Survival isn't enough

David

"she danced round Biden like a matador sticking her knives into a clapped-out old bull "

Must have been another debate. The one I saw she was competent at best, clearly heavily coached, remarkable only because she avoid the jaw-droppingly poor performances turned in previously.

Your boosting of Palin is utterly bizarre. I can't imagine you being happy with, say, Obama claiming foreign polciy experience because his state happened to be the near a foreign country. She's utterly rubbish.

jose garcia

well i been watching the presidential debates and i am so surprised how civilized they are.

there are no mentions of Obama Sleaze, his party and personal connections,his role in the mea anf fae scandals i cant even imagine the same in england, or anyone else.....

baffling

Librul Elite

Yawn

Margaret

I don't know why McCain didn't use the devastating information to his advantage unless he hopes to get more help from Clinton towards the end of the race.

McCain voted in favor of the Senate's bailout package that is larger than the one the House voted down and contains more unrelated give-aways than the earlier bill without the needed reforms. This is why conservatives dispise McCain. He talks the talk, but doesn't walk the walk. He is too invested in the global warming myth, too slow to accept the need for off-shore drilling. His disasterous spponsership fo McCain-Feingold has haunted our elections. He claims to be a fighter, but I don't see much evidence.

SIGH

Frank P

As I have commented elsewhere
Melanie, I just don't think McCain has enough analytical talent to put the whole complex story together and shy from it because they wouldn't be able to regugitate it in front of a TV camera. But why doesn't Brett Hume and his team on Fox put it together? Perhaps its too convoluted for them even, it's the 15 second sound bite world. How I long for Money Programme special such as they did on Maxwell, etc. in the good old days when there were still good objective investigative sleuths around.

Perhaps you should fly over and offer your services to McCain's team for the duration of the campaign?

The Truth Hurts

An extraordinary conclusion of yours!
Palin did indeed come out better than expected and refrained from making any more serious gaffes regarding foreign policy: she also used the time worn phrase "as Americans sit at their kitchen table to discuss where to get ..."
However her naivity showed through.
She avoided direct questions and returned to her comfort zone by talking about energy, which she obviously knows something about, but made a serious mistake by trying to fob us off with the idea that global warming is caused by cyclical climate phases whilst glossing over the huge American contribution to greenhouse gases. It became obvious that she is the Senator for the US's main energy producing state and is hand in glove with the energy giants.
Palin dishonestly attempted to present the US bailout plan as a Main Street Plan and avoided the harsh fact that it is a Wall Street Bailout Plan for fat cats, and which exploded on the Republicans' watch.
Joe Biden lacked fire, but did demolish Palin's repeated efforts to present McCain/Palin as mavericks--which they certainly are not. His political wisdom shone through by letting Palin keep using the phrase maverick then finally demolishing all her fragile arguements.
On the whole Palin did well. Like a youngster who passed his High School exams and is hoping to make it in the real world. She kept quiet about her Fundamentalist Christian church and the ideas she shares about God, Creationism and the literal interpretation of the bible. She couldn't refrain from admitting her admiration for Israel despite its many sins. She didn't even mention her homophobic views, nor her strongly held view against women's right to control their own bodies.
Joe Biden was a gentleman and didn't touch on her other weak spots such as making rape victims pay for their emergency medical services in her home state of Alaska. She didn't mention her ideas that a war with Russia is likely.

On the whole this lady presented a fairly good debate but is clearly out of her depth, has dangerously ignorant ideas, and is much too green to be a vice president.

Raymond in DC

There is much that McCain is doing or not doing that makes one wonder if he really wants to win. He refuses to call out the Democrats for their culpability in this economic crisis. I cringed when he said Obama did "outstanding" work as a community organizer, given that he accomplished nothing positive. He won't address Obama's activities with ACORN, the Woods Foundation, or the Chicago Annenberg Challenge. And has he even mentioned Obama's Global Poverty Act? While McCain offers his own support for "service", he hasn't challenged the *mandatory* aspects of Obama's "volunteer service". If he won't raise these issues, the MSM will never shine a light on them.

Brian O'Connor

Ace has a theory on why McCain hasn't used the Dems contribution to the Freddie Mac/Fannie Mae meltdown . . . yet. http://tinyurl.com/45ckc4

I think it's worth keeping in mind the possibility that McCain doesn't necessarily approach problems the way most people do.

He's a former navy pilot who understands the concept of the "envelope" and the application of the OODA loop. http://tinyurl.com/6a6o79

In air combat, timing is of crucial importance. It determines whether or not you're going to live — or burn to a crisp inside the cockpit of your plane.

I'm not prepared to despair.

Hysteria

It's a good question - why isn't this type of information used. As Frank says - maybe it is just too damned complicated to put into a story that makes sense in the modern media. How could all the anti-Obama information be boiled down to a believable simple message?

Also of course the zeitgeist has moved - with a two-front unpopular war together with a fincial crisis - the democrats could probably have put up Jimmy Carter again and still win. (Ok - maybe not - but you get the point)

Best guess now is Obama wins, is exposed to be the chancer we believe him to be and the republicans gets back in 2012.......

Palin will be an interesting footnote in history - no long term saviour here I think.

Verity

David, it is you who is bizarre. I watched it live, ever word, ever gesture, and she triumphed throughout. Fox gave her 91% approval. She got 90% approval from a poll by Drudge which had almost half a million participants. Little Green Footballs, with almost 10,000 voters gave her 97%. Only the hardcore left, like hard faced Katie Kouric's outfit, CBS and, of course CNN scored for Biden, the department store dummy.

I'm not familiar enough with the Middle East to have spotted it, but according to correspondents, he got his geography confused, believing the West Bank to be Gaza. I thought this was his area of boss expertise.

With his eyelids surgically lifted and his face botoxed, he certainly didn't show much emotion, but Palin was vicacious and committed and she knocked it out of the park. The comments were flying onto the internet throughout, and people felt energised by her.

I agree with Melanie. McCain has to tell what he knows about Obama and the people behind him. It was also outrageous that the woman who moderated the debate has a new book coming out called (something like) "Breakthrough: The new politics of Barak Obama", and by coincidence, it's being published on Inauguration Day. Well, well.

McCain made a very daring and imaginative move when he picked Palin. He has to keep up the momentum of talking Obama and his cohorts and backers in the shadows down, down, down.

I was the first on the internet, I believe, to dub Obama the Manchurian Candidate. He got chosen when he was young because he was handsome, the right colour (people who spoke against him could be dubbed "racist", he was elegant, he was malleable and, given his early years, he didn't have a strong identity of his own. He was perfect.

He's not bright enough to have got this far on his own. He has been pushed and guided by people with an agenda. I have now read that it is possible that William Ayers wrote Obama's book about his father for him. This wouldn't surprise me because Obama has accomplished exactly nothing. He never published articles in the Harvard Law Review. He hasn't written anything substantial anywhere. He hasn't formulated any Senatorial legislation either in the Illinois Senate for the national Senate. Bugger all. He can't even vote Yes or No. He votes Present. Yet he wrote a whole book about his father?

Speaking of books, not just the moderator Gwen Ifill has a book coming out, but if I recall correctly, didn't Jeremiah Wright announce he would be publishing a book in October?

The Chinese curse is certainly having an effect in the West, isn't it?

Craig Strachan

Right. Palin is totally ready for primetime, but McCain is letting her down.

You really think that?

Steve, New York, NY

Yes Melanie, Fanny and Freddie were Democrat fiascos, but deregulating Wall Street belongs to the Republicans. Lets call it a draw. As for Palin, it only seemed like she was dancing around Joe Biden because she was following the script that had been written for her by her handlers. I suppose if we were holding a baton twirling contest, Sarah would win hands down, but being the person to decide whether to shoot down a hijacked plane full of passengers as Cheney had to do on 9/11 is not where most of us sane people want Sarah Palin to be. Choosing her as his running mate speaks volumes about the John McCain and how he makes decisions. Thankfully the Republicans will be kicked out of office by what I expect will be a tidal wave for Obama. Get used to it Mel.

John Birch

Palin certainly exceeded the low expectations set out for her but credible polls had Biden winning the debate. Meanwhile, Obama's lead continues to grow in the polls and even Charles Krauthammer essentially condeded an Obama victory today. Palin's fifteen minutes of fame will soon be over.

