Dirty work at the blogroads, Watson

Yusuf Abdul-Aziz McNulty

Completely off topic but let me just update you with something:

At least 900 people dead in Gaza with around 40% of that being women and children.
Around 4,500 reported wounded, both these figures rising by the hour.

How about you get offline and see the real world?

Take care now.

Howard

That is now 3 blog posts you have used for self promotion. How many will will get if you win?

J McNulty (mine is real)

Dear Yusuf Abdul-Aziz McNulty, I do not accept your figures as accurate. In fact, I do not accept that any of the grotesque lies coming out of Hamas spokesmen are even remotely true. This has been proven time and time again.

Roberta

I had to spend Christmas in Birmingham with relatives. It was dire. Sad to say, Miss Austen's prognosis was entirely accurate:

"One has not great hopes from Birmingham. I always say there is something direful in the sound."

Neil Foster

Well I agree with the 'irrelevant nonsense' bit.

Fortunately for all you Melanophiles stuffing the ballot in her favour I point you in the direction of the small print at the bottom of the poll, viz - "All polls are subject to correction for overvoting, or other identified cheating, prior to the finalization of the results. ".

It's very easy to track IP addresses.

Dalam

Sorry Melanie, but this self promotion and touting for votes in unseemly and beneath you.

roger

The two greatest works of art created in birmingham are called the M5 and the M6. God how nice it is to use them to get out of there!

hadrian

Perhaps if Hamas were not so dead set on destroying Israel and tormenting them with rockets, Yusuf, there wouldn't be a single Gaza resident dead.
Self Defence is the duty of any government. How many dead Israelis do you wish to see?

john doe

Birmingham is an unmitigated dump. An abject wasteland of spiritual despair.....a vacuum.

Sam Armstrong

Yusuf Abdul-Aziz McNulty
January 11th, 2009 9:31pm

Thanks for the update. You'd think, wouldn't you, that in order to spare it's citizen's lives, Hamas would move them away from places that Israel wants to bomb.

You have a great day too sweetie.

James Cartwright

Armstrong - Oh, so because Hamas (allegedly) haven't done that, the IDF bombers have no reponsibilty whatsoever. Don't think so. Moreover the same stories were told by the IDF in 2006 - and were shown to be lies.

Ian G

There's a lot more to Birmingham than these posters realise. I will be voting for Melanie. Living in Brum for 20 years and have been on the internet for 10 and I have never heard of these Brum blogs. I have heard of Melanie.

Corin

CiB appears to be some arty-*arty blog equivalent of 'What's On ' for B'ham. Not for serious people.

jose garcia

i saw this coming when melanie posted the link, after 1 day a lot of people begun to post for some unknown blog from birmingham

Matt Murtagh

CIB is a vital part of the artistic and creative community in a once benighted but now culturally vibrant city, a vibrance it has played no little part in creating.

It saddens me firstly that such cliched views of Birmingham still exist and secondly that an 'arty' blog can be seen as not for 'serious people' although this is sadly indicative of the philistinism rampant in the mindset of this blog.

Eleanor

Serious people don't do arts and culture?

What strange people haunt this blog.

Antonia

All this doesn't really matter, Melanie. I visited the other blog and have found there nothing to interest me. So,win or loose, I will be coming back to your blog.

Kiwi

Yusuf Abdul-Aziz McNulty: "At least 900 people dead in Gaza with around 40% of that being women and children."
And not a single Hamas terrorist amongst them. Not even one. Simply amazing!

Shakassoc

I have just voted for Melanie. I was born in Birmingham, live nearby, and have contributed for many years to creative activities in the city; but I see nothing on the CiB blog that I recognise. I conclude that it is simply a front for the self-promotion of its creators and their narrow-minded, right-on views of the arts. Whether or not you agree with Melanie (and it is usually hard to disagree), nobody can deny that she is a passionate, honest and articulate advocate of her views, and that she touches on matters that are deeply important to all of us. By the way, Birmingham isn't a dump.

Gbagd

Very surprised that people seem to view Birmingham in such a negative light. I'm originally from London, surely somewhere that can't be labelled with the same slurs as directed at Birmingham on here, however have lived in the capital of the west midlands for the last 6 years and have found it to be a fantastic, creative and vibrant city. Generally I have found that the people who are the most critical of Birmingham are the ones that have spent hardly any time here.

