The Lib Dem Appeal to Left and Right

Rhoda Klapp

Do you really mean if you're not in the centre, you're a lunatic? And all three parties in the centre is OK for democracy?

Sir Graphus

The Liberals are left of centre, but pick up quite a few votes from wavering centre-right Tory voters. They must appear to look right, but in reality, they look left, and will never form a coalition with the Tories. Their current appeal to Tory voters is the most dishonest pitch in the pretty murky field of this election campaign

Richard Manns

Surely you do not count the "sheer volume" of people who are willing to vote LibDem, but the likely of their coming into a position of influence.

They've been hovering around 20%ish for a quarter of a century, and are likely (if you believe the polls) to lose both in seats and vote percentage in the next parliament.

And even if there's a hung parliament, that means that they have a few months sounding off their opinions before the main party of government tires of them and goes to the Queen.

I generally take LibDems half-seriously, as they as involved in the Scots and Welsh Assemblies, but for 25 years the LibDems have been shouting that they matter more than that, and I see no reason to think they're on any serious upswing.

Edmund Jerk

On civil liberties, immigration and crime they seem like a good choice. However their uncompromising stance on Europe, the silly stuff about tax rises (for "the rich") and "green jobs" (and the other bits of eco-warrior schlock) puts me off of voting for them.

Paul C

The Lib Dems are the Coffee Table Party. Like an expensive book left out to impress neighbours who drop by. Everyone is so taken in (I mean impressed). But come an election, the party has to decide its actual policy, and at that point its supporters fall away to the extent that the policies are clear, ie to the extent to which they fall to the left or right. The best gamble for them is always ambiguity, so don't ever expect them to be clear on anything.

What IS clear is that historically they sided with a discredited Labour government to prolong the agony until a Conservative government found a leader who did not suffer fools and which was such a change from Labour that it lasted 18 years.

I don't know the likely outcome of the next election any more than anyone else, but if the Lib Dems side with Labour, they will be committing future electoral suicide, and will usher in a future Conservative government with the balls to do something.

radgie gadgie

They wont be able to appeal to proper left or right once they print up their manifesto which will be dense with the most centrist of centrist/statist platitudes with tiny nods and sops to their tree-hugging social worker style activists.

The right/left appeal will be minutely calibrated variations on a centre left(ish) theme. And so they will fail to become kingmakers as there isnt a groundswell of opinion wishing them to do so.

All 3 parties manifestos are likely to be tragically feeble so my ideal scenario is to vote - but for anyone but them in the hope that it will force another election and make them offer a real choice.

Tim Carpenter LPUK

Appealing to the Left and Right cuts no mustard with me.

The issues facing this country cannot be articulated in the "Left-Right" paradigm, but in the Authoritarian vs Libertarian dimension.

Handing freedom over with one hand while gripping tighter with the other is no answer. I cannot trust the Left with personal freedom if they demand to limit my economic freedoms, for they surely believe they "own" me, and where will that end? I cannot trust the Right with my economic freedoms if they want to tell me how to live my private life, for they still feel they have the right to control my behaviour, and where will that end?

This is why "the centre" is in some ways worse, for it asserts that the State has a "right" to interfere in both social AND economic dimensions. The State systemically wishes to grow, so Centrism is the reason why the State is in our faces more than ever before.

p.s. "Their Janus-like qualities"

I have heard that before. Well, I think that is what they said. It was rather noisy...

Whig

TimCarpenter LPUK hear hear! hear hear! And a very amusing post to boot. As Janus was the Roman god of doors, maybe we should show them to the Lib Dems and usher in a genuine Liberal Party. All three parties are, broadly, offering the same - a little more state here, a little less state there. One might have a good policy here, but a laughably bad set of policies overall (e.g. the Tory school policy is somewhat liberal, but their attitude to the NHS isn't). I favour the Tories because I believe economic liberty more important than social liberty (but I hold to both) and they are a little more free market than Labour and, by the look of it, the Lib Dems. There are only tiny true Liberal parties in this country, liberalism means freedom from state oppression in ALL areas, 'economic' and 'social' - of course, any separation of these two is artificial anyway.
Look at the inherent contradictions contained in this statement 'We still don't really know if they are they are the left-leaning party of civil liberties or right-wing Thatcherite neo-liberals'. The whole point of 'neo-liberalism' is that it supports both social and economic freedom from government interference (Thatcher was only a neo-liberal to a point). Of course, it's laughable to posit Labour as a party of 'civil liberties' when they've expanded intrusive state intervention and intrusiveness so much, and their 'anti-discrimination' measures simply result in additional cost and regulation rather than real freedom. The activist welfare and regulation state has caused the 'strange death' of Liberal England and the parties differentiate themselves on who can avoid the welfare state becoming so much of a burden it collapses entirely - Labour by tax and the Tories by some fiscal stringency. This doesn't even begin to deal with the real problems we face!
If 'leftist' - ie statist - voters move towards the Lib Dems this will only confirm what the party is about. Not Liberal Democracy, but Social Democracy.

Fergus Pickering

Radgie Gadgie, why would anyone read a party manifesto? It has bugger all to do with what the party in power will actually do. And, with the Liberal Democrats, they will not be in power at all. The nearest they will get is propping up Labour again and getting nothing for it. The last time they had a leader who wasn't a fool he was Jeremy Thorpe, which is, I am sure you will agree, far from ideal.

JustAnObserver

The LibDems are nothing more than a bunch of social democrats who occasionally like to flash a bit of classical liberal thigh to woo voters on the centre-Right.

Last Autumn at their Party Conference, Nick Clegg stated quite clearly that he wanted his Party to be the successor to Labour as the main "progressive" (i.e. interventionist) party of Britain.

Vote Liberal, Get Labour (whether they're red or gold).

Centre-Right voters MUST vote Conservative if they want a centre-Right government.

They cannot afford a vote for Clegg.

michael

Lib dems are swingers. They want to shaft everyone.

Ronnie

So, there must only be two main parties, any third party must decide which of the two other main parties it wants to be.

Thus wrote a supporter of one of the two other main parties, or something like that.