John Birch

Another one of those left-wing news networks, Fox News, had Biden beating Palin 61 to 39. You certainly are tied into U.S. public opinion, Melanie.
http://voices.kansascity.com/node/2299

Daibhidh MacAdhaimh

'The Truth Hurts'
Biden did not demolish the McCain/Palin maverick reputation with facts but tried to with successive, deliberate misrepresentations of McCain's track record.
'Dangerously ignorant ideas'?
I did not detect any other than Biden's idea of a timetabled withdrawal from an active war-zone, and resurrecting long discredited government intrusion in to people's everyday lives.
Your self-agrandising assessment of Palin's performance is very patronising. It clearly stems from an ideology that has as its object highly intelligent and intuitive substance beyond its comprehension and tolerance level.
Totally out of its depth.

ndm

Apparently the American public disagrees with Melanie Phillips. George Harris reports in the Kansas City Star:

Randomly selected subjects on three other polls also show Biden winning:

CNN/Opinion Research Biden 51 Palin 36
CBS Biden 46 Palin 21
Fox Biden 61 Palin 39

These numbers are devastating for Palin - she could not even hold the 43 or so percent of Americans McCain is currently getting in the polls.

Sarah Palin can wink all she wants and her adoring fans can wank away but once again she showed last night that she is utterly and totally unfit to be the next Vice President of the United States of America.

Not Even Likely

I thought she did all right. But she can't defend everything McCain has done or all of his voting record. It's not her fault - no one can do that. I felt the debate was an effective draw...there was no cataclysm that would drag down either candidate. Therefore, it returns to Obama and McCain. As it should.

Verity

The Truth Hurts writes: "She avoided direct questions and returned to her comfort zone by talking about energy ...".

Awwww, how like a girl, eh? And such a pretty girl at that!

Had it been a man who gave delivered exactly the same sentences, Truth's comment may have read, "time and time again he returned to hammer home the vital message about energy, nailing it into the minds of the audience".

Hmmm ... seasoned politician that she is - and she clearly earned her college nickname, The Barracuda, I wonder which message she was pounding into the audience's mind. "Ooooh, I'm so scared of this big important debate with Senator Botox here" or "Listen up, America! We're in hock to people who don't like our way of life or our government! Stick with me and we'll change it."

I too share the universal worry about John McCain. Why has he used none of the amunition he's got about Obama? Everyone in the United States, and the world, knows Obama's history by now. Why isn't McCain hanging him out to dry?

field

I saw plenty of references to Biden's gaffe history.

However, to gaffe is not unknown. To seize up, dry, be reduced to a dumbfounded smile of submission is NOT what you expect of a potential President.

I am afraid she will have to have several performances of this calibre and above before she even begins to make up for the damage done.

Please also remember she had the benefit of notes which you could see her consulting throughout the "debate".

Bob Latchford

Fox, Drudge & Little Green Footballs!

Brilliant! Verity, your dry sense of humour never fails to brighten my day

The Truth Hurts

The results are out:

1) CBS News/Knowledge Networks Poll, uncommitted voters declared that:
Biden won 46%
Palin won 21%

2) CNN Poll, all respondants declared that:
Biden won 51%
Palin won 36%

Clearly the great majority of people polled thought that Joe Biden won.

Of course, stastically there will always be a large number of people who would always back Biden whatever he said or did, in the same way that diehards (Melanie excluded of course!) would have declared Palin the winner even before the debate, however folks, facts are facts and don't go away however much you might dislike them.

Biden won.

Have a nice day
The Truth Hurts

Don L

Good article Melanie and good questions. I used to think McCain wanting to lose by not fighting hard was a coincidence. After four years of Bush being the worst defender and communicator, we're dealing at best, with another GOP picked incompetent in that area -or it is true -he wants to lose.

Verity

McCain thinks there's no chance of winning in Michigan and is closing down his operation there. But Sarah Palin has said, "No! Let's keep on fightin'!" She want McCain to send her and the First Dude on a bus tour of the entire state of Michigan and she'll give whistle stop speeches.

By God, that girl's a team player!

Swift Boat

Brian O'Connor- Yep he crashed and burned as pilot & now it's his turn as a presidential candidate.

Brian O'Connor

No sooner was the bailout passed than out comes this very effective ad about who was responsible for the Fannie and Freddie meltdown: http://tinyurl.com/4g9qcm (Hat tip Ace: http://tinyurl.com/3hrfde)

I suspect that this is merely McCain's first shot — and notice that it followed passage of the bailout. (For a history of the FM/FM financial fiasco, see this: http://tinyurl.com/3zfjb7)

I continue to believe that McCain is timing his responses for maximum effect. Think OODA, and a target rich environment.

THX1138

Verity "Fox gave her 91% approval"

Er not quite

The Fox Poll was Biden 61 Palin 39

KateA

'The Manchurian Candidate'!! I think I might choke if I can't stop laughing.

"I was the first on the internet, I believe, to dub Obama the Manchurian Candidate.."

Is that right Verity? What a stroke of genus.
Or, a 'first' in stupidity.

Raymond Shaw, the 'Manchurian Candidate' was a white US military hero, step-son of a senator, captured, tortured and brainwashed by North Koreans. He was decorated with the Congressional Medal of Honour on his return to America.

John McCain, white US military hero, son of a high-ranking general, captured, tortured and .... by the Viet Cong. He was awarded a Silver Star Medal for resisting "extreme mental and physical cruelties" ...on his return.

In the book, the candidate's mother is brash, forceful, paranoid, domineering, intellectually deficient, self-promoting, and publicity-mad. Extraordinary how these authors come up with unbelievable characters!

"One of your mother's more endearing traits is her tendency to refer to anyone who disagrees with her about anything as a Communist." WHAT a woman!

The Manchurian candidate is programmed to be an outwardly-normal, productive, and respected member of the community until activated ... and police-proof of course - war hero and all that.

Anybody laying bets?

"He [McCain] was so sure he was going to die ... he offered the communists "military information" in exchange for hospital .... [he] made a series of propaganda statements including at least one television interview during which he gave specific "military information" pertaining to his mission.

McCain was released from captivity on March 14, 1973 after 5 ½ years as a POW.... He was awarded a Silver Star Medal for resisting "extreme mental and physical cruelties" ... from late October to early December 1967; the exact time frame during which McCain was in the hospital making propaganda statements for the enemy..."
(US Veteran Dispatch)
http://www.usveterandispatch.com/

A sleeper for 40+ years? Now set to destroy the USA. What other explanation for the choice of a vacuous, pit-bull in lipstick.

The only thing Palin has proved herself good enough for is her own reality TV show or maybe a bit of pole-dancing in a pub. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink, "drill, drill, drill". Christie Hefner (COE of Playboy) has suggested the Palin performance would make a good ad for Viagra.

field

Strangely Verity seems to be a stranger to the truth.

Thanks to Truth Hurts and others for the true story on the polls reaction of Americans to the debate. It reflects I think what I said: she did herself and McCain ENORMOUS damage with that Couric-crumble. I myself am sceptical it won't happen again if she is ever again let out on an interview without notes on her lap. I doubt they'll let her out.

I think she performed reasonably well in the debate but the Americans, while they like folksy, also expect some factual to go with it. She's all folksy and no facts.

I don't think McCain would get anywhere dumping her now. And she is still in many ways an impressive performer. Perhaps she should jsut get out and shake some hands. Whistle stop tour will be more her forte I'd say.

Frank P

Brian O'Connor

Great links, thanks. Keep 'em coming.

Zordana

This is simply devastating stuff. Why on earth doesn’t McCain start using it?

I take it you have written to him Melanie, if not you really must, because i think Obama would be bad for America.

The Truth Hurts

THX1138, come on now, don't be so picky with Verity, after all she did get two digits right!
It's just that she selected them from two different numbers.
Could happen to anyone!

Verity

Fox watchers gave the Governor 91% approval last night after the debate, US time.

Then, Obama's spambots raced around the internet for poll results. Eeeeeeek! Fox 91%, and that famous Obama texting flooded those famous lefty mailing lists. Wreck the Fox poll! Urgent! Urgent! Vote! Vote! Vote!

Immediately after the debate, before the conservative polls were polluted with the swill of Obama flotsam and jetsom, Governor Palin had a 91% approval rating.

The only poll that couldn't be dynamited is Little Green Footballs, because it's not public, and only registered users can vote and Charles Johnson has iron walls around his site.

Nick Kaplan

Obama is up to his neck in the bad loans and dodgy companies that have caused the Credit Crunch. In addition to his involvement with ACORN (a group also mired in electoral fraud) the law firm Obama used to work for ‘Miner, Barnhill and Galland’ sued banks such as Citigroup that had not met their CRA obligations and had not issues enough sub-prime mortgages.

Worse still, can anyone guess who has been giving Obama advice on housing policy? One Franklin Raines: vice chairman of Fannie Mae from 1991-96 when the CRA was ruthlessly expanded by Clinton and when Fannie Mae began buying all this bad debt. He later became CEO of Fannie from 1999-2004 and was forced to resign due to “accounting errors.”

But worse than any of that Obama is the second largest receiver in the Senate of donations from Fannie Mae at $126,000(even though he has only been in the Senate for 4 years whilst other Dems have had funding from Fannie and Freddie for the last 20 years)... One wonders if this influenced his stupid decision to support Fannie and Freddie against the reforms to these institutions proposed by one John McCain in 2005 and again in 2007.