Also, I have to add (though I don't know how much its worth), that Israel are entitled to defend themselves from attack, but surely this isn't achieved by random targeting and the killing of hundreds of innocent civilians. Some might think that rather than protect themselves they are simply fuelling the recruitment and drive of Hamas to further escalate their actions also...

Gbagd

Very surprised that people seem to view Birmingham in such a negative light. I'm originally from London, surely somewhere that can't be labelled with the same slurs as directed at Birmingham on here, however have lived in the capital of the west midlands for the last 6 years and have found it to be a fantastic, creative and vibrant city. Generally I have found that the people who are the most critical of Birmingham are the ones that have spent hardly any time here.

Also, I have to add (though I don't know how much its worth), that Israel are entitled to defend themselves from attack, but surely this isn't achieved by random targeting and the killing of hundreds of innocent civilians. Some might think that rather than protect themselves they are simply fuelling the recruitment and drive of Hamas to further escalate their actions also...

Dave

What exactly is unclear in the Hamas charter about the destruction of Israel and the killing of the Jews that all of you left wingers, liberals and gullible fellow travellers for Islam and it's design to rule the world don't understand? What don't you understand about the fact that Hamas is viewed and designated a terrorist organisation by Egypt, the UN the US/UK and others? Hamas doesn't need this conflict, which it created, for it to recruit more terrorists to it's ranks to use as suicide bombers and to use the civilian population as human shields.

stanley Jerusalem

The reason why people in the Gaza Strip don't have shelters is that for the last 8 years, unlike the surrounding Israeli countryside, no-one in Gaza needed to shelter from Israeli Rockets fired at them. There weren't any.The bonus to Hamas is the number of Gazan dead from receiving Israeli Airforce and Army strikes in a retaliation they didn't entirely expect.

Michael

Melanie, using a blog to rally support is hardly 'dirty tricks'. And the post in question is certainly no more divisive than a lot of your own writings.

Ben Whitehouse

I'm really concerned that such outdated negative views surrounding Birmingham still exist. I've lived in Birmingham on and off for the last ten years and full time for the last four.

It's a vibrant place with an exciting cultural scene. There are some very exciting social media projects being piloted here by local bloggers/tweeters which are being copied across the country.

Created in Birmingham is a hub for cultural and artistic ideas and has proved invaluable to people around the region to come together and work creatively, positively together. The readers and writers of the blog are passionate about making a difference locally with an eye on having an impact nationally. The nomination for the blog award is a nod for their hard work as advocates on behalf of local cultural work. It's free from bias, agenda and a narrow view. It welcomes all and encourages all.

E Tahwi

Melanie, they call that blog the "Blue milkshake" because it own by Islamic extremist, the extremist favourite drink is milkshake

Harry

I agree with Michael. You have made three posts on your blog asking for support. Would you repudiate all your supporters who also blogged in your favour?

Michael

E Tahwi, is that a requirement? You're not allowed to be an extremist if you don't like milkshake?

Latfina

Michael, are you you left wing who is against religion? in Islam you are not allow to drink alcohol, so the answer is you are allowed to drink shake you get that?

Ben Whitehouse

Michael, that makes Daniel Plainview from the film "There will be blood" an Islamic Extremist. He drinks up your milkshake, he drinks it up.

phil

James Cartwright see I use your full name -you have had too much milkshake ,befuddles the mind you know -turns truthinto lies and sweet into bitter -try beer ,its GOOD IN THE UK

stanley Jerusalem

OK enough codswallop. Let's get back on track Folks!

Michael

Latfina, of course I 'get that'. But it's perfectly ridiculous to suggest that because someone likes milkshake they must be an Islamic extremist. You get that?

James Cartwright

phil says "James Cartwright see I use your full name -you have had too much milkshake ,befuddles the mind you know -turns truthinto lies and sweet into bitter -try beer ,its GOOD IN THE UK"
Self refuting.

Michaela fahlawi

Michael, are you left wing liberal human rights lawyer for who drinks what?

Margaret Muller-Johansson

That is funny! phil,

Ben Whitehouse

Kelis sang about her milkshake bringing the boys to the yard. Does that make her an Islamic Extremist?

