‘We are at war with all Islam’

Katheirne

The best weapon is Truth. Tell the truth about Mohamed, his words, his deeds, his life. And ponder on this:- Bukhari Vol 9, Book 88, No 174: 'I heard the Prophet saying: "Islam cannot change."' Freedom of speech, and of conscience, are the means by which the weapon of truth will win the war against Islam.

Tariq

"I am at war with Islam (...) but I am not at war with Muslims.’ It’s a crucial difference". Perhaps, but one that is guaranteed to be lost on Ms. Ali's fellow neocons in Washington, who see nothing in shades of grey (nuance is only for liberal wimps). Furthermore, you can't ban a religion without persecuting its practitioners. Bit problematic, no?

Paul

There is no freedom of religion in Islamic countries something muslims in the West easily forget!!!

Herbert Thornton

Tariq says that neocons think that neocons see nothing in shades of grey, and that they believe that nuance is only for Liberal wimps. I should have thought it more accurate to say that when it comes to defining freedom, westerners as a whole, and liberals especially, are are too reluctant to accept nuance.

The dangerous result of this is that westerners, in their enthusiasm for "freedom", are too ready to defend those who preach and actively advance ideologies that are in fact opposed to, and determined to destroy the very kinds of freedom that are generally accepted by civilised society. If we wish to remain free, and if our civilisation is to be preserved, the central idea of "Freedom" must be nuanced.

What we cannot afford to view in shades of grey, and thus tolerate, are the ideas and activities of mortal enemies who despise freedom and seek to subject us to religious tyranny. Those are matters that we all - and not just the neocons - need to view in black and white, because not to do so is foolhardy and quite possibly suicidal. When Ayaan Hirsi Ali says that she is at war with Islam she demonstrates that she understands this, despite the doubts implied in Mary Wakefield's questions to her.

Vince P - Chicago

I think it would be more accurate to say that Islam is at war with us. Those of us not infected with Politically Correct Mindrot can see that.

Guðrún

Extremely intelligent and brave person Mrs Ali is. Few weeks ago she participated in a literary festival in my country, Iceland, and she made many of my country fellows to open their eyes. (Unfortunately, many still keep their eyes closed). I wonder why don't the governments of the Western countries listen to her and take the steps that are necessary to take against Islam? Why are they so afraid and what are they afraid of? Why do they risk their own country and culture instead of listening to Mrs Ali? If Mrs Ali read this I send you my best wishes and thank you for your part in the literary festival. It was a deep pleasure listening to you. Thank you for your bravery and good luck to you.

Mr Khan

Overuse of philosopher names and quotes are typical of young graduates out to impress - usually with little comprehension or contribution to the argument itself hence the need to cite names to make oneself important. Ms Harsi's quotations from thinkers dating centuries back highlights a similar problem, failing to realise that the discussion has moved into a more contemporary phase and become more sophisticated... one which she seems to be out of touch with - maybe her degree didn't cover that... Islam and secularism are at odds no doubt - however, aside from rhetoric, substantive normative positions is where the difference lies - not on those of reason, ration or empirically verifiable matters...much of the focus being a poltical reformation of the muslim world so that it fuses religion and politics in a new paradigm to pull it out of its horrible abyss it finds itself...

leigh

I agree with tariq that we can be at war with Islam but not individual Muslims. More accurately we are war with the legacy of Mohammad. After all he was a man who stored up the insults and then unleashed a blitzreig of hare and revenge that Allah approved of.

moif

Freedom of religion should also mean freedom from religion, but it doesn't.

Reg Stocking

Some decades ago I attended much more Baptist Sunday School than was my own idea. If the God Is Love ideology drummed into me then has any resemblance to what the self-identified Christian Right in America today is all about, then you are Tweetie Pie the canary bird, and I'm Yosemite Sam. The American (of Indian descent) neo-conservative pundit Dinesh d'Souza has come out with a book claiming that the West can make peace with militant Islam very easily. First, all women will take the veil. Then we outlaw all suggestivity in media, not just pornography but undergarment advertisements, birth control information, advice to the lovelorn, etc. I'm not quite sure whether he recommends abolishing laisser-faire capatalism or trying subtly to convert the Ummah. When Islam didn't feel threatened, the bulk of Muslims were perfectly friendly and reasonable. So let's quit threatening them. This will require some soul-searching and restraint.

mal

The interviewer is so obnoxious "her neocon pals"

Fergus Pickering

Of course you can be at war with Islam but not at war with Muslims. I am at war with Socialism (and i hope you are too). On the other hand I wish no harm to Roy Hattersley.

Harry Cooper

The asylum fraud Ayan Hirsi Magan is so out of her mind. My word the spectator is really scraping the barrel.