Some of this is finally coming out in the media with articles in the Wall Street Journal and one today in the Independent. Let’s hope the Republicans run with it before all blame (some of which rightly) is placed on them.

Nick Kaplan

The Truth Hurts needs to learn that the only part of his/ her post that is correct is his name; hopefully what follows will be painful:

“She kept quiet about her Fundamentalist Christian church and the ideas she shares about God, Creationism and the literal interpretation of the bible. “

What evidence do you have that Palin believes in a literal interpretation of the bible? I certainly haven’t seen any. This is all nonsense puffed up by the media because Palin said she wouldn’t want a ban on the discussion of Creationism if it came up in class. This does not mean she believes in Creationism, I am an atheist, I happen to hold the exact same position as Palin about the discussion of Creationism in Science lessons, so having the latter opinion does not entail believing the former proposition.

“She couldn't refrain from admitting her admiration for Israel despite its many sins.”

How evil of Palin, to admire the only free and democratic state in the Middle East, perhaps she should transfer her allegiance to Hamas? Furthermore I do not see how this is any different to Obama’s supposed position. He has on many occasions publically given his support to Israel.

“She didn't even mention her homophobic views.”

That’s hardly surprising seeing as she is not a homophobe, she just doesn’t support gay marriage, you really aren’t good at subtle distinctions. One of her earliest decisions as Governor was to block a proposal that would have denied equal rights to homosexuals regarding the benefits system, not really the move of someone with “homophobic views”.

“nor her strongly held view against women's right to control their own bodies.”

I don’t suppose Palin has any problem with a Woman’s right over her own body (being a very independent woman herself), her problem is with a Woman’s right over her child’s body. If you are going to attack Palin for being anti-abortion at least be grown up enough not to just knock down a purpose built Straw Man.

BOGDAN OF ENUCHALIA

Even if the team McCain/Palin lose, it will, in the end, be better for Sarah and her family (although worse for America). She should avoid the temptation of submerging herself in a stinking swamp of Washingtonian nomenclature which would demoralise her and her family and change her for the worse. No one, no matter how strong, even Superman, can win with the bureaucratic monster. It has devoured Reagan, Bush and it will devour her. She should stay in her native Alaska. Her talents will be much better utilised there, and withoud any nasty side-effects

Anat

Melanie: 'This is simply devastating stuff. Why on earth doesn’t McCain start using it?'

I think the answer is the need to remain neutral until the vote in the House on the bailout bill. Now that this bill has successfully passed the House and the Senate, BcCain will start hammering the real culprits -- the Democrats.

o.u.

One possible reason that has been suggested for McCain not hitting Obama with this issue is that he's waiting until the bail-out has been approved - until then, he's holding off from any partisan attacks.

o.u.

Biden did come off fractionally better, I think, to the neutral and uninformed viewer.

The thing is, he had to lie an awful lot to it - something that he's clearly very good at.

Some of them (compiled by various people, who I am failing to credit :) :

1. TAX VOTE: Biden said McCain voted “the exact same way” as Obama to increase taxes on Americans earning just $42,000, but McCain DID NOT VOTE THAT WAY.

2. AHMADINEJAD MEETING: Joe Biden lied when he said that Barack Obama never said that he would sit down unconditionally with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad of Iran. Barack Obama did say specifically, and Joe Biden attacked him for it.

3. OFFSHORE OIL DRILLING: Biden said, “Drill we must.” But Biden has opposed offshore drilling and even compared offshore drilling to “raping” the Outer Continental Shelf.”

4. TROOP FUNDING: Joe Biden lied when he indicated that John McCain and Barack Obama voted the same way against funding the troops in the field. John McCain opposed a bill that included a timeline, that the President of the United States had already said he would veto regardless of it’s passage.

5. OPPOSING CLEAN COAL: Biden says he’s always been for clean coal, but he just told a voter that he is against clean coal and any new coal plants in America and has a record of voting against clean coal and coal in the U.S. Senate.

6. ALTERNATIVE ENERGY VOTES: According to FactCheck.org, Biden is exaggerating and overstating John McCain’s record voting for alternative energy when he says he voted against it 23 times.

7. HEALTH INSURANCE: Biden falsely said McCain will raise taxes on people’s health insurance coverage — they get a tax credit to offset any tax hike. Independent fact checkers have confirmed this attack is false

8. OIL TAXES: Biden falsely said Palin supported a windfall profits tax in Alaska — she reformed the state tax and revenue system, it’s not a windfall profits tax.

9. AFGHANISTAN / GEN. MCKIERNAN COMMENTS: Biden said that top military commander in Iraq said the principles of the surge could not be applied to Afghanistan, but the commander of NATO’s International Security Assistance Force Gen. David D. McKiernan said that there were principles of the surge strategy, including working with tribes, that could be applied in Afghanistan.

10. REGULATION: Biden falsely said McCain weakened regulation — he actually called for more regulation on Fannie and Freddie.

11. IRAQ: When Joe Biden lied when he said that John McCain was “dead wrong on Iraq”, because Joe Biden shared the same vote to authorize the war and differed on the surge strategy where they John McCain has been proven right.

12. TAX INCREASES: Biden said Americans earning less than $250,000 wouldn’t see higher taxes, but the Obama-Biden tax plan would raise taxes on individuals making $200,000 or more.

13. BAILOUT: Biden said the economic rescue legislation matches the four principles that Obama laid out, but in reality it doesn’t meet two of the four principles that Obama outlined on Sept. 19, which were that it include an emergency economic stimulus package, and that it be part of “part of a globally coordinated effort with our partners in the G-20.”

14. REAGAN TAX RATES: Biden is wrong in saying that under Obama, Americans won’t pay any more in taxes then they did under Reagan.

Ronnie

There is just less than one month to go in the presidential campaign, a substantial period of time, and yet some of the most hysterical Republican supporters/'apologists' who contribute to these blogs seem to have thrown in their towels.

Thank God I never have to campaign with you lot of screeching amateurs

It may be that some of the hysterical nonsense peddled by the by rabid right about Obama is true. If it is and Senator McCain has it in store, do you think he should use it early or late in the campaign? Early and his opponent has lots of time to rebutt and recover. Late and the effects could be devastating. If he plans to use this information then timing is crucial.

Obama's headline strengths in both the primaries and the general elecion are that he is not a Bush, he is not a Clinton and he is not a Republican.

McCain has to show the broad mass of the electorate (not the slavering, name-calling hypocrites supposedly on his side) that he is a non-Bush Republican with a positive vision that can be trusted after the 'dark' years of Karl Rove and Dick Cheney. Its not an easy balance to strike. Picking Sarah Palin didn't help as that decision created many unwanted distractions and actually stopped him getting his message across effectively since the Convention.

Now McCain must and presumably will go on the attack during the next few weeks.

The debates between the presidential candidates will be crucial and, in many ways, the real campaign starts now. Sarah Palin did as well as could be expected in the debate against Biden, she didn't make any obvious mistakes. Now she should be out there 24/7 spreading her folksy charisma across the Union, that's what she's there for.

McCain should now be raising the temperature as it has seemed very quiet until now. Obama may have peaked too early and may not be able to respond. It will be interesting.

As for the shallow nutters who think its already over... If you were on my campaign I'd have sacked you all by now.

James

Ms Phillips is right. I read the Dennis Sewell article in an edited version in the Evening Standard yesterday and it is devastating in its clarity.

Only when US house prices stabilise will we know we are at the bottom of all this. That's why it's so important.

It's on a smaller scale because we're a smaller country, but a crude attempt at social engineering has very recently poisoned the new build part of the UK housing market.

Tab across on The Spectator's website to the Coffee Housers' Wall for the week 29 Sept - 5 Oct for more details left by other website users.

The key to any property, as the TV show never tires of telling us, is 'Location, Location, Location'.

Labour has insisted that all new build developments include a percentage of either 'affordable' homes (often part owned by councils or their offshoots) or 'social' homes.

The tenants in these council - or 'social' homes may be sugar and spice and all things nice, but if they're not, what will that do to long-term property prices in the locality?

The lenders have got wise to this because they know all about location, location, location and lending on homes in new build areas is virtually frozen because the lenders don't know what they'll be worth because of the unknowns over the social make-up of the neighbourhood. It could be full of junkies for all the lenders know - and then how will they recoup their loan?

Plenty of these new build homes will have the double whammy of going down in value along with everything else and then going down again because their location, location, location is devalued by having tenants whom many people would rather not live next door to.

In America and in Britain, the destructive influence of the Left simply goes uncommented upon by the mainstream media, almost certainly because these cosseted fools have never had to live in areas with social housing.

