A less than united front

Norm

The problem is we can't believe a word they say even if it's true because it's probably a lie.

Truthtriumphs

Why, oh why, are these dreadful demonstrations, supposedly in the name of freedom of speech, allowed to take place with monotonous regularity?

They are fascistic, intimidating, hatred -spewing and disruptive to the citizens of the capital city who wish to go about their lawful business.
They ensure that police time is wasted, at huge cost to the tax-payer, thus taking police away from much needed other duties.

So where is our esteemed justice minister, Jack Straw, in all of this?
He was so indignant on last week's Question Time about the BNP, so why so silent now when it comes to the Fascist Islamist groups flexing their muscles in London's streets?
The menace posed by the BNP is but a walk in the park compared to that by the Islamists.
Oh, silly me, I forgot.
Straw's constituency has a huge Muslim percentage.
So, under New Labour, justice is more equal for some than for others.

Wilhelm

Islam didnt go through a reformation, or an enlightenment, an industrial revolution, the suffragettes. their banks cant give out loans because islam forbids them making a profit, usury or riba as its called.

To put it another way, islam is buggered, I take no pleasure in saying that, but thems the facts.

Dixon

"Norm
October 29th, 2009 11:52pm
The problem is we can't believe a word they say even if it's true because it's probably a lie."

Its called "taqqi'ya".

Pip

Norm, so true :)

Archie

I disagree Ms. Phillips. As others will doubtless point out, the MCB is a gift to the BNP!

Merlyn

It seems a surprising coincidence that the 'moderate' Muslims appear to have spoken - AFTER the BNP made their scary voices heard.
Would they have bothered otherwise? -I wonder...

Liz SA

Please can someone explain to me why these Islamist radicals not charged with high treason? Since they claim to represent a growing section of the population, perhaps they too should be invited onto Question Time. When will the Establishment wake up to the threat that these people pose? They're so busy bullying Israel that they can't see the problem which sits at their own doorstep. Islam has taken full advantage of another 'soft' target.

the u -man

taqqiya ?? bullying israel ?? you people need to wake up and smell the coffee

Merlyn

Liz SA, Treason has been removed by law as a punishable crime- by guess who..
Yes, Tony Blair.

So, are we in trouble?

Dave N

I just hope that when these Muslim hot-heads, with their inflamatory banners, start throwing traffic cones etc at the police, the cops do not shamefully retreat before the jeering mob as they did last time.(Gaza demo, wasn't it?)
Strange, that when unruly demonstrators are white, the police, complete with horses and snarling dogs, wade in without any hesitation.

Kiwi

the u -man writes (pun intended): "taqqiya ?? bullying israel ?? you people need to wake up and smell the coffee"
Surely you meant to say Cardamom Tea?

Liz SA

Thanks for the info Merlyn. I left the UK in 1991 and didn't know of that particular change in the law. What a travesty. You guys have been stitched-up good and proper.

elixelx

"taqqiya ?? bullying israel ?? you people need to wake up and smell the coffee..."
U-man, Are you here suggesting that politically-motivated Muslim organisations and their spokesmen don't lie?
Are you suggesting that the "obligation to lie in order to dissimulate the jihad"--taqqiya--is never practiced by practicing Muslims?
Are you suggesting that Israel, a state of 6million, is actually bullying its Muslim neighbours, all 12 States, and 300million?
May I recommend the song, "Neighbourhood Bully" by Bob Dylan, which says this far more eloquently, succinctly and musically than I ever could!
BTW, if you think that Israel can bully its neighbours because it has a nuclear option, imagine what Iran would do if it ever got same!

Verity

Uman - please read up on Islam before giving us the benefit of your thoughts. You can start with taqqya and kitman.

James

There is nothing British about Islam.

gareth

no more treason!! thanks for letting us know Merlyn.
That is the the future isn't it, everything will be thrown out - for our benefit of course - by the Fabian/Bloomsbury/BBC/Guardian axis intellectuals who have hated England for so long so well. I thought the spirit of the age was changing a bit away from them - but actually it was wishful thinking, the socialist cup has not been drained to it's dregs yet. There is worse to come, with Europe and Islam somewhere in the mix.

