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Michael Henderson

Michael Henderson suggests


Tuesday, 8th July 2008

A plurality of Muslims under 35 support there being areas of the UK where some elements of sharia law are introduced

James Forsyth 12:44pm

A friend of Coffee House is in touch to point out that the numbers from the ICM poll for Peter Oborne’s Dispatches programme last night, show that a plurality of Muslims under 35 are in favour of there being some parts of the UK where elements of Sharia are introduced. Here are the numbers:

"Would you support or oppose there being areas of Britain in which some element of Sharia Law is introduced?"  

                     

                    All         34 and under         35 and over
Support:     38              44                        30
Oppose:     46              39                        54

These numbers are worrying. As Paul Goodman, the Tory shadow minister for Communities and Local Government, said in a Spectator interview last summer: ‘Moderate Islam has as its core not wishing to see different people living under different law. Not wishing to see sharia incorporated into British law.’

Now, obviously not all these people who would like to see elements of sharia introduced are extremists. Many are probably thinking of sharia-compliant mortgages and the like. But it does show just what trouble the Archbishop of Cantebury and the Lord Chief Justice are stirring up with their ill-thought out remarks on the subject.

PS Clive Davis has some reflections on last night's Dispatches.

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Comments

Emily Delors

July 8th, 2008 1:24pm

A majority of children would like sweets every day. A majority of Sun-reading women would like breast implants. A majority of the working class would like to bring back hanging. A majority of BNP voters would like immigrants to go away. A majority of people would like Gordon Brown to resign. Why should anyone take this particular majority, of a minority, any more seriously?

Alex R

July 8th, 2008 1:32pm

If only they were thinking about sharia-complaint mortgages. No one under 35 is thinking about buying a house or getting a mortgage today.

Verity

July 8th, 2008 3:28pm

Emily DeLors - I'm not working class and I would argue for the reinstitution of the death penalty. Do you really think that what you refer to as the working class are the only people who want the death penalty back?

In my own case, I would bring it back for all convictions of murder that were backed up by DNA. It is not just the "working class" who have a strong sense of natural justice.

Verity

July 8th, 2008 3:28pm

Emily DeLors - I'm not working class and I would argue for the reinstitution of the death penalty. Do you really think that what you refer to as the working class are the only people who want the death penalty back?

In my own case, I would bring it back for all convictions of murder that were backed up by DNA. It is not just the "working class" who have a strong sense of natural justice.

EyeSee

July 8th, 2008 3:43pm

Give the boy a prize. Yes, Muslims want their practices to be allowed here. It is not surprising, but to have given every indication that it can happen (just like the Left has supported Pakistani ghettos) is wrong either way. A wise man wouldn't allow it, our government probably will (and is, bit by bit). Without meaning to be unkind to people as individuals, this expectation that their adopted country will change to suit them, will have a corrosive effect on the whole of British life. In this respect the much vaunted and mythical 'moderate' Muslim is as much of a threat as the 'radicalised' one. Except one wants to be a criminal, the other is mislead and let down by the governemnt. This is exactly the wrong time to have spectacular dimwits in power, but that is what we have. The British tradition of tolerance and fair play will similarly be eroded and diluted with unfettered immigration (a key Blair legacy) and so a resurgent BNP like party is a very real possibility, with the street violence that will bring. Britain is Britain, with it's own national identity; if you like what you see, join us. If you don't like what you see, don't come to change things. We will adopt anyone's good idea, but return to the Middle Ages? No thanks.

Chris

July 8th, 2008 4:13pm

'Why should anyone take this particular majority, of a minority, any more seriously?'

Emily - if our traitorous government didn't take this seemingly untouchable minority so seriously with all the featherbedding and special treatment given them - then we wouldn't.

If they want sharia law, there's plenty available in Pakistan, Somalia, Sudan, Nigeria or Saudi Arabia. Apparently really happy populations living under it too.

C Powell

July 8th, 2008 5:21pm

You know what: I would vote like a shot for the party which said the following - to Muslims in particular - but to all "communities" (whether racial/religious/sexual or anything else I've forgotten): -

1. All citizens of the UK are entitled to be treated equally under the law of the UK i.e. English law (and in Scotland Scottish law) and under no other.

2. Everyone - as citizens - has the same rights as everyone else but no more than anyone else, no matter how special you think your religion/sex/colour/ethnic background is and no matter how aggrieved you feel. So don't even bother asking. It is not the job of government to soothe hurt feelings; ask your mother or grow up. If you do ask and accompany those requests/pleas with threats of or actual violence do not be surprised if your fellow citizens don't think much of you (at best) or despise/fear you (at worst).

3. If you want respect, don't demand it. Earn it by your conduct.

4. All citizens are expected to abide by all our laws in full.

5. You are free to live your own lives how you wish provided (a) you do not harm others; and (b) abide by our laws - see point 4. Don't even think about using "culture" (even if true) as a reason/excuse for harming others/failing to comply with our laws.

6. We will engage with you as individual citizens. We do not engage with any "community" through self-appointed "leaders". The only proper representation is through your MP.

7. All non-citizens living here must abide by our laws. No-one choosing to live in another country has a right to demand that that country accommodate its culture/laws to suit the visitor.