One can only hope that in the current crunch some of them are forced out of their homes and get to see what it's like to live in an area like that.

I see that ITV is planning to get rid of a few regional 'journalists' (hurrah!) so maybe they'll be the first.

Dave

Verity you can hardly complain that people scream "racist" when you critisise Obama and then fling around accusations of misogyny when someone else critises Palin.

And where did you get those Fox numbers you quoted?

BenM

Keep on dreaming Mel.

Come Nov 5th, the mad conservative error is over.

Period.

Bill M

David,
Just as an FYI, when Obama was asked what foreign policy experience would quailify him for president he responded that it's because he spent some of his childhood overseas. No joke. That was his answer. He could see Kenya from his swingset.

Jeremy Poynton

Well, maybe because Bush had 8 years to deal with it and didn't.

Quite simple, really, if you put your sword down and use your brain instead.

Jeremy Poynton

"I know that John McCain will do that and I, as his vice president, families we are blessed with that vote of the American people and are elected to serve and are sworn in on January 20, that will be our top priority is to defend the American people."

-- Sarah Palin

Don't you think one illiterate this century is enough for the poor Americans?

Verity

Immediately after the debate, the poll on Fox gave Palin 91% approval on almost half a million participants.

Then, Jim Jones's - oooops! Obama's - henchbots bombed the squillions of text addresses that the Messiah and lo, his people, have collected with such frantic vigour over the past eight months. "MESSIAH ALERT! MESSIAH ALERT! Poll at Fox 91% 4 Palin! Go ye forth to Fox and vote!"

That's how it works in the Messiah's tent. Everything above board and a fair fight. Little-number plate-Obama-arse- licker, stick around. The Messiah may let you carry the Kool Aid. If he commands you all to go to Guyana, Immigration's not as tough as it is in the United States, so they may let you in.

WhoCares

"(CRA) introduced by Jimmy Carter and then ruthlessly enforced by Bill Clinton to force the banks to give mortgages to the poor to lever them onto the housing ladder – in reckless disregard of the fact that they would not be able to meet the repayments. That was what lay behind the implosion of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that in turn sparked this whole crisis".....

If BS was currency, Melanie could bail out the world finances in a jiffy.

There is no evidence that I have seen from Kuntz, Krauthammer or anyone else others that could illustrate that extending credit to the lower income strata in the communities was designed or enforced (!) in a way that "coerced" the banks to abandon "safe and sound operations" (explicitly required by the CRA). That is utter rubbish which is told only for one reason: to camouflage the orgy of unsecure lending through dubious paper as a great way of making a pile of easy money.

Verity

Kate A - Very, very many thanks for taking the time to do a lengthy précis of The Manchurian Candidate. I think we will all agree that you are familiar with the book - although we might wonder why.

It's a shame you are so literally-minded that you imply that I thought all the circumstances of the weird Obama's rise would directly mirror the plot of a long-ago book.

My contention stands, despite your apparent inclination to keel over and choke with laughter.

Obama, a rootless, uncertain young man, abandoned by his father, taken to what was then a very alien and primitive country and put into a second family his mother had either married into or moved in with. Went to a Muslim school there. I wonder why, given that there are plenty of civil schools in Indonesia, and in Jakarta in particular.

Never mind, then he gets taken back to the US at some point, to the state of his birth, Hawaii, except he grows up not understanding that he is now living in an American state, not a territory. It was made into a state a year before he was born, yet he has consistenly referred to it as a territory. Quite eerie ...

But a nice looking boy, probably fairly clever, if rather subdued and uncertain about his identity. Didn't seem to be involved in any high school activities ...

And the mystery over his birth certificate. He never did produce it, you know, although someone said they had seen a certified copy of it.

OK, fast tracked to Harvard right at the beginning of "positive discrimination". Nice looking blackish poster boy.

Then the problem with his medical records. The other three major players have released their full medical records, as this is the tradition in the US, although not a legal requirement. Obama sent in a doctor's note.

Why?

Obama was spotted by William Ayers and several others in the same coterie as handsome, presentable, suggestible a long time ago. During his 12 years in the Illinois Senate, he produced exactly zero. Even on votes. He didn't even vote yay or nay. He voted "Present". No legislation. No papers. Nothing. Just a shadow who votes "present". For 16 years.

And after only two years in the Senate in DC, is suddenly the beneficiary, out of around 300 legislators, of the second biggest payout from Fanne Mae and Freddie Mac. He's ahead of Nancy Pelosi! Not only that! This shadow, without a single accomplishment to his name, is now a contender to become President of the United States.

Who's been helping him in the background for these 16 years, during which time he has accomplished nothing but the accumulation of money ... somehow. Who has pushed this unlikeliest individual forward as a contender for the world's most powerful position?

Daibhidh MacAdhaimh

Nick Kaplan:
Hear, hear.
I suspect the ideology fuelling the political thoughts of The Truth Hurts could seamlessly empathise with Pilate's immortal question to Christ, 'What is truth?'
The Roman Empire by the time of Christ's adulthood had become irrevocably altogether corrupt within. Political leaders like Pilate no longer recognised truth. The Empire ultimately imploded.
The steady corrosive impact of leftist ideology, particularly its deconstructionist infestation, upon social order is nudging the West in the same self-destruct direction. People are no longer able (allowed) to identify and practice truth, common sense, reality, and absolutes. Only when someone of Sarah Palin's common sensical calibre pops up from beneath the surface of the deconstructionist scum, is the vitriolic nature of the leftist beast revealed. It's sour characterics, as employed in The Truth Hurts' tiresome assessment of Palin, include self-agrandisement, self-importance, patronising and condecension. Simmering beneath the layer of high fuluting solidified wind produced by these traits, lurks hostility in the form of ready to fire, unhinged vitriol and personalised attacks that betray all the left's 'politically correct' decrees entailing respect and tolerance associated with their politically imposed 'multicultural' and 'diversity' fetishes. Then again, the left is all about 'do as I say not as I do.'
The Truth hurts? The accusative is missing in the construct. I suggest a first person singular pronoun as a means to encourage the title's author some needed introspection. Not that this suggestion will be considered.
I speak as a former socialist at grass root level, pit-bottom level actually, coal mining community. The bread and butter variety politics of the heart. I eventually awoke to the tyranny of thought that took over the left post-1990 (Berlin Wall collapse). Its abandonment of rationale and also its intolerance of individual thought obliged me to seek a political divorce. I turned from Marx to Mark, an inner transformation which, I imagine in the view of the aforementioned 'Truth' makes me a deluded follower of the One who IS The Truth - the One that set me free from leftist bondage.

ndm

Verity writes:

-- Immediately after the debate, before the conservative polls were polluted with the swill of Obama flotsam and jetsom, Governor Palin had a 91% approval rating.

-- The only poll that couldn't be dynamited is Little Green Footballs, because it's not public, and only registered users can vote and Charles Johnson has iron walls around his site.

Verity appears to have lost all sense of sense awareness. She appears to be auditioning for a role in Oliver Sachs' next book.

Fellow traveller

One genius thing I love about Melanie's blog is that it is *so* inflammatory that it sort of sets everyone off into a spiral of weird craziness, but *she never gets involved* in that bit. I hope she's not embarrassed about us.

For example, someone with her intelligence would be quite able to point out to Verity that the whole wonderful conspiracy of Palin's 91 per cent being sabotaged by organised Obama mass voting is pretty obviously false.

1. Republicans can organise mass online voting too. On past evidence, they're pretty good at it. This is not intended as a criticism.
2. For a Palin approval of 91:9 to be converted into a Biden approval of 61:39, pro-Biden voters would have had to vote 15x as often as pro-Palin supporters.
3. It would be really hard for them to do this, because they would have to run around distorting every other poll in the US as well in exactly the same way. Except, of course, Drudge and LGF.

I mean, it could have happened. But Melanie's a realist and she's pretty experienced around politics, so I'm guessing that she knows that's a bit silly. If she disagrees with this argument, I'd like to hear it.

On the other hand, if her intention is just to wind everyone up, step back and watch us all throw crazier and crazier accusations at each other, then I suppose that's fine too. It's just not as serious a contribution to the debate as it seems at first look.

Ronnie

I'd just like to say that I think that Verity's post of 7:33 pm on 4 October is excellent. If the questions she asks about Obama were presented in as measured a way as they here then many more people, including me, would take them more seriously.

I believe that there are indeed questions to be asked and this is the way to do it.

Brian O'Connor

Here's an interesting video of a Fannie Mae executive (a temporary CEO) talking to the Congressional Black Caucus, plus some editorial comments. Yet another piece to be considered. http://tinyurl.com/4rfjyf

(Get it while it's hot . . . you never know when such things will be pulled.)

Dan Friedman

What a great irony, if we in America give over our government to precisely the same people who have brought us to near-ruin with their affirmative action credit crisis.