Cheeta Watch

I doubt Jack Straw will do anything, say anything or in fact been seen at all during this period. He will next be heard telling a story from the past about a wrongly victimised citizen and how he vowed from then on ..... etc. I agree that all of this projected to the untrained eye will simply bolster the BNP. I wonder how long we've got before they make significantly more progress.

Dixon

"Verity
October 30th, 2009 1:09pm
Uman - please read up on Islam before giving us the benefit of your thoughts. You can start with taqqya and kitman."

What was his thought? I ve tried to figure it out but havent a clue what was meant? Is it a BNP person saying we should be doing something more direct about the matter rather than merely discussing it? Perhaps we could have an explanation from Uhaul itself?

Laura

This is rather confusing to me. I'm not understanding why the pro-sharia muslim brotherhood will be joining a counter demonstration which is in opposition to sharia.

John.

We, (the native British), left the colonies when asked to do so, at the end of Empire. In the same way shouldn't all these unwelcome people be asked to leave our country, which they are beginning to treat as their colony, too? The Chinese allow no-one who is not ethnic Chinese to be a Chinese citizen. Should we not make the same stipulation obtain in order to qualify for British citizenship? Why shouldn't we stipulate whom we, the native people of this island, wish to live among us? Perhaps Idi Amin got it right after all!

Beer Moth

Yeah, come on u-man, don't be shy. Let us all know how coffee smells.

Barbara

Why are they allowed to say what they do, yet the bnp, who promote Britishness, our way of life, values, and indegenous ways, get defiled in the press. These people to me speak with a traitorous tongue and if immigrants should be deported for such statements, they would not be allowed such freedom in a Muslim country, they are taking advantage of our free society, but their insults may be their down fall. I find the their statements abusive and insulting, and treasonable.

Graeme

Dear Melanie. I have just visited the website British Muslims for a Secular Democracy and I do not believe that is as moderate as it would claim. There are photographs on that website showing Muslim women wearing hijabs along with a man with a fist length beard. Neither of these are requirements under Islam. Nine Muslim adults plus two Muslim teenagers have told me there is absolutely nothing to tell Muslim women to cover their hair or wear chadors or burkas. Sura 24 ayat 31 is talking about the near nakedness of the pagan Arabs of the seventh century and nothing else. An Australian Muslim of Syrian descent told me that the Koran states that if a man has a beard, the maximum recommended length is the fist NOT that you must have a beard a fist length otherwise you could get food in it. This is actually more of a hygiene instruction than a religious one. When we see a Muslim organisation calling for the banning of the hijab, chador and burka, female Imams to be introduced and that 90% of sharia law is ordinary jurisprudence arrived at by ordinary men in the seventh century, and are prepared to accept mixed marriages between Muslim women and Christian men and that Israeli Arabs are the freeist muslims in the Middle East enjoying more Democratic rights and civil rights than their Arab neighbours and if they do not agree with that, they can go and live in that totalitarian slave state on Israel's North Eastern border, then I will call them moderate reformers. I have had far too many in depth, at length conversations with my Muslim friends and workmates over the past ten years to be told otherwise.

Graeme

P.S I have just found out that Yasmin Alibhai-Brown is the chair of BMSD. I think this speaks volumes itself about this organisation to have this leftwing politcally correct person to be its leader as the Politcally Correct are in alliance with the Islamically Correct.

HairyNoddy

The MCB produced a press release criticising the french government for banning the hijab, but kept strangely quiet over the treatment of the Iranian election protesters by Ahmedinejad's goons.

PW Virginia USA

Not being British I don't think I can comment on domestic policies,yet where I live violent demonstrations against our country don't happen because our police are armed and dangerous...

David

The mass demostration has been cancelled...probably because they were afraid they might be confused with a giant halloween party.

John Duckham

Wilhelm
October 30th, 2009 2:18am

Hallo Wilhelm. You can get loans from Sharia banks, or Syariah as they are labelled here in Indonesia. I takea s weird and wonderful walk in the park to get round the Koranic rules but it is doens and the end result is usury. Also Islam has been going through a reformation since it was first invented by the Prophet. It is permanently changing all over the world to suit local circumstances. But because there is no central control we tend to assume that the version used in Saudi and around the Holy Places is the right one but it is not so. There is no right version because there is no authority to define one.

Scot Richards

PW Virgina.

FYI: Our police are also armed and dangerous. Unfortunately they're ordered to protect the Muslim fanatics. In our country we have freedom of speach. But only if you don't speak with an English accent.