The TV channel Five has a programme called Milkshake- more Islamic Extremists?

Are Nesquick Islamic Extremists for producing milkshake?

Dairy Queen- Islamic Extremists?

The argument just doesn't hold together. It's an absurd statement and Melanie should point out so in a post or update to this blog.

Nick

The latter part of this discussion thread is hilarious, not least because one side is firmly tongue-in-cheek, and the other is utterly irrational.

What on earth do "are you you left wing who is against religion" and "are you left wing liberal human rights lawyer for who drinks what" mean?

I've never seen so much debate spring from a frothy milk-based beverage. And I've also never seen 'human rights lawyer' used as a term of abuse before!

Fascinating.

phil

Margaret Muller-Johansson ITS GOOD TO SEE SOMEONE APPRECIATES MY HUMOUR BUT LOOK AT OUR JAMES REPLY ITS EVEN FUNNIER !!

IN ENGLISH HE WOULD BE REFERRED TO AS THICK JUST LIKE A GOOD MILKSHAKE :)

Bob

This is, quite possibly, the most random, illogical and hilarious bunch of comments I've seen on the internet yet!

Beware the evil Michael (now apparently James) who campaigns for the right for all to drink milkshake.

But fear not my extremist friends: E Tahwi,
Latfina,
Michaela fahlawi and phil are here to fight for and preserve that milky, frothy beverage for you and you alone.

What did someone say about this blog being for "serious people"?

logdon

From Jihadwatch.com

"Melanie Phillips, has been nominated for "Best U.K. Blogger 2008". The left are mounting a campaign, to have people vote for the opposition. I hope Robert that you can put a link/story on this article, so that she can get increased visibility in Britian.

Keep up the good work."

http://2008.weblogawards.org/polls/best-uk-blog/

Posted by: Eorna at January 11, 2009 3:43 PM

Frank Pulley

Th link to the Best Blog Awards no longer activates the page.

robert

If anyone needs to know the definition of the word "provincial", they couldn't do better than to check these hilarious comments regarding an obscure town in the middle of England called Birmingham. Wake up people, there's a world out there!

phil

nick it stems from the milk of human kindness and some of these people either havnt had enough or drank too much of the blue variety .:)-oh heck i,m off for some kosher wine .

Notabrummie

I fear something may not have been made absolutely clear ... many voters are registering a negative preference i.e voting in the poll for CiB (300 ahead at present) as it is the most likely to beat a columnist whose views they find distasteful, and not because they love Birminghams undoubted creative genius. In my view this is a perfectly legitimate use of the democratic process.

Jeanie

Yeah, the thing is Mel, the Guardianistas lurk over here an awful lot (I discovered this blog by reading The Guardian one day in the library and their fury sent me straight here) so I think you'll find that an awful lot of people like that have now decided that Birmingham is the cultural centre of the universe.

Frank P

The poll itself is trivial of course; the fact that there are those who wish to sabotage it, or 'tactically' vote to prevent MP's blog from winning such a poll is an indicator that she causing the counter-culture trolls some discomfort by her persistent determination and success in coruscating reportage. Keep it up, gal. You've got 'em rattled!

Kiwi

Notabrummie: "many voters are registering a negative preference" and... "In my view this is a perfectly legitimate use of the democratic process."
Quite right, but not in the spirit in which intended, is it? It's plain to see that, if not for tactical voting, Mel's blog is ahead by a country mile. I can't imagine anyone voting for Melanie just because they didn't want CiB to win, can you? Sour grapes bluemilkshake anyone:)

Francis

Well there does seem to be a bit of a conspiracy out there. Not only is one of the other nominated blogs by one of the founders of CIB and directing votes to it but one of the others is suggesting readers to vote for CiB - a certain nosemonkey's eutopia who freely admits to not knowing anything about the blog but wants to spite this one (http://www.jcm.org.uk)/blog/?p=2058).
This site has even compiled a list of sites encouraging their readers to vote for CiB: http://www.podnosh.com/blog/2009/01/11/thanksforvotingcreatedinbirmingham/ Fair enough if they have actually heard of the site in my opinion but there is something petty not to mention pretty nasty about some of it.

Graham

Has it occurred that many people voted for Melanie to stop Neil Clark and the "lefties" from winning?