AbuNudnik

Yes, McCain's absence of bite is puzzling. Ayers is an unrepentant terrorist with whom Obama has had a long association. That he was "just a guy in the neighbourhood where I lived" is an outright lie, as are his assertions that he went to church for 23 years and never knew what kind of opinions his very vocal preacher had: black liberation theology straight our of Marx.

The vulnerability of Obama on the loans mess (and ACORN, by the way, has a number of its people charged with voter fraud) is an open target. Why McCain doesn't attack is an odd thing.

But it can't be that Obama "...chaired the committee that increased funding of ACORN and other community organizers. " Not in the Senate, to which he was elected only in 2008.

KateA

Verity: "Thanks .... etc ...familiar with the book - although we might wonder why."

My pleasure dear girl. No need to damage the old brain further by 'wondering'; I taught it - 20th century American literature - to first year students. No problem recalling the text.

'Literally-minded'? Ah! A Tip: it's a good idea to check your references - the character needs to FIT the story if you are to avoid absurd analogies.

I "imply" nothing; your words on the page define correspondence - Obama (for you) is the Manchurian Candidate. Despite more of the same above, no such similarity with the text exists. You chose the wrong book.

The real analogy, which you ignore, is, as I have shown, between McCain and Raymond Shaw. An incredible 'own goal'.

Frank P

Brian O'Connor.

Excellent, now it's getting out there. It will be interesting to see whether the Obamarized British liberal MSM (95% of it) will run with this. Please don't hold your breath as we need you to keep this stuff coming. Thank you once again.

Frank P

Brian O'Connor.

Excellent, now it's getting out there. It will be interesting to see whether the Obamarized British liberal MSM (95% of it) will run with this. Please don't hold your breath as we need you to keep this stuff coming. Thank you once again.

The Truth Hurts

To answer Nick Kaplan:

I am indeed amazed that you are unaware that Palin has openly suggested that Creationism be taught along with Evolution in schools. This gives an insight into her soul, and clearly shows she believes in such poppeycock. Why should Creationism be given even time with logic? Does this show her fairness? No! It shows her ignorance, in the same manner that we most logical people would laugh in your face if you suggested that, on the grounds of fairness, the arguements for and against a flat earth vs. a round earth be taught to children so as not to influence or prejudice them. Plain ridiculous and Palin's proposition belies her inner beiefs--Fundamentalist rubbish.
The Wasilla Assembly of God church where Palin attended as a child, and the Wasilla Bible Church where she presently attends both preach the literal interpretation of the bible. Do you find it strange that we believe she has the same wierd ideas?

Her admiration for Israel is, sadly, shared by Barack Obama, or should I say, both are beholden to AIPAC and the Israel Lobby with its pernicious manipulation of the system to ensure a continual shower of weapons and cash upon Israel so that this "democratic" state can continue to mistreat and humiliate its neighbours and hang on to the occupied lands.

Palin has declared that she wants to strip domestic partnership rights for gays, considers homosexuality to be "evil", and "curable through the power of God". Again, her Wasilla church is holding a revival to help gays "cure" themselves. In the light of these facts, don't you think it reasonable to label Palin as homophobic?

OK, OK, if you don't care for my style, I'll tell to you in simple words, Palin is anti abortion. Your arguement all hinges on when we consider a foetus to be a baby. There is no clear answer but I for one (and I'm not alone) consider that it isn't at the moment of conception. Many many believe a woman has the right to abort during the first few months especially after rape, incest or proof of a serious physical defect however Palin has declared the complete opposite, namely that even in the case of rape, the foetus must be taken to term. Add to this her having voted in favour of rape victims having to pay for their emergency medical care (can anybody beleive this woman's cold heart) and we have a pretty fair picture of a woman with extremist fundamentalist views. I am unaware if her child's Down syndrome was detected during pregnancy, but if so, I respect her decision to carry it to birth. That was her decision and she is to be respected for it, but SHE HAS NO DAMN RIGHT TO IMPOSE HER VIEWS ON OTHERS.
She's got one heck of a nerve!Dogonne it!

I have provided many facts in my posting but yours seems to be a negative waffle with no facts.

I made up my nom de plume with you in mind Nick, The Truth Hurts. Doesn't it.

To Daibhidh MacAdhaimh:
I shall treat your abusive, rambling, incoherent, disjointed diatribe with the respect it deserves.
At least Nick's posting was an attempt at reasonable dialogue even though he disgrees with me.

THX1138

Verity -"The other three major players have released their full medical records, as this is the tradition in the US"

That is simply not true neither Palin or Biden have released their medical records

From McCain Campaign Spokesman Michael Goldfarb

"Governor Palin has no history of health problems," [McCain campaign spokesman Michael] Goldfarb says. "We believe that a candidate should be able to preserve some privacy in this process, and we’re confident the American people will validate that judgment come election day."

Why not?

A bit like Troopergate where there seems to be plenty of flip flopping going on

July 24, Palin said "I have absolutely nothing to hide … I'm happy to answer any questions between now and when they [the legislature] do conduct an investigation also. … I'm happy to comply, to cooperate. … No problem with an independent investigation."

On

On September 16, a McCain spokesperson said "the governor is not going to cooperate with that investigation.

Something to hide something to fear!!

Lilaccruiser

Normal Phillips rubbish. Palin was barely competent. The polls record that Biden, who was hardly exciting, won by a country mile.

As for the ACORN stuff - it's not devastating, it's just really dull. And it's all over the media but Obama is 8 points ahead in the polls.

Looks like you culture warrors are going to take a hell of a beating in the presidential election. Those who live by hate and bile...

Verity

Kate A - It was a glancing referenc, not a PhD dissertation. This is a blog, not the hallowed halls of academe.

No one cares.

Here's something else unacademic, this one for the boys on board. Before marriage, Sarah Palin's name was Sarah Heath, and here is the next Vice President of the United States in the swimsuit segment of a beauty contest. The year was 1984. (Turn the sound down because there is an attention-seeking trumpeter playing directly into the mike.)

Enjoy.

Verity

BTW, Kate A - I absolutely haven't a clue what "own goal" means, but presumably something negative. But please don't explain! Just don't make assumptions that watching soccer - or is it tennis? - is universal - there's a good sort.

Verity

The Governor steps up to the plat: http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/31468_Palin_Does_What_McCain_Wont

Verity

The Governor steps up to the plate: http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/31468_Palin_Does_What_McCain_Wont

Verity

The Truth Hurts Because I May Look Like An Illiterate Moron If I had to Look It Up: " am indeed amazed that you are unaware that Palin has openly suggested that Creationism be taught along with Evolution in schools."

Deep breath, and read very, very slowly, and no shame at all in following the text with your forefinger: She didn't.

She said, if a suggestion came up in class, and the teacher thought it pertinent, it should be discussed. In other words, the Governor is not a thought Fascist like your good self. The Governor thinks the administration of the classroom is up to the teacher, not her.

She thinks no one should fear discussing anything.

(I hope you understand, at the same time, that the Governor has no say in what is taught, or discussed, in schools. That is up to the school boards.) You seem a little shaky on structure.

The trouble is, Truth Hurts, that it is you who are unaware. Terribly.

You have to rein in your excitability over abortion.

The Governor most assuredly doesn't want to strip gays of civil partnership rights. She emphatically vetoed such a notion in the Alaska Senate, and believe me, for a Governor to veto a bill that has been duly voted on by the state legislature is a very big deal.

field

Verity -

If you are now relying on a vote of subscribers to a right wing activist website (nothing wrong with that) as an accurate guide to what the American public thought about the debate then you have lost all contact with reality.

One feels you are going to carry on with this insanity even if Obama ends up with more electoral college votes than McCain, still denying the obvious.

Face up to it: Palin screwed up big time. No one made her, tricked her or inveigled her into that. She screwed up all by herself. She has reclaimed SOME ground but only a little.

field

Fellow Traveller -

Some truth in what you say. Having told us Palin won the debate by a mile, you'd think she'd want to explain why 200 million Americans don't agree. But no - you're right. She enjoys the privilege of the commentator through the ages - moving on to another subject.

AbuNudnik -

You are right to focus on the weakness of McCain.

I value him in lots of ways, not least that he understood what needed to be done in Iraq (when most were ready to cut and run) and that democracies need to maintain high standards of ethical treatment of POWs.

If his campaign is failing, it is not because of a leftist media conspiracy as Verity would have us believe, it is because he hasn't been vigorous enough in going after Obama. Obama is hiding a lot of embarrassing facts about himself. He's a presidential candidate. It is indeed perfectly reasonable to ask him what he was doing in an overtly racist church with ties to the loony-fascistic Nation of Islam.

However, McCain seems to me tired and old. To take Obama on in that way would require a lot of energy and commitment because it would not be easy.

Teri B.