Tony

These Muslims are following what the Koran asks them to do and that is to ultimately turn the world to Islam. It is fundamentally a dictatorial ideology. It treats its women worse than second-class citizens. It portrays itself, as the victims were in reality they are the aggressors. It manipulates British democracy to help turn it into an Islamic state with much help given by the useful idiots & traitors that are running this country. So which political party will save us from ultimately replacing our democracy with Islamic rule? Will it be Labour, the Tories, the Lib-Dems, the Greens or UKIP? Which one will stand up to these bullies? There is only one party who has a leader with enough courage and who still beliefs in real freedom and democracy, and you guessed it, the BNP. It’s our only hope. Unfortunately a sick and hypocritical establishment called the MSM, which has a real problem in reporting only truth, continuously vilifies this party. However more and more British people are seeing through their lies and finding out independently like I did what the real facts are. They represent Britain’s only hope in saving Britain from the abyss. I am sick of this ruling elite that have been in power for 12 years who proven themselves to follow a Marxist agenda, forcing multiculturalism and giving most of our sovereignty away to the Marxist run EU and who keep on telling us that we and Israel are to blame for the Islamic inspired terrorist attacks. Lets face it the BBC for one is full of Israel hating lefty liberals. And yet it is the only true democratic nation in that region.

logdon

There are plenty here who are dismayed at the way the Neather story is being dismissively treated by both media and political establishment.

Although Labour has been exposed as the major gross abuser of the goodwill of the indigenous population by this deliberate dilution in order to establish a permanent voting base, the Toryâ™s hands are far from clean.

A quick read of Melanieâ™s Londonistan reveals ncompetence on a grand scale and a kind of ghastly gentleman's agreement that Britain could actually become the jihad recruitment centre of the world, provided they laid off us.

The third denier of Neather is, of course the diversity/PC/Marxist cabal whose blind emotional attachment to anything other than white causes frothing apoplexy and accusations of nazi racism even extending to the display of our national flag.

So the odds of a welcome by the political establishment of any stripe and itâ™s supportive media is zilch.

logdon

Meanwhile here is what is at stake. From the the Gathering Storm site.

As long as the Muslim population remains around 1% of any given country they will be regarded as a peace-loving minority and not as a threat to anyone.

At 2% and 3% they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs.

From 5% on they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. For example, they will push for the introduction of halal and work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves under Sharia, the Islamic Law.

When Muslims reach 10% of the population, they will increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions. Any non-Muslim action that offends Islam will result in uprisings and threats.

After reaching 20% expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings and church and synagogue burning.

At 40% you will find widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks and ongoing militia warfare.

From 60% you may expect unfettered persecution of non-believers and other religions, sporadic ethnic cleansing, use of Sharia Law as a weapon and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels.

After 80% expect State run ethnic cleansing and genocide.

100% will usher in the peace of 'Dar-es-Salaam' - the Islamic House of Peace - there's supposed to be peace because everybody is a Muslim.

logdon

I've tangled with Bunglawala on the pages of Cif.

He was more or less rooting for the Taliban by suggesting that we make nicey, nicey accommodation with them. I disagreed.

This, lets not forget, a man with our Governments ear, suggesting that fraternisation with an enemy who are sending maimed and dead soldiers back to Britain is acceptable.

My argument was met by his characteristic oily evasiveness, culminating with the parroted line, isn't it always better to engage? As they say, yeah right.

To me, that explained it all. His allegiance to Islam trumped any idea that we are at war with these people. His attempted lofty rising above it all and liberally couched language is completely at odds with the harsh monochrome actuality of Islam but lets get real, thats what they do.

They lie and evade when needed. They bluster and threaten when on firmer ground. They find the fault lines and slither in. Truth is whatever is most advantageous.

Islam is designed like that. Lies sanctioned by taqiya. Wars disengenuously ended by hudna or false treaty. Deception of the kuffar when in the Dar el Harb institutionalised by a tell them what they want to hear but always keep Islam in the heart.

Itâ™s all in the Koran which unlike our evolving Bible is the word of Allah and can never be changed.

It is an acknowledged fact that they deliberately use our democratic rules and freedom of speech when it suits. And our sensitivity to others when it doesn't.

