Why would the English working class consider voting Labour again?

cuffleyburgers

Correct Rod, the true extent of the squalor of labour's motivations have been thrown into sharp relief by this sad dispute.

The fact is that all sectors of society have been rpyally shafted and betrayed by these student union marxists, and the country can never be the same again. Never.

The only people who would want to vote for labour are a few single mothers on benefits and an army of quangocrats; unfortunately there are enough of them in marginal constituencies that it is too soon to callthe outcome of the next election.

What a betrayal.

Roy

My experience of being a working class mortal in England goes back to the 40's and 50's, a completely different country then. Let me make one important statement here regarding the working class and the changes that have occurred since then. No sounding board was ever taken of what profound changes were about to begin in the country. Not the remotest inquiry of what the people thought. From then until now the working people of Britain have not been party to any discussion or even knowledge of any agenda that might have been forthcoming. Any referendum on important questions of changing the racial mix of the country or what mix it would amount to, was not taken. Nor was there, to my knowledge, any referendum on joining the EU. Nor any discussion of what this meant in regard to movements of labour. The working people should have had it pointed out to them what was taking place. Not just foisted on to them bit by bit as time went on. In all a disgusting social experiment amounting to the disenfranchising of the British people to their land.

Boudicca

Spot on Rod. The statement that the sub-contractor had to bring an entire workforce over from Italy/Portugal because they needed a common language was the most crass public statement I've heard in years. The ONLY common language throughout the EU - and pretty much the rest of the world - is English yet this argument was used to prevent the employment of English workers.

This Labour Government is going to get the hiding of its life when an election is finally called. It may even see the total destruction of Labour as a functioning political party - and it deserves it.

We are told by Mandelson - an unelected, alleged fraudster - that we must bow to the rules of the EU which we didn't vote for because we were denied a vote. Who on earth is he to tell us what we must and mustn't think. The arrogance is breath-taking. Mind you, he seems to 'have done a Gordon' in the past couple of days and gone to ground: so we have two McCavities 'leading' the Labour Govt.

There will be a price for Labour to pay for this. Even their heartlands may become marginal constituencies - but the beneficiary may well be the BNP. If nothing else, to give Labour the kicking it deserves.

Dave Exton

It's not surprising that members of the government and the rest of the wealthy law makers in this country welcome the cheap plumbers, gardeners, maids and all of the rest. After all they see all of the benefit, and there is no chance that they will have to become one of them

Wilhelm

Ron Piddle

It always amuses me when middle class student slackers like 40 something Ron who writes for the Guardian pretends to be a salt of the earth working class geezer.

Ron must be going through a mid life crisis.

Rhoda Klapp

Good article, but it does ignore the part the Tories have played in the ongoing betrayal of the British people, working class or not. Discredit where it is due. Now, who shall we vote for to fix this?

MikeF

The major irony is that the Labour Party still depends on the votes of the white working class to get elected. It can't do that entirely on the basis of its middle class supporters and ethnic minority enclaves.
But at the same time many Labour activists and ideologues despise those very people whose votes they need - in large part because they feel that by voting for Margartet Thatcher the white working class betrayed them. This is one of the roots of multiculturalism - an extravagant exaltation of the virtues of ethnic minorities as a substitute for that older working class that is in turn just a disguise for the self-referential elitism that underpins so much leftwing thought. Didn't Bertolt Brecht in one of his rare moments of insight - let's face it he was a Stalinist toady most of the time - make a comment about governments 'elelcting a new people'. That is exactly what is happening now.

Mandeep

Oh dear Roy, you make it sound like you poor mortals had all us blackies and brownies dumped on you whilst your back was turned as some sort of huge multi-party multi-decade conspiracy. I'm afraid your naivety is only compounded by your offensive idea that globalisation, immigration, liberalisation and the other tools have have improved Britain's wealth is one great 'experiment'.

When you suggest a referendum on racial mix, what did you expect? A little questionnaire asking what % of black people you are prepared the tolerate? What % of brown asylum seekers you can handle and what % can be left to die? How many white people you wanted on your street?!

Peter Whittle

A superb piece Rod. I wrote about this at Conservativehome -take a look at some of the comments - the first one is a classic: http://conservativehome.blogs.com/centreright/2009/01/a-protest-we-sh.html

David

Of course, the Total spokesman may also not be telling the truth - maybe it's just easier to hire one set of sub-contractors as a job-lot. Hasn't the same thing been happening with British workers in places like Spain?

Didn't the Thatcher voters betray their fellow blue-collar Britons by supporting anti-union legislation and enjoying cheap consumer goods from abroad? All the while refusing to pay for a better education system so our workforce could be more competitive. Didn't some union leaders of the 70s and early 80s also betray their members through their poor judgement?

In many people's eyes, the Labour Party only became electable when it distanced itself from the unions and embraced free-trade, neo-liberalism and The City, so that 'run on the pound' and 'winter of discontent' headlines no longer had the power to scare.

Still, it's encouraging to see the Spectator arguing for more power to the unions.

Finally, wasn't there a shortage of plumbers before the Poles arrived? Haven't Italians had the right to work here for decades?

Wilhelm

Rod Piddle in his youth was a member of the extreme Socialist Workers Party, he worked for the liebour shadow cabinet between 1984-1987, Then he went to Uni and became a slacker. After that he joined the BBC which is Liberal Central and writes for the Guardian.

Rods report card aint pretty , is it ?

Hysteria

what Rhoda said

rod liddle

Pete, thanks mate - tried to find your piece and I can't, presumably down to my usual technophobia Couldn't bung me a link could you? I think you have my email?