Desperation sure isn't a pretty sight, lol. What's this about Obama palling around with terrorists?

Oh Silly Sarah, can we talk about your connection to The Independence Party in Alaska that advocated cession from the USA?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwvPNXYrIyI

Brian O'Connor

The Truth Hurts wrote:

Add to this her having voted in favour of rape victims having to pay for their emergency medical care . . .

This accusation — which has appeared time and time again in MSM stories — seems not to be correct.

Read this first: http://tinyurl.com/4wapoz

Read this second: http://tinyurl.com/3flx4u

Alas, once rumors of this sort start, it's almost impossible to stop them.

Brian O'Connor

An article in the NYTimes claims that the relationship between Obama and William Ayers (former Weather founder and unrepentant terrorist) was "sporadic" and not close even though they were both heavyweights in the now-defunct Chicago Annenberg Challenge. The article does concede that Obama tried to downplay his relationship with Ayers. http://tinyurl.com/3z9cey

The NYT's conclusions differ markedly from those of Stanley Kurtz, who overcame mind-boggling obstacles to gain access of the CAC files (held in the Daly Library at the University of Illinois, Chicago) and to report on them.

The roadblocks Kurtz met with are well documented here: http://tinyurl.com/5zf8ua and his summary of what he found in the files is here: http://tinyurl.com/4kx2uh

Wretchard (The Belmont Club) outlines the NYT/Kurtz differences here: http://tinyurl.com/3t7hp8 and includes a link to Kurtz's hot response to the NYT here: http://tinyurl.com/4tnwlc

Thanks to the New York Times, the William Ayers/Obama connection has resurfaced. Things are getting interesting.

James

It's high time the McCain team levelled the playing field and pointed up the character and judgement of Obama.

Sarah Palin has had slime thrown at her in the form of accusations that one of her children was in fact her daughter's and been mocked on the highly unfunny 'Daily Show' ad nauseum.

So why haven't the media turned Obama over the way they have her? This man has a terrorist supporting buddy in Bill Ayers, an anti-white racist as a spiritual mentor in Rev Wright and a convicted felon as mortgage arranger in Tony Rezko. What sort of character and judgement does that indicate?

This all seems to have slipped people like John Stewart and the rest of the gliberal media by.

Why?

Frank Pulley

Jackie Mason weighs in for McCain:

http://americandigest.org/mt-archives/5minute_arguments/sarah_yenta_jac.php

Hayward Maberley

And now an Australian take on "The Manchurian Candiddate" He is already there!
It is from an article in The Australian of 30 September 2008 by Phillip Adams entitled “George The Manchurian Candidate”.
In it Adams alludes to Richard Condon's novel concerning Raymond Shaw, scion of a family prominent in US political life, being brainwashed by the Chinese and Russians.
It makes as much sense as any other conspiracy theory, particularly those on this blog. And who is to say that it is not so?
Adams writing swings between, in terms of the Classics, The Georgics of Virgil and the Satires of Juvenal. Those and the odd comic piece such as this. One inaccuracy that I will point out to him is that the KGB no longer exists, in name that is. It is now the FSB
An extract below with the www address. Enjoy!

"Now everyone knows the truth: how George W. Bush has been the KGB's President, operated by mother Barbara, a covert commie for 50 years. Now her sleeper-agent son, working from the Oval Office, has brought down the US and the entire capitalist world. Here's how it went down.
Whereas Raymond Shaw was captured on patrol during the Korean War and brainwashed for months, George W. was captured while on one of his legendary drunken binges. It took only a few hours for KGB agents to brainwash him, as there was so little brain to wash.
Released into his mother's care, George announced he was giving up the booze in favour of faith. When he proclaimed "I'm born again", it was the truth. George was born again, but not into fundamentalist Christianity. He was born again in the fundamentalist faith of Marxism-Leninism.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24420839-5013491,00.html

Brian O'Connor

Verity's post (Verity October 5th, 2008 2:07am) is correct: she accurately represented Palin's position on teaching Creationism in school, and she accurately represented Palin's position on gay marriage and abortion.

You just have to wonder where these false stories come from. not to mention other false stories, like those accusing Sarah Palin of not being the mother of her youngest child; of the story accusing McCain of having an affair with a lobbiest; the non-existent sympathy of Palin for the agenda of a secessionist political party.

Isn't it interesting that in their aggregate, the "mistakes" that get such widespread publicity seem to demonize mostly one side even as Obama's 2+ decade relationship with a racist, black liberationist Rev. Wright, Obama's working relationship with Ayers, Obama's close relationship with Rezko, etc. receive at best cursory attention and at worst are simply ignored by the MSM.

Question: If McCain or Palin had attended the same church for 20 years as David Duke, who served as McCain or Palin's confidant and ideological guide, whose teachings they subjected their kids to a few times a month, who either McCain or Palin referred to as being like a member of their family and defended after his outrageous racist rants came to light . . . what would the MSM have to say about it?

Adam B.

Brian, ironically "truth hurts" doesn't care much about the truth. This person has also shown him/herself to be an antisemite on another thread.

Hayward Maberley

Melanie,
Obviously no fact checking as usual. For your use of the torero analogy is all wrong.
No knives are use in a corrida. Picadors use a lance, the Torereo uses banderillas and in the last stage a sword. But there is no dancing, the matadors movements are slow and controlled.

Frank Pulley

Hayward Maberley

Now I know whence all your bullshit: you collect it at the bullfights.

Huw Thornton

Well, things have got interesting now, in the sense that Sarah Palin has attacked Barack Obama for his association with Ayers.

I withdraw totally the comments I made on the earlier posting about McCain being either a wimp or a part of The Great Conspiracy.

It will be interesting to see how the allegations play with the electorate. I must say, I did not think that the McCain campaign would acknowledge the allegations directly - it might come over as a desperate move.

I must say that I'm starting to admire Sarah Palin. She's a real asset to the McCain campaign.

Verity

Brian O'Connor. Thank you. And I haven't even laid a finger on Michelle yet.

Verity

Hayward Mayberly - You absolutely must bury your ego and read the preceeding posts before crfashing in with your own untethered "contributions" - if that is not too strong a word. The novel "The Manchurian Candidate" has been addressed at great length above by Kate A, rendering everything you had to allow absolutely pointless.

Frank P - excellent response to the preachy, know-it-all font of irrelevant facts, Hayward Mayberly.

John Punshon

Why does McCain not use this material? Because, of course, he is a RINO. Had he not been, there would have been no need of the excellent Mrs Palin, more's the pity.

THX1138

Wingnuts be careful what you wish for:

The guilt-by-association attacks on Obama are as much about tapping into a range of hazier doubts as they are about the details of any given charge, so I'm not sure they'd work on the better-known McCain. There is no shortage of mud like this on both sides, though, from Ayers and Rezko to Gordon Liddy and the Alaska Independence Party.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v

Paul Begala, Dem strategist fires a shot across McCains bows

"This guilt by association path is going to be trouble ultimately for the McCain campaign. You know, you can go back, I have written a book about McCain, I had a dozen researchers go through him, I didn’t even put this in the book. But John McCain sat on the board of a very right-wing organization, it was the U.S. Council for World Freedom, it was chaired by a guy named John Singlaub, who wound up involved in the Iran contra scandal. It was an ultra conservative, right-wing group. The Anti-Defamation League, in 1981 when McCain was on the board, said this about this organization. It was affiliated with the World Anti-Communist League – the parent organization – which ADL said “has increasingly become a gathering place, a forum, a point of contact for extremists, racists and anti-Semites.”

Ronnie

Ah yes...! The Iran-Contra scandal.

Verity

Field writes: "Verity -

If you are now relying on a vote of subscribers to a right wing activist website (nothing wrong with that) as an accurate guide to what the American public thought about the debate then you have lost all contact with reality."

Incorrect.

Private blogs, especially intensely monitored blogs that are owned by someone with great internet skills, are the only ones that can be trusted on voting issues because they are the only ones impervious to Obamabots.

It's simple to send out text messages to these vast text mailing lists they have been furtively compiling over the last three or four months, saying "Bomb the Fox poll" or "Bomb the NYT poll."

But they can't get in to the heavily ringed blogs, and therefore, by default, those are the only blog polls one can trust.

I hope I have explained this in terms you can understand, Field.

svengali

I admire the commitment to our back-and-forth mudslinging, but if we all pulled back the zoom lens a bit, couldn't we agree that in global terms McCain isn't very right wing and Obama isn't very left wing?

McCain plainly isn't some unhinged white power secessionist and Obama really obviously isn't a fanatical marxist terrorist. Nor are they in the service of these people. There are, however, plenty of far more dangerous people in the world, and a disastrous presidency to make up for.

McCain and Obama might both have sat on committees with people we don't like, But so have any of us who have every had any responsibility, because that's what we have to do to get things done. None of these crazies are about to be made secretary of state.