One conveniently allows them to spout at will, the other to shut down all disagreement. Compare this rally which is actually advocating the overthrow of our state with the cartoons and you get the picture.

It is literally going on all over the world. Wherever they are they undermine and plot. Nowhere is immune.

In other words they , as Melanie points in the piece, will twist and turn, nothing is ruled out and they openly gloat at our self hamstringing.

This is the Third Jihad. The infiltration of western society by adherents to a faith which is here not to share but to dominate.

The moderate voices are silenced and drowned out. Death threat is a political weapon. Violence often the first resort.

And according to Neather this was all planned by our government in an attempt to eradicate whatever trace of our settled culture still standing and to flood us with Labour voting minorities.

Selling us out to remain in power?

Thats what theyâ™ve done, the worst criminal political act imaginable against a sovereign state.

steve

The method,(er! counter?? demo, by the mcb) is surprisingly familiar, to actually attempt to control the debate.
Choudary vs MCB!...right, theres real objective viewpoints for you :-)
No doubt, they may even grab an opportunity, for their trademark victim status, as the The EDL, intend to counter-demo & there lies the CRUX of the matter

REAL opposing opinion, REAL harsh criticism.

...(that will never do :-)
so lets immediately address them all as nazis.

yes, lets attempt to keep the debate, er..."in-house" a very familiar muslim scenario.

Just imagine,the UAF turn up and their usual trouble ensues!).
The ejector seat muslim spokes-persons, will be available (of course :-) to the media.

Overall, this is a very devisive,(deliberately orchestrated??)situation

The one redeeming quality may be that, the ideology in islam
will be again microscoped, even if briefly.

Jez

The big day.

In London, Islamic extremists are to march on Buckingham Palace. Counter demo's are organised.

In Leeds, UAF mobilise to 'counter' English Defence League demonstration. 'Thousands expected' (YEP / West Yorks Police).

Weather; In Leeds, the warmest it's been for weeks with a completely clear sky... people are going to come out for these demo's.

Muppet Pastor

They would never allow you to make such comments on CiF, any comments that question the 'narrative' that Muslims are peaceful, lovely people are ruthlessly deleted
They have another funny article attacking you today, whilst mentioning that terrorism is decidedly ' un-Islamic'. i wonder what the thousands of people killed by Mohammed would say about that? The dead can't speak, but the battle against Islamic propaganda must be waged every day.

Derek BLADES

Tony, 31 October, wrote "These Muslims are following what the Koran asks them to do and that is to ultimately turn the world to Islam."

Christianity also has a long evangelical history. Christian missionaries are to be found in all corners of the world trying to convert non-Christians to their faith. Moslems are no worse than followers of other religions in this respect.

The problem is that those who are so foolish that they believe in any religion usually also believe that they must encourage others to adopt their chosen nonsense. Education is the best antidote and it works just as well with Moslems as with Christians.

logdon

Two tales as example.

Imagine a burka under a graduation mortar board. How ludicrous?

Here they are in all their PC pomp, the great and the good, these bloody worthies of Cambridge acquiescing to a sexist and barbaric relic of the Seventh century which even the sane and moderate Muslims reject as part of their religion.

It is nothing less than a political demonstration of extremism and male dominance yet the dhimmi do gooders canâ™t see that this support undermines the Muslims who do want to be part of Britain and certainly do not want shariah.

Next is a harrowing tale of the racism which will not speak its name. That school wriggled and writhed in an attempt at denying truth and straight justice this poor victim was entitled to. And why? Because the perps were vicious racist young Pakistani descended thugs, thatâ™s why.

If our educational establishments ranging from a â˜bog standardâ™ comp to one of the highest and once respected seats of learning in the world cannot see the irreparable harm done by their tinkering and meddling who actually can we trust?

And in steps Nick the Merciless. Defender of our Faith and the only one who will put his head over the parapet of cloying misinformation and liberal self regarding cant. A man who in one fell swoop has increased his voter base to 22%.

And they wonder why?

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1224131/Cambridge-University-allows-Muslim-students-wear-burkhas-mortar-boards-graduation.html

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1223938/The-classroom-apartheid-teachers-frightened-discipline-thuggish-minority-Asian-pupils-fear-branded-racist.html

Austin Barry

I do hope the demonstration is more imaginative than a few brillo-bearded Islamists waving placards.