I think it about time that we stopped endlessly asking Muslims what they do or do not want or, indeed, paying any attention to such reports. All this endless focus is a result of the fact that a significant proportion of that community is prepared to indulge in violence or threats of violence to get its own way and the rest are either too scared or too ambivalent to do anything about it. We should simply say that all those who break the law will be prosecuted to the full and that the rest should concentrate on living their lives and making themselves useful members of society rather than endlessly demanding this, that and the other. The only reason we listen to what any so-called Muslim leaders have to say is because of the threat of violence so it is about time we told them that we will pay no attention to them until the threat of violence is removed and they start behaving like grown-up members of society and, further, that certain matters (such as what laws we live under) are non-negotiable, indeed, beyond discussion. 9That message might also be usefully conveyed to senior members of the Church / judiciary etc.) In the meanwhile we will take whatever measures we have to to protect all of us from the menace which exists. We accept that many Muslims do not approve of what is done or said in their name, which is why we must not give the impression that we consider all Muslims to be terrorist and must behave in our day-to-day dealings with courtesy and consideration to them as we should with all our neighbours. But, equally, they must understand that the behaviour of a minority reflect on what the rest of us feel about their community and religion and should think hard about what they can do to change the perception that the evil-doers amongst them have created. Shouting about "Islamophobia" is not an acceptable response.

Victor Purinton

July 8th, 2008 6:27pm

It's time for a speech. Where is Churchill when you need him?

Something like "In the United Kingdom there will always be one and only one legal code, based on strictly secular principles, that applies equally to all citizens. This position will never be compromised.

"If this is unsatisfactory to anyone, they should renounce their citizenship and leave the country."

Derah Yasque

July 8th, 2008 6:28pm

Emily Delors.

"Why should anyone take this particular majority, of a minority, any more seriously?"

Because very soon they will be the majority?
They already are in my town.

Wilfred

July 8th, 2008 6:31pm

Is your headline writer on holiday, James?

Frank Pulley

July 8th, 2008 7:14pm

Wilfred

Bwaaahahahahha!

Verity

July 8th, 2008 7:39pm

Wilfred: Cleverly spotted! Pete Hoskin is indeed on holiday! He should be pleased that his talent is so identifiable - and missed!

Alex

July 8th, 2008 8:25pm

I can't be alone in seeing the irony in this post linking to the dispatches program when one of it's points was that the media will take very strange slants on a story to get an anti-muslim angle.

Why did you go with the scary young muslim story when the stats tell us that even when presented with a very woolly question about sharia law, a majority of muslims either oppose it in Britain or are indifferent? Sure support isn't as low as I'd like but I really don't see signs of doom in those figures.

Elizabeth

July 8th, 2008 10:52pm

Give an inch and they will take a mile.
The Serbs allowed Islamics to have sharia and other islamic rights in Kosovo and found themselves bombed back to the stoneage when those same islamics claimed the State.
Beware that new islamic state/s are not going to be gradually created and then claimed - in England.
Remember the precedent has been set. If they have the 'population' they get the land (except of course if they are Palestinian.)
Look at Serbia and take care. It is a pattern set for 'oppressed' minorities the planet over and the Serbs have now had 15%, and the most historic, of their land taken and incorporated into a jihadist criminal state.
Well done George and Tone.

Steven

July 9th, 2008 4:14pm

Elizabeth: The Serb/Kosovo crisis was overseen by President Clinton. His handling of that issue (where, over a period of 80 years, Muslims ethnically cleansed 80% of Serbs from Kosovo, and then got US backing to remove the remaining 20%) will be seen as one of the great blunders of the 20th century.

frank

July 9th, 2008 4:25pm

these are just the ones who admit it

frank

July 9th, 2008 4:31pm

Emily Delors, you're quite intelligent aren't you? Learned, educated, astute? Yes, of course you are. The majority of young muslims, who will soon be replacing their parents as leaders of their communities, and who are raising the next generation of muslim children, want sharia law. But let's not take it seriously. It's not important.

And please show me the statistics that state the majority of the working class people want to bring back hanging? Or were you trying to be funny? I wonder what ivy league university's womans studies class daddy paid to babysit you for four years?

frank

July 9th, 2008 4:32pm

Emily Delors, you're quite intelligent aren't you? Learned, educated, astute? Yes, of course you are. The majority of young muslims, who will soon be replacing their parents as leaders of their communities, and who are raising the next generation of muslim children, want sharia law. But let's not take it seriously. It's not important.

And please show me the statistics that state the majority of the working class people want to bring back hanging? Or were you trying to be funny? I wonder what ivy league universities womans studies class daddy paid to babysit you for four years?

SAM

July 9th, 2008 10:53pm

What happened in Kosovo was only the outcome of what the main philosophy of islam. The root of all these evils is deep grounded its principle belief.

Who in this forum has not heard the video where openly muslim clerics proclaim that they will take over Britain, USA, Europe? Who? If you have not, it is better for you to watch the movie by Geert "FITNAH".

B.D.Vissian

July 23rd, 2008 10:26pm

Why Are Muslims so Keen to Come To Britain They Don't like its Laws they don't like its Culture Why Dont they Go to Countries that have Their Culture And Sharia Law and Live happy ever after.

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