Neither McCain or Obama caused the economic problems we are having now, and if either of them could have seen that the policies they supported would cause it, I'm guessing they would both have backed off. The fact that no one else guessed maybe shows that they weren't cynical, just not blessed with the ability to travel through time. Both of their motivations in their political careers to date that I can see have been positive, not negative.

Neither of them is even slightly like the Manchurian Candidate, which was a great book, one good film and one really bad one. But actually a story. McCain isn't a communist plant - and I'd like to think that he's faintly sickened by the attempted demonising of Obama. Both men have their faults, but if we lived next door to either of them, we'd admire them as successful men with character and judgment, if not perfect. If Obama can't get through a military security clearance, it makes me think that the security clearance criteria might be more wrong than Obama.

Biden isn't a cynical liar, and Sarah Palin isn't a creationist.

There are, however, substantive decisions to be made by the next president that will affect the course of history for the rest of our lives and beyond. If this election turns into a slanging match or a beauty contest, then the american electorate will have missed a once-in-a-generation opportunity to have an adult, open discussion about where Western society should be heading.

It's also faintly scary to me that, in Putin and Medvedev, a resurgent nationalist Russia has two strong, experienced, effective and potentially dangerous politicians, who must look at the news clips from the US and laugh themselves silly.

This is the depressing feature of blog culture in my opinion. It purports to be a serious discussion of the issues, and yet I struggle to find a single blog at the moment discussing any political point other than whether someone should have winked or not, how well someone knew someone 40 years ago, or whether the polls from somewhere show a 0.5 per cent swing to something or other. We lob bombs at each other as if this was just entertainment. I include myself in this criticism.

I am proud to come from a family which has produced many generations of conviction politicians with many different beliefs. Some were successful, some were frustrated, but they would be ashamed of all sides that we have become so obsessed with style, celebrity, image and gossip, where elections are fought on YouTube and Fox News and by rumour and conspiracy-theorising.

Sorry, didn't mean to sermonise. Like I said, I include myself. But read this thread! It reads like a bunch of mad people all shouting at once.

davemaz

For some vague reason, we in the states seem to ascribe to our British friends a deeper understanding of the political process and the world issues at stake. Probably because of BBC. Melanie exposes that idiotic belief as a simple case of a poor national self-image. The way you subscribe to the philosophy that has captured our government's limited imagination (yeah, we can use the war on terror to get rid of "bad people") is inexplicable. And Palin - a distraction. The "Lipstick on a pig" line originates as something akin to a Potemkin Village - a powerful attempt to foist a morally and philosophically empty politic on a gullible people. (and in this case, trying to make a shallow candidate appear more than simply a superficial cheerleader). Lipstick would give my cat the same level of political experience and substance as it has Ms Palin.

Ronnie

Its OK svengali, we are a bunch of mad people shouting at each other.

The weakness in Verity's poll argument, of course, is that only McCain supporters/'appologists' vote in right wing blog polls. To imagine that they are in some way an accurate and objective reflection of the general electorate's current thinking is ridiculous.

The Cat Anand

If anyone tried to put lipstick on me, I would slash their face off.

field

Verity -

If Palin was having such a fantastic effect on American voters - why are the opinion polls (the big ones - not telephone or internet polls) moving in the Republicans' direction? Why has the gap moved in Obama's favour since her disastrous performances?

These pollsters have every incentive to get their surveying right, because that's how they demonstrate to advertisers and others that they are the right people for the job. So the idea all these polls are the product of a leftist conspiracy is ridiculous.

Verity

Field, if I recall correctly, the polls were giving it on a plate to John Kerry right up until the votes were counted.

Brian O'Connor

THX1138 wrote:

The guilt-by-association attacks on Obama are as much about tapping into a range of hazier doubts as they are about the details of any given charge (. . . snip . . .).

I'd be interested in knowing how you'd care to prove that assertion.

It seems to me that the details of charges surrounding Barama's association with Wright; his association with Ayers; his executive experience in service of the CAC and the CAC's list of the ideological leanings of those benefitting from its largesse; his 96% — 97% party-line voting record; his assertion that Iran is just a little, harmless country; or his willingness to sit down and talk to Ahmadinejad without preconditions . . . are all details which speak eloquently for themselves.

I guess I don't see much need to invoke "hazier doubts" given those details; or, if "hazier doubts" are raised, it seems to me they pale in comparison to the details themselves.

Verity

Frank P - If you're checking in here, St Mark of Steyn is back!!!

Richard

According to one account Biden made 14 mis-statements of fact in the debate. Could the mis-statements have been a trap to get Palin off her game? If so they failed because with one exception Pailin ignored them.

The exception being when Pailin said that tomorrow morning someone will figure out who is telling the truth.

The someone is not the mainstream media -- which seems to ignore such misrepresentations when made by a democrat.

What seems left to ponder is, to paraphrase Bob Kerry - D, that Biden like Bill Clinton is a very skilled liar.

As one person said to me - everyone lies in Washington.

KateA

Verity: "It was a glancing referenc, not a PhD dissertation. This is a blog, not the hallowed halls of academe."

God forbid! Let us not lower ourselves to the level of THINKING, investigating, conducting evidence-based discourse. How boring; we might actual learn something useful instead of fantastical gibberish.

This blog is facilitated by a highly regarded British intellectual Verity; the 'form' is irrelevant; it does not imply a dumbing down of substance.

In City Journal, Heather MacDonald - hardly a raging 'Marxist' - writes:

"... the populist message [carries] an implication that learning is itself a disqualifier. ... historical and literary ignorance is at such a high, an occasional hint of the value of serious study would be most welcome."

Welcome indeed. It was in fact, Melanie Phillips, who issued the first wake-up call against ignorance and political ideology masquerading as knowledge. I am of the same generation and academic background; for more years than I care to remember, we have shared a common dedication to standards.

I cannot therefore fathom the rationale behind this extraordinary promotion of a brashly lacquered, empty vessel. It is a perverse capitulation - 'All shall have prizes'? NO! Devoid of the rigorous scrutiny I have so long admired, this is a betrayal of every educator fighting social engineering.

"... she danced round Biden like a matador sticking her knives into a clapped-out old bull" - a shockingly blood-thirsty image but not what I saw.

Palin twisted like a bar-room pole-dancer, smirking, winking, pouting, cheer-leading and seducing the camera. Biden, not at all an "old bull" but a calmly courteous debater.

Certainly the commentators on Republican Right US blogs seem to agree with my perceptions e.g. "Wow, that wink, that lipstick, I tell you man, more than my spine stiffened".

John McCain, infamous for womanising, clearly chose his running mate with an eye to the lowest common denominator. Palin naturally fits the role. Wink, wink, pout; please love cute little ole me, protect me from those terrible people with brains who refuse to mangle syntax; just see what I'll do for you in return! Hey, I'm the barracuda who loves 'Joe six-pack'!

Yuk! The responses - generally more graphic than my example - expose a constituency of American males with 'brains' only in their genitalia. Not too surprising:

'Alaska's Rape Rates Double the National Average: Alaska has the nation's highest per-capita rate of forcible rape, with a disproportional number of rape and sexual assault victims being Native women, ...'

When Palin was mayor of Wasilla that small town had a higher violent crime and forcible rape rate than Chicago, Illinois.

Wasilla, Alaska [pop. 5,000]: 1,200 cases
Chicago, Illinois [pop. 2,896,016]:1,192
National Average: 469.2
(Uniform Crime database, which can be accessed through the FBI website)

These figures, in a state obsessed with fundamentalist Christianity and crammed with professing born-again Christians, are the stuff of the horror movie. Palin is the perfect female example of the apparent dichotomy. Born again, pro-life, 'hockey mom', who acts like a hooker.

A dearth of factual evidence, as opposed to 'received wisdom' and hysterical accolade, led me to research Palin. The Irish 'cute hoor' reference in a previous post has been confirmed many times.

The word missing from this debate is totalitarianism; fascist, communist, Marxist et al, are utilised but avoid the reality. These are interchangeable. They are all totalitarian ideologies. As totalitarian as Islamism.

Palin should not be underestimated. Her record to date - sectarianism, self-serving deceits, abuse of personal power, assuming herself and her husband and staff to be 'above' due process - she ticks all the boxes of an aspiring totalitarian dictator.

PS: Friend of Israel? Doubt it, only if it will somehow further her ambitions. The mayoral campaign for Wasilla was distinguished by the filthy rumour that the incumbent, Mr Stein, was NOT a Christian but a Jew 'living in sin'. He was required, after years of service to the community, to produce his marriage certificate.

Palin advertised herself as: "The First Christian Mayor of Wasilla" and won.

