOL - what it tells us about Cameron is that he want the conservatives to win the GLA elections so as to shore up his own political position, knowing the Londonbased media pay a lot of attention to what happens with the GLA.

I support the initiative, but not the price tag of £40billion. I think there has to be a question mark over that - what we need is not a consultation but a task force of accountants, engineers and creative thinkers who should be given the task of coming back with a project for £10 billion. Not possible? Well NASA used to say you couldn't launch something into space for less than $20,000 per kg - now the private Space X are doing it for $5,000 and hope to get it down to $500.

There must be ways of reducing the cost. Take one idea: allow companies to dump waste there (it will need to be treated) and let them off the landfill tax.

Another: can we site an O2 style concert hall there?

Rhoda Klapp

Nobody is going to close Heathrow. It accounts for most of the employment in that area. Hundreds of thousands of people. Hundreds of business HQs located close to the airport. With effects extending all over the Thames Valley and beyond. What use to build a new place in the river in order to inflict economic disaster elsewhere? At the very least it needs a little thinking through. We'd need another M25, for a start. And all this because we can't build a runway because of nimbys? Yes, LHR is crowded, unpleasant and frustrating. But that is just what happens with any large airport. Shifting it to a less accessible place will not make it better.

strapworld

Boris Island could prove to be a major plus for British engineering and planning. Except of course that tenders will have to go EU wide-God Forbid the Germans get it. (I see they have our milk now).

Dimoto is so right. Just who are these self appointed environmentalists. WHY are they listened to and who is funding them?

Kittler

Was reading a report the other day on the distribution of current major infrastructure projects in England. SE England had 84% at £2731 per head whilst the poor old NE got £5.
Should they quietly pay up for this or threaten succession.

Kittler

David Cockerham, "for the convenience of the whole world"
We know that is what London exists for but must the rest of us have to pay for it.

Fergus Pickering

Secession is what you mean, I think, Kittler. Since plainly nobody once to go to the North East or live in it, secession wouldn't make a blind bit of difference. Perhaps they could join Scotland if fatboy wants them. Oc aye.

Adam Nixon

@David Cockerham
It could serve the whole world flying in at any location near London. To serve those of us flying out, it should be to the west and/or north.

@Dimoto
You misquote me and seem to think I'm saying that most of us live in London. I am saying the opposite. And no, to get to this new place we will not "travel on slightly less congested transport ": we will have to trek from Paddington, Euston, King's Cross and whatever right across central London and out the other side.

Publius

@Rhoda Klapp
"And all this because we can't build a runway because of nimbys?"

For once, Rhoda, I disagree with you. The noise imposed on the hapless residents around Heathrow is nothing less than criminal. No one should be expected to live in such conditions. Close it, close the whole wretched place.

Kittler

Yes, thank you Fergus. Please award yourself a gold star.
I will now type my 100 lines "I must read things carefully before I post"

ThigArLatha

Manston anyone?

lescam

"but also Cameron sidling away from the environmentalism that defined his early years as leader."

Thank God for that.
The less "environmentalism" the better.

Robert Christopher

Why isn't Maplin Sands being considered? After all, it was once considered the best option. Pity about its heritage, though it might be a mixed blessing!

What is scary about this report is the date:
Boris, airport and my fears for Foulness
8:30am Saturday 16th August 2008 Jim Worsdale
http://www.echo-news.co.uk/news/3598496.Boris__airport_and_my_fears_for_Foulness/

It looks like there are few people around and it might be even far enough away from the SS Richard Montgomery:
http://h2g2.com/dna/h2g2/A22716759

Robert Christopher

Could be the MOD is the reason.

David Cockerham

@Kittler; @Adam Nixon. The point is that when the world flies to London it either wants to go to central London and stay there, or it wants to go to central London and take connections from there to all points in the UK. What therefore matters most is how accessible central London is from the airport, not how accessible the airport is from the north and west of London. Yes, that means it will be less convenient for people who live in those areas than for those who live to the south and east of London, and yes, that means those finding it less convenient may be greater in number than those finding it more convenient. But the degree of inconvenience to anyone living in the home counties is miniscule anyway in comparison with the inconvenience of Heathrow now to millions living further afield, so that's hardly a strong argument against Boris island. My main doubt about it is whether the M2, M20 and southern parts of the M25, especially the Dartford Crossing, could cope with it. For that reason it would be vital that the project included a new Thames road crossing from the airport to Essex, linking up to the M11 and bypassing the M2, M20, M25 and Dartford Crossing entirely.

J H Hollway

Boris Island is about getting people into the UK and then pushing them by train into London. Think of it as the airport for arrivals.

I've used the off-shore Hong Kong airport quite a few times and that is miles from the city, but minutes via the high-speed rail link.

Rational Plan

Hong Kong is a small dense city. The airport is the same distance from the centre as Heathrow from central London. The new airport would be another 25 miles further from central London and 70 miles by road from the western M25. it would be a major headache to close Heathrow.

Adam Nixon

@David Cockerham

Thank you for your reply. You demolish the case for Boris Island for _outgoing_ travellers with your correct statement that "those finding it less convenient may [you meant "will"] be greater in number than those finding it more convenient". And no, contrary to what you say, inconvenience will be astronomical, even for home counties residents, if they have to go into the centre of London and out the other side or round the M25 (both options alreday horrribly congested). The great majority of UK residents can get to Heathrow without going right through London, since it is to the west of the city, which is the side where most people live.

As regards _incoming_ travellers wanting access to central London and connections, it makes no difference to them where exactly the hub airport is located, since it will have the links and connections there.

Adam Nixon

@J H Hollway: "Think of it as an airport for arrivals". You mean we should deliberately, and for no reason, ignore half its role? Haven't you noticed that quite a lot of people live in the UK?

J H Holloway

Nobody is closing Heathrow.

Air travel is massively on the up...so you need another airport with room to get people through immigration and onto the London-bound train.

It's quite straight forward.

Dimoto

The proposed airport would be funded by foreign (wealth fund) investment, not the tax-payer.

Unlike the dubious economics of the HS2, airports do stack up as investments. The new airport would be a major draw.

Nobody seems to mind our "existing hub" being owned and operated by a distinctly shifty Spanish outfit.

We've had the NIMBYs, now we've got the HRPS (Heathrow Preservation Society).

Lee Jakeman

"Nick Clegg, by the sounds of it, is more provisionally negative." Now there's a surprise.

Rhoda Klapp

Every arrival is balanced by a departure. Well, nearly all. Airlines do not like empty aircraft. They will not fly in arrivals and fly out empty, obviously. The proposed airport is not conveniently situated, for most. And above all, Heathrow is not going away. Whether I want to preserve it or not (I don't much care) it isn't going away. This will only limit its growth. Whether some private finance outfit funds the new isalnd or not, massive sums of public money will need to be spent on infrastructure. Maybe that is not a bad thing. What we need is a working document to outline what is planned. That is in fact what we are going to get, that is all that is real at the moment. No need to panic, no need to get your hopes up.

Matthew Tysoe

No man is an island Rodney...