Andrew Marr: Let me ask you about another burning injustice which you didn’t mention but I think a lot of people would regard as a burning injustice: the treatment of all of those West Indian people who came here in the 1950s and 1960s – asked here to work, people from the Caribbean and elsewhere. We were very, very short of jobs in those days. We brought them into this country. And as a result of your hostile environment policy, their lives have been turned upside down. I’m talking of course of the Windrush generation. Do you not think that was a burning injustice?
Theresa May: I think – and I’ve apologised for what happened to the Windrush generation – and it was something that was taking place over a number of years, across governments, what matters is…
AM: But it was clearly under you.
TM: …but what matters is, you’re absolutely right: we asked those people to come here. They came here. They helped to build our great institution of the National Health Service. And they deserve to be treated better. And that’s why we’ve apologised. That’s why we’ve been working with governments, for example in the Caribbean, to make sure we identify cases where perhaps people have gone back and not been able to come back to the UK, so that we can actually support people. It’s why we’re helping people to get the documents. The issue was, they didn’t have documents given to them at the time which proved their status here in the UK. We all knew they were British, we knew they were part of us, and we’re rectifying that for them at the moment.
AM: Do you know how many people of the Windrush generation have lost their homes as a result of your hostile environment policy.
TM: The Home Office has been looking at all the issues that have been affecting people from the Windrush generation. They have set up a task force so that people have got somebody they can call into when they’ve had a problem, they will be helped and supported. And as we’ve made clear, there is a compensation scheme available for people.
AM: Do you know how many people of the Windrush generation have been refused NHS treatment as a result of your hostile environment policy?
TM: Andrew, what we are ensuring is that those people from the Windrush generation are being given the help and support they need. There were many people from the Windrush generation who did actually get their documentation and who have had no issues. Sadly there are some who are not in that category who we now need to support and who we have been supporting since this first came to light. I think that’s what matters..
AM: Do you know how many people of the Windrush generation have lost their jobs and been unable to get benefits because of your hostile environment policy?
TM: Andrew, what we have been doing is looking at every aspect of the impact of people from the Windrush generation and ensuring that – as I say, these people are British; we have apologised for what happened to people. This should never have happened to people and it is right that we are making every effort to ensure that we can give people the – it’s not just about papers, it’s not just about status – it’s about giving people the confidence and the reassurance of knowing that what they always felt and knew and what everybody else felt and knew is not in question. They’re part of us.
AM: I keep coming back to, it was your policy and their lives were turned upside down. Let me give you the case, for instance of Sarah O’Connor, who came here in 1967 from Jamaica. She has sadly since died, but before she died, she said this:
VT (Sarah O’Connor): I lost my job last July, couldn’t work because I haven’t got the right documents. You go and try and get some sort of help from the unemployment and get told: ‘no, you’re not entitled to everything’. Apology is all good and well – but an apology doesn’t help the things that the Windrush people have gone through.
AM: What’s your message to her family?
TM: I can – well, I hear what Sarah said about apologies, but I can only apologise for what Sarah went through and what her family have gone through. This shouldn’t have happened. We have been doing everything we can to ensure that we are supporting those who have found themselves in difficulty as a result of being part of the Windrush generation, of not having the documents that guaranteed their status. We’re making every effort to ensure those people are being supported properly.
AM: Can I ask what you’re apologising for? There’s apologies which say: ‘I’m sorry something bad happened’, and then there’s apologies which say: ‘Do you know what? My policy – my policy – made these bad things happen, and my policy was wrong and I’m sorry for it.’ Are you prepared to say that now to the Windrush generation?
TM: Well… If you look at what has happened to the Windrush generation, actually there are people who found themselves in some difficulty without documents before we came into government. But let me just look at what the policy…
AM: The families are watching, they want to know if you’re actually going to apologise for the policy.
TM: … Well I just want to explain the policy to you, Andrew. The point of the policy was to ensure that those people who were here in the United Kingdom illegally were identified, and that appropriate action was taken. What went wrong was that people from the Windrush generation, who were here legally, who had every right to be here, who had helped to build our great national institutions, found themselves unable to show that true documentation and got caught up in that. But I think for most people…
AM: But what we’ve established, I’m sorry…
TM: …No, I’m sorry Andrew, because I think this is very important…
AM: OK.
TM: …Because for most people, they do want to know that the government is taking action against those people who come to this country illegally or stay in this country illegally. What we need to do is make sure that, in doing that, we don’t find people who have every right to be here, being caught up in it. That’s what went wrong in Windrush.
AM: But this policy went, as we have just demonstrated, catastrophically wrong and I’m asking you again: you were home secretary during most of this period. It was, in effect, your policy: Theresa May’s policy. The Council for the Welfare of immigrants say that this lady died after a ‘long period of terrible stress as a result of Theresa May’s Immigration Act. The buck stops with the Prime Minister.’ Will you apologise for the policy?
TM: The policy, the purpose of the policy, it was to ensure – and we maintain a compliant environment policy – the purpose of the policy is to ensure that those people who are here illegally are identified and appropriate action is taken. I apologise for the fact that some people, who should not have been caught up in that, were caught up in that, with in some cases as we’ve just seen, tragic results.
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