Mandeep - dunno what you're on about, mate. Some people can see racism in a handful of dust.

Wilhelm - I haven't worked for The Guardian for six years, you dumb monkey. The rest, mind, is of course spot on.

rod liddle

........and Rhoda, Hysteria, sure, point taken. I just thought it was a given.

Wilhelm

Rod puts up the Nuremburg defence and squeeks

''I haven't worked for The Guardian for six years.''

Thats what they all say, it was all a dream, it didnt work for Albert Speer and it wont work for you, kid.

rod liddle

I don't think Albert Speer worked for The Guardian. Maybe you're confusing him with Gary Younge.

And it's "squeaks", not "squeeks".

And actually it DID do Speer some good, given that he wasn't executed.

Newcastle are going down this year, don't you think?

Winston Smith

Rod,

I have to say, what an excellent article. You sum up the problems in our society, caused by NuLabour exceptionally well. Although I am of a libertarian, I am a right wing one. You tend to be the same albeit of the left. I would class you as a true Labourite, that is, before Marxism invaded its ranks.
What I find really interesting is how the political parties have completely shifted from where they once were. The NuLabour Party is now a Fascist Party and nothing at all to do with the working classes. The Conservative party have now become the NuLiberal, Social Democratic Party, with their flagship paper the Daily Telegraph following suit as it allows the likes of Mary Riddell to post, quite a lot. The Liberals, well, they're probably going in the direction of pre Marxist invaded Labour and oddly enough the BNP are turning into where the Conservative party was in the pre 80's with a dash of old Labour thrown in(when it comes to backing the British Workforce).

I did enjoy the article very much and I will also add that the abominable NuLabour party are pushing more and more people towards the BNP. Our Armed Force's servicemen and women will predominately vote BNP after appalling treatment of them by NuLabour. Our Indigenous working classes will vote for the BNP more also, as they are the only party supporting them in their strikes and fight for British jobs for British people. Those angry at in the UK at NuLabour's selling off of the UK to Europe will vote for the BNP as the Conservatives really aren't great opposition, which shows they'll be even more useless in government, more so because they tend to agree with NuLabour quite a lot instead of opposing them.

Like it or not the BNP will make considerable gains next election and this is all down to their manifesto which is 100% geared towards the British people and Working classes, something that NuLabour, Liberal and Conservatives have completely forgotten about in their drive to become top politicians in Europe, helping to make the world a better place, of course, at the the expense of the British people.

I also have to say that I too for the very FIRST time, next election, will be voting for the BNP as well. They are the only party speaking up for me and many others. Don't get me wrong, there is also the English Democrats and the Veritas party, but unfortunately they are not a big enough party yet to make an impact and I really can't wait years for them to be so. Something needs to be done or else the UK will continue on its destination right down the plughole into a pre EU, former Soviet Block, country.

Daniel Deyl

Dear Mr Little, the piece goes from the heart, and it shows. The argument is put forcefully but only in half. It may well be true that New Labour has betrayed its core voters and that being a blue-collar worker in Britain (or in any other major country) is not muh fun nowadays. But where is the remedy, and what should it actually achieve? The outrage caused by Total's frank statement is understandable. But how do you fix that? Should the law tell emplyoers who to hire, or is it their free choice? Are you ready to limit their choice so drastically? And how exactly? Quotas? It may well be the case of the remedy being worse that the problem.
(Or is it just the PC hypocrisy behind the situation that is deplorable? If so, and should it be removed somehow, it still would do British workers little good.)
Or does the article simply describe the feeling that, put in George Orwell's words, "their life is missing something that we used to have"?
I'd rather expect you to give us at least a hint of what you think should be done to improve things.
That said, it is still a pretty good piece.
Yours sincerely,
Daniel Deyl

Tomas

One small point. Most Asians speak a common language- ENGLISH. In fact most Western Oriental Gentlemen speak ENGLISH.

So once our Government has raised our language capabilities, basic skills and a desire to work, and finally gotten used to the fact that we are a tiny nation adrift in a very big and competitive world, well mybe we might just about begin to get back on track....... because life is no longer presented to us on a plate as it once was many many years go.

Mandeep

Rod, if you don't understand my previous comment, it is because I was replying to *Roy*. Yes, Roy, with a "y", not a "d". Don't you know how to spell your own name? Or perhaps your ego is struggling with the concept that I like to read other comments than yours.

Richard

I am surpised that someone like Yasmin Alhibai Brown has not pointed out, with great disdain, that these workers are 'hideously white'.

Oliver Chettle

Left-wing politics has always been a movement made by and for middle class rebels with mild personality problems derived from childhood difficulties with their parents and other authority figures. Its core purpose is to transfer power from the authority figures to these middle class rebels. Working class socialism is largely a myth constructed by middle class lefties. The workers want their interests to be respected, but that doesn't make them socialists. The tragedy of the last hundred years in the west is that the democratic right has not exposed this conspiracy more effectively, and made its own alliance with the working class for the benefit of decent people from all classes.

Harry O

"If you were from the English white working class, would you ever even consider voting Labour again"?
It's not just the working class who ask themselves that question. Anyone who is dependent on an income from work to pay the bills is asking which party might actually deliver something of what they promise by providing some social stability, political honesty and less personal interference. The answer, whatever it might be, unfortunately is not the Tories, who offer little in the way of an alternative approach. That the BNP is even seriously considered shows both the paucity of current political thought and the depth of white despair in finding a genuine and representative alternative unburdened by the political dogma and cant of both the Tories free enterprise and Labour's post marxism. The real worry is that this is most closely offered by the BNP.