Brian O'Connor

David Bernstein explains one reason why the Obama/Ayers and the Obama/Wright connections are important. http://tinyurl.com/4a4g6y

field

Verity -

If you think Obama is operating at a John Kerry level, you are very much deluded. The guy is a good and interesting performer. I am not convinced by him but there's no way you can compare him with the terminally dull John Kerry.

Kate A. makes some good points about all those "hooker's wink" approach to politics. But I doubt that 1200 figure for lil ol Wasilla. I mean it's a frozen waste for half the year. Could anyone get that worked up in sub zero conditions.

Sure that isn't the Wasilla figure translated into the equivalent for Chicago? - a somewhat different matter.

field

By the way I've nothing against a woman looking attractive and being in charge, indeed having the top job. The French do it best of course - BUT they are every inch the intellectual as well. Now THAT is the ultimate fantasy as far as I am concerned! Palin is only half way there.

Hayward Maberley

Mr Pulley and Verity,
Thank you for your comments.
My drawing attention to the incorrect analogy used by Melanie concerning a corrida was fair I believe. For if you can misconstrue something as obvious as that you cannot have much in the way of powers of discernment.
As for The Manchurian Candidate piece, I thought another take on it it might be of some interest seeing how Dubya and the current "Faith Based" Administration have done such a wonderful job with the USA economy!

Verity

Kate A, Whoaahh! you're scary! I assume, at 11:51, you're angry and you'd poured a skinful down your throat. If not, that's worse!

Tom the Redhunter

"Why on earth doesn’t McCain start using it?"

Partially because he doesn't like to campaign that way, and partially because his aides are warning him that any such attempt will be portrayed as racist by the MSM. The recent AP story by Douglass Daniel was a warning shot.

Verity

Kate A - You look like a drooling idiot who doesn't even understand the terms (except as you understand them in Britain, which doesn't apply in, you know, a foreign country, which the United States is).

How many times have you been to Alaska? Which is your favourite city? How many of the state issues do you understand? Sincerely, could you let us know how you regard the issues of Alaska and how you differ from Governor Palin on their resolutions?

I suspect, never. You're one more ignorant, angry loser wannabee whose government will shortly be scanning her emails and the links she has visited during the day under the guise of preventing "terrorism", which will be sold on to potential investors to the greater enrichment of "Lord" (haha ha haha ha) Mandelson and David Blunket for selling on after their "people" have had a look and skimmed a lot off for themselves.

And you think you can jeer at someone standing for office in an open democracy?

Verity

Sad little Katie A, so transparently knowing nothing of the governance of the United States, the most powerful nation in the history of the world, and mistaking it for the Loughborough Town Council (or whatever; who cares?).

Palin governs, with the legislature, an area around the same size as Europe. No little Angela Merkels popping up. No little Gordon Brown sock puppets for Tony Blair. A vast, vast, unimaginably wealthy part of the the world, with a variey of peoples calling it home.

Meanwhile, in Britain, the government is going to harvest your emails and your telephone calls - oops! - RECORD THEM FOR YOUR OWN PROTECTION! - and lose the discs in the back of a cab when there was never any reason they should be out of the office, and sold on to Russian squillionaires. Actually, given the poverty Gordon Brown has herded you into, this might not be a bad deal.

Ronnie

Oh dear, Verity thinks her e-mails aren't scanned...

And the number of timnes she uses the words 'Marxism', 'Islam(ist)' and 'terrorism'...

Oh dear.

raymond joseph douglas

Give me Palin any time over our clever-clogs liberal left!Family,marriage,pro-life,pro-israel,Palin is my kind of gal!Only wish we had her here!

patricia

why does mccain not use this devastating stuff?

probably because he heard that you had writen it up and quickly decided to treat it with the disgregard it deserves.

maybe he s not so stupid after all.

Nick Kaplan

The Truth Hurts; the only thing that I am finding painful right now is your wilful ignorance.

Here is the quote in which Palin describes her position on the teaching of creationism:

“I don't think there should be a prohibition against debate if it comes up in class. It doesn't have to be part of the curriculum.”

As you can see this is a most reasonable of positions which can and should be the position of those who believe in creationism and those who do not. In fact the only people who would not adopt such a mind numbingly obvious stance on this issue are the most ardent of thought fascists.

You claim that Palin’s membership of a church that does believe in creationism must mean that she is a creationist. Perhaps you are right, however by that logic you would then have to accept that Obama’s membership of a Black Power church means that he is a racist, he despises the country he seeks to lead (God Damn America etc) and he believes that white Americans created the aids virus. Despite both views (creationism and black liberation theology) being manifestly ludicrous, the only one that is manifestly dangerous is the belief in Black Liberation Theology. So by your own logic it is perhaps best that you switch your allegiance to McCain/ Palin.

Your criticisms of AIPAC come dangerously close to the implication that there is some Jewish conspiracy to control world affairs in accordance with the ‘Protocols of the elders of Zion.’ If this is indeed what you are implying I have no more to say to you given that you must be a hateful anti-Semite. However I will give you the benefit of the doubt and just say you are wrong to imply that the Israel lobby ‘manipulates the system. ’

Palin has not tried to strip homosexuals of rights; she has done the exact opposite in blocking a bill that would have denied homosexual couples many of the same rights as heterosexuals. She just happens to be against marriage for homosexuals because her religion teaches her that marriage is between a man and a woman only. I disagree with her on this front but it does not make her a homophobe. Your distortion of the issue does however make you a liar.

And yes Palin is anti-abortion. I do not then see why you are so surprised that she is also anti-abortion in cases of rape, this is the only consistent position. Your criticism here is based on the same assumption that makes you support abortion in the first place, i.e. that the comfort of the mother, not the rights of the child (if you believe it to be a child, which Palin clearly does) are of preeminent importance. But if like Palin you believe that life begins at conception it does not make sense to them say “but its okay to terminate that life if it is a product of rape or is disabled.” The fact that you think otherwise implies something rather revolting about your morality i.e. you believe it is more acceptable to kill a disabled child than a able bodied child because having a disabled child may inconvenience the mother.

As for whether or not you support abortion at all, I think that it is important that you determine at what point life begins as, assuming you believe infanticide is immoral, the point at which something becomes a life is the point at which it is unacceptable to terminate a pregnancy. Can you give me a philosophical description of which factors determine whether or not something should be categorized as a human being? If not then it appears you have very little justification for your support of abortion rights.

Verity

Nick Kaplan - Good post. What it points to is that Palin is consistent. Her beliefs are not like dust in the wind. She understands her own value system and she lives by it. She also understands the laws of Alaska and governs by them.

I think she's actually rather heroic.

Hayward Maberley

Verity,
Are you not aware that at any time at a minimum of six points any email can be picked up by whoever wants to hack. And unless you are using an email system with inbuilt encryption anyone can read them. Encryption which most security services have either the key to or the means to obtain the key. In fact it is already happening at GCHQ and the current government is following SOP for that is what any government whether Labour, Conservative, even LibDem would do. Big Brother watches everybody now! No matter who runs the country

Byron in Wahroonga

The way you can put your finger on the core issues from a mass of data makes lesser mortals like myself gasp in awe, Melanie. Palin has put McCain back into the race but it is now his, to lose.

Byron in Wahroonga

***must have been another debate. The one I saw she was competent at best***

Ha! Dave, time to check the expiration date on your tablets? Palin eviscerated Biden.

Nick Kaplan

A deafening silence seems to be the response of ‘The Truth Hurts’ to my latest post. Has he keeled over in crippling agony... Can he not handle the truth?

Neil Saunders

The U.S. is a foreign country. Do we pay this much attention to the elections of our Continental neighbours? Clearly not. Maybe we should.

Verity

Howard Mayberly - "Big Brother watches everybody now! No matter who runs the country."

Yes. That's why I don't live in the country.

Hayward Maberley

Verity,
You maybe anywhere on the planet, but if you are blogging/emailing to The Spectator that communication runs through landlines, copper or optical, to servers that run the internet/mail for The Spectator. There will be nodes at differnt points for distribution. The nodes, the servers and individual work stations are already accessible by GCHQ. Then there is Raptor!

Conservative Cabbie

Nick Kaplan

Thankyou for your thoughts on Sarah Palin and her views on abortion - they echo what I have been saying on blogs since she was announced as the running mate. She is probably the candidate with the most philosophically consistent view.

As you said, if you believe life begins at conception, then under no circumstance (even rape or incest) can you countenance abortion.

The people with the really nasty views on abortion are Joe Biden and Barack Obama.
Obama believes that in the case of a failed abortion (in other words, a baby is born alive), that it is acceptable to withold medical care for that child. In other words to abandon it to certain death. I've commented on this a few times because I'm amazed at the lack of traction it's got.

Joe Biden is almost even worse. As a strict catholic, he believes that life begins at conception and yet still accepts abortion because of privacy issues. In other words, murder is acceptable as long as you do it in private.