Does that mean that the lefties are better organised? Or there are more of them? Or perhaps there's something else to this that these arguments are missing...

Harry

Francis, I've heard of both sites, and I'm voting created in Birmingham! As I said before, Melanie has touted for votes THREE times on this blog, and her supporters are touting for votes all over the place, including in these comments. It is hilarious therefore to suggest that promoting a vote for Created in Birmingham is somehow illegitimate and against the spirit of the competition. If that were the case, Melanie and her supporters would be amongst the worst offenders.

In a democracy it is perfectly legitimate to support one candidate over another for whatever reason (including wanting to see another candidate defeated) and to tell others why.

Ben Whitehouse

The idea that Created in Birmingham is actually supported by the creative community in Birmingham doesn't seem to have crossed the minds of some of the people making comments.

Birmingham has a strong blogging/twitter community that regularly meets to share ideas, work on projects. I wouldn't expect everyone to believe that there's a community of people who'll come together for the benefit of others.

More info here: http://www.paradisecircus.com/

And here: http://www.birminghamitsnotshit.co.uk/

I feel very sorry for the people who can't see there really isn't a conspiracy being fostered by Created in Birmingham and it's supporters. (Obviously I can't speak for the other nominated blogs)

And the list of people supporting CiB, I proudly say my blog is on that list. You'd do well to read the blog posts to see why people are supporting it. It's odd that Melanie has singled out the Blue Milkshake blog rather than saying "there's lots and lots of comments and here's one I picked to fit my theory".

Roland

Ben - but that's what she always does!
Good Luck!

Kiwi

To Harry, Ben Whitehouse et al: CiB is local, seemingly a kind of an elitist Birmingham What's On entertainment guide. Whereas Melanie Phillips is National, and whether you like it or not, covers issues of real importance. I can't for the life of me see why voters in Glasgow, Manchester, Bristol or London, for example, would be the slightest bit interested in when and where the next meeting for the Birmingham BookCrossers group is.
I'll give them their due, one thing the left is good at, is community organising. Draw your own conclusions!

Ben Whitehouse

Well... out of all the voices she's picked the one that fits her conspiracy theory. I talked on my blog about the power of creating a positive community for the creative sector, which is more than Melanie seems to be doing. Unsurprising that she didn't quote me.

It also seems like some of the other people commenting are preparing for defeat already by sowing the seeds of the conspiracy won it story now.

And Created in Birmingham is free from political bias it's not left or right or whatever. The community around it is so diverse it couldn't be pinned down.

Wonder if Melanie has two "speeches" prepared yet?

Ben Whitehouse

Oh Kiwi, you do make me laugh. Elitest? Where anyone can contribute ideas, come along to events and get involved. I think that's the opposite of elitest but feel free to correct me.

There is a "what's on" function but also a commissioning, networking and community side to it.

CiB won the MediaGuardian Award in 07 so it's already had some national recognition and it's providing a model of how creative community can work so it's important to people in Blackpool, Manchester, Bristol & London and beyond.

Ronnie

This is all very sad and utterly pointless.

Harry

Kiwi, it's about what makes a *good blog*. Are you seriously saying that a good blog can only be national or international in scope? When I look at the contenders, I see in Created in Birmingham an excellent example of what a blog should be, commenting, yes, but also involving and engaging its readers, even if it's only on a local scale, and doing some could for the community it serves.
.
So when I look where to cast my vote, I consider CiB to be fulfilling what I believe the mandate of a blog is better than Melanie's blog does. That's why I'm voting for it, even though I am not from Birmingham and would probably have little use for the blog personally. It should not be about whether we are fans of a given blog, but about whether it is a good blog.

phil

gentle BEN(Whitehouse)--"The best weapon to use in the war on terror is truth and justice, not lies and abuse" -Your words Ben from your blog and if you ever read what I write you will see that I mostly agree ,but it does me no good with those that support the Palestinian cause as opposed to the Israelis. The vast majority of lies on these threads are perpetrated by those that appear as if by magic and when they receive a response vanish into the ether.

I will have no regrets if CIB win so long as it is on merit and not helped by cheating as I believe has happened on both that and Mels blog -I deplore the villainy that has demeaned both blogs and ruined our enjoyment of a fair contest .