Roy

One could write a book or two on the deplorable actions of various governments of the last 60 years. My contention is that no great judgment was entered into by policy makers and legislators of what they set in motion. Never mind what the people thought had they ever been consulted. It seems common methodology by politicians to not mention in detail their true agenda, but give bland inexact half truths when electioneering. Such are the costs and how the exalted democratic system we so admire can be engineered to suit the ones who take the time to work it to their advantage or their social ideological mind set. It is these liberalist engineers who work tirelessly in their darkened back rooms whilst the rest of the country is at the pub or the football match that set the ball rolling towards calamity.

Archie

Lindsay, Rutland; I even know a bloke who insists he lives in Carmarthenshire, if you please! Nice to see "ordinary people" putting the boot in - in every respect, albeit posthumously - to that ghastly, effete creep Heath and all his pathetic works!

Fred Kite

Left wing unions such as Unite have been the first to stab their members in the back in the name of "diversity".
A press release, put up on the Amicus/Unite website dated 5 December 2008, describes in detail how that union was actively helping foreign workers in Britain.

Under the heading "Unite Bringing the Migrant Community Together" that union announced that it would, together with Unionlearn, be hosting an event in Stoke on Trent "which will give information, advice and guidance to migrant workers working in the UK."
"Unite members and migrant workers will have access to translators, employment law solicitors and local college staff. The Employment law solicitors will provide the migrant workers with any legal advice they may need and can offer them the time and assistance that our members would not usually be able to receive."
Note that last sentence: the Unite Union is actually saying that it will provide services to foreign workers that its own members "would not usually be able to receive." In other words, the Union actively discriminates against its own members.

Nick R

As I appear to be banned elsewhere in the Barclay Bros empire, I don't expect this to appear, as behind the "One country two systems" smokescreen lurks the same enforcer regime, I am sure. Anyway, a most succinct analysis, and like you, I was taught about the sub-divisions of Lincolnshire- swept away by grocer Heath and his whizz kid Walker back in 1974. Indeed, I got an A grade in my geography O level.I, imagine, just knowing that Lincolnshire is in England would get you an A at GCSE- a la Jade Goody- "East Anglia- where's that?" level of knowledge we have today. Elsewhere, as published in the daily part of the empire, these self-same men were getting a right royal kicking from a self-confessed exile from Lincolnshire. They're all bone idle- won't get up at 4am to pick sprouts, and they're all ignorant racists etc. We just need to remind ourselves who it was that created this mass of uneducated, work shy, benefits junkies that this member of the "commentariat" was lambasting. Thank you Rod for a proper analysis and a reminder that there are some people still out there who have some observations made from experience rather than brainwashed wishful thinking gleaned from a life spent gazing down from ivory towers keeping well clear of the REALITY which is the bone-crunching reality of trying to earn a crust in the deluded kingdom. The men protesting in Lindsey were workers- not shirkers.

John Thomas

It is said here (MikeF) that Labour depends on the white working class for election. Indeed, but it also depends on the Roman Catholic vote - and in the period since Blair, Labour has trashed everything the RC church believes in. If Catholics woke up to the fact of who the real enemy of all their beliefs is, and, in the next election simply abstained, then Labour would be consigned to history. But will they? Apparently, many US RCs voted for that other arch-abortion legaliser, B. H. Obamessiah ...

peter whittle

Rod - nope, I don't sem to have your email anymore. But if you go to Centreright.com, part of Conservativehome.com, you'll find my piece under the title A Protest we Should Support

Patrick Harris

No sympathy then for the workers who have not been educated to the same high standard as Liddle and who are therefor not able to express their feelings with such flair.
They believed people, like Liddle, who gave credence to the belief that the European Commission had the workers best interests at heart, gave credence to the lie that the Government had their (the workers) best interests at heart,
They believed this misinformation because of it's source, the cognoscenti, the government, supposedly, the guardians of their freedoms.
They are now beginning to wake up to the lies and propaganda - they aint happy.
We will soon see if they put their future and the future of their children above X Factor, Corrie or Enders.

Minnie Ovens

A Unique experience this!
One white middle class Anglo-Saxon positioning himself solidly with the unions and the working class.
And I dare say a majority of other middle class types as well.
It is in the dawning realization that, for many a decade, while grumbling about the unions, it is not they who have been the "Barbarians at the Gate" but our own Governments.
Since the mid sixties Government has permitted excess immigration under the pretext that it is good for the economy.
And so it is when it is in small numbers and the immigrants have skills which would enhance our economy.
But that has not been so for many years. We have three million unemployed, nearly by government decree, who have no hopes of employment and whose children have been bred to accept this, and therefore the shame, desolation and inability to aspire.
In the meantime a very bloated bureaucracy has arisen in the public sector which feeds on unlimited immigration because it doesn't care about retraining those left behind British workers.
No jobs, dumbed down apirations and education. I don't think that was John Stuart Mill's philosophy and certainly not Beveridge's intention.
We've replaced the class system with the Public versus the Private sectors.
And the polulation continues its exponential rise in a country which is starting to feel the negative effects that overpopulation brings.
God help us all.

Dee Adario

Just how low can this government go to cover the fact it has sold our jobs off to the EU. It comes to something when working people are accused of xenophobia by their own crass and habitually lying government just for wanting to keep food on the table and a roof over their heads.
Is it also true that since the redundancies at Corus UK, Corus UK are actually advertising for steel workers in Poland to work in the UK. Perhaps you could check this out Rod.
And we have not seen the last of these strikes, when the French contract is started in Nottinghamshire for the new power station, there will be a further influx of EU workers to the determent I think of UK jobs. Keep up the good work Rod.

tally

you could here the sigh of relief when it was found polish workers were among the strikers as well. It seems English people have to have a few minorities in their ranks before their complaints are taken seriously.
A scottish MP has this to say about the English "Published Date: 05 February 2009
By ROSS LYDALL AND EMILY PYKETT
WILDCAT strikes will become a regular occurrence if European law continues to be used as an excuse for protests fuelled by xenophobia, a senior Scottish MP warned last night.