Perhaps they could demonstrate some of the more robust aspects of Sharia law: stoning an adulterer to death, say, or hoisting a passing gay onto a nearby crane. They could possibly administer corrective beatings to their accompanying wives.

Perhaps Mr. Yusuf Islam could reprise his great hit, "I Love My Dog - even though he is not Halal".

I'm sure that a great day will be had by all.

Austin Barry

My above would-be amusing post was twice moderated out when I posted it yesterday from another pc without logging in as a regular Coffee-Houser. Rather sinister and I now know how Frankie Boyle feels.

Ben-Tsiyon (ha rishon)

Blades, there is little history of proselytizing by the Jews; the last, I believe, was before Jesus Christ.

Orthodox conversion to Judaism brings with it adoption into the Jewish nation and is not made easy, so that the would-be convert should be aware of the burden that comes with being Jewish. Contrary to popular belief, the 'chosen people' were chosen for burden, not benefit, as our long history demonstrates.

John.

Blades: There's a slight difference between Christian proselytism and Muslim proelytism. Jesus, when with an adulteress, told the would-be stoners-to-death that he who was without sin should cast the first stone, then told the woman that her sins were forgiven and she should go away and sin no more - so forgiveness, love and tolerance are the touchstones of the religion you think is nonsense. The Muslims however do not advocate tolerance, kindness, forgiveness or equal treatment for both sexes for any crimes they may have committed or indeed for anything else. Christians also do whatever they can practically to help and better the lives of the people amongst whom they find themselves - who has built the most schools and hospitals - open to all regardless of faith - and who runs agricultural etc. schemes to make life happier for all, the Christians or the Muslims? How many demontrations declaring that Christianity will rule the world do you imagine would be allowed in ANY Muslim country? Get the picture?

The Gateless Gate

Would Larry David urinate on a copy of the Koran? No, well why would producers allow him to urinate on a picture of Jesus?

Parody, bad taste, but acceptable because Christians are easy-going laid-back kind of guys?

Augustus

The story that sticks in my mind about Muslim demonstrations in Britain relates to the homecoming parade of British troops at Luton earlier this year. The scene: There were their families
beaming with relief no doubt that their loved ones were home,
mostly in one piece, and there too was a mob of howling Muslims
hurling abuse at the soldiers and their families, and brandishing banners decrying the very democratic tenets that allow them to protest in the first place. And then, and you couldn,t make this up, it transpired that one of the men leading the protest turned out to work as a baggage handler at Luton Airport. Britain, where the inmates are truly running the asylum.

Herbert Thornton

So much for Dr. Pangloss Sookhdeo's optimism.

See also my reference (in the thread headed ‘The struggle for Islam's soul’) to the National Post article “Think Globally, Kill Locally.” Does it make you feel any safer?

Herbert Thornton

I should have also said, in my previous post, that the heading 'A less than united front' applies even more aptly to British politicians' attitudes towards Britain’s Islamic communities.

Florence of Arabia

Any notion that Cambridge is a centre of knowledge is right out the window.

Do. they. not. have. a. single. Islamic. scholar. at Cambridge????????

Cambridge University thinks the burqa is a religious requirement because a few pig ignorant imams claim that it is, and a few pig ignorant attention-seeking girls claim it is?

Mo’ may have been a control freak, but nowhere did he get involved in fashion tips. I have pointed out before that nowhere – no-where – in the Qran or the Suras is clothing mentioned, except that Mo’ says that women should dress “modestly”. He also handed down the same stipulation for men. That was the end of his venture into haute couture.

Burqas, niqabs and the like are intelligent garments devised by nomads in the Sahara – for centuries before Islam cursed the world with its presence. These items of clothing around the face keep the constantly blowing desert sands out of eyes, noses, mouths and ears. The keffiyah serves the same purpose for men. Established for centuries before Mohammad was born. The long garments are to keep the searing desert sun off human skin. That’s why men wear long, all enveloping garments, too.

Duh.

What do they teach these people in Cambridge? And these ignorant, uppity girls are getting degrees?

Abu Agdallah

Holy Mohhha Happy Halloween!

St. Bruno

The full result at Sparkbrook, Birmingham September 2009 by-election:
Ali Shokat (Resp): 2495
Mohammed Azim (Lab): 2228
Abdul Kadir (Con): 799
Naeem Qureshi (Lib Dem): 506
Charles Alldrick (Green): 213
Sakander Mahmood (Ind): 55

Fantastic! More like unreal!