The Economist writes:
The facts as Ms Hirsi Ali tells them here do not fit well either with some of the stories she has told in the past or with her tendency in her political writing to ascribe most of the troubles of the Muslim world to Islam…As a young woman, Ms Hirsi Ali’s mother, Asha, does not seem to have inhabited “the virgin’s cage” that the author claims imprisons Muslim women around the world. At the age of 15, she travelled by herself to Aden where she got a job cleaning house for a British woman…Ms Hirsi Ali sounds less frank when she tells the convoluted story of how and why she came to seek asylum at the age of 22 in the Netherlands. She has admitted in the past to changing her name and her age, and to concocting a story for the Dutch authorities about running away from Somalia’s civil war. (In fact she left from Kenya, where she had had refugee status for ten years.)…

However, last May a Dutch television documentary suggested that while Ms Hirsi Ali did run away from a marriage, her life was in no danger…the facts as she tells them about the many chances she passed up to get out of the marriage—how her father and his clan disapproved of violence against women; how relatives already in the Netherlands helped her to gain asylum; and how her ex-husband peaceably agreed to a divorce—hardly seem to bear her out.

Ayaan Hirsi Ali is not the first person to use false pretences to try to find a better life in the West, nor will she be the last. But the muddy account given in this book of her so-called forced marriage becomes more troubling when one considers that Ms Hirsi Ali has built a career out of portraying herself as the lifelong victim of fanatical Muslims."

Amber Muhammad Islam

I agree with Vince. All Politically Correct Mindrot would support Ali's point of view. A view that is in fact carved out of personal tragedy rather than religion. From Turkey to Malaysia and Indonesia including my country Bangladesh no one even dreams of female circumcision. This is an African tribal vice. Ans nowhere is it stated in Islam. As for Paul: Do you know that in countries like Bangladesh, India, Malaysia, Indonesia and several other countries Islam has peacefully coexisted with religions like Hinduism, Buddhism and Christianity for centuries? And yes in Bangladesh we have a lot of religeous tolerance and freedom. And Paul if you are an American do you know where countries I mentioned exist on the world map?

frank goddard

"ONWARD CHRISTIAN SOLDIERS" She is totally right,Islam is an ideology,and Sharia Law must be outlawed in a Christian country and their schools closed,Frank G..NZ

Greg

I am afraid that Miss Ali is right. I do not want to believe that she is accurate in her analysis, but I have to accept that her view best interprets the history and present action of Islam.

Parsa Venkateshwar Rao Jr

Ayan Hirsi Ali will soon have a reconversion to Ilsam once she finds out how unelightened and adolescentish that thing called Enlightenment was. Perhaps she should read a bit of Pascal. And she does not seem to know much about Islamic philosophers like In Sina, Al GHazali, or even Ibn Rushd. Her education is incomplete. There is something nice and irritating at the same time about her fanatical rationality.

David

But telling the truth is being outlawed as Islamophobia, I am wondering how long it is before people like Ayaan Hirsi Ali can continue to tell the truth like this, last night I heard Sarkozy define Islamophobia with Anti-Semiticsm and I know tha there is a EU law coming to make Islamophobia a criminal act, how much longer do we have the freedom of expression to to tell the truth?

K. James B.

At war with Islam, not Muslims. Can one simply separate a mindset from minds - and the hands and feet to which they are attached? When Ayaan says that Islam is different than Christianity, in that one can question the latter and not the former, she imposes a monolithic vision on and of Islam. But Islam is nothing in itself: it exists only as it is believed and embodied. And their is a spectrum of embodiment, with some more moderate than others. The distinction between "moderate" and "levels of belief" Ayaan proffers is, perhaps, a distinction without a difference. It depends on how one parses these things. And there is no single Islamic parsing, despite Ayaan's insistence that it is monolithic. Her dismissal of Ed's faith betrays her own black and white mentality. I'm no fan of Islam. I am a Christian. But it appears that Ayaan has rejected one binary mentality and adopted another, without appreciation for nuance and careful observation. As someone who exited the religion of my youth, I know all too well how easy it is to paint with a broad and brackish brush. But it is limited and limiting, though it may be emotive and rhetorically engaging.

Asad Siddiqi

Ayaan Hirsi Ali lost her clitoris because of African tribal customs not because of Islam. But she is avenging this loss by waging a war on Islam. She is a nut and i wonder why the Spectator has given her so much prominence and importance.

Watchman

Just an observation that those who disagree with Ms Ali have done so by rather unpleasant personal attacks on her rather than what she has said. Her comments make total sense to anyone with a modicum of understanding of Islam and her evidence is there for all to see. Why become personal in attacking her - if you disagree with her say why you do. Well said, Ms Ali, you are a lady of great courage although I do wish you would examine the claims of Christianity (not the Christian Church) before tarring it with the same brush as all religions.

hans

Any goal scored by a bad tempered football/soccer player still is a goal. Any argument brought about by Mrs Ali will have to be consired in its own right independant if we like her personally or not. So please Tariq, Harry, Amber etc , come up with clean/proper arguments ( if you have them) to oppose her views. Hans

Sam

This woman is 1.insane, 2.materialistic, 3. traitor. Who she is shapes what she says, so there is every reason to make the debate personal. The fact that she does not have even ONE good thing to say about Islam is overwhelming evidence of her bias and wicked intentions. She is getting way too much attention as it is!