Michael Connarty, whose constituency covers the Grangemouth oil refinery affected by unofficial action, said the week of unrest owed more to hostility towards foreigners working in England than genuine grievances against European laws.

He said he was concerned long-standing working practices in Scotland that allow workers living within 40 miles of a plant to be prioritised for work were at risk of being compromised amid "nationalist" protests breaking out south of the Border.

the Labour MP for Linlithgow and East Falkirk, told The Scotsman: "I don't think this is about the legislation. What I think this has become is a neo-nationalist argument. I really do believe that it's not about protecting the rights of workers.

"I'm not surprised it's flared up in England. There have been a lot of signals. There is a natural protectionist instinct and a natural instinct against people from other countries. I don't think it has any place in Scotland and I hope we will be able to root it out."

Mr Connarty said that the "half-and-half" deal to ensure 50 per cent of jobs went to UK workers at the Lindsey factory would "take the heat" out of the current dispute".
He is just another cheeky bastard scotsman who wants Grangemouth ringfenced but in England we're all racists.
I want him and the rest of his ignorant arrogant clan out of English affairs as soon as possible.

Stephen Gash

I originate from Lincolnshire and now live in the most deprived part of the UK, Cumbria (like Humberside, one of Heath's Euro-political artifices).
Rod's article highlights why the EU will really never work (unless corruption is used as a measure).
The USA was founded on a common language. A person from Seattle can get a job in Miami and converse with the local Floridians. Yes it also has a common currency, but without the common tongue it is doubtful that the USA would be the economic battery it has been for two centuries.
The other reason the USA has worked, is that it is a federal system. The EU is a soviet-style autocracy. The UK has become an autocracy. If it had been a truly federal system with each constituent nation retaining its own parliament and fiscal powers, we would not now see the malcontent of the English workers that had until now just festered quietly. Unions, the UK and the EU, are merely a front to rob the English.
I don't think the growing hostility will remain levelled only at Italians and Portuguese. The accusing finger will also be pointed at the Scots, who by the way, are protected in Scotland. Scottish laws prioritise workers living within 40 miles of a workplace in Scotland. This is illegal in England under EU law, but one is willing to bet that similar protectionist arrangements exist in Italy and Portugal, and undoubtedly in France.
It's time the English started to look after themselves, in true EU fashion, instead of playing the boyscout.

Wilhelm

Rod Tiddle

Whats eating you ?
Not invited to the BBC radio 4 Christmas party or did Waitrose run out of fair trade coffee.

Which is it, kid ?

Dee Adario

Nick R
February 6th, 2009 11:45am
As I appear to be banned elsewhere in the Barclay Bros empire,

It seems the Telegraph comments have lost the plot and just have too many time gaps on their postings, they are just not letting people's comments be posted anymore! Or the staff don't get in because of the snow !

Nicholas Storey

So Rodders was in the glue business - now we approach the explanation for all the junk furniture jokes. Maybe MFI was his guv'nor's biggest customer...

Nicholas Storey

peter whittle - Should your reply not read "Rodders - nope, I don't seem to have your e-mail any[or no]more, MATE."?

Rod James

Theonly reason an idigenous working class male would still vote labour would be out of a perversegenerational loyalty. this feeling of betrayal is not new and was expressed to me when I retired in 2002 by the a group of employed skilled artisans in the public bar of the White Horse in thatdank county of Holland. The politest of which was"dont want to retire back here mate,we'er second class citizens in our own country" But, with an out of touch PC political class that goes straight from university to politics no-one was, or is ,listening. Wait for the explosion if things get worse.

Max

Just to add to Mr Liddle’s comments (much less eloquently).

The ordinary English people have been betrayed and lied to on a daily basis for years. Even simple things. We are often told about how rich we are - fifth or sixth largest economy and all of that. It’s not true and it's irrelevant. The only sensible measure of wealth is per-capita. Methods of calculation differ but some show Britain was about 23rd in the world.

So, the people of every reasonable country anyone can think of, have a higher standard of living than us. We may not be rich, but we have been betrayed in every way possible.

The quality of education is low, but this is no problem to our educationalists. They just falsify exam results by making exams easier - as is generally acknowledged.

Much of the deterioration in education is due to the general uselessness of our education leaders (trying to teach children to read without properly explaining phonetics, and then taking 40 years to discover it doesn’t work - that sort of thing) but it is obvious that standards were bound to decline when schools had to accommodate large numbers of children who do not speak English, and it is also obvious that the only people who would suffer would be the ordinary English people.

And do our leaders know or care what it must be like for ordinary English people when they discover that their children are now members of a minority race in their local school, though it is situated just around the corner, AND speakers of a minority language?

Joe Brit is well aware that he counts as nothing in the minds of his leaders. He is to be sacrificed if deemed necessary to some higher, but vague, all encompassing new world order.

Britain is backward, dowdy and poor. Our roads, our streets, our hospitals, our schools are often filthy but always overcrowded and bursting at the seams. There is little to lift the spirits. And on top of all that, the new population is highly visible yet sullen, complaining - even hostile, and when not complaining, silent.

