Has Brown realised that the Lisbon Treaty is dead?
Peter Hoskin 11:50am
So far, the Government have acted as pig-headed as we expected them to over the Irish referendum result. Rather than seeing it as a sign that the public may have very real concerns about the Lisbon Treaty, Brown and Co. have merely used the opportunity to get even cosier with their EU counterparts.
However, there are signs this morning that the Government may be wavering in some way. The Sunday Times reports: “No.10 admits EU treaty is finished”. And, on Marr this morning, David Miliband said:
“There can be no question of bulldozing, bamboozling or ignoring the Irish vote ... But the rules are clear, if all 27 states do not pass the treaty then it does not pass into law. But it is right we take our own decision.”
So, the Government will press on with ratification. But – should the Irish pull out – it seems like they'll then push for the Treaty to be dropped altogether. Of course, that's exactly how it should be – them's the rules, after all. But with indications that other countries may press on regardless of Ireland, it's still reassuring that our Government's positioning itself in this way. Having said that, I'm sure they'll be putting their weight behind the Treaty of Wherever – and not offering us a referendum on it – soon enough.
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Comments
John Gorst
June 15th, 2008 12:23pmThere was a worrying subtext in Miliband's response to Andrew Marr this morning. Although he conceded that it requires 27 states to ass the treaty for it to become law, he did not definitively equate the Irish referendum result with a rejection of the treaty. He displayed either disregard or ignorance of the Irish constitution when he said that it was for the Irish PM to decide whether to "apply the last rites" to the treaty. It is this attitude that is resonant of the attitude of the political establishment all across Europe; a belief that populations can be cajoled into integration. Nigel Farage was (for once) right when he asked "what part of 'no' don't these people understand?".
Kevyn Bodman
June 15th, 2008 12:24pmSo if there's no referendum on the Treaty of Wherever it's another opportunity for some aggressive opposition from Cameron and the Conservatives.
Are they up for it?
Are they up to it?
Frank Pulley
June 15th, 2008 1:25pmThis whole circus is turning our Constitutional Parliamentary Democracy into a travesty, which is of course exactly what the cultural revolutionaries intended all along. The Brussels bureacratic steamroller chugs quietly on, ignoring the plaintive cries of all who shout, "Whoa! You're crushing our sovereignties."
I can imagine the bar of the European Commission, "Ireland? Where the hell is Ireland? Isn't that one of those quaint little offshore islands we've been subsidising? Ignore the stupid ingrates! We must press on without them for the greater good. Don't worry! a few million Euros of increased subsidies will soon bring them to heel"
The arrogance of Barroso, given his size, would be comical if it were not so dangerous.
David C
June 15th, 2008 1:31pmSo Miliband says:
“There can be no question of bulldozing, bamboozling or ignoring the Irish vote ... But the rules are clear, if all 27 states do not pass the treaty then it does not pass into law. But it is right we take our own decision.”
It will be safe to invert everything he has said.
They are set to either ram through the Lisbon (Consti)Treaty or ignore Ireland and have it catch up at some later date (a bit like countries joining the Euro).
Next: "the rules are clear, if all 27..."
But they've ignored this rule before and they can do it again. After all, "it is right we take our own decision" and if this happens to coincide with everybody else's, well they just ran into a spot of good luck, eh?
Their thought processes run on rails. We know the direction, it's only the time-table that is in any doubt.
Just words from this bunch of liars and anti-democrats.
It is a smokescreen while they wait for the initial euphoria over the vote to die down.
The government no longer cares how much it is hated. Brown wants his name in the History books.
Nicholas
June 15th, 2008 3:08pmI missed Marr today. Evidently Milliband was trotted out in the latest episode of the "New Labour Sunday Morning Propaganda Show" but could Coffee Housers confirm whether there was any Conservative representation and, if so, please comment on it?
Max Kaye
June 15th, 2008 5:40pmNicholas, DD was on.
BTW, you can view the Marr Show online on BBC's iPlayer. That's how I watched it today after lunch.
Herbert Thornton
June 15th, 2008 6:17pmThe Lisbon Treaty dead? Now why does this all remind me of John Cleese and the Dead Parrot?
Of course the Lisbon Treaty it isn't dead. It's just stunned.
Verity
June 15th, 2008 6:41pmQuite, Herbert Thornton. With all those apparachiks' vast salaries, grandiose expensve accounts and self-importance at stake, this treaty is already on life-support and will miraculously come out of its coma when they figure out how to swing it with the public (also known - in democracies, but not the EU - as voters").
TrevorH
June 15th, 2008 7:39pm"There was a worrying subtext in Miliband's response"
Oh now there's a surprise.
Perry with his sulci intact (still)
June 16th, 2008 1:46pmOne of the cardinal signs of the demise of intellect and living-in-the-real-world is that the subject doesn’t realise anything! I think it’s like being in an automatic state, or state of automotism.