Lyrical la-la lemmingland

Phillip Reece

The same people who are downplaying this incident are the same media types who would turn on a sixpence and accuse the government and security services of 'failure' if she committed a crime, on the basis that the government 'knew' she was a risk and didnt do anything about it, as if the papers wouldnt be full of 'what kind of a government lets known islamic terrorist sympathisers work at an airport'.

Irene Lancaster

This is a very thoughtful posting. Unlike some of the newspaper pundits and the judge in the case, I've taught people like the girl in question and they are, quite literally, deadly serious. More worryingly, they often have male friends who would not hestitate to carry out the sort of attacks mentioned in her writings. As for Shelley, etc, they wouldn't last long in any Muslim society. Far too heretical!

Verity

We don't normally refer to possessors of PhDs as Doctor in Britain, except in academic circles. Unless Bari's a medical doctor - and there's a scary thought - he should just be referred to as Mr Bakri.

N. Simon

The majority don't actually get it Melanie. And then they wonder why bombs go off and no-one had any warning... in fact, right now, they've been given plenty of warning, so they shouldn't be surprised when these little plots come to fruition.

Andy Dickinson

So what's worse? A discriminatory immigration policy or dealing with stuff like this? Along with the draconian legislation against terrorism suspects - to "guarantee" the safety of the majority.

And which is worse, the wars to civilise Afghanistan and Iraq - to include muslims in the globalised humanity "united in diversity" and deal with "radical Islam" - or a discriminatory immigration policy?

Lee Jakeman

She should be allowed to act out her fantasy. Take her to a disused army base, give her a hand grenade and tell her: "Okay - be a martyr. We'll come and clean up the mess when you're done".

field

Oh dear, Melanie - you're on the wrong track again on this I think and once again helping undermine a long tradition of liberty in this country. This really is another threat to our freedom. Remember, forty years ago when Trotskyism was fashionable lots of young people flirted with the concepts of violent revolution and had manuals of guerilla warfare etc on their shelves. No doubt they often confided to their diaries their desire to "sacrifice" themselves for "the revolution". In fact I'd be surprised if you didn't know some such people. Are you really saying that we should have been rounding up such people and putting them in prison? There is a world of difference between solo fantasising about Jihadism and conspiring with others to develop the means to undertake Jihadist activity. I'd be much more worried about the Muslim clerics engaged in subverting our democracy by promoting Shariah through various pressure groups (without advocating violent Jihad) than about this solo nutjob.

Herbert Thornton

Well said, Melanie. I can't say that it makes cheerful reading but it's realistic - as Britain will eventually discover to its cost unless it wakes up.

Kevyn Bodman

Continue to make it clear what she was convicted for, and CRUSH the mendacious talk that she was convicted for writing poetry.

David M.

If writing rubbish lyrics alone is a crime then please Santa can we have Billy Bragg hauled before a judge to answer for his! No, of course she wasn't convicted for that alone. The worrying thought is that this case is just the tip of a very large iceberg. Melanie is quite right to highlight the fact that much of the media has assumed its usual depressingly familiar & craven position. Neither denial nor dhimmitude is an option. The sedition of young people in muslim communities has to be confronted or we are in for some very "interesting times" ahead.

field

No one seems prepared to address the point that thousands of people who are now law abiding citizens once flirted with violent revolution in their youth - remember Chris Huhne and other students breaking down the door at an Oxford College? It was very common. They weren't just writing poetry. They had their books on guerilla warfare and made statements about wanting to die for the revolution. Are you saying those thousands should have gone to jail just for what they wrote in their diaries about their desire to eb part of a violent communist revolution? Is that what you and Melanie are saying now, in retrospect? After all, Leninist revolution was just as dangerous - probably more so - than modern Jihad has ever been. It led to he deaths of well over a hundred million. And presumably even now you wish to see a sweep of SWP bookstalls and have those spotty teenagers who confide in their diaries about their wish to "smash the bourgeoisie" to be carted off.