Most of us here like to make our points and respond as intellectually as possible with well researched and truthful facts -this is spoiled by those that come here to vilify Jewish people and or Israel ,they have no other purpose and rarely stay long enough to even read a reply .We do have of course our own brand of racists here too ,but not many, and I think less now as I seem to have" frightened "some of them off.You will never see Christianity abused here nor real Muslims ,in fact no other religion, but we have to put up with incessant rhetoric from out and out racists ,so is it any wonder that sometimes posters lose their rag .

I and others have said on a number of occasions that the ambition of the Israeli state was "to be a light unto nations" I believe it still is but the people have become hardened by a never ending war .Hate is not a sentiment I like to consider but I admit to being quite close to it for those that have caused that state to show the outside of the sabra fruit so much more than the inner and soft and sweet one .You have been to Israel and you will have seen both sides but you also will have seen the respect for your religion which is implicit in the Jewish way of life and the care taken with your holy sites ,not so ours anywhere in many Arab lands .

So I will close Ben by agreeing with the original sentiment and adding one extra word fairness .

GC

Of course Melanie's entitled to puff her own blog and she got my vote.

It's a courageous blog and while the sort of up-front directly personal invective of the sort I personally favour is fair game and makes the world a jollier and happier place all round some of the stuff I've seen in these comments (happily much outnumbered by the very many perceptive and interesting ones I've noticed) were quite shameful.

Incidentally a propos of nothing I swear wa'allah anyone remember the BBC World Cult Service (in its Hausa chapter) voting Saddam Hussein as Man of the Year back in 1991? Andrew Taussig's paper at http://www.open.ac.uk/socialsciences/diasporas/conference/pdf/lose_some_win_some.pdf refers if you're curious.

Guy Gin

With less than an hour to go till the polls close, I just accessed the Best UK Blog results page and found this: Total Votes Cast 0 (zero). Is this a symptom of system overload? Or can it mean they've cancelled the Best UK Blog contest this year?

Banksy

I haven't stopped laughing since I found out Phillips lost the weblog vote. Such joy

Guy Gin

Answering my own question: must have been system overload. The final scores are now up. The opposition won by 945 votes, 6281 to Melanie's 5336. In percentages, 40.1% to 34.1%. We did our best.

Roland

Ben Whitehouse - Congratulations!

Margaret Muller-Johansson

Next time!, Banksy why you don't have you own blog, you would of see how many intelligent people votes for you?

None

Dave

I always liked Birmingham

Parker

Hearty congratulations to Created in Birmingham!

Banksy

Margaret Muller-J: Get you! Where did you learn such coruscating wit? Correspondence course through the Daily Mail?
Anyway, I'm still laughing me socks off.

Neil

To Mrs Muller-Johansson, surely the question should be how many intelligent people voted for Melanie Phillips?

Congratulations to Created in Birmingham - a resounding victory for common sense.

D.Martin

I notice she's taken down the banner link to the 2008WeblogAwards now - obviously not so 'honoured' now that she's come 2nd... how easily giant egos are dented.

Alessandra P

D.Martin, what is wrong being second? you couldn't be 9th

Margaret Muller-Johansson

Bansky, get a grip!

phil

Banksy I dont want to interfere with your smart alec put downs of Margaret, but I doubt you could write one word in either Swedish or NORWEGIAN -you have displayed the sickness of endemic ignorance in our left wing idiots .Margaret has given her full name why dont you when you write such dirt and you have shamed we real Brits --sorry Margaret he knoweth not what he doth ..,

phil

Ben W you have disappeared .it does usually happen though when someone gets a reasonable answer -quite incredible but sadly symptomatic of much of our culture -congrats to the winning blog and I have to say even more so to Mel who actually writes about current affairs -it is a real blog whether you agree with her or not ,and you can be sure those that voted in a proper and honest way know what happened here -I do not blame the blogger just the low lives that cheated and demeaned all who voted fairly for both blogs .I am talking to you banksy ,neil d,martin et al did you cheat?

D.Martin

Ha ha phil grow up will you - it's a Z-list internet award - no-one except you, Melanie and her acolytes give a monkeys about it. Ha ha I suppose that remark will mean that in your omnipotence you can detect that I am a 'left-winger'! Ha ha ha...
(Alessandra, I do not find anything wrong with being second, but my point was that Melanie clearly does)

phil

I certainly can marty boy and I can smell you from here -wash your mouth out with a bar of carbolic soap -if you want to be a smart alec I am your man ,but don't waste my time with childish stuff .Most of us here have had an education -y tu ?