Most newcomers to this country do not integrate, do not assimilate and do not identify with the host country. If there is any integration to be done it is the ordinary English people who are required to do it. They are the only ones who must adapt, must accommodate, must turn a blind eye; and most of all, they must keep their mouths shut. That is the new fact of life as experienced by the ordinary English person.

I remember when Britain was a nice friendly sort of place. Everyone knew where they stood, could say hello. (Children could play with highly prized and much loved gollywogs and come to no harm.) Now people ignore each other, distrust each other. There is little sense of national identity or sense of belonging, no comfort, no rest. Everyone is on their guard all the time. We avoid eye contact, we question what we say, how we look. And almost everywhere is grey and dreary and everywhere is overcrowded.

Is it surprising that no-one seems to care about anything anymore in this country? Is it surprising that there is little desire to improve and overcome? Is it surprising that when a small drop of snow falls everyone just downs tools and takes a day off?

What on Earth do our leaders expect – patriotism?

The people required to be good citizens and clear the snow and keep the trains running are constantly denigrated, their interests dismissed and their values derided. (Why decent young English people join the armed forces and put their lives at risk in Afghanistan is beyond me.)

The ordinary English people want to get their own back and I applaud them for it. I hope they do a lot more than just not voting Labour.

Patrick

No sympathy then for the workers who, unlike Liddle, were not educated to his standard and therefor unable to express their feelings with such flair.
It's because they believed the misinformation, put about by the cognoscenti, that the European Commission had their (the workers) best interests at heart. they also believed that the UK government had their best interests at heart, it should be so, now they find it aint, they are not happy.
We shall soon see if they have the balls to fight for their future and the future of their children, I don't hold out much hope - the call of X Factor, Corrie and Enders is far greater.

Max

Mandeep.

Most Asians seem to define themselves by their or their parent’s, country of origin. So it is normal for people born in England to describe themselves as say, Indian. I don't know your place of origin, but ask yourself, how would you feel if people very different to yourself decided that they wanted to live in that country and the government decided that it would be wrong to stop them.

The numbers going there are so huge that the future of your country will no longer be decided by your people but instead by the newcomers - who make it clear that they do not like you and refuse to integrate or assimilate or identify with you.

You are not allowed to complain. You have to accept that your way of life will become extinct.

That is the situation faced by the English people and is now unstoppable. Birth rates alone make that certain.

All of the above ignores the relative development of the peoples concerned. Our future is in the hands of people from backward countries and even includes the reintroduction of mad religion.

Please don’t use that old left wing trick of declaring that England has always been subject to immigration. It has not been in any really sense. Previously people have come here from close by and were indistinguishable from the host peoples. (How many of Huguenot decent would now declare themselves to be French? None, I should think.)

David Lindsay

A pity about the "English" bit in Rod Liddle's superb piece. Workers in all four parts of the United Kingdom have risen as the one that they are.

As to where we go from here - http://www.britishpeoplesalliance.org.uk, info@britishpeoplesalliance.org.uk

Fred Bishop

We voted for these people to run our country. They are mostly foreigners from the minor countries of the UK.
Now if you consider that statement to be racist, xenophobic or any other word used as a tool of English supression, then look at what those Scots have done to England. They did so only after they had insulated their homeland with what is effectively heavily subsidised independence.
We need rid of them. We do not need a change of government we need a change of politicians. All of them. Then we need a voice for England to speak for the English people, get out of Europe and then start negotiations with the countries of Europe and the independent minor countries of the UK. To do that in a way that ensure4s no more racist exploitation of the English we have to have an English Parliament. We need to start looking at the smaller parties like the English Democrats.

Matt

It's not just the working class, Rod.

Lee Barnes

I am white working class.

I understand that my role in modern Britain is to volunteer for the army then die in foreign wars whilst mass immigration makes me a stranger in my own country.

I am aware that I am supposed to stay silent as the jobs I used to be able to get are taken away and given to foreign workers.

I realise that the Labour Party are now Fabians in the pockets of the globalists and that anyone that says the role of government is to protect the financers and not the workers is to be called a 'xenophobe'.

I also know that I have a choice and I will excercise that choice in the ballot box when I vote BNP.

We may be despised, but we are waking up and when we do - watch out.

Rasputing

I do have sympathy for the argument that British workers have suffered because Eastern European workers are willing to live 6 to a room. However, what Rod Liddle - and many of his countrymen - need to realise is that the British workforce has severe shortcomings. I have lived in the U.S. and Eastern and Western Europe. I was shocked at the poor skills and work ethic of the average British tradesman. I only use Polish workmen, not just because they are cheaper (again, it is a fair argument that they undercut local wages), but because they are miles ahead in terms of attitude and quality. I am also amazed by the apparent lack of awareness of this problem. THe decline of British manufacturing is instead attributed to, inter alia, Thatcher, cheap foreign competition, and lack of investment in education. The last one was cited by a reader
and is absolutely wrong. How much do you think Poland or Italy spends on their schools? MOre than the UK? The real problem is that the lack of discipline and standards in the schools and families. Sorry to rant. Britain obviously has great advantages; there is a reason it attracts so much immigration. But the country needs to engage in some serious self-reflection as to the competitiveness of its workforce.
Why would Total favour bringing Italian workers over, after all? Can't imagine they are cheaper.
NB: saw an interview with some of the striking workers. One was drinking a beer..it was before 7 am.

streetlegal

Yes, and note also this other double standard: it is xenophobic or racist to oppose foreigners . . . as long as those foreigners are from within the construction known as the EU. It is only xenophobic towards some foreigners--not all the others who aren't in the EU.

Richard

I would say that these men are, wait for it, middle-class.