Stuart

The comparison with 60's and 70's Revolutionaries is completely false. While they may have fantasised about revolution and called the police "Pigs" they never actually started throwing molotov cocktails at tube commutersor ramming skodas into airport lounges. The terrorism threat today is very real and very deadly. I happen to think that the sentencing for this girl is marginally on the right side ONLY from the perspective that it is a great political weapon in responding to those Islamist who complained about this case in the first place. They now have to acknowledge a British Justice system that can also show leniency. But will they acknowledge that? Anyway, according to Dr Bari's previous outburst we are all heading towards a Nazi state. Is it any wonder the Government dropped MCB as any credible interface with teh Muslim Community. And yet, they still don't get it!

Andy Dickinson

Look at the knots people have tied themselves up in, because they cannot contemplate a discriminatory immigration policy.

field

Stuart - Well if we are discussing the level of threat then presumably during the IRA insurgency (which resulted in the deaths of some 3,000 citizens as compared with 50 from Jihadis) we should have acted against IRA sympathisers - there were plenty of those. I recall the father of a friend of mine used to have a record of IRA rebel songs. I am sure plenty of Irish teenagers have over the years confided in their diaries about their desire to die for Mother Ireland. Anyway, you are forgetting the leftie Angry Brigade who did use weapons in anger - and were supported by the counter culture folk. The point is that there are plenty of people who shoudl be hauled off to prison before this "Lyrical Terrorist" but our so called protectors in forces like the West Midlands Police prefer to target the messenger - Channel 4 Dispatches in this case - rather than tackle the problem.

Stuart

My comment is against the idea that lack of "discriminatory immigration" has anything to do with this. It would be an interesting contrast thesis and article for Melanie to write to state that the conditions that exist between the Muslim Community and their host country, Britain, is all the fault of Jews! The reason why is this. Jews have so successfully integrated into British society from immigrant status and become massive contributors to British culture, commerce, science, arts, law, medicine etc that the British Govt. decided to deal with unrest from radical Muslims by applying more liberal and benign policies in order to encourage them and hope that they would graft onto British society in the same way as Jews have. What they didn't realise that this actually encouraged radical Muslim groups and leaders to believe that they could manipulate the Government into changes in Foreign Policy or gifts of priveliege that would actually mean they didn't need to integrate so well because islands of convenience were created for them. Jews had no political jihad agenda but some radical Muslim groups do! (Did you know that our Finance Act contains Shariah compliant instruments?) Look at what Dr Bari has recently said about Britain becoming like the Nazis and "its only some silly kids downloading". What so emboldens him to say things which are divisive rather than integrating? Is it because MCB were once given the wrong message? Why couldn't they say to their own community "downloading beheading images and Mujahadeen war videos and images is wrong and must stop" Why not a campaign against this? Anyone, please feel free to develop this thesis as you wish. (Apologies to Melanie if she has already written on this contrast.)

Frank Pulley

I believe that Samina Malik should be allowed to say anything she likes - over a long period of time in a prison cell. And that all the prison visitors recruited to listen to her 'poetry', should be from the survivors or relatives of the victims of 9/11 and subsequent atrocities perpetrated by militant islamists. Not quite Voltaire's ethos on the free speech ishoo , but then - the world changes while remaining the same - as some other French smartass pointed out.

JJS

You cannot argue rationally with field -- waste of time.

Greg

Well all I have to say is to quote Sir General Charles Napier. " Go ahead and have your funeral pyres and practice your customs and along side it we shall build out gallows and practice our !

Fr Frank Gelli

It seems best that Samina has not gone to jail. It would have made her into a martyr. Both of jihadists and of British liberals - no mean feat! But I wonder whether she should not have insisted in being jailed. After all, not much of a serious jihadist if she is afraid of a few months inside. Unless it is true that she meant it all as a joke, in which case it is right she has been spared the clink. Fr Frank