Just one area of Birmingham gone down the tube there are others, plain sailing for an English land of Islam.
Still the people down south find it OK? I find it frightening.
Take it or leave it but where do I go and what can I say, who will listen let alone hear?

Mrs Manning

Bunglawala is a fake liberal. No doubt.

Verity

Bruno - The land your ancestors built and the language your ancestors developed and spread to the world is being taken over by stealth by adherents of the fascist Frankfurt School.

Tony Blair's Gramscis have almost accomplished what the Nazis could not. The subjugation of Britain.

Because they were sly enough to fight for the supremacy of the Left under the radar ... with the low cunning of "political correctness".

And Cameron loves the template and will not change a dot. It's his highway to Brussels and the top table.

Clap Hammer

I am always 'pulled' to Bungle's posts on CI(F) and, rather strangely, I find myself in the presence of friends there. It seems that his 'fan club' encompasses many different people in different countries who somewhat enjoy seeing this Mr Bean figure writhe and gesticulate in his efforts to 're-invent' himself as a 'moderate'. His efforts seem never ending right down to his 'acceptance' of homosexuality. (Not in the Islamic Totality of course, but in Western Liberal Democracies).

The bottom line for me is if he can criticize 'his Prophet'. I won't risk being moderated here for tabulating the 'Sins of the Prophet' but I am sure that Bungle knows what they are and will speak out soon. (snigger).

(When Hell freezes over).

Clap Hammer

All this 'conversion' does signify that extremist groups and persons are aware of the damage that has been done to their 'public persona' and the Internet must recieve full marks for allowing almost anyone to access what these .... persons have said in 'previous lives'.

A good definition of a 'Moderate Muslim' would be advantageous.

Any suggestions?

Matt

Doesn't this highlight the problems that Britain faces in general? It could also be applied to the BNP situation - the vast majority of Britons oppose them, but we are divided on so many other issues that we will never unite on that one crucial one.

Not for Prophet

Derek Blades: "Christian missionaries are to be found in all corners of the world trying to convert non-Christians to their faith. Trying, sweet thang. That's the key word. Not forcing at the point of a sword.

"Moslems are no worse than followers of other religions in this respect". Which respect would that be? Beheading people who choose not to go along to get along? Trying to carry suicide bombs onto aeroplanes carrying innocent passengers, to make a point? Bombing railway stations in, oh, let's say, Madrid? Bombing office towers in New York? Bombing London Underground tubes? Bombing a London bus? Trying, and comically failing, to blow up Glasgow Airport? Driving bomb laden trucks into a US Marine base and murdering 200 US Marines while they slept? Bombing the Taj Hotel in Bombay, with hundreds of innocent people inside or in the environs? Bombing the Israeli Embassy in Buenos Aires? Bombing a nightclub in Bali full of innocent revellers?

I'm sorry, Derek Blades, but I seem to be missing a clue here. How do these murderous and evil events equate with Christian missionaries quietly trying to spread the word of Christianity, and can accept the words, "not interested" without being motivated to murder?

The sons of the prophet cannot take 'no' for an answer from another free human being.

Derek BLADES

Not for Prophet (geddit?), 3 November, listed a number of terrorist attacks by Moslems as proof that Islamic proselytizing is more violent than Christian evangelism.

I do not regard those acts of terrorism as part of an Islamic effort to convert non-Moslems to Islam. Nor would any other person in his right mind. They were protests against what the terrorists see as a long history of Western attacks on, and humiliation of, Moslems - from the carve-up of the Ottoman Empire through the founding of Israel, wars on Iraq, Cast Lead and its predecessors, and the current occupation of Afghanistan by NATO forces.

Starting with a just settlement of the Israeli-Palestine issue the West can do a lot - without compromising its own secular values - to show the Islamic world that the West is no longer dedicated to the submission of persons of the Islamic faith. That is the approach advocated by President Obama and his advisors. Good luck to them!

Brit

Scot Richards: "In our country we have freedom of speach [speech]. But only if you don't speak with an English accent."

~~That's true in the US also. We must adopt one of theirs: Cuban, Haitian, Irish, Italian, German, Korean: you name it. They all tell me how to speak. Anything goes but English. ~~~