RobHK

@Max
"I don't know your place of origin, but ask yourself, how would you feel if people very different to yourself decided that they wanted to live in that country and the government decided that it would be wrong to stop them.
The numbers going there are so huge that the future of your country will no longer be decided by your people but instead by the newcomers - who make it clear that they do not like you and refuse to integrate or assimilate or identify with you.
You are not allowed to complain. You have to accept that your way of life will become extinct."

Very well put. You could ask a Palestinian, for example.

Marc O'Polo

Excellent article. These things have needed saying for years. If ever one pointed it out, one was vilified and you started to think that you were wrong and the NuLab propogandists were right. No they weren't. Just one point, by way of an example: Of course Poles (&c) will do menial tasks on rubbish pay. They come from a country that pays a third even of that; they're prepared to stay six to a room (as Rod says); they're not born and bred here, thus not harbouring arrogant notions of actually getting decent pay and a not-altogether-crap existence. They're going to go back to Poland (&c.) NuLab have just taken the piss out of the working classes something rotten. And this has been blisteringly obvious for years.

streetlegal

Note also this other double standard: it is xenophobic or racist to oppose foreigners . . . as long as those foreigners are from within the construction known as the EU. The alleged xenophobic applies to an exclusive set of migrants--not all the others who aren't (yet) in the EU.
Mandleson et al are thus themselves racist by limiting their inclusivity to the EU.
Of course in time all jobs in the UK will be open to all comers from around the globe, not just the EU. In fact, this is already happening in places--eg technology companies who threaten to move your job to India or elsewhere unless you up your performance.

John

"Some people can see racism in a handful of dust."

So there is plenty of racism in the more dusty countries, then?

Maybe Mandeep knows one.

JohnAnt

It has occurred to me reading this article that possibly one reason why Cameron is making no attempt to woo the disaffected Labourites of the North of England is that he knows that (like the Scots) they'll simply vote for a different party. In this case, possibly the BNP. That would save Cameron a lot of time - split the Labour vote and still win a majority in the H of C.

Dave

Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick......................!

Anne Palmer

Dig a little deeper Rod. I feel sure these workers are paid at least the minimum wage fair enough, but are deductions being made for their board and lodgings? But where do they sleep? One to a room? Five to a room? How many on a "barge"? Even so, they may indeed be happy with any arrangements made because they are still earning more money than they could do in their own Country and who can blame them for that? No one, I certainly can't. But is it fair on British workers?

Dig a little deeper Rod. Through the EU's Competition Laws, many of our firms and essential services are owned by foreigners. How many brought their own workers in from the continent? How many are working on the Olympic site?

Dig a little deeper. Each hotel here in the UK and Ireland has many foreign workers. I talk to them because I like languages and in the liking I find out where they stay, how many to a room and when i ask why are there no 'locals' anymore, the answer is always the same. "Oh they do not want the work". Yet, think back and the local always did the work and were happy to do so.

There are firms here in the UK that recruit British people to work abroad under the same conditions set out above, they do not mind their "Spending money" because they are seeing more of "Europe" than they would normally do. It can be a whole can of worms being opened up, but perhaps one that should be opened up. Who knows what the outcome may be?

Dig a little deeper Rod and you will find that if Government continues to ignore the people, the whole thing will flair up in their faces but it will not just affect this Government because the people are (at last) beginning to realise that most, if not ALL politicians are the same. They want the money, the perks, the vast expenses, but they do not want to Govern, they want foreigners in Brussels to do it for them.

paul gilboy

right on Rod the white working class have no political representation. Our people are treated worse than animals. When europe throws up barriers to chinese goods all the british companies who upsticks to take advantage of cheap labour will see their vast profits slashed.

David Short

Much of the English working class has already given up on voting Labour, and has done so ever since the dawn of new Labour.

New Labour cynically dismissed the views of much of its solid constituencies, which is why the vote and turnout has been much lower since 97 in the North and elsewhere.

Labour still gets in, but with a reduced majority, because so far the working class in the north has not opted for the BNP.

This has happened in a great many northern constituencies. The safest Labour seat in the land, South Shields (the only constituency that has never had a Tory MP since the 1832 Reform Act, was given to David Miliband, against great opposition up there.

That's how Labour has treated its natural constituency, in order to get voted in as the government by snapping up middle-class constituencies, using the charm of the nice public schoolboy, Mr Blair.

Which is why we have a government voted in by fewer than 23 per cent of the electorate, and has absolutely no ideology, direction or policy whatever, except to stay in government.

A. MacAulay

Anyone who protests against "Eyeties" looks a complete idiot of course. But how much more so to start a protest action against the presence of "Pork and Cheese" in England. It doesn't only sound daft, but also sad. Also just a little aside, Rod, the term is Gastarbeiter, and I would suggest consulting the excellent Leo, http://dict.leo.org/, when one feels an occasional need for a Fremdwort.

And Wilhelm, joining the SWP and then leaving it is not so unusual for a young man. One discovers that marxist skirt is mostly barking and then dreadfully hierarchical and only interested in big-time dialectical materialists, and that to become a revolutionary one has to learn tons of really boring agitprop and attend endless meetings where points of order are debated for hours and hours. In the end one leaves to have more fun somewhere else because one realises that its the rich wot gets the pleasure and its the poor wot gets the pain.

Of course anyone who joins the SWP and stays in it is a masochist of the worst sort and should be under observation from the Special Branch.

Max

Though not always a great admirer of the USA; it has to be acknowledged that they still retain a modicum of free speech over there and it is still possible to hear views which are not outright lefty-loon or refined to the point of nullity, which now masquerades as right-of-centre here.