Len.P Alexandria , KY .USA!

Why is it that Liberals all over the World are Unable to face FACTS??? Are Facts scaring them out of their Narcisstic Illusionary World in which they Exist???

Ben

Asad Siddiqi says that the practice of removal of the clitoris is a tribal custom and has nothing to do with Islam. However this practice only takes place amongst muslims: in a country where there are both muslims and christians you find that the christians dont do it. In some parts of East Africa they do a bit more than remove the clitoris and do a full mutilation.

MPlusnina

Just a simple note: Kant only re-phased one of The Old Testament’s Ten Commandments to love your neighbor as yourself (Lev. 19:18) which proves that our conscience (regardless of who we are: atheists or agnostics or true believers or Ms Ali for this matter) is rooted in religion.

Brian Lilburn

As a kiwi just back from a Buddhist retreat at the Buddha Light International Temple in Christchurch New Zealand, it scares me a bit and makes me sad to hear the delightful English-speaking Chinese abbess 'going overboard' on tolerance and telling us that it doesn't matter who we choose to follow while practicing Buddhist meditation techniques, the Buddha himself, or Jesus, or Mahommed! She wouldn't have any idea of what is in the article here, or how devastating violent Islam was historically on relatively peaceful hindu and buddhist communities - or would she? Probably not. If she had been taught about it, or read this article, would she have said what she said? I wonder.

John Dancer

At last the Emperor's nakedness has been exposed.

Tomasz

I have deep respect for Ali, but it is well known now that the story of her childhood is fake: she made it up to get asylum in the Netherlands, and bacause of those, well, lies she was forced to resign her post and leave the country. In my opinion, it doesn't diminish the the importance of her message, but this ficticious story should not be cited anymore.

Lennart

Female Genital Mutilation is not 'an African tribal vice' as Amber Muhammad Islam alleges. "According to Sami A Aideeb Abu Sahlieh, a Palestinian-Swiss specialist in Islamic law:- The most often mentioned narration (Hadith) reports a debate between Muhammed and Um Habibah (or Um 'Atiyyah). This woman, known as an exciser of female slaves, was one of a group of women who had immigrated with Muhammed. Having seen her, Muhammed asked her if she kept practicing her profession. She answered affirmatively, adding: "unless it is forbidden, and you order me to stop doing it." Muhammed replied, "Yes, it is allowed. Come closer so I can teach you: if you cut, do not overdo it, because it brings more radiance to the face, and it is more pleasant for the husband." "Many diplomats, international organization workers, and Arabists argue that the problem is localized to North Africa or sub-Saharan Africa, but they are wrong. The problem is pervasive throughout the Levant, the Fertile Crescent and the Arabian Peninsula, and among many immigrants to the West from these countries." http://www.meforum.org/pf.php?id=1629 "Is Female Genital Mutilation an Islamic Problem?" Middle East Quarterly, Winter 2007 Earlier this year, the Metropolitan Police stated that up to 40,000 Moslem females suffer FGM but the Met has been unable to obtain even one conviction because of fear and unwillingness among the Moslem 'community' to assist the Police. And, of course, the fact that Mohammed approved it, and so Moslems who condemn it can be accused of being unfaithful to Islam since "he who obeys the Messenger(Muhammed), obeys Allah" (Koran 4:80).

George Steiner

Very scholarly chaps. And very British. Much talk about genitalia, when the issue is war.

Elaine Griffin

Its such a shame that this article is not available to a wider audience. Appearing in the Spectator as it does preaches to the converted. Hirsi Ali needs to be heard.

Mike Stallard

From the point of view of the Catholic Church, Islam is an ally, not an enemy.
The late Pope insisted that the invasion of Iraq was wrong, for instance.
In the Catechism, we read "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims." (841)
Muslims and Christians have a long history of warfare and hatred even, but, in the British Empire, they were some of our firmest allies (Nigeria, Indian Army, Malaya). Shame we lost the plot.

David Watkins

Ayaan Hirsi Ali is, I am regretfully sure, right about Islam, but she seems to be wrong about the 18th century philosophes, who were deists, not atheists, and usually preferred Islam to Christianity, considering it more rational and tolerant. Voltaire, for instance, would certainly have agreed with Gibbon that the creed of Islam consists of an eternal truth, that there is one God, and a necessary falsehood, that Mohammed is His prophet. She is certainly wrong about Kant, who did not pretend to have discovered a rational basis for morality. He accepted Hume's proposition that there is no way of getting from an "is" to an "ought". He proposed the Categorical Imperative as a moral intuition which transcended Reason.