D.Martin

OOOoooh Spanish! So erudite, so learned! But you're correct phil, I have no education, nor can I read and write. And of course I'm left-wing too! My word, you are ever so insightful phil!

phil

D.Martin thought so thanks for the confirmation -you,re not all that bad .gracias por tu visita -tu no es tan estupido-tan-escribe -but don,t worry son you are not too good at English either .

phil

You were a worthy winner for me Mel I don't suppose you remember ROY JONES the boxer who was robbed of a gold medal at the olympics by a KOREAN IN KOREA -the whole world knew who had won -Roy became probably the best world pro champion we have ever seen and the world also knew who had won in Seoul-so we will not worry about the milkshake boys .I love writing on your blog .I try to play clean but occasionally as you will have seen I let them "have it "-oh it does feel good and Pete is very fair.

Ben Whitehouse

"Ben W you have disappeared"

Just out doing my thing, blogging, being creative, work, making things happen. Sorry, didn't realise I was becoming a fixture.

I did think about sending Melanie some milkshake but thought the joke wore thin a few comments earlier and it was a bit juvenile. Then I thought that someone at the Spectator might think someone was sending Melanie anthrax and I didn't want to disrupt anyone's working day.

"it does usually happen though when someone gets a reasonable answer"

It wasn't that I felt your answer was or wasn't reasonable. I just didn't have anything to say about it. I don't want to get drawn on the whole Israel/Palestine thing as I was here to talk about Created in Birmingham. Could see I wasn't getting very far and wanted to articulate my view of why I was voting for CiB & not Melanie.

I ended up staying for the hilarious milkshake comments and seeing some of the really entertaining conversation.

I couldn't say that people here have any less passion than the supporters of CiB. I'm just concerned about the slightly self reflective nature and the lack of practical tangible change. We can talk these issues round and round but not actually alter the shape of the universe.

I don't see many people changing their minds because of these discussions and, personally, I'd rather debate healthily and learn from others than some of the point scoring.

I'm intrigued at your suggestion this is a "real blog". I think a blogger can define their blog as being whatever they want it to be. It doesn't make it more or less real. My blog (google me and you'll eventually find me, I'm not the painter or the UN guy) is what I make it to be, it's my space and if you don't want to engage that's fine. It's not a question of being real but being authentic. I also utterly dismiss the notion that CiB isn't a real blog. There were real people sat in a real bar discussing real ideas in real time and enjoying one anothers real company. That's community. That's why I support and continue to support CiB.

Jamie Sport

'the ‘irrelevant nonsense’ is entirely my own independent work'

And we're sure it is, Mel. The point you fail to realise is that a great many people dislike what you do, and the things you write. That is why you did not win Best UK Blog.

These aren't dirty tactics. This is the process of voting, and of internet democracy, which I'm fairly sure you have absolutely no grasp of, hence this article.

Good luck next year.

phil

Jamie Sport-a very poor choice of name for one so unsporting to a lady -but I will respond as I am sure she would not want to engage with your type.If cib won by fair voting I am happy for it ,but if they did not, those that use your "internet democracy" have demeaned both cib and this blog . Sadly I believe that is exactly what happened -Mel was leading by a good margin until you haters all turned out to negate the whole purpose of this amusing competition,but that is what you do isnt it?just another aspect of the fall in our nations morality -I see you people as traitors to all we Brits have held dear for so long and for what so many gave their lives to preserve -shame on you sport.

Ben Whitehouse

Well, after voting verification CiB has been announced as the winner. No if's, but's or howevers. I'm hoping I don't have to keep swinging by here.

To be honest it doesn't seem that Melanie engages with anything that happens after she's posted her initial blog. There doesn't seem to be any kind of follow up from post to post and she doesn't seem to respond to comments either.

That's not really in the spirit of blogging.

Also if Melanie had won this wouldn't just be an "amusing competition" it'd have been a victory for free thinking or something.

We'll never know eh? But like Jamie says "better luck next year".

Who knows, she might even be going toe to toe with my blog and my readers. :D That could be fun!