Two things the anti-lefty loons in the USA are agreed upon.

One: the benefits to the economy of mass immigration, if they exist at all, are grossly exaggerated because migrants send home the bulk of their earnings; thus shorting-out the normal economic cycle.

Two: Lefty loon governments encourage mass immigration because this is likely to change the political structure of the nation sharply to the left. Short term gain for them trumps everything else.

When I first found myself watching people ON TELEVISION articulating these views it made me came over all-wobbly.

Am I allowed to watch this I wondered? Surely there must be laws against this sort of thing. I’m glad to say there was no unnecessary nudity - in fact all the commentators kept their clothes on - but I still felt dirty.

Such a thing would NEVER be allowed here. If it ever did, it would be like catching your grandmother having sex with a donkey.

Wobbly indeed, but don’t worry, it will never be allowed to happen here.

@RobHK

Palestine is a pretty good analogy and has long occurred to me. I often wonder whether to feel sorry for them or reflect that what has happened to them is happening to us.

Interestingly on a TV programme called “50 Things You Need to Know about British History” (or words to that effect) one of the presenters said that we are now being colonised by the old subjects of the British Empire. He said it loud and clear - we are being colonised. Who could doubt it?

This is a failing country, which has been in sharp decline all of my lifetime. We have little or no industry left and we have not been in a position to achieve anything of substance on our own for a long time. Our much vaunted “City of London” financial services are entirely foreign owned. Now we find the one good spot - our Banking system - has been mismanaged to a degree that is without precedent.

Our public services are utterly corrupt, being at the same time overmanned and yet mysteriously incapable. Our educationalists have no idea how to educate children and our schools have left the general population unable to compete in the wider world.

Most of the people coming here are from societies more often interested in religion or their “culture” and other ethereal affairs, than they are in new ideas or wealth creation or improving lives.

But to return to Mr Liddle’s point.

For generations the people who are supposed to protect the interests of the British people have done nothing of the kind. The Labour Party in particular seems to hate the British. (And they have a special contempt for the interests of the English - hence the West Lothian question - which no other democratic nation on Earth would stand for.)

In international affairs we always come off worst.

Britain has the longest coast-line in Europe. Anyone would think that Britain would have the dominant fishing industry. But no. Somehow, many other nations – some of them hundreds of miles from Britain - have rights to the coast of Britain that British fishermen don’t have.

"Donating” our fishing waters to those other European countries was the price we paid to join the EU and works out at about six billion (with a "B")pounds per year. When our contribution to the EU (which brings to us the “benefit” of foreign workers taking our British jobs) is worked-out, does anyone include that in the cost each year? Of course not.

Also, does anyone know of any other EU country that gave away an important national resource in order to join? I thought not.

And, in the matter of farm subsidies it seems that our farms just don’t QUITE qualify for the same levels as other countries. Something to do with the size of our farms. Funny that.

Then there is the question of our rebate negotiated by Mrs Thatcher. We have given up most of that on the promise that changes to the CAP would follow. Another mystery - there has been no changes. Our so-called leaders have been conned yet again (assuming they tried or even cared).

Recently on television we were told that our precious Labour politicians made our pig farmers adopt improved conditions for our pigs, making our pig-meat uncompetitive. But concern for the welfare of pigs (to which I heartedly approve) didn’t go so far as to insist that all pig-meat sold in Britain should conform to the same minimum standards. Why not? Will we ever be told? Or is this just another of those little mysteries we have to put up with?

European countries have promised to bring their standards in line with ours but only some 12 years after us. Just enough time to see our farmers nicely bankrupted and out of business (it seems that about half have gone already) and for the foreigners to take our market. The British lose again.

Is there some sort of plan behind all of this? Doubt it. It may cost the tax-payer half a million pounds just for each member of the House of Lords (for example) but we shouldn’t expect to get anything back for it. This is England.

And it isn’t just the EU. Immigrants (some legal) have poured into this country from all over the world. Do they integrate, do they assimilate, do they identify with us? Silly question. Of course not. They mustn’t be inconvenienced. If there is any adapting to be done it must be done by - you guessed it – the British and especially the English.

My advice to all young English people (capable of reading and writing) is to emigrate to a country where you feel comfortable and then integrate, assimilate and identify totally with your new country – and don’t behave like the immigrants to this country.

Good luck, I wish I was young enough to join you.

Kevin Stroup

Western Civilization is rotted now. Everyone wants something for nothing. We keep reelecting the same retarded fools, yet expect things to improve. Remember the old adage: What you reward you get more of. What kind of behaviors does the government reward?

David Preiser

Rod,

Of course the white working class who have previously voted Labour will continue to do so, regardless of the recent incidents. All it will take is a few days of the BBC doing the "Oh, but we remember the THATCHER years!" routine. The audience will shout "Boo!" like a cooperative panto crowd, and any thoughts of voting Tory will be quickly put to rest.

Kered Ybretsae

The white workingclass ethnic minority, having turned its back on the so called Labour Party, will not have far to look for a new Party to champion
their needs BNP.

Jambo

I may not think this Labour party is any good.

But, fck me, it would sounds a great deal better than the other mob.

jambo

Well spotted Mie: "But at the same time many Labour activists and ideologues despise those very people whose votes they need - in large part because they feel that by voting for Margartet Thatcher the white working class betrayed them."

George

I love the casual throwing about of the word 'Marx' in these debates. What direct effect has Marxism had on the state of Britain today? Jesus, I would think only about five proffesors have read all of him, and only two of them understood what they read. Yeah, we may all have browsed through the lightweight and rather shallow 'manifesto', but jesus some right wingers are just paranoid mentals.

Richard

Rod,
if you do not know already, here is a link showing that the BBC 'mislead' the viewers and made the striker who used the word 'eyetie' appear to be an outright xenophobe.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/feb/06/bbc-misleading-edit-wildcat-strike

Neil Saunders

To George

It is true that very few people are familiar with the whole range of the voluminous works of Karl Marx (although I suspect that many of us, as you suggest, have at least read "The Communist Manifesto", written in collaboration with Friedrich Engels).

When the name of Marx, or the notion of Marxism, is invoked these days, it is usually Cultural Marxism that is meant. This modified version of Marxism (concentrating on social and cultural issues while jettisoning most of Marx's economic ideas) was first promulgated by the Frankfurt School in the 1920s.

It would be true to say that in the English-speaking world, at any rate, there is now a permanent coalition between such Cultural Marxists (in the realm of culture and society) and the free-market right. I call this the Frankfurt Consensus, and it is the default ideology of all of our mainstream political parties, irrespective of whether they are perceived (or represent themselves) as left-of-centre, centrist or right-of-centre.

It matters not one bit whether the Frankfurt Consensus's votaries have read a syllable of Karl Marx; their ideology still derives - selectively, and in a way of which he was highly unlikely to approve - from his.

Although it has dated rather quickly, a good basic guide to the realignment of politics in recent years is provided by Aidan Rankin's "The Politics of the Forked Tongue: Authoritarian Liberalism" (New European Publications, 2002). Little known and discussed, this short book may prove to be "The Road To Wigan Pier" of our time.

Lloyd Evans

Hi, everyone. What a fantastic noise. Let's all meet for a drink

Ruby Duck

You are talking about EU workers. We have committed ourselves to a free market for labour in the EU and it's a done deal.
But the market has to be fair as well as free and when, as it has been over the last 10 years or so, the value of the pound has been high, the market is not FAIR because the visiting worker is in effect earning far higher wages on account of the greater value of the
pound in his native country, which is where most of the money goes, and therefore can accept lower absolute wages than a British worker.

But the EU worker is not my main concern.
In my profession the competition is from Indian (and latterly Chinese) workers.
I'm not going to comment at length about the quality of the people that are doing the telecoms job I would have been doing had it not been for the outsourcing that started about 10 years ago. Some are good and some are not so good. All seem to believe in the (mythical) skill shortage in the UK, and have contempt for the native workers.
There are large numbers of very skilled IT people (software and hardware engineers, as well as operational support) in their late 40s and 50s who are apparently excluded from consideration for jobs and there are large number of capable young people who don't get the opportunity to practice their skills because the jobs are outsourced.
There is (or was) legislation that is supposed to prevent jobs going to non-EU nationals if they could be done be an EU national but the legislation is not enforced.
If there were an economic argument that would hold water I would hold my peace, but the result of the 10 yr experiment I have been aware of is a disaster - the skills shortage that didn't exist has turned into a real one, and the outsourcing suppliers are bleeding the British client companies dry because they have the whip hand.
I had a conversation with a middle manager at the start of this process. His argument was that he paid £25 per hour for the Indian engineer as opposed to £35 per hour for a British contractor. He had to get out a calculator to calculate that £25 per hour was approximately £50k pa, which was approximately twice the salary of a comparable permanent employee.
The willful blindness of the greasy-pole climbers defies belief, but it appears to be the only story we're allowed to tell.
What has happened to the unions under Labour ? Are they so committed to the ;sbel that they have forgotten what they exist to do ?

david lovibond

When, not so long ago, we were one people rubbing along together in one nation the enemy was someone else. The British people were bound together by ties of custom and anciently-tested affection. Those few who committed treason were not indulged.

Now that 'we' is a commonwealth of sundered communities - many of which have only a theoretical subscription to Mr Brown's undemanding idea of 'Britishness’ - loyalties among the alien colonisers of English cities are not to a land that demands so little from them but to their places and cultures of origin. If the policies or practices of this country do not please them in every particular these new 'Britons' feel entitled to scream for retraction and apology. If the English are slow to adopt their, in this case Islamic ways, they must be threatened and abused. If we protest 'enough...' we are racists but if we do nothing our country is lost.

One thing is certain: the enemy is no longer without, he is here, behind us. God help England.

Dan Dancer

The reason people employ Polish plumbers is mostly not that they are cheaper, but that a) they will come when they say they will, not 2 days later for half an hour on the way to take a deposit from another mug and b) they will do as good a job as they can and not as bad a one as they can get away with.

Ashley Slater

People will vote Labour for the same reason they've always voted Labour. When push comes to shove they don't like toffs and they don't trust Tories. Sorry, but most voters don't have a sophisticated approach to the ballot box. These people might not like Gordon Brown but they prefer him to a bunch of Old Etonians. I hate to be the bearer of bad news.

John H

I'm a little late to be joining this discussion. However ...
Ashley's comment points to a major difficulty in this country - inertia. As someone with an impeccable working-class pedigree, the envy of socialists everywhere, I have no problems with 'Toffs' running the country provided they do a good job. I also have no problems with immigrants provided they try to fit in rather than impose their own 'culture' on me. The people of this country are extremely tolerant for the most part, but we expect incomers to be the same. This has resulted in the development in the UK of a way of life which other nations achieve, if they do, via bloody revolution. The PC culture, which is given more support than it deserves, may well be taking us along the path familiar to Europeans. Enoch Powell could well be proved right if some immigrant factions continue on their present path. I sincerely hope not - and yes, there are indigenous trouble-makers too. Some of them irritate the rest of us by using 'English' and 'British' interchangeably.