Bruce

This discussion is quite irrelevant. Demographically, Muslims are have an average of 5 children per family while Europeans have 1.3, not enough to replace their current population. What this means is that Muslims will come to rule and democratically. Your future will consist of Sharia law.

DB

Amber Muhammed Islam, pardon me, but the incidents (1) concerning the harassment and persecution of Bangladeshi author Taslima Nasreen in Calcutta and Bangalore (both Indian cities), and (2) the persecution of Hindus in Malaysia, directly contradict your statement that "in countries like Bangladesh, India, Malaysia, Indonesia and several other countries Islam has peacefully coexisted with religions like Hinduism, Buddhism and Christianity for centuries? And yes in Bangladesh we have a lot of religeous tolerance and freedom." I am from Calcutta, and I have heard the Imams' invective in the streets. Islam preaches no secular codes, and tolerates no one but itself; it asks for the supremacy of Sharia law in a secular democracy. With due respect, people who cannot respect the laws of their host nation should leave and establish themselves in nations that are more hospitable to the Sharia, Bangladesh, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia being a few of many. Ayaan Hirsi Ali's personal standpoint is far from mine but Islam's current workings in my nation spur me to sympathise with her.

George Steiner

Just to get back to the subject of war chaps. Or if you like Jihad. There are over one billion Muslims. If ten percent supports the idea of Jihad as war, that makes a hundred million of them. If ten percent of these are ready to fight Jihad, that makes ten million of them. If ten percent of them will actually fight Jihad, that makes one million of them. No shortage of soldiers of the faithfull. What does the West have to put up against this?

Herbert Thornton

George - You made a calculation of the number of Jihadists who will actually fight.

I think the best answer to your question about what the west has to put up against this is to point to the west's nuclear arsenal.

It may sound cold-blooded and unthinkable, but surely, if the level of jihad rises above a certain point - and I leave it to you to calculate the level - it will inevitably be countered by using the nuclear arsenal?

I feel sure too that calculations have been made about how to use it to the most effect - and that they have also been made in Russia, China and India.

Stephen Rothbart

Anyone can see the sincerity of this woman. If she lied about a few things to get into Holland, then so what? Everyone lies about their past at some point in their life, and at least for her it was a matter of life or death. For those doubters about the brutality of Sharia law and the number of people here in Britain undertaking surgery to make them virgins again, so they can qualify for arranged marriages, the treatment of Mrs. Gibbons in Sudan, the misogynist treatment of a rape victim in Saudi Arabia, and finally, the death of her producer of her film, all are indisputable facts. True, not everyone practices it, but those Muslims that agree to a secular society must thus denounce those societies that practice Sharia law, and largely they are too scared to, and this is not helped by the liberals' attempts to constantly appease those regimes and those organisations.

George Steiner

So Mr. Thornton, you are going to nuke Birmingham and the Banlieue of Paris, eh?

Herbert Thornton

George -

You write - "So Mr. Thornton, you are going to nuke Birmingham and the Banlieue of Paris, eh?"

Let me in turn ask you - "So, George, after both Birmingham and Paris have been destroyed by terrorists' nuclear bombs, are Britain and France simply going to wait until London and Marseilles have gone too?"

The gruesome truth is that those events are far from impossible. Closing our eyes to that fact makes them all the more likely to happen - and shooting the messengers will certainly make no difference.

DTS

To Herbert Thornton, you have highlighted a major problem in any relationship with Islam, peaceful or otherwise. Where do you aim?

Herbert Thornton

DTS - I (and I believe we all) should aim towards - to use the wise old adage - keeping our powder dry. This includes retaining the will to use it if necessary.

Pete Smith

Sadly, most of the world is now living in fear of Islam and it's uncompromising attitude to any kind of modernisation.

William Bligh

Surely Mr Khan, citing the Koran and Hadith ( or the bible) is citing thinkers from centuries further back than the One's Ms Ali cites. Or are you saying one should never quote from any thinker who died more than a hundred years ago? Mr Khan wrote: "Ms Harsi's quotations from thinkers dating centuries back highlights a similar problem, failing to realise that the discussion has moved into a more contemporary phase"

osman abdulkadir

my comment on ayaans she is alier she lied to the holland gvn when she came there and we know her history very well she is saying that coz she is in trouble

shreya datta

Ms. Amber Mohammed, among Christians female circumcision only happens in Africa. But among Muslims, in parts of Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, South Turkey, Bohra Muslims in India and Pakistan and Indonesia and Malaysia.And speaking of Malaysia's religious tolerance, a Muslim woman who converted to Hinduism Revathi Masoosai, has been separated from her little baby daughter